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body_n nature_n soul_n unite_v 6,882 5 9.6339 5 false
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A46060 The immortality of mans soule, proved both by scripture and reason contrary to the fancie of R.O. in his book intituled Mans mortality ... Hooker, Thomas, 1586-1647. 1645 (1645) Wing I57; ESTC R9011 27,478 48

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made the mixture of these bodies hath for the perfecting our body beyond nature breathed a soul into it to be short the property of a body is to suffer the property of a soule is to doe if the body be not put forth by some other thing then it selfe it is a very blocke whereas the soul which is in our body ceaseth not to stirre up down though it have nothing to move it from without therefore it is to be concluded fom these reasons and the like that might be alleaged that the soule is a substance incorporeall unbodily notwithstanding it be united to our bodies Thirdly as our soule is a substance unbodily 3 Immateriall so is it unmateriall likewise that appeareth first because matter receiveth not any forme or shape but according to his owne quantity and but only one forme at once wheras our soule receiveth all formes without quantity come there never so many at once or never so greate Secondly no matter receiveth contrary formes at once but our soule comprehendeth and receiveth them together as fire and water heat cold white and blacke and not only together but also better by laying and matching of them together Lastly to be short it appeares that the soule is not materiall seeing the more we depart from matter the more we understand surely there is nothing more contrary to the substance of the soule then the nature of matter then is this reasonable soule of ours neither a bodily nor a materiall thing nor depending upon matter in the best action thereof then must needs be of it selfe and not proceed from body or matter for what can a body bring forth but a body matter but matter and materialls but materialls and therfore the soule is an unmateriall substance which hath being of it selfe 4 Imomrtall and incorruptible Plutarke de sera ●uminis vindicta tractat Fourthly the soule as it is a substance incorporeall immateriall so is it incorruptible and immortall Plutarke saith it is in vaine to dispute thereof for saith he the doctrine of Gods providence that of the immortallity of the soule are so lincked together that take away the one the other follows God grant that experience prove not Plutarkes words true in some now living for saith he to what purpose was the world created if there were no body to behold it or to what end behold we the creatures in the world but to serve him and why should wee serve upon no hope and to what end hath he endewed us with these rare gifts of his which for the most part doe but put us to paine and trouble in this life if we perish like the bruit beasts which know not God But because all are not of Plutarkes mind wee will see if we can satisfie the contrary minded by reason for the better satisfying of those who take not so much paines as to enter into themselves I shall indeavour to paint out to them their right shapes by lively reason which they have defaced by ignorance and therefor now to the purpose First I shewed before that the soule is not a body neither increaseth nor decreaseth with the body but contrary wise the more the body decreaseth the more the understanding increaseth the neerer the body draweth to death the more freely doth the mind understand the more the body abateth the more powerfull is the mind why then should we thinke that the thing which becommeth the stronger by the weaknesse of the body which is advanced by the decay of the body should perish to dust with the body a mans seeing fails because his eyes faile but the blind mans understanding encreaseth because his eyes are not busied and the old mans reason becommeth more perfect by the losse of his sight therefore why say we not that the body failleth the soule but the soule faileth not the body that the glasses are out of the spectacles but the eyes good still Objoct 1 But Mans mortality pag. 13. saith R.O. the part or member is endowed with the faculty so seeing is in the eye naturally really and not the soule sees by the eye and hearing locally in the eare and so common sence judgment memory locally adherent to and inherent in their places hee proveth it with this frigid argument because if the member be perished the sence falles Answ To which I answer if the ey be the thing that seeth and the eare the thing that heareth why doe we not see things double and heare sounds double seeing wee have two eys two ears it is the soul then that seeth heareth and these which hee taketh to be our sences are but the instruments of our sences for when our eys are shut or pickt out we then behold a thousand things in our mind yea and then our understanding is most quick sighted when the quickest of our eye-sight is as good as quenched or quite dead how is it possible that the reasonable soule should be tied to the sences what a worthy reason is it to say the soule dyeth with the sence seeing the true sences do grow increas even then when the instruments of the sences doe die Also I pproved before that the soule is not the body nor any part of the body seeing then it is so why measure we that by the body which measureth al bodies or make that to dye with the body wherby the bodies that died many hundred yeares agoe do after a certaine manner live still or who can hurt that thing whom nothing hurteth or hindreth in that body though a man loose an arme yet doth his soule remaine whole stil let a man forgoe the one halfe of his body yet is his soule as sound as before for it is united in its owne substance by the force and power of its selfe it sheddeth it self into all parts of the body though the body rot a way by peice meale yet abideth the soule whole undiminished let the blood drain out the moving wax weake the strength perish yet abideth the mind sound lively it never forsakes its lodging till there be no roome left for it to lodge in when our sences are overcome by death then it doth most labour to surmount it selfe working as goodly Godly actions at that time when the body is at poynt to faile it yea and oftentimes more godly too then ever it did while the body was in health as for example it taketh order for it selfe for our houshold for the commonwealth for a whole kingdome that with more uprightnesse goodnesse wisedome and modration then ever it did before yea and perchance in a body so far spent so bare so consumed so withered without and so putrified within that he that lookes upon him sees nothing but earth and yet to hear him speake would ravish a man up to heaven now when a man sees so lively a soule in so weake and wretched a body may he
not from reason conclude as is said in hatching of chickens the shell is broken but there commeth forth a chicken Secondly for proofe that the soule is immortall see what is the ordinary cause that things perish fire either goeth out for want of nourishment or is quenched by his contrary water water is resolved into ayre by fire which is his contrary the cause why the Plant dieth is extremity of cold or drought or unseasonable cutting or violent plucking up also mans body dieth by encreasing or diminishing the humors called complection or by violence of all these causes which can wee chuse to have any power against our soule I say against the soule of man which notwithstanding it be united to matter to a body is it selfe a substance unbodily unmateriall and only conceivable in understanding nay what can be contrary to that which lodgeth contraries equally in it selfe which understandeth the one of them by the other which coucheth them all under one skill and to be short in which the contrarieties themselves abandon their contrariety so as they doe not pursue but ensue one another Fire is hot and water is cold Contrarieties cannot kil the soule our bodies mislike these contraries and are grieved by them our mind linketh them together without either burning or cooling it selfe and it setteth the one of them against the other to know them the better the things which destroy one another throughout the world maintaine one another in our minds nothing is more contrary to peace then warre and yet mans mind can maintaine peace by preparing for warre and lay earnestly for war in seeking for peace even death it selfe which dispatcheth our life cannot be contrary to the life of the soule for the soule seeketh life by death what can the soule meet withall in the whole world that can be contrary to it which can enjoyne obedience to things most contrary contrarieties then cannot do it Nor want of food What then can want of food How can that want food in the world which can feed on the whole world or how can that forsake food which the fuller it is the hungrier it is the more that it hath digested the better able it is to digest the more it hath the more it desireth take from it the sensible things and the things of understanding abide with it still bereave it of earthly things and the heavenly remaine with it the more abundantly to be short a bridge it of al worldly things yea and of the world it selfe and even then doth it feed with greatest ease and maketh cheer agreeable to its owne nature Also the body filleth it selfe to a certaine measure and delighteth in some certaine things but what can fill the mind fill it as full as you can with the knowledge of things and it is the more eager and sharper set to receive more the more it taketh in the more it still craveth and yet for all that it never feeleth any rawnesse it never catcheth a surfit for want of concoction what shall I say more discharge your understanding from minding it selfe and then doth it live in him and of him in whom all things doe live againe fill it with the knowledge of it selfe and then doth it feele it selfe most empty and sharpest set upon the desire of the other now then can that die for want of food which cannot bee glutted with any thing vvhich is nourished and maintained vvith all things and vvhich in very deed liveth upon him by whom all the things which we wonder at here beneath are upheld Nor violence Well violence you will say perhaps may doe the deed what is violence but a justling of two bodies together but the soul is no body nor bodily substance as I proved before can there be any violence between a bodily and spirituall substance or betweene two sprituall substances seeing that oftentimes when they would destroy one another they uphold one another and if the soule cannot be pushed at neither inwardly nor outvvardly is there any thing in nature that can naturally hurt it No! will some say Object wee see it weakned by an incounter as we may discerne by the senses the more excellent the thing is which the sence receiveth so much the more the sense it selfe offended and grieved therewith As for example the feeling by sire the taste by harshnesse the smelling by strong savour the hearing by the hideousnesse of the noyse whether by a Thunder-clap or by the falling of a River the sight by looking upon the Sun upon fire or any thing that hath a glistering brightnesse I omit that in most of these Answ it is not the sense it selfe but the outward instrument of sence that is offended hurt But let us here see whether ther be the like in the soule or no nay the contrary the more of understanding and excellency the thing is the more doth it comfort and refresh the mind if it be darke so that we understand it by halves it hurteth us nor yet it doth not delight us nay as we increase in understanding it so it liketh us the better and the higher it is the more doth it stir up the power of our understanding and as you would say reach us the hand to draw us to the attainment thereof as for them that are dim-sighted we forbid them to looke upon the things that are over-bright but for them of rawest capacity wee offer them the things that are most intelligible when the sence beginneth to perceive most sharpely then is it faine to give over as if it felt the very death of it selfe contrary wise where the mind beginneth to understand then is it most desirous to hold on still and whence ariseth this but that our sences worke by bodily Instruments our mind worketh by a bodilesse substance which needeth not the helpe of the body and seeing that the nature the nourishment and the actions of the soule are farre different not only from the nature nourishment and actions of the body but also from all that either is done or wrought by the body can there be any thing more childish then for us to demee our soules to be mortall by the abating and decaying of our sences or by the mortality of our bodies nay contrariwise it may be most soundly and substantially concluded thereupon that mans soule is of its owne immortall seeing that all death as well violent as naturall commeth of the body and by the body Thirdly the immortality of the soule may be firmely proved even from death it it selfe The two best definitions of death that eyer I heard of or read of are these and both true 1. Death is a seperating of the matter from his forme 2. Death is the utmost period of moving from both which the immortality of the soule may be proved and first of all from the first Wee have already proved the soule to be the forme and the body must needs be the matter then
in the definition of it therefore there is none its just as if a man should say I know not where the Indies are therefore there are none since it is so then it needs no long scanning 1 Soule not a quality but a substance whether it be a substance or a quality for qualities have no being but in another thing then themselves the soule which causeth another thing to be cannot be a quality for as much as the soule maketh man to be man who otherwise were but a carkeis or carrion therefore we must needs grant that the soule is a forming substance and substantiall forme yea and a most excellent substance infinitly passing the outward man which by the power and vertue thereof causeth another thing to have being and perfecteth the bodily substance which seemeth inwardly to have so many perfections Secondly as the soule is a substance not a quality 2 Vnbodily so it is a substance unbodily incorporiall 1. If we consider the nature of a body it hath certaine dementions and comprehendeth not any thing that is not proportioned to the greatnesse and capacitie of it for as it selfe must have place in another thing ' so must other things occupy some certaine place in it by reason whereof it commeth to passe that things can have no place therin if they be greater then it without annoying one another to be short if the thing be lesse then the body that containes it the whole body shall not containe it but some part of it only and if it be greater some part must needs be out for there is no measuring of bodies but by quantity but we see our soule comprehends heaven and earth without annoying either other and also time past present and to come without troubling one another and also innumerable places persons and townes without cumbering our understanding great things are there in their full bignesse and small things in their utmost smalnesse both of them whole and sound in the soule whole and sound and not by peice-meale or only in part of it Moreover the fuller it is the more it is able to receive the more things are couched in it the more it stil coveteth and the greater the things be the fitter is it to receive it even when they be at the greatest It followeth therfore that the soule which after a sort is infinit cannot be a body and so much the lesse can it be so for that wheras it harboureth so many and so great things in it it selfe is lodged in so small a body Secondly a body cannot be in divers places at once nor cannot passe without removing but the soule as a thousand places may be in it without occupying any places so is the mind in a thousand places without changing place that not by succession of times nor by turnes but often times altogether at one instant as we shewed in the first chapter now there is not a body that is or can be ubiquitary or in diverse places at once it is against the nature of a body all bodily motion requires time yea such time as within a little over or under is proportioned both to its place and to the length of its way it hath to go then it is certain that our soul is not a bodily substance which thing appeareth so much the more plainely that it being lodged within this body which is so movable it removeth not with the body 3 Also it is a sure ground that two bodies cannot mutually enter either into other or contain either other but the greater must needs alway contain and the other lesser must needs be contained but by our soules we enter not only into other bodies but also either into other minds so as we comprehend either other by mutuall understāding imbrace either other by mutual love it follows then that this substāce which is able to receive abodiles thing can be no body so much the rather because the body that seemeth to hold it containeth it not Fourth That the soul is no bodily substance is manifest in that it maketh al things that it lodgeth in it after a sort spirituall therfore it self must needs be a spirituall substance because it bereaves the thing it contains after a sort of its body makes it spiritual if ther were any bodiliness in it it were unable to enter into the knowledg of a body a thousand severall shapes are seen in a glass if the clear of the glass had any peculiar shape of its own none of those shapes could be seen but only its own also all visible things are imprinted in the eye if the sight of the eye had any peculiar colour of its own either it would not see at all or all things would seem like to that colour which is in the eye likewise the tongue is the discerner of al tasts if it be not clear but encumbred with humors all things will be of the tast of the humor that the tongue is incumbred with if it be bitter they also are bitter if watrish they are watrish yea if it be bitter it cānot judg of bitternes it self that a thing may receive al shapes al colours all tasts it is requisite that it be cleare of all shape of all colour of all savour of its owne and that a thing may in understanding know and conceive all bodies as our soule doeth it is requisite that it be altogether bodilesse it selfe for had it any bodilinesse in it it could not receive any body into it without marring or altering it selfe or the other for if you look neerly into the nature of a body you shall find that no body receiveth into it the substantiall forme of a nother body without altering or loosing its owne or the other neither can passe from one form to another without marring the first as is plainely to be seene in wood when it receiveth fire in seeds when they spring forth into buds and so in other things what is to be said then of mans soule which receiveth conceiveth the formes and shapes of all things with out corrupting its own and morover becommeth the perfecter by the more receiving for the more it receiveth the more it understandeth and the more it understandeth the more perfect it is Fiftly if it be a bodily substance from whence is it or of what mixture is it if of any then of the Elements if of the Elements how can that give life which hath none in it selfe how can that give understanding that hath no sence that divers things that have no being of themselves should give being to another or be made a thing that hath a being that of divers out-sides should bee made one body or of diverse bodies one soule or of diverse darknesses one light of divers deaths one life surely this one absurdity is able to countervail and out-weigh all those 69. in R. O. his treaties of mans Mortality by this it plainly appears that hee which