Interrogatories were ministred to infantes at the time of their Baptisme and that they had sureties which we call godfathers that answered for them and in their name T. C. Pag. 134. Sect. 1. As for S. Augustines place although I can (*) not allow his reason that he maketh nor the proportion that is betweene the sacrament of the body and bloude of our Sauiour Christe and his body and bloude it selfe of one side and betwene the sacrament of Baptisme and fayth of the other side saying that as the sacrament of the body of Christe after a sorte is the body so the baptisme of the sacrament of fayth is after a sort fayth (a) whereas he should haue sayd that as the supper beyng the sacrament of the body of Christe is after a sorre the body of Christe so baptisme beyng a sacrament of the bloude of Christe is after a sorte the bloud of Christe For fayth is not the subiect of Baptisme as the body and bloude of Christ is the matter of the supper Yet I say that S. Augustine hath no one worde to approue this abuse of answering in the childes name and in his person but goeth about to establishe an other abuse which was that it was lawfull for those that presented the chylde to say that it beleeued so that it is lyke that the minister did aske those whiche presented the infant whither they thought that it was faythfull and did beleeue and those which presented it sayde it was so wherevpon this question rose whither it was lawfull to say that the chylde beleeued Io. Whitgifte I neuer hearde that any learned man as yet mislyked this place of Augustine but I knowe they haue vsed it as a moste manifest testimonie agaynst Transubstantiation and the Reall presence and as a true declaration wherefore the sacramentall breade and wyne be called the body and bloude of Christe beyng but the sacramentes of the bodie and bloude of Christe And nowe you with vnwashed handes not vnderstanding the place presume to giue a blinde and vnlearned censure vpon so worthie and learned a Father euen there where he speaketh moste soundly and learnedly But howe should your arrogancie else appeare The supper is a sacrament bothe of the body and bloud of Christe the breade of the body and the Rom. 4. wine of the bloude as S. Augustine there sayeth and Baptisme is truly called by him the Sacrament of fayth bycause it is Signaculum iustitiae fidei as Circumcision the figure of Baptisme was accordyng to the worde of the Apostle ad Rom. 4. and therefore in reprouing S. Augustine for callyng it the Sacrament of fayth you séeme to be ignorant of this place of the Apostle To this saying of Augustine doth that of Tertullian in his booke De Poenitentia very well agrée where he speakyng of Baptisme Tertull. sayeth Lauacrum illud obsignatio est Fidci That washyng is the sealyng of faythe And Chrysostome opere imp Homil. 5. in Matth. sayeth also that Baptisme is the seale of Chrysost. fayth neyther did euer any man before you mislike this kinde and phrase of speache that baptisme is the sacrament of fayth S. Augustines woordes be euident that there were questions in Baptisme moued in the name of the infant whiche coulde not be vnlesse there were also answering to the same Chap. 1. the. 3. Diuision Admonition Thyrdely they prophane holy Baptisme in toying foolishely for that they aske questions of an infante whiche can not answere and speake vnto them as was wonte to be spoken vnto men and vnto such as beyng conuerted answered for themselues and were Baptised Whiche is but a mockerie l Gal 6. 7. of God and therefore agaynst the holy Scriptures Ansvvere to the Admonition Pag. 192. Sect. 1. 2. To the thirde superstitious toy as you call it that is the questions demaunded of the Infant at the tyme of Baptisme I haue also answered Augustine alloweth questions to the infant out of S. Augustine in the firste parte where it may also appeare that this manner of questionyng was vsed in the Baptising of Infantes long before Augustines tyme for Dionysius Areopagita maketh mention of them in like manner To proue that this questioning with the infant is a mocking of God you quote Galat. 6. verse 7. Be not deceyued God is not mocked for vvhatsoeuer a man sovveth that shall he reape Paule in this place taketh away excuses which worldlinges vse to make for not nourishing theyr pastours for no feyned excuse will serue bycause God is not mocked But what is this to the questionyng with infantes howe followeth this God is not mocked Ergo he that questioneth with Infantes mocketh God Truely you mocke God when you so dally with his Scriptures and seeke rather the glorie of quoting of many places of Scripture than the true applying of any one T. C. Pag. 134. Sect. 2. In the. 191. and. 192. pages he speaketh of this agayne but he bothe nothing else but repeate in bothe places that whiche is here onely he sayeth that it is a mockyng of God to vse the place of the Galatians God is not mocked agaynst this abuse and his reason is bycause S. Paule speaketh there agaynst those that by feyned excuses seeke to defraude the Pastor of his liuyng as who shoulde saye S. Paule did not conclude that particular conclusion thou shalte not by friuolous excuses defraude the minister with this generall saying God is not mocked for his reason is God is not mocked at all or in any matter therefore he is not mocked in this or as who shoulde say bycause our Sauiour Christe saying that it is not lawfull to separate that whiche God hath ioyned speaking of diuorce it is not lawfull to vse this sentence beyng a generall rule in other thinges when as we knowe it is as well and properly vsed agaynst the Papistes which seuere the cup from the breade as agaynst the Iewes which put away their wiues for euery small and triflyng cause Io. Whitgifte In déede it is a very mocking of God thus to abuse the Scriptures for the Authours of the Admonition alleage this text to proue that to question with Infantes is to mocke God when there is not one worde in that place spoken of questioning with infantes and therefore this texte is alleaged without purpose except you will say that it is quoted onely for the Phrase and manner of speakyng It is true that God is not mocked but this proueth not that questioning in Baptisme is to mocke God and therefore vaynely it is applied Those which seuer the cuppe from the bread in the Lordes Supper do separate that which God hath coupled and therefore that text may well be alleaged agaynst them but suche as question in Baptisme in the name of those that are to be baptised do not mocke God and therefore that texte is in the Admonition altogither abused Chap. 1. the. 4. Diuision T. C. Pag. 134. Sect. vlt. And as for this
taketh away life nor fire that consumeth the body which I moue vnto but it is the sworde of correction and discipline which may by sundrie other meanes be drawne out than by shedding of bloud That sword of discipline I call for still and say wyth Zuinglius If it be permitted that euery In his Epistle before his booke called Ecclesiastes man may freely defend his errors and spread abrode in the Church false doctrine there wil be more contentions sectes and discorde among Christian Churches than euer there was among Infidels And again If euery man may without controlment preach among the people his own priuate phansie and opinion contrary to the determination and authority of the Church it will shortly come to passe that we shall haue more errors than Christians If I haue accused any man vniustly there is a lawe whervnto I am subiecte but your words are not of that weight neither your defense suche that therefore they please or satisfie wise men bicause you speake them If they can say no more for them selues than you haue sayd for thē then they must remayne still in the same suspicion If there be any iust cause why ye shoulde haue the good abearing agaynst any man if you will come foorthe and orderly require it I am sure you may haue it But oh the mildnesse the patience and the quietnesse of this spirite of yours To the godly Readers grace and peace from God c. TWo treatises ye haue heere ensuing beloued in Christ which ye muste reade without a 1. Thes. 5. 21 Iam. 1. 19. 20 Iam. ▪ 2. 1. parcialitie or blinde affection For otherwyse you shall neither see their meaning nor refrayne your selues from rashly condemning of them without iust cause For certayne men there are of great countenance whiche will not lightly like of them bicause they principally concerne their persons and vniust dealings ▪ whose credite is great and whose friends are many we meane the lordely Lords Archbishops Bishops Suffraganes Deanes Doctors Archdeacons Chauncellours and the rest of that proude generation whose kingdome muste downe holde they neuer so harde b cause their tyrannous Lordship can not stande b Math. 15. 23 Luc. 16. 15. with Christes kingdome And it is the speciall mischiefe of our Englishe Churche and the chiefe cause of backwardnesse and of all breache dissention For they whose authoritie is c Mat 20. 25. 26. Mat. 23. 8. 9 10. Mar. 10. 42. 43. Luc. 22. 15. c. forbidden by Christ wil haue their stroke without their felow seruants yea though vngratiously cruelly and Popelike they take vppon them to d Mat. 24 48 49. beate them and that for their own childish Articles beeing for the most part against the manyfest truthe of God First by experience their rigour hathe too playnely appeared euer since their wicked raigne and specially for the space of these fiue or sixe yeres last past togither Of the enormities whiche with suche rigour they maynteine these treatises do in parte make mention iustly crauing redrèsse thereof But the matters do require a larger discourse Onely the authors of these thoughte it their partes to admonishe you at this time of those inconueniences whiche men seeme not to thinke vpon and whiche without reformation can not but increase further dissention the one parte beeing proude pontificall and tyrannous and the worde of God for the other parte expresse and manifest as if it pleased the state to examine the matters it woulde be euident And woulde to God that free conference in these matters might be had For howsoeuer learned and many they seeme to be they should may in this realme find inowe to match them and shame them too if they holde on as they haue begonne And out of this realme they haue all the best reformed Churches throughout Christendome agaynst them But in a fewe wordes to say what we meane Either muste we haue a right e Math. 9. 37. 38. Ephe. 4. 11. 12. ministerie of God and a right f Mat. 18. 15. 16. 17. gouernment of his Churche according to the Scriptures set vp both which we lacke or else there can be no right religion nor yet for contempt thereof can g Pro. 29. 18. Amos. 8. 11. 12. c. Ma. 21. 23. c. 1. Cor. 11. 30 Gods plagues be from vs any while differred And therefore though they linke in togither and sclaunderously charge poore men whome they haue made poore with grieuous faults calling them Puritans worse than the Donatists exasperating setting on such as be inauthoritie agaynst them hauing hitherto miserably handled thē with r uilings ▪ depriuations imprisonments banishments suche like extremities yet is these poore mens cause neuer the h Mat. 10. 16. 26. worse nor these chalengers the better nor God his i Esai 59. 1. hand the further of to linke in with his agaynst them nor you christian brethren must neuer the rather without examination k Exo. 23. 1. 2. Mat. 7. 1. 2. Iam 4. 11. 12 condemne them But thankfully take this taste whiche God by these treatises offereth you and weigh them by the worde of God and do your endeu ur euery man in his l 1. Cor. 5. 20 1. Cor. 7. 27 calling to promote his cause And let vs all with more m Psal. 50. 15. Mat. 7. 7. 1. Tim. 2. 1. 2 earnest prayer than we are wont earnestly commende it to God hys blessing and namely that it will please him by his spirite to lighten the heart of our most gracious Soueraigne and the rest in authoritie to the benefite of his small flocke and the ouerthrowe of their proude enimies that godlinesse may by them proceede in peace and God his glory through Iesus Christ be throughly aduaunced Whiche we call God to witnesse is our onely labour and suite And so presently we leaue you hartily beseeching God to graunt it Amen ¶ An answere to the Preface of the Admonition THese two treatises contayned in this Admonition as they be voyde of sound learning so are they full of blinde affection and stuffed with vncharitable and vnchristian Arrogancie and vnchristian speches of the Libellers termes and phrases Wherfore it is to be feared that they proceede not of loue but of hatred not of zeale but of malice not of humilitie but of arrogancie not of minds desirous to reforme but of stomackes seeking to deforme and confounde that which is in due forme and order by lawfull authoritie established For what charitable zealous and humble spirite would so spitefully and slaunderously speake of their brethren whose doctrine is pure whose zeale is feruent whose suffering for the Gospell hath beene in time of triall comparable with any mans that nowe liueth who haue also paynefully taught the worde of God in this Realme and do at this day and by whose ministerie the Gospell hathe taken roote and is come to that encrease that nowe God be thanked appeareth Surely
to whom God hath committed the sworde of gouernment such insolent audacitie against states and lawfull regiment is rather to be corrected with due punishment than confuted by argument T. C. Page 74. Sect. 6. 7. 8. As for Prelate of the Garter if it be a needefull office there are inowe to execute it besydes the Ministers which for as much as they be appointed to watche ouer the soules of men purchased with the bloude of Christ all men vnderstand that it is not meete that they shoulde attend vpon the bodie muche lesse vpon the legge and least of al vpon the Garter It is not vnlawfull for Princes to haue Ministers of their honor but also it is not lawfull to take those that God hath appoynted for another ende to vse to such purposes Thou seest here good reader that M. Doctor kepeth his olde wont of (*) Vntruthe manifest peruerting of the wordes and meanyng of the authors of the Admonition For whereas they saye that the name of Erle Countie Palatine Iustice of peace and Quorum Commissioner are Antichristian when they are giuen to the ministers of the Churche whose calling wil not agree with such titles he concludeth simply that they saye they be altogether vnlawfull and simply antichristian as if I should reason that it is not meete that the Queenes Maiestie should preache or minister the Sacramentes therefore it is not meete that there shoulde be any preachyng or Ministring of the Sacramentes Nowe letting passe all your hard wordes and vnbrotherly speaches with your vncharitable prognostications and colde prophesies I will come to examine whether you haue any better hap in prouing the office than you haue had in prouing the name Io. Whitgifte I sée no cause why he that is prelate of the garter maye not also sufficiently discharge his duetie in watching ouer the soule for I thinke the garter dothe not require such continuall or great attendance Those that are appointed to watche ouer y e soule are not exempted from bodily seruice to their Prince excepte you will take from the Prince not onely authoritie in Ecclesiasticall matters as you haue done but ouer Ecclesiasticall persons also as by this and such other lyke assertions you séeme to doe ▪ But here of more in place I peruert not the wordes of the Admonition as appeareth by their manifest wordes what their meaning is God knoweth But how little authoritie these offices should haue if your plat forme were framed shall be declared when I come to your seigniorie neyther the names nor offices that come from a Christian Prince that detesteth Antichrist can be called Antichristian vpon whom soeuer they be bestowed Wherevnto this your example tendeth of the Quéenes Maiestie wise men may easily coniecture It smelleth of that Papisticall cauillation Scilicet that we giue to hir Maiestie authoritie to preach and to administer the sacramentes bycause we acknowledge hir lawfull authoritie in Ecclesiasticall causes I pray God my prognostications be not to true the more I consider of your booke the more I am driuen to suspect it My hard speaches be within the bondes of modestie but yours may better beséeme the order you talke of then a man of your profession Chap. 2. the. 43. Diuision Ansvvere to the Admonition Pag. 68. Sect. 1. 2. Lordes Grace Lordbishop honor c. be names of reuerence teachyng vs to acknowledge our duetie towardes our superiours and their authoritie ouer vs. And it is much more to be reprehended not to giue honor to whom honor is due then to receyue honor when it is due You maye and you please in verye auncient Histories and in Titles of dig nitie in ministers not Antichristian great learned fathers see as honorable and reuerent titles giuen vnto Byshops as these be And surely it is not Antichristian to be called by names and titles not ambitiously soughte for but orderly and lawfully giuen according to the condition and state of the place wherin a man is But it is Antichristian that is proude presumptuous disdainfull arrogant and contemptuous to refuse to giue to euery one that name and title that by law ciuilitie and duetie of vs is required and expresseth our reuerence duetie and obedience You would speake as much of names of honor and reuerence in other persons if you durste be so bolde wyth them as you thinke you may be with some Io. Whitgifte Nothing is sayde to this The offices of Archbishops c are not strange or vnheard of in Christes Church and of superioritie among the Cleargie Chap. 3. the first Diuision Ansvvere to the Admonition Page 68. Sect. 3. 4. Pag. 69. Sect. 1. Nowe it followeth to proue that the offices signifyed by these names are not straunge and vnheard of in Christes Churche neyther yet plainly in Gods worde forbidden that they are not to be remoued but as most necessarie to be reteined It is without all doubte that both these names and offices haue Antiquitie of the offices bene in Christes Church long before Nicene Councell and that they haue had in the same continuance euen to this daye as partlye if may be gathered by that which I haue spokē before and most manifestly by all histories and learned writers from before that Councell of Nyce to this instant houre and therefore they little consydered what they writte when they set it downe that these names and offices were straunge and vnheard of in the Church of Christ. These men contemning auncient writers neuer read them that is the cause of such vnlearned assertions T. C. Pag. 75. Sect. 1. And wheras in the former treatise of the name of the Archbyshop he blew the trumpet before the victorie heere in this of the office he bloweth it before he commeth into the fielde or striketh one stroke saying that they little consider what they write that they are contemners of auncient writers and that they neuer read them and that they are vnlearned which denie these things which he affirmeth Well what we reade howe vnlearned we are is not the matter whiche we striue for the iudgemente thereof is first with God ▪ then with the Churches and in their iudgementes we are content to reste But if you be so greatly learned and we so vnlearned and smally read then the truth of oure cause shall more appeare that is maynteined with so small learnyng and reading agaynst men of such profound knowledge great reading And yet I knowe not why if we be not tooidle we should not be hable to reade as much as you which may haue leysure to reade a good long writer or euer you can ryde onely to see and salute your houses and liuings being so many and so farre distant one from an other And if we be so vnlearned and holde suche daungerous opinions of Papistrie and anabaptisme as you beare men in hand we doe why do you not by the example of the Ministers in Germanie procure a publike disputation where you may both winne