Selected quad for the lemma: body_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
body_n	blood_n	break_v	shed_v	10,145	5	9.7147	5	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A64642	Eighteen sermons preached in Oxford 1640 of conversion, unto God. Of redemption, & justification, by Christ. By the Right Reverend James Usher, late Arch-bishop of Armagh in Ireland. Published by Jos: Crabb. Will: Ball. Tho: Lye. ministers of the Gospel, who writ them from his mouth, and compared their copies together. With a preface concerning the life of the pious author, by the Reverend Stanly Gower, sometime chaplain to the said bishop.	Ussher, James, 1581-1656.; Gower, Stanley.; Crabb, Joseph, b. 1618 or 19.	1660 (1660)	Wing U173; ESTC R217597	234,164	424

gain and profit is there in our blood Psalm 30.9 God is full of Grace and Compassion and he considers that we are but dust And happy are we that we are but dust Had we been more glorious Creatures as Angels we had not had the benefit of a Saviour When they rebelled God considered their mettal And as with an high hand they rebelled So the Lord reserved them in everlasting chains under darkness unto the Judgement of the great day Jude 3. 1 Thes. 1.10 They fell without a Redeemer It is well for us that God considereth that we are but dust For by Jesus Christ he saveth us from the wrath to come It had been better for us never to have been born then to be born fire-brands of hell But now the point is that we are Brands pluckt out of the fire Zach. 3.2 It is fit therefore we should know who is our Redeemer Now as I have shewed you the last day it is Jesus Christ And here consider 1. Christ Jesus offered for us for the satisfaction of Gods Justice and this is his priestly office 2. As there was no Remission without shedding of blood therefore after the blood is shed and the Priest offered himself there comes a second thing else we are never the better and that is Christ offered to us This makes up our comfort Many talk of the extent of Christs Death and Passion saying he dyed sufficiently for us which is an improper speech For what comfort were this that Christ was offered for us if there were no more A bare sufficiency in Christ serves not the turn this were a cold comfort As if a man that were in debt afraid of every Serjeant every Sheriffe should be told Sir there is money enough in the Kings Exchequer to discharge all your debts This is very true but what is that to him what comfort hath he by it unless the King make him an offer to come take freely for his discharge And a cold comfort were it to us to know Christ to be sufficient for us unless he invite us to take freely of the waters of life Ho every one of you that thirsteth come you to the waters c. Isa. 55.1 Thus unless Christ be offered to us as well as for us we are never the near Now to make this appear Observe that in every Sacrament there are two acts of the Minister The one hath Relation to God a Commemoration of the Sacrifice in which respects the ancient Fathers called it a Sacrifice the other the breaking of the Bread and pouring out of the Wine wherein there is a Commemoration of the body broken and the blood shed not as they are concomitants the Wine in the bread as the foolish Papists dream for that were rather a commemoration of his life then of his death when the blood runs in the veins The commemoration of Christs death is made by separation of the blood from the body and as there is one Act of the Minister in cons●crating by breaking the body and pouring out the blood so there is a second Act which is ministerial When the Minister saith Take eat This is my body as if Christ were present and said Come Take my body thou hast as free an interest to it as when thou art invited to thy friends table thou hast right to the meat before thee So that as Christ is offered for thee so he is offered to thee And what now should hinder thee unless thou art one that will obstinately oppose thy own salvation and say I will not have this man to rule over me thou canst not miscarry But if thou wilt be thine own lord perish in thine infidelity Here be the keyes of the Kingdom of Heaven given unto Gods Ministers unless thou wilfully oppose thine own salvation and shut that door of salvation which Christ hath opened so wide for thee See the ways of God are plain Christ hath paid a great price for thee and then as great as it is he offers it to thee Now for the former of these which is Christs satisfaction made unto the Father for us I made choice of this place of Scripture which sets it out particularly Herein two things are to be observed 1. The person who it is that will thus humble himself the Apostle grounds his Exhortation on the fourth verse where he tels us We ought not to look every man on his own things but every man on the things of others Let this mind be in you which also was in Christ Jesus If Christ had looked only on his own things he might have saved himself a great deal of labor and pains He being the Son of God might as soon as he was born have chalenged a seat with God in Glory He need not go per viam He might be Comprehensor in meta but he would pass on to his journeyes end in a thorny and troublesome way Let then the same mind be in you which was in Christ Jesus who minded not his own things but the good of others 2. What it was wherein he humbled himself he took upon him the form of a servant and was obedient unto the death of the Cross. The highest humiliation that can be that he who is above all praise whom Angels adored that he should be brought from heaven to earth and not only be a pilgrim there but have a sorrowfull and pittifull pilgrimage and at last to be cut off by a shamefull death from the land of the living this humiliation hath no parallel The depth of the humiliation consists in the height of the person thus humbled and were not he so high it could have done us no good It 's no small satisfaction that can appease Gods wrath therefore the Apostle to the Hebrews speaking of Melchisedeck the type of Christ concludes how great this man was Consider the invaluable price how great he was who being in the form of God he who was fellow and fellow-like with God as good as himself as great as himself was thus humbled It was the second person in the Trinity he and no other that was thus humbled for thee He was weary for thee and reviled for thee sweated and fainted for thee hungred for thee and was buffeted for thee It was he the second person of the Trinity in proper speech without either Trope or Figure shed his blood for thee died for thee and suffered all these things in his assumed nature taking on him the form of a servant though not in his divine He remaining God alone could not die but yet die fain he would for thee therefore he took thy nature on him that he might die for thee in the assumed nature He took not on him the nature of Angels but the seed of Abraham He being the fountain of life and the Prince of our life and without sheding of blood no Redemption could be wrought having not blood to shed as God therefore took our nature on him as it

jealousie shall smoke against that man c. We are but now entred into the point but it would make your hearts ake throb within you if you should hear the particulars of it All that I have done is to perswade you to make a right choise to take heed of Satans delusions Why will ye die Ezek. 33. Therefore cast away your sins and make you a new heart and a new spirit for why will you die Where the golden candlestick stands there Christ walks there he saith I am with you Where the word and Sacraments are there Christ is and when the wo●d shakes thy heart take that time now choose life Why will you die Consider of the matter Moses put before the people life and death blessing and cursing We put life and death before you in a better manner He was a Minister of the letter we of the spirit Now choose life But if you will not hearken but will needs try conclusions with God therefore because you will choose your own confusions and will not hearken unto God because you will needs try conclusions with him will not obey him when he calls therefore he will turn his deaf ear unto you and when you call and cry he will not answer Prov. 1. I presse this the more to move you to make a right choise But now to turn to the other side as there is nothing but death the wages of sin and as I have shew'd you where death is so give me leave to direct you to the fountain of life There is life in our blessed Saviour if we have but an hand of faith to ●ouch him we shall draw vertue from him to raise us up from the death of sin to the li●e of righteousnesse 1 John 5.12 He that hath the Son hath life he that hath not the Son hath not life You have heard of a death that comes by the first Adam and sin and to that stock of original sin we had from him we have added a great heap of our own actual sins and so have treasured up unto our selves wrath against the day of wrath Now here is a great treasure of happiness on the other side in Christ have the Son and have life The question is now whether you will choose Christ and life or sin and death Consider now the Minister stands in Gods stead and beseeches you in his name he speaks not of himself but from Christ. When he draws near to thee with Christs broken body and his blood shed and thou receive Christ then as thy life and strength is preserved and encreased by these Elements so hast thou also life by Christ. If a man be kept from nourishment a while we know what death he must die If we receive not Christ we cannot have life we know that there is life to be had from Christ and he that shall by a true and lively faith receive Christ shall have life by him There is as it were a pair of Indentures drawn up between God and a mans soul there is blood shed and by it pardon of sin and life convey'd unto thee on Christs part Now if there be faith and repentance on thy part and thou accept of Christ as he is offered then thou mayst say I have the Son and as certainly as I have the bread in my hand I shall have life by him This I speak but by the way that the Sun might not set in a cloud that I might not end only in death but that I might shew that there is a way to recover out of that death to which we have all naturally praecipitated our selves ROM 6.23 The wages of sin is death THe last day I entred on the Declaration of the cursed effects and consequents of sin and in general shew'd that it is the wrath of God that where sin is there wrath must follow As the Apostle in the Epistle to the Galathians As many as are under the works of the Law are under the curse Now all that may be expected from a God highly offended is comprehended in Scripture by this term Death Wheresoever sin enters death must follow Rom. 5.2 Death passed over all men forasmuch as all had sinned If we are children of sin we must be children of wrath Eph. 1.3 We are then children of wrath even as others Now concerning death in general I shew'd you the last time that the state of an unconverted man is a dead and desperate estate He is a slave It would affright him if he did but know his own slavery and what it is that hangs over his head that there 's but a span betwixt him and death he could never breath any free aire he could never be at any rest he could never be free from fear Heb. 2.15 the Apostle saith that Christ came to deliver them that through fear of death were all their life time subject to bondage This bondage is a deadly bondage that when we have done all that we can doe what 's the payment of the service Death And the fear of this deadly bondage if we were once sensible if God did open our eyes and shew us as he did Belshazzar our doom written did we but see it it would make our joynts loose and our knees knock one against another Every day thou livest thou approachest nearer to this death to the accomplishment and consummation of it death without and death within death in this world and in the world to come Not onely death thus in gross and in general but in particular also Now to unfold the particulars of death and to shew you the ingredients of this bitter cup that we may be weary of our estates that we may be drawn out of this death and be made to fly to the Son that we may be free indeed Observe that Death is not here to be understood of a separation of the soul from the body only but a greater death then that the death of the soul and body We have mention made of a first resurrection Rev. 20.6 Blessed and happy is he that hath his part in the first resurrection for on such the second death hath no power What is the first resurrection It is a rising from sin And what is the second death It is everlasting damnation The first death is a death unto sin and the first resurrection is a rising from sin And so again for all things the judgments or troubles that appertain to this death all a man suffers before It is not as fools think the last blow that fells the tree but every blow helps forward 'T is not the last blow that kills the man but every blow that goes before makes way unto it Every trouble of mind every anguish every sicknesse all these are as so many strokes that shorten our life and hasten our end and are as it were so many deaths Therefore however it is said by the Apostle It is appointed for all men once to die yet we see the Apostle to

is Heb. 10.5 Sacrifice and offering thou wouldst not but a body thou hast prepared me then said I Io I come in the volumn of thy book it is written of me to do thy Will O God As if he should have said Lord I am not able to accomplish thy Will or to be subject to thee in thy nature therefore thou hast made me a man that in the form of a servant I might shew obedience which I could not while I was in nature equal unto thee Now consider how great this person is that hath suffered all for thee Rev. 1.5 Jesus Christ who is the faithfull witness the first begotten of the Dead and the Prince of the Kings of the earth to have a great Prince bound like a thief araigned and executed the consideration of this state of the person would move a stony heart Rev. 17.14 He is the Lord of Lords and King of Kings Amongst men the Father is more honourable then the Son and the Son is but a servant untill he be emancipated but it is not so in the Divinity but the Father and the Son are both alike honourable Among men the Son hath the same specifical nature with the Father but not the same individual but it is not so in the Divinity the Father and the Son there have the self same individual nature I and my Father are one therefore there must be an equality The Pharisees themselves could draw this conclusion that if he were the Son of God he was equal with God John 5.18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him because he said God was his Father making himself equal with God A man would think how could that follow He was but Gods Son but Gods Son must be equal to the Father In making himself Gods Son he made himself equal with God and therefore know upon this and by this stands the point of our Redemption If a pure and holy Angel had suffered never so much it would not have availed for our Redemption It is a price no man nor Angel must meddle with all It will require a greater Price It was God himself that suffered in his assumed nature He and no other person for we must understand though Christ took on him the nature of a man yet not the person of a man here stands the point the second person in the Trinity is the Suppositum of all this humiliation and therefore observe when the point of suffering comes there 's a remarkable speech Zach. 13.7 Saith the Son to the Father it was against his heart to smite him the expression is a lively one it went to his heart to smite one that was his equal that did him no wrong Awake O sword against my Shepherd and against the man who is my fellow You know of whom it is spoken by M●thew Mat. 26.31 I will smite the Shepherd and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered The Lord is ready to break him Isa. 53. The sword was as it were unwilling to smite The man that is my fellow A blow lighting on Gods fellow equal with God of what value is it Consider the difference betwixt a man and a man The State of a Prince makes great odds between that is done to him and that is done to another man When David would adventure himself into the battel Thou shalt say they go no more with us least they quench the light of Israel 2 Sam. 21.17 and more fully 2 Sam. 18.3 Thou art worth ten thousand of us they would not hazzard the person of the King in the battel Why because thou art worth ten thousand of us The dignity of a Prince is so great that ten thousand will not countervail the loss of him If this be the esteem and worth of David what is the worth of Davids Prince If thus with a King what with the King of Kings and Lord of Lords This is a great ground of the sufficiency of Christs suffering Heb. 9.13 If the blood of Buls and Goates sanctifie to the purifying of the flesh how much more verse 14. shall the blood of Christ who through his eternal Spirit offered himself to purge your Consciences from dead works to serve the living God It is not the offering of the body only but he did it through his eternal Spirit When the Martyrs and Saints offered themselves a sacrifice they offered it through the flames of their love and therefore embraced the stake and love is described as strong as death but Christ did not offer his sacrifice with the flames of his love though love was in him the greatest that ever was but with the everlasting flames of his God-head and Deity with that fire from heaven which is a consuming fire He did the deed that will purge our Consciences from dead works Act. 20.28 Take heed unto your selves and to the flock over which the holy Ghost hath made you oversee●s to feed the Church of G●d which he hath purchased with his precious blood God hath purchased the Church with his own blood Who 's blood Gods blood The blood of God must be shed He who thought it no robbery to be equal with God must shed his own blood As Zippora saith to Moses A bloody husband hast thou been to me Exod. 4.25 So may Christ say to his Church a bloody Spouse hast thou been to me that my blood must be shed for thee 1 Cor. 2.8 Had they known they would not have crucified the Lord of Glory that is they would not have crucified God He that was crucified was the glorious Lord God Acts 3.15 You denyed the holy one and killed the Prince of life Here 's the matter unless the Prince of life had been killed thou couldst not have life This the Apostle sets down as the ground of all before he comes to the particularities of his humiliation and sets down who it was who was thus humbled He whom the Heaven of Heavens could not contain he must descend unto the lower-most parts of the earth that 's a descent indeed His Humiliation appears in this that he who was thus high became a man and being found in fashion as a man he humbled himself and became obedient unto death even the death of the Cross. In this humiliation consider I say these two Points 1. The person who was humbled 2. The point of his humiliation Some things hath regard to the whole course of his life others to the conclusion or period of his life All his life from his incarnation to his passion was a continual thred of humiliation from his Cradle to his Cross from his womb to his Tomb so here is set down the humbled life of our blessed Saviour For I would not have you think his humiliation consisted only in coming to the Cross when they so mercilesly handled him it cost him more then so as sinners have the curse of God on them in their life as well as in their death so Christ must have a

It helps our understanding by being a sign and is a confirmation as a seal by vertue whereof Christ is passed and made over to us so that we have as true an interest and right to him as to our meat and drink yea hereby he becomes as effectually ours for every purpose in our spiritual life as our meat and drink doth for our corporal To which end these Elements are changed spiritually in their natures not in substance but in use so that which was but now a common bread becomes as far different as heaven is from earth being altered in its use For instance the wax whereby the King passes over an inheritance to us and by which conveyances of our estates are made that wax is but as another piece of wax differing nothing from that which is in the shop till the King hath stampt it with his Seal but being once sealed one would not give it for all the wax in the Kingdome for now it serves to another use so is it here in these elements but still know the difference is not in the matter or substance but in the use And this is the reason why this blessed bread and wine is termed a communion namely because it is an instrument whereby Christ instates me into himself and whereby I have fellowship and communion with him In the words then we have these particulars viz. 1. A sinne If any man shall presume to eat that bread or drink that cup unworthily It s a dangerous thing a great sin to eat and drink at the Lords Table in an unworthy manner 2. A punishment He eats and drinks damnation or judgement unto himself So that now what was ordained to life and appointed to be a seal and confirmation of Gods love and favour is now changed and become a seal and confirmation of Gods anger and indignation The unworthy receiving of it makes it prove cleane contrary to what it was intended 3. A reason because he discernes not the Lords body but takes them as ordinary things deeming the elements not different from the bread and wine which we have at our Tables not knowing that they are the dishes wherein Christ is served in unto us that by these the greatest gift is given us and nourishment conveyed for the maintenance of our spiritual life This life was given us in baptisme but in and by these signes is conveyed spiritual nourishment for the continuance and maintenance of it for the strengthning of our faith and making us daily stronger and stronger to fight the Lords battles Now when we discern not this nor by the eye of faith see Christ Jesus crucified for us and by these elements conveyed unto us but take them hand over head without any consideration we receive them unworthily and a fearful indignity is offered unto Christ which he will certainly revenge I 'le then 1. Shew in general what it is to eat unworthily 2. What it is to eat judgement and then 3. I 'le come to the particulars how this sin may be avoided and what the particulars are wherein the sin consists 1. Concerning the first What it is to eat unworthily Obj. And here may some say is there any of us who can avouch that he eats and drinks at the Lords Table worthily is any so presumptuous to say that he is worthy to eat Christs flesh and drink his blood As for bodily food and entertainment the Centurion could say I am not worthy that thou shoulds come under my roof How then comes this to passe that he which eats and drinks the Lords body unworthily eats and drinks damnation to himself Sol. But here understand what is set down worthiness is not always taken for a matter of merit or proportion of worth between the person giving and receiving but in Scripture it 's often taken for that which is meet fitting and beseeming And in this sense the Apostle uses it 1 Cor. 16.4 If it be meet that I go also they shall go with me If it be meet the word in the Original is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or worthy which is here rightly translated meet so in that Sermon of Saint John Baptist Mat. 3.8 bring forth fruits meet for repentance that is fruits beseeming amendment of life And in this sense are we said to walk worthy of God who hath called us to his Kingdom and glory VVorthy of God that is worthy of that calling God hath imparted to us 1 Thes. 2.12 And therefore to use the similitude as I have elsewhere If the King should vouchsafe to come into a Subjects house and finde all things fit and beseeming so great a Majesty that Subject may be said to give the King worthy entertainment not that a Subject is worthy to entertaine his Prince but the meaning is he provided all things which were meet and fit for the entertainment of him So is it here if we prepare our selves with such spiritual ornaments to entertain the King of glory as are requisite for those who approach his Table though our performances come far short of the worth of his presence yet we may be said to eat his body and drink his blood worthily When the King in the Gospel had prepared his feast two sorts of guests there were who were unworthy 1. Those that made light of the invitation who had their excuses when they should come to the feast One must go to his farme another to try his Oxen Luke 14.18 2. Others there were who came and yet were unworthy guests for coming unpreparedly for in the midst of the feast the King comes in to view his guests and beholds a man that did not refuse to come but yet came without his wedding garment and so came unworthily for not coming preparedly Yea see then there may be an unworthinesse in those that do come since they come unfitted and unbeseeming such a banquet They are unworthy receivers of the Lords body and he accounts it an irreverent usage of him In like manner may some say touching the Ministry of the Word May not I read a good Sermon at home with as much profit what needs all this stirre Why here 's the advantage and priviledge you get in the publick Ministry of the Word God himself comes down as a King amongst us he views his guests and considers who comes with his wedding garment who comes preparedly Christ comes and looks on us and where two or three are gathered together in his name there he hath promised to be in the midst of them He walks in the midst of the golden Candlesticks the Ministers of his Word he takes a special view of those that come and frequent his Ordinances and to reward them You see then what it is to eat worthily it s to do it with that reverence that is requisite where the King of heaven is the Master of the Feast Now this being the sin unmannerliness and unprepared approaching his Table we come to the second thing viz. 2. The punishment

and feet But that which he shed in the garden in the cold winter time when he shed great drops great clots of blood thickest blood that pierc'd his garment and ran down upon the ground Consider how much blood he lost when he was whipped and lashed when the spear came to the very Pericardium thus let us weigh his torments and it will be a means to make us much affected with his sufferings for us But this is not all there is another thing yet in the blood this was but the outward part of his sufferings Yet some there are who are against Christs sufferings in his soul If it were so say they then something either in the sacrifices of the old Testament or in the new Testament should signifie it What ever such persons object against it I am sure there was as much in the sacrifices of the old Testament as could possibly be in a Type to signifie it Now that I may make this to appear know that in every sacrifice there were two parts or two things considerable and those were the Body and the Blood the whole was to be made a sacrifice viz. both Body and blood the body was to be burned the blood to be poured forth Now nothing in a beast can signifie the sufferings of Christ in soul better then the pouring out of the blood Lev. 17.11 The blood was the life and this is that which had a relation to the soul and was therefore as in the same place appears poured out as an attonement for the soul And to this in our common prayers there is an allusion viz. Grant us gracious Lord so to eat the flesh of thy dear son Jesus Christ and to drink his blood that our sinful bodies may be made clean by his body and our souls washed through his most precious blood And in Isa. 53.12 The Metaphor holds He poured out his soul unto death for us So that whatever some have fondly thought its evident and manifest that Christ suffered both in soul and body both soul and body were made an offering for sin who knew no sin I should have gone further but the time cuts me off FINIS HEB. 4.16 Let us therefore come boldly ùnto the throne of grace that we may obtaine mercy and finde grace to help in time of need IN handling heretofore the Doctrine of the conversion of a sinner I declar'd and shew'd you what mans misery was and what that great hope of mercy is that the Lord proposeth to the greatest sinner in the world I shew'd unto you the means whereby we may be made partakers of Christ and that was by the grace of faith which doth let fall all other things in a mans self and comes with an open and empty hand to lay hold on Christ and fill it self with him I shew'd you also the acts of Faith as it justifies And now because it is a point of high moment wherein all our comfort stands and in which it lies I thought good to resume it all again so farre as may concerne our practice that we may see what the work of Gods Spirit is from the first to the last in the conversion of a sinner from the corruptions and pollutions of the flesh in which he wallowed and to this purpose have I chosen this place of Scripture wherein we are encouraged by Gods blessed Word that what ever we are though accursed and the greatest sinners in the world and that whatever we want we should come to Gods throne of grace And we are to think that whatever sinnes are or have been committed and though our sinnes are never so great yet that they are not so great as the infinitenesse of Gods mercy especially having such not only an Intercessor but Advocate to plead the right of our cause so that Christ comes and he pleads payment and that however our debts are great and we runne farre in score yet he is our ransome and therefore now Gods justice being satisfied why should not his mercy have place and free course This is the great comfort that a Christian hath that he may come freely and boldly to God because he comes but as for an acquittance of what is already paid As a debtor will appear boldly before his creditor when he knows his debt is discharg'd he will not then be afraid to look him in the face Now we may come and say Blessed Father the debt is paid I pray give me pardon of my sinnes give me my acquittance And this is that boldnesse and accesse spoken of Rom. 5.2 In whom we have accesse by faith Now that I may not spend too much time needlesly come we to the ground and matter in the words Wherein there is 1. A preparative for grace 2. The act it self whereby we are made partakers of the grace of God First the preparatives are two The law and the Gospel and wrought by them The first preparative 1. Wrought by the Law The Law works in a time of great need this is the first preparative for a man to be brought to see he stands in great need of Gods mercy and Christs blood so that the sinner cries out Lord I stand in great want of mercy His eyes being thus opened he is no longer a stranger at home but he sees the case is wondrous hard with him so that he concludes Unlesse God be merciful unto me in Christ I am lost and undone for ever This is the first preparative and till we come to it we can never approach the throne of grace The second is 2. Wrought by the Gospel I see I stand in great need but by this second preparative we see a Throne of grace set up and that addes comfort unto me If God had onely a throne and seat of Justice I were utterly undone I see my debt is extreme great but the Gospel reveals unto me that God of his infinite mercy hath erected a Throne of grace a City of refuge that finding my self in need my soul may flie unto And now to fit us for this Gods blessed Spirit works by his Word to open unto us the Law and our wants to enlighten our understandings that we stand in great need to win our affection and open the Gospel and its comforts Therefore first for the time of need the Law reveals unto us our woful condition to be born in sin as the Pharisee said and yet not able to see it Every man may say in generalities I am a sinner yet to say and know himself to be such a sinner as indeed he is to stand in such need that he cannot do This one would think to be a matter of sence but unlesse Gods Spirit open our eyes we can never see our selvs to be such sinners as we are or else what is the reason that the child of God cries out more against his sinne and the weight thereof after his conversion than he did before What are his sinnes greater or more than they were