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A36881 A short view of the chief points in controversy between the reformed churches and the Church of Rome in two letters to the Duke of Bouillon, upon his turning papist / written by the Reverend Peter Du Moulin ... Du Moulin, Pierre, 1568-1658.; Du Moulin, Peter, 1601-1684. 1680 (1680) Wing D2596; ESTC R17193 33,229 96

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Roman Church you are obliged to get Eternal Life by your Merits instead of putting your whole trust in Gods Mercy through Jesus Christ you shall never enjoy any Peace of Conscience seeing that the most righteous Persons have great Defects and stand in need of Gods Pardon Good works indeed are necessary to Salvation not from any merit in them but as the onely means prescribed by God to attain the the Kingdom of Heaven One of the great Diseases of the Roman Church is that a Sinner after he hath confess'd his Sins to a Priest receiveth from him the Pardon of them A Sinner forgiveth another Sinner Offences committed against God as if a Felon did forgive another Felon Crimes committed against the King Thereby a man makes himself a Judge in Gods Cause A Priest takes upon him to be Judge of Sins which he knoweth not for he knoweth not the Thoughts and the Affections of the Heart in which Sin doth chiefly consist Neither doth he know the truth of the Sinners Repentance without which there is no Pardon Indeed faithful Pastors have received of Christ the Power to remit Sins as touching the Ecclesiastical Penalty and Censure of the Church and to reconcile the Sinner excluded from the Communion to the Church But you would be much disappointed if you thought that the Pardon given you by a Priest doth exempt you from answering for your Actions before Gods Judgment Seat For when the King forgives a Felon he doth not exempt him from being judged by that great Judge Can a man that feareth God and to whom God hath left some liberty of Judgement read without horrour the Cauteles and Rubricks of the Mass in the beginning of the Missal which the Priest hath upon the Altar Whereby Provision is made against the inconveniencies that may happen to the Consecrated Host when it happens that Mice have gnawn the Mass-God or when a Beast hath devoured it or when the Wind hath carried it away or when the Priest or a sick person hath vomited it Can ye find in your heart to worship a God that may be stollen or eaten by Beasts or blown away by the Wind and that being fallen cannot raise himself How many times doth Scripture say That Jesus Christ gave Bread to his Disciples and that we break and eat Bread in the Lords Supper Luke 22.19 20. That Bread is called the Body of Christ as it is in remembrance of him In the same manner as in the next line the Cup is called the New Testament because it is the Sign and the Memorial of it Therefore the Apostles did not worship it The Roman Church holds that Jesus Christ did communicate in the Holy Eucharist with his Disciples All Parties agree that it follows from the Doctrine of that Church that Jesus Christ did eat himself and had his Head and his Feet in his Mouth The Gospel tells us that in that Holy Action the Devil entred into Judas Can ye believe that Jesus Christ and the Devil entred together into him To strengthen these Errours the sixth Chapter of St. Johns Gospel is impertinently alleged in which the Lord Jesus speaks of giving his Flesh to eat for Pope Innocent the III and after him a multitude of Doctors have determined that in that Chapter the Eucharist is not meant at all and that these words of giving his Flesh to eat must be understood of a Spiritual eating by Faith There Jesus Christ speaks to the Capernaïtes to whom he promiseth to give his Flesh for their meat but he never gave them the Eucharist He speaks to them of a manner of Eating necessary to Salvation and without which none can be saved saying John 6.53 Except ye eat the Flesh of the Son of man there is no Life in you Now many are saved without receiving the Eucharist as the converted Thief crucified with Christ and John the Baptist and many Martyrs And Jesus Christ declareth that by Eating and Drinking he understands Believing when he saith v. 35. He that cometh to me shall never hunger and he that believeth on me shall never thirst Wherefore he warneth them v. 63. that the words which he said unto them were Spirit and Life It is acknowledged by all that many Priests of the Roman Church are ill-Livers yet it is the Doctrine of that Church that a Priest who hath been wallowing all Night in a Debauch hath the power in the Morning to make a God with five words and hath him in his power I must also humbly beseech your Grace to consider that the Councel of Trent declareth it to be the Tenet of the Roman Church generally believed that Sacraments are Null if the Priest hath no Intention to Consecrate which Intention is presumed but by Conjecture and none can be certain of it so that the People adore an Host not knowing whether it be consecrated which is an Adoration at a venture Neither can any in the Roman Church be certain whether he be baptized for none knoweth the Intention of him that baptizeth nor that of him that gave him Orders These things my Lord I touch summarily of which the Proofs are easie but too long for a Letter To disguise these Truths unto Your Grace I am told that you have been perswaded to read the Invectives of Barklay in which Scripture is hardly alledged and Gualtiers Chronicle which is but a web of false passages of some supposititious Books which are not received by the Learned of the Roman Church or Calumnies imputed unto us and such things as we never thought on If upon those false Passages and Calumnies Your Grace had been pleased to consult with some of our Side expert in such Matters they would have made you see evidently the falshood of them The like I say of some passages of Fathers shewed unto Your Grace most of them taken out of forged Writings whose falshood is acknowledged by our Adversaries We have Fathers only as they were copied out of Manuscripts that were found in Monasteries written by Monks who have falsified them and whose false dealing is discovered by the diversity of the Copies of which I could shew you many Instances if I had the Honour to converse with Your Grace about that Subject But God hath not permitted our Adversaries to bring to an end that Enterprize of corrupting all the Fathers for numberless Passages are found in them which bear witness unto the Truth For which the Doctors of the Roman Church blame them very often and give them many ill words But because that Discourse might grow too to great a length I do only refer Your Grace to a Paper by it self a * Which die Reader shall find in the second Chapter of this Authors Anatomy of the Mass Comparison of the Lords Supper with the Mass that you may know what horrible alteration was made in the Lords Institution and that you may know that by going to Mass you cannot be saved You I say My Lord
is the Sign and Figure of his Body and Blood and that the Signs are ordinarily called by the Names of the things which they represent Thus in his Epist 23 to Boniface Hath not Christ been once sacrificed in himself And yet he is sacrificed unto the People in a sacred Sign and he doth not lye who being asked answereth that he is sacrificed For if the Sacraments had not some Likeness to the things of which they are Sacraments they could not be Sacraments Now by Reaof that Likeness they take often the name of the very things Add to this the Canon De consecr dist 2. cap. 48. i. e. the Roman Code of Canon Law The Immolation of the Flesh which is done by the hands of the Priest is called the Passion the Death and the crucifying of Jesus Christ not in Truth but by a significant Mystery This is then the Sense of these places of St. Austin that the Eucharist is the Sacrifice of the same Price because it is the Sign and the Sacrament of it and because the Signs take commonly the name of the thing signified as the same Father saith St. Aug. quaest 55. in Levit. Idem contra Adimant c. 12. Theod. dialog 1. The signifying thing useth to take the name of the thing signified And the Lord hath made no Difficulty to say This is my Body when he gave the Sign of his Body And Theodoret expounding these words This is my Body saith that the Lord hath given to the Sign the name of his Body And Tertullian Tertul. contr Marc. 4.40 This is my Body that is the Sign of my Body Indeed the Eucharist is called a Sacrifice of our Ransom in the same manner as in the Institution of the Sacrament the Bread is called the Body of Christ and in the same manner as the Cup is called the New Testament because it is the Sacrament and Memorial of the same for neither the Cup nor that which is in it is a Testament St. Austin knew that Jesus Christ hath wholly paid our Ransom on the Cross and that there is no other Ransom but the Death of Jesus Christ to redeem us now the Eucharist is not the Death of Jesus Christ And if to apply the Sacrifice of the Cross unto us we must sacrifice Jesus Christ again by the same Reason to apply the Death of Jesus Christ unto us we must put him to Death again But what can we ask more since our Adversaries confess that Jesus Christ did not offer himself in Sacrifice in the Eucharist and put that Sacrifice among the unwritten Traditions So much Bellarmine confesseth in the first Book of the Mass Chap. 27. § Quinta The Oblation saith he which is made after the Consecration belongeth to the Integrity of the Sacrifice but not to the Essence of it which is proved because the Lord did not make that Oblation nor the Sacrifice at the first And both Baronius and the Jesuit Salmeron put the Mass and the Sacrifice of the same among the unwritten Traditions As for the Passage you alledge out of the Catechisms of Cyrill of Jerusalem I need say no more but that the Book which you quote is supposititious whose Style is far different from that of the other beforegoing God hath permitted that an evident Sign of Forgery should be in that Book the Author exhorteth his Hearers that they be no more Spectators of the Combats of Gladiators of the Amphitheater and of the Horse-races in the Hippodrome But since Jerusalem was Christian there hath been no Spectacles in the Amphitheater or Hippodrome Gesner in his Bibliotheca saith that he hath seen those Catechisms in the Library of Ausburg under the name of John of Constantinople Of the Invocation of Saints For the Invocation of Saints Your Grace alledgeth St. Ambrose in the Book of Widows where he saith That we must pray to the Angels that have the keeping of us and to the Saints and Martyrs of whom we may expect Assistance St. Ambrose writ that Book when he was a new Christian but he changed his Language after that time for in his Oration for Theodosius written long after he saith Thou alone O Lord must be called upon and prayed to And Mary was the Temple of God St. Ambr. l. 3. c. 12. de Sp. Sanct. but she was not God wherefore we must worship God alone who wrought in that Temple And a little before We read that we must not worship any but God for it is written Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God and him only shalt thou serve The Comment upon the Epistle to the Romans ascribed to Ambrose upon the first Chapter saith Address is made to the King by Colonels and Governours because the King is a man and knoweth not to whom he ought to commit the Administration of the State but to get Gods Favour who is ignorant of nothing for he knoweth what men are deserving there is no need of any ones Suffrage to help us but of a devout Spirit And upon Colos 1. Christ holds the Primacy in all things wherefore if any beleive that he must have Devotion for some Element or for some of the Angels and Powers let him know that he is in an Errour Chrysostom in his first Sermon of Penitence speaks thus God must be prayed to without an Intercessor And upon Heb. 1. in his third Homily Why do you look up to Angels gaping after them They are Servants to the Son of God sent to several places in your behalf And in the eighteenth Homily upon the Epistle to the Romans towards the end To whom wilt thou have Recourse Whose Help wilt thou implore Wilt thou call upon Abraham But he cannot hear thee Wilt thou call upon those Virgins But they will give thee none of their Oyl Wilt thou call upon thy Father or thy Grand-father but none of them though never so holy hath Power to alter that Judgment These things being considered thou must venerate him and pray to him alone who hath Power to blot out that Obligation and to put out that Flame St. Austin saith S. Aug. Enchir. c. 3. Of God alone we must ask the Good which we hope to do or hope to obtain by our good Works And in the Book of the Quantity of the Soul 34 chap. God alone must be served by the Soul for he alone is the Maker of it And in the last Chapter of the Book of the true Religion Let the Worship of dead men be none of our Religion for if they have lived godly they are not so disposed to seek such Honours but they would have us worship him by whose Illumination they rejoyce that we are Partners of their Dignity We must therefore honour them by way of Imitation and not worship them on the account of Religion And he speaks thus to God Idem l. confess c. 42. Whom can I find to reconcile me with thee Must I address my self to Angels By what Prayers By
his Disciples and from the words of Christ that he drunk the Fruit of the Vine we expound his other words this is my Bloud We expound also these words of Christ This is my Body from St. Pauls words who 1 Cor. 11. saith four times that we eat Bread in the Lords Supper and that we break Bread Certainly that Apostle giveth a clear Exposition of Christ's words This is my Body and this is my Blood saying 1 Cor. 10.16 The Cup of Blessing which we bless is it not the Communion of the Blood of Christ The Bread which we break is it not the Communion of the Body of Christ We alledge also those Texts that say that Jesus Christ is no more in this World that the Heaven doth contain him that Christ is like unto us in all things sin onely excepted and that by consequent he hath not a Body dispersed in a Million of several places at once and inclosed whole in every Crum of the Host and in every Drop of the Chalice Likewise when Jesus saith Do this in remembrance of me We expound not these words as the Councel of Trent doth which puts this Sense upon them I do constitute you to be Priests to sacrifice my Body really under the species of Bread and Wine but we bring the Interpretation which St. Paul addeth 1 Cor. 11.26 For as often as you eat this Bread and drink this Cup ye do shew the Lords Death Consider also that there is great Difference between a Judgment of Authority and a Judgment of Discretion With this last we judge of Meats by the Taste without giving Laws to any And it is so that not only Pastours but also every one of the People may and doth judge of the true Doctrine And it is so that St. Paul will have the Corinthians to judge of his Doctrine 1 Cor. 10.15 I speak as to wise men judge ye what I say Of that matter and of the Interpretation of Scripture I have written a Book purposely which I have dedicated to your Grace and which was presented to you by Monsieur de Cabrilles from me I asked your Grace at Liege whether you had received it Your Answer was that you knew not what was in it for you have laboured to strengthen your self with Reasons against us but would not take Notice how we answer them and have conversed much with our Adversaries but hid your self from your Servants who might have cleared your Mind about their Objections and armed you with Answers Of the Condemnation of Hereticks Your Grace saith farther that you have desired to see whether the ancient Hereticks were condemned by Persons of our Religion and whether one man be found in all Antiquity that had the same Religion as we in all Points These Condemnations of Hereticks were made by men sound in the Faith that were of the same Religion as we in all points who have condemned many Errours now received in the Roman Church The Councel of Laodicea approved by many Universal Councels which were held since rejecteth the Books of Judith Tobit Maccabees and other Apochryphal Books The Eliberin Councel held about the year of the Lord 305 hath made this Canon It is decreed that there shall be no Picture in the Church that the things that are adored or served be not painted upon Walls The Councels that have commanded the Adoration of Images are later by 4 or 5 hundred years In the first Nicen Councel the Marriage of the Pastors of the Church was approved upon the Remonstrance of Paphnutius Such is the fourth Canon of the Councel of Gangra If any makes a Difference of a married Priest as if he ought not to participate of the Oblation when he doth administer let him be Anathema This is the XXXV Canon of the Councel of Laodicea Christians must not forsake the Church of God and go to serve Angels and gather Congregations If any them be found applying himself to that secret Idolatry let him be Anathema because he hath forsaken the Lord Jesus Christ the Son of God About the year of the Lord 399 a Councel was held at Carthage of which this is the 23 Canon When Service is made at the Altar the Prayer must always be address't to the Father The present Roman Church contradicts that Canon for in their Service they have Prayers addrest unto Saints This is the 25 Canon of the same Councel In the Divine Service let nothing be offered but the Body and Blood of the Lord that is Bread and Wine mingled with Water The 16 Canon of the IV Councel of Carthage absolutely forbids swearing by the Creatures To this the Catechism of the Councel of Trent is contrary which approveth swearing by Relicks The 10 Canon of that Councel of Carthage saith Mulier baptizare non presumat Let not a Woman presume to baptize The Practise of the Roman Church is contrary to that The Milenitan Councel where St. Austin was present and of which he hath made the Canons forbids Appeals from Africk to Rome in these Words It is declared That if the Priests or other Clerks in such Causes as they shall have shall complain of the Judgment of their Bishops the Bishops shall hear them But he that will appeal beyond the Seas let him not be admitted to the Communion by any living in Africk In the VI Councel of Carthage there is a long Epstle of the Councel to Celestin Bishop of Rome who by a new Usurpation would draw to himself the Appeals of the Bishops of Africk whereby the Fathers of the Councel beseech him to receive no more Appeals from their Countrey forbidding him to send any more of his Legats or to use any more forged Canons to raise his Dignity and bring Worldly Pride into the Church of Christ Therefore Baronius and Bellarmin and Cotton Jesuits condemn that Councel In the Councel of Chalcedon held in the Year of the Lord 451 the Legats of the Bishop of Rome pretending to the Primacy and bringing forth a forged Canon of Nicea laboured to hinder the Bishop of Constantinople from being equal with the Bishop of Rome against which the Councel made this Canon The Fathers with good reason have given Prerogatives to the See of Antient Rome because she was the Imperial City And the hundred and fifty Bishops of the first Councel of Constantinople moved with the like consideration have attributed to the most holy See of New Rome which is Constantinople equal Priviledges judging with good reason that the City honoured with the Empire and the Senate and which hath the same Prerogatives as the Antient Rome Imperial ought to be magnified as much as Rome it self in Ecclesiastical things The Popes of our time and their Advocates condemn that Council not only because it equalleth the Bishop of Constantinople with that of Rome but chiefly because it groundeth the preeminence of the Bishop of Rome upon the Dignity of the City because Rome is the Capital City of the Empire and not
upon the Succession in the Apostleship of St. Peter For the Fathers of that Council do not acknowledge him in that Quality The Council of Aurange condemneth the Merits in the 12th Canon saying God loveth us according as we shall be by his Grace and not such as we shall be through our Merits In the Year of Our Lord 549 Reparatus Bishop of Cathage called a Synod in which Vigilius Bishop of Rome was anathematized as an Heretick Eutychian And Honorius Bishop of Rome was condemned by the VI and the VII Universal Councils as an Heretick Monothelite In the VI Council of Constantinople assembled again in the Palace of Trulle in the 17 and the 77 Canon the Church of Rome is expresly and by name condemned and is commanded to hinder no more the cohabitation of Priests with their Wives and to Fast no more on the Lords Day upon pain of Deposition or Excommunication Whence it appeareth by the way that the Greek and Eastern Church in which that Council was celebrated in which that Council was celebrated was not subject to the Roman Church since she prescribed Laws to her In the Year 754 a Council composed of 338 Bishops was held at Constantinople in which it was decreed that Images should be removed out of Churches and the worship of them was forbidden There also the Bread of the Eucharist is called the Image and the Figure of the Body of Jesus Christ But in the Year 787 the Empress Irene assembled another Council against that Council at Nicea in which Images were set up again and the Worship of them was commanded upon Pain of Anathema But in the year 794 the Emperour Charles the Great caused that Council of Nicea to be condemned by another Council assembled at Frankford although he knew that Pope Adrian was of a contrary Opinion and had defended that Council of Nicea by an express Book This is My Lord the Condemnation of Errours about our Controversies which I find in the ancient Councils Neither could I find any ancient Council which in matters of Faith condemns the Doctrine that we profess For the Chronicle of Gaultier which was shewed to your Grace representeth things falsly and doth not agree with other Authors of his Religion who justifie us against most of his Calumnies I am ready to undergo any Punishment if in the 500 years which your Grace mentions one only man be found that had a Religion any whit like the present Religion of the Roman Church In the ancient Church the publick Service was celebrated in the vulgar Tongue understood by the People The Laity received the Communion in the two kinds The reading of Scripture was not prohibited to the People The Church did not believe Purgatory Before the year 370 of the Lord no Tract is found of Invocation of Saints There was no Mention of Roman Indulgences nor of the Treasure of the Church in which the Pope hath laid up the Overplus of the penal Works and Satisfactions of Saints and Monks which he distributes among the People by his Indulgences In those days they made no Images of God They worshipped not the Images of Saints They adored not the consecrated Host with Worship of Latria They spake not of Accidents without a Subject They believed not that Mice could gnaw the Body of Christ or that it could be blown away be the Wind or stole or devoured by Beasts as we are taught in the Beginning of the Missal In those days the Bishops of Asia Africa Aegypt Graece c. took no Oath of Allegiance to the Roman Bishop in their Ordination and took no Letters of Investiture from him In those Days they believed not that Jesus Christ had eaten his own Body in the Communion They believed not that it was in the Priests Power to create his Creator The Pope did not style himself God and the Divine Majesty He boasted not that he could not err and that he was the Sovereign Judge of Controversies He drew no Souls out of Purgatory He took not upon him the Power of adding to the Creed He canonized no Saints He gave no Pardons of two or three hundred years He dispensed not with Vows and Oaths He dispensed no with Vows and Oaths He neither gave nor took away Kingdoms He put no Kingdom in Interdict In those days the Blessed Virgin Mary was not called the Queen of Heaven and the Lady of the World The Bishop of Rome did not bestow several Offices upon Saints charging one to look over such a Country another to such a Disease another to such a Trade They spake not in those days of Franciscan Fryars nor of Dominicans nor of Capucins nor of Jesuits nor of Beads Rosaries Agnus Dei and the like Commodities In a Word the Roman Religion is a Religion spick and span new and an horrible defacing of the ancient Religion taught by Christ and his Apostles If Your Grace hath such a great Desire to be instructed about Antiquity you may desire one of those that take upon them to instruct you to give you but one Example upon any of the forementioned Points I am sure that they will never undertake it it being utterly impossible I could shew to Your Grace that all these Inventions were devised to serve the Gain and Ambition of the Pope and his Clergy But I will pass to that which Your Grace addeth Of the Pope's Primacy From thence you pass to the Pope's Primacy and speak thus I sought to be informed whether all the Western Churches had not always acknowledged the Bishop of Rome to be the Primate and the Head of the visible Church established by our Lord for the Conduct of the same and seeing the Protestants were so far from rejecting the first five Centuries that they often both in their Sermons and Books quote and produce the Fathers that writ in those Ages I thought the shortest way for my Information would be to see what were the Sentiments of those Fathers in the controverted Points Truly my Lord that short way which you say you have taken is of an infinite Length and indeed there is no end of it It would have been a far shorter way to have asked of the ablest men of the Roman Church whether it may be found in Gods Word that God hath established the Pope Successor of St. Peter in his Apostleship and in his Primacy over the Universal Church They would have freely confest unto you that the Holy Scripture saith nothing of it and that it is a Tradition about which we have no Commandment of God I observe also that you speak only of the Western Churches whence I gather that he who suggested these things to your Grace knows that the Eastern and the African Church never acknowledged the Bishop of Rome in that Quality and Character Now those Churches were then greater than the Western as also they are ancienter Now by the Councils approved both by the Western and the Eastern Churches which I have already
and Sovereign Judges of the Sense of it Yet the Roman Church never made any Interpretation of Scripture which was generally approved We have onely Comments of Doctors who disagree among themselves Truly the Church of Rome intends not to make Scripture plainly understood since she hides it from the People and will not have it to be read and hath forbidden the Translation of it into the vulgar Tongues What Interpretation can we expect from the Pope who boasteth that he can change the Commandments of God and saith that Scripture is subject unto him Be pleased my Lord especially to consider whether it be just and reasonable that the Pope should be Judge in his own Cause and whether the Roman Church can be the Sovereign Judge of her own Duty and whether in this Question whether the Roman Church be a Sovereign Judge in points of Faith the Roman Church her Self can be the Judge To give you some Instances of this Jesus Christ saith to St. Peter Mat. 16.18.19 and to all his Apostles Whatsoever thou shalt bind on Earth shall be bound in Heaven c. Upon which Text the Roman Prelate groundeth his Primacy In Conscience is it just that he should be acknowledged the Sovereign and infallible Judge and Interpreter of those Texts upon which he groundeth his Empire For who can doubt but that he will give Judgment on his own side as indeed by his Interpretations he hath laid up for himself greater Riches than that of the greatest Kings and hath built to himself an earthly Empire See then how he interprets that Text. Because Christ hath said Whatsoever thou shalt loose on Earth the Pope pretends he may also loose those under the Earth drawing Souls out of Purgatory And whereas Jesus Christ in that Text speaks only of loosing Sinners that are bound with Ecclesiastical Censures the Pope from that Text assumes unto himself the Power of loosing Subjects from the Obedience sworn unto their Princes of dispensing with Oaths of freeing Children from the Obedience due to their Fathers and of dissolving Marriages lawfully contracted And whereas Christ gave to all his Disciples that loosing Power the Pope hath reserved unto himself many Cases in which none but himself can give Absolution Besides he so interpreteth that Text as if all that is said unto St. Peter was said unto the Pope of which yet the Scripture saith nothing and giveth to St. Peter no Successor in his Primacy or in his Apostleship Your self My Lord may judge whether the Pope who hath forbidden Marriage unto Bishops can be a good Interpreter of the words of the Apostle 1 Tim. 3.2 3. A Bishop must be the Husband of one Wife having his children subject in all gravity Whether the Pope having taken away the Cup of the Lords Supper from the Laity can be a good Interpreter of these words of Christ Drink ye all of it Whether the Pope and the Roman Church which by Canons of Councels command the Adoration of Images can be good Interpreters of the Second Commandement which forbids it Whether the Pope who makes Ordinances for publick Brothel-houses at Rome can be a good Interpreter of Gods Commandement Thou shalt not commit Adultery Whether the Pope who forbids Flesh and other Meats can be a good Interpreter of the Apostles Precept Whatsoever is set before you eat asking no question for Conscience sake Whether the Roman Church which in the Councel of Trent defineth that Coveting is no sin be a good Interpreter of the Commandement Thou shalt not covet Whether the Pope who brings into the publick Service a Language not understood by the People can be a good Interpreter of the fourteenth Chapter of the first Epistle to the Corinthians where it is so many times forbidden to pray and speak in the Church in an unknown Tongue Whether Pope John XXIII who denied the Immortality of the Soul and for that Crime and many more was condemned by the Councel of Constance could have been a good Interpreter of those Texts of Scripture which speak of Eternal Life For your part My Lord you take another course For without speaking of the Authority of the Roman Church which acknowledgeth no Judge but the Pope you say that you have found in the Fathers of the five first Centuries the Religion which you seem resolved to embrace Wherein you resist openly the Roman Church which admitteth not the Fathers for her Judges and condemn them very often of Errour Ignorance and Heresie Then you contradict the very Fathers who in a thousand places refuse to be believed or received for Judges and send the Reader continually to the Holy Scripture Hardly shall you find many Texts of Scripture wherein the Fathers agree about the Interpretation You may be pleased therefore to consider that you undertake a Journey in a way where you see no Light They are Greek and Latin Fathers which you never read and where you can get no Information for your Judgment A man that hath nothing else to do needs to spend ten years in study before he can get some mediocrity of knowledge in them and the words which they use are taken now in a quite different sense How can you know whether the Passages brought to you be faithfully alledged How can you know whether the Books whence they are taken be not supposititious Of which the Multitude is incredible But after all If the Verdict of the Fathers be received the Roman Church must be cast and it will appear that their Religion is but New Since the Roman Church and the Pope boast that they can alter the Commandements of God and make new Articles of Faith even in that they have a new Religion Now you may ask Who then shall be the Interpreter Who can give us the true Sense of Scripture I answer that since the Question here is of an Interpreter that cannot err and who shall always infallibly find out the true Sense there is no such in being God hath not in any place of his Word bestowed that Gift of Infallible Interpretation upon the Roman Church no more than upon the Greek or the Syrian There is no need of such an Interpreter for things necessary to Salvation are so clearly set down in Scripture that they need no Interpretation Must we have an Interpreter to know that God hath created the World that we must love God with all our heart that the Son of God is dead for us Now I say that all the Points necessary to Salvation are to be found in Scripture in terms as clear as these The Interpretations used by the Pastors of our Churches are taken from the Scripture it self so they are not the Interpreters it is God that expounds himself For Example When they expound these words This is my Body they take the Interpretation from Jesus Christ himself who saith that it is a Commemoration of him and from three Evangelists who say with one accord that Jesus Christ hath given Bread to