copies which the Authors writ and whereby that should be tried that we say So that in the ages to come when the old copies shall be worne out and their New-purged ones shall haue gotten a little antiquitie these desperate Termagants will resolutely deny that euer any such thing was written or any such purging vfed so it shal be generally maintained that the things that the Iesuites and censors haue clapt into their bookes were written by the authors themselues If this can be answered what do pillories and papers ordained for forgers when not a poore parchment of euidence but the deeds and euidences of the Christian world shall thus be forged and all antiquitie be Iesuited and reduced by this practise to the new cut 2 In the meane time I answer the Iesuite that I wil stand to my offer if he will let the triall be made by bookes vnpurged such as are the true copies that the authors published that there is no point of our faith but many learned in their owne Church hold it with vs and no point of Papistrie that we haue reiected but some of them haue misliked it as well as we and his two instances of the Masse and Reall presence I accept though I haue answered them a Pag. 158. letter m. 178. lett e. 379. lett f. in THE WAY so directly that it was his best policie to dissemble it and to require me for my credit to do that which I had done alreadie For to his first demand How many learned men of our Church haue denied the Masse to containe a sacrifice in such sort as Protestants do denie I answered b Vbi sup in two seuerall places For the vnderstanding whereof and the applying my said answer to this place the Protestants denie that Christ in his last Supper which the Iesuite absurdly calls the Masse offered any propitiatorie sacrifice properly so called according to the reall notion of the word sacrifice of his bodie and bloud This I shewed by the testimonie c Can. loc l. 12. c. 13. Suar. com 3. d. 84. f. 2. Azor instit moral tom 1. l. 10. c. 18. of three seuerall Papists to be denied by some Catholickes in the Councell of Trent and they consequently denie as we do that the Priest offers any such sacrifice d Christus ea quae ab alijs obseruanda instituit ipse primitùs obseruarit Tho 3. q. 81. art 1.0 In hac quaestione initium sumendum est ex facto Christi quod exemplar est actioniâ— nostrae fundamentum ac primum initium huius mysterij Fra. Suar. vbi sup pag. 949. because the Priest now doth no more then Christ did then in his Supper They therefore that denie Christ offered any sacrifice denie it also in the Priest And then I alledged a discourse of Thomas where he propounds the question Whether in this Sacrament Christ be immolated that is sacrificed and his answer is that the celebration of this Sacrament is called the sacrificing of Christ for two causes First because images are vsed to be called by the names of the things whose images they be as when we behold a picture on a table we say this is Cicero Now the celebration of this Sacrament is a certaine image representing the passion of Christ which is his true sacrificing and therefore is called the sacrificing of Christ Next in regard of the effect of Christs passion because by this Sacrament we are made partakers of the benefit of our Lords passion In which words making no mention of such reall and vnbloudie sacrificing as the Church of Rome now teaches it is more then plaine that he beleeued it not For if he had he would haue vttered it as fully as he doth other things Besides these I ad the Master of Sentences who e If we talke of all Diuinitie the bookes of Peter Lombard Master of the Sentences is held to be the first methodicall worke that drew all diuinitie into a certaine forme Walsing p. 128. professing to set downe all the points of Diuinitie most exactly as our aduersaries say yet no where in all his booke mentions this kinde of sacrifice but f 4. d. 12 §. Post haec quaeritur propounding the question Whether that which the Priest doth in the Eucharist be properly said to be a sacrifice or immolation and whether Christ be dayly sacrificed or were onely once sacrificed his answer is To this it may briefly be said that which is offered and consecrated by the Priest is called a sacrifice and an oblation because it is a memoriall and representation of the true sacrifice and holy immolation made vpon the altar of the crosse and Christ died once vpon the Crosse and was there sacrificed in himselfe but he is dayly sacrificed in the Sacrament because the remembrance of that which is once done is retained These words shew plainely that some learned men in the Romane Church haue denied the Masse to containe a sacrifice euen in such sort as Protestants denie it 3 So there be also that affirme the reall substance of Christs bodie to be no nearer them that receiue the Sacrament then heauen is to the earth as the Caluinists hold For Picus Mirandulus g Conclus pag 64. nu â—4 pag 65. nâ— 20. sayes the bodie of Christ is sacramentally on the altar but locally in heauen and one bodie cannot be in diuers places at once And the opinion of the Caluinists is no otherwise then h Effectum tandem vt in hanc insaniam prorumperet Berengarius vt verum corpus sanguinem Christi non esse an pane vino docuerit haec haeresis apud Heluetios hoc nostro tempore per Caluinum reuocatae est Prateol Elenc verbo Berengarius Berengarius and yet Waldensis i Sacrament Eucharist c. 19. pag. 17. tom 2. writes that there were many that with the Church of Rome condemned Berengarius for his maner of speaking which yet thought as he did And k THE WAY pâ—g 349. I alledged a saying of l 4. d. 10. q. 1. §. Quantum Scotus that from the beginning since the matter of this Sacrament was beleeued it hath euer bene beleeued that Christs bodie is not moued out of his place in heauen that it might be here in the Sacrament and yet it was not in the beginning so manifestly beleeued as touching this conuersion Where Scotus affirmes that it hath not alway bene beleeued that the bodie of Christ is moued out of heauen to be in the Sacrament * Note touching the forme of recantation prescribed to Berengarius by Pope Nicolas wherein the Pope enioynes him to say J confesse the bread and wine after consecration to be the true body and bloud of Christ and to be sensibly handled in the hands of the Priest yea broken and chewed with the teeth of the faithfull Which words are read de Consec d. 2 ego Bereng and pressed by the
aduersaries If he thinke his Diuines haue spoken so abundantly for it let him say ingeniously how chances his Bellarmine d De iustif l. 5. c. 7. confesses that by reason of the vncertenty of a mans owne righteousnesse and for feare of vaine glorie the safest way is to repose our whoâ—â— confidence in the sole mercy and goodnesse of God how chance his Waldensis saies e Pag. 30. Sacram The same merit of condignity condeÌ„ned also by Grego Ariminensis Burgensis Echius saies Vega qu. 5. de merit p. 788. He is to be reputed the sounder Diuine and the better Catholicke and more consonant with the Scripture that simply denies such merit confessing that simply no man merits the kingdome of heauen but obtaines it by the grace and free will of God that giues it These are strange courses therefore to affirme that an ancient doctrine which is neither so Catholicke nor so safe as the contrary nor so agreeable with the Scripture But of this point I haue intreated at large a the WAY Digr 35. elsewhere and laied downe enough to shew the foulenesse of it here I am onely to vphold that I said It was begun lately by the Schoolemen which is the confession of Friar Waldensis a man as learned as any of them all that say the contrary and b Quod opus Doctrinale antiquitatum sidei Thomae Waldensis non immerito And. Vega fontem esse asseruit ex qua postea plerique omnes qui contra nouos haeresiarchas scripserint hauserunt Posseu Bibl. sel p. 286. ThomaÌ„dico Waldensem vberrimum fontem ex quo hauserunt bonam partem fete omnes qui Luteranam sectam impugnarunt Vega qu. 4. de merit pag. 782. to whom the best of our aduersaries are beholding 5 The Sixt point was the Masse wherein the Digress by cleare testimonies shewed the vse of an vnknowne tongue the Transubstantiation the Sacrifice and the outward forme to be all brought in and added to the Sacrament since the Apostles time and the time of the Primitiue Church Whereto the Reply saies no more but that I cannot name the time when nor place where nor the persons in whom the substance of the Masse consisting onely in the consecration oblation and consumption of the hoast began I answer first these 4. the Latine language the Transubstantiation the Sacrifice and the forme of Praiers and other actions vsed as their garments ceremonies eleuation adoration circumgestation c. * Essentia sacrificij Eucharistiae in duobus consistit nempe in ritu externo in significatione Suar tom 3. p. 958. c. belong to the substance of the Masse and the Digress shewed they were not vsed by Christ nor his Apostles nor yet in the time of the Primitiue Church Now that which was not thus vsed is an innouation forsomuch as Christ left both the substance and manner of ministring the sacrament certaine and determinate and indispensable and it is not necessary in euery innouation to shew one determinate time person or place where it began because if it began after Christ and his Apostles it is an innouation when or where or by whom soeuer it was brought in Secondly touching the Sacrifice which is thâ— maine substance and very heart of the Masse I shewed the full confession of some Papists denying that Christ offered any sacrifice of himselfe vnder the formes of bread and wine at his last supper This is close to the matter for c Catholici scriptores omnes in eo potissimum laborant vt osteÌ„dant in Missa offerri Deo vere ae propriè corpus ac sanguinem Domini Bell. de Miss l. 1 c. 5. §. è contrario if the sacrifice be the sustance and Christ offered no sacrifice when he instituted it d Nam tota haec essentia ex institutione pendet Suar. p. 961. e. its plaine the substance of the Masse is not from Christ Therefore an innouation an addition an alteration therefore not Catholicke Thirdly afore the Repliar be so resolute about his sacrifice and substance it were expedient for the question in hand to be at some certenty touching the thing wherein his sacrifice consists for there is much reasoning about a sacrifice and yet no agreement what or which it is e Bell. de Miss l. 1. c. 27. Some say there is but onely one sacrifice f Tapper art 16. Cassal de sacrif p. 63. c. 20. Roffensis Alphons Gab. Hos Caâ—et Alexand Eck. Mag. TurrecreÌ„ quos refert Cassal ibid. p. 64 Some two They that say two hold the bread and wine to be one and the body and blood of Christ another They that hold onely one are not agreed what it is g Refert Suar. p. 959. B. whether the body and blood of Christ onely or h Bell. vbi sup the formes of bread and wine withall Againe whether i Suar. d. 75. s 2. the actions exercised in the Masse are sixe First the oblation of bread and wine by eleuation praier and other ceremonies before consecration Secondly the consecration Thirdly the distribution Fourthly another oblation after consecration Fifthly the breaking of the host and putting part of it to the wine Sixthly and the eating of it which the Reply calles consumption it is not agreed in which of these the essence of the sacrifice consists but k See them in Suar. s 2. 3. 4. 5. 6 there are as many opinions as there be men and their assertions and reasons are so ridiculous that nothing can be more When therefore the Reply hath no certainty touching the substance of his sacrifice but all things are still in question it is but folly for him to brag that the first author of this substance cannot be named But let him name the substance and shew me an agreement among his fellowes and masters that what he names is the substance and he shall haue an author Else when I haue named the author of this he may say neither this nor that belongs to the substance but the other For there are not so few as 6. opinions euery one whereof is guarded with speciall authors that we may entertaine them in their opinions as Hermias did the Philosophers l Herm. gentil philosoph Irrisio Let them shew me what is true and I will obey them But they plucke my minde in peeces and I confesse I cannot endure this frequent conuersion of euery thing Now they tell me I am immortall and I reioyce presently they say I am mortall and then I weepe by and by they turne me into water ayre fire a little after I am none of these but a beast or a fish now I swim among the Dolphines anon I am a dog or a bird When I looke vpon my selfe I know not how to call me whether a man or a wolfe or a serpent or a Chymaera These wise men turne me into all manner of things I swim I flie I creepe I runne I sit Empedocles turnes me into a tree
beyond Salomon come to my Court and OVT WITH YOVR PVRSES AND YOV SHALL FINDE DAMNATION TO YOVR SOVLES And f SIMVLTVM STABIT SVPER â—OS DIADE RVTILANTE VT TIBI Eâ—FVNDANT ELECTRVM EA PROPT ER RVDES MIGINA MANDENT VIRODERE ET BLACE BLICIAE ALLVDE Bâ—NT TVNC CELIBES ET BLASCONES LVGERE CVâ— ROBOAM Bâ— BLENONES MIXTOS DORTONIBVS RIDERE CVM IEROBOAM pag. 11. the riddle of Cyril the Monke reported by g Telesph de Cusent l. de magnis tribul Venet. 1516. Telesphorus in his booke of prophecies may be expounded The diuell shall make a Pope with a worme in his head a sort of hungry parasites laughing at his heels CHAP. LV. 1. The Communion in ancient time was ministred to the people in both kinds 2. An innouation in this point in the Church of Rome 3. The pretences vsed against the Cup. A. D. Seuenthly concerning the Communion in one kind I answer Pag. 286. that the practise of the ancient Church it selfe did vse sometimes receiuing in one kind as is shewed by 1 See Greg. de Valent. tom 4. disp 6. q. 8. p. 5. §. 8. 9. Catholicke authors and although it vsed also receiuing in both kinds yet this proueth not that to receiue in one kind is contrary to the law of God but rather that it was by the law of God left indifferent Now in matters left indifferent by the law of God the practise of the Church may be different in different times or places according to the difference of occurring motiues and reasons and all good Which answer may be applied in case M. White shew other differences in the ancient and present Church practise which to shew is altogether impertinent to this our question where we are to see onely whether there be any practise or point of doctrine maintained by the present Church contrary to the law of God or contrary to the doctrine of faith held vniuersally by the ancient Church 1 THe communion in one kind I shewed to be contrary to the practise and doctrine of the ancient Church For a Mat. 26.27 Christ ordained it in both kinds and b 1. Cor. 11.28 commanded the vse of it in both kinds Chrysostome c Hom. 18. in 2. Cor. sayes There is wherein the Priest differs not from the people as in the participation of the sacred mysteries * 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Idem Ieron in Soph. l. sub init where one Body and one Cup is exposed to all alike And innumerable places might be brought out of antiquitie and be added to that which I but briefly toucht in the Digress but it shall not need for I presume no man will denie d Defens lib. de offic pij viri vnder the name of Veran Modest Pacimont p. 138. Cassanders words to be true This vse of our Lords bloud together with his bodie in the ministration hath the institution of Christ and the custome of the whole Church aboue a thousand yeares and of all the East to this day The consideration wherof moues the minds of many men religious and truly Catholicke vehemently to wish and labour that by some generall constitution this so ancient and long continued custome of ministring the Sacraments wholy might be reuolued The Reply answers it was left indifferent by the law of God and therefore the Primitiue Church vsed it also sometimes in one kind as Greg. Valence hath shewed This I denie Gregorie hath raked together all the places he could heare of in antiquitie to giue some colour to ministration in one kind and hath most leudly bestowed his wit to auoid the authorities that shew the contrary but it cannot be proued either that the thing is indifferent or that the Church solemnely in the congregations vsed but one kind as the Church of Rome now doth or that the practise of such particular persons as he pretends was according to the doctrine of the Church which are the things whereupon the true iudgement of this question depends 2 But this it is the B. of Rome and his Church are now growne to that height of presumption that whatsoeuer Christ instituted and practised himselfe and commended to his Church and the Church accordingly practised and taught many generations after him yet by vertue of the chaire and vnder pretence that he hath power to dispence and vary in diuers things any thing may be altered without changing the ancient faith But say good student say directly what reason can be assigned why the vse of the cup should be lesse commanded by Christ then the vse of the bread and why Christ should be thought to haue left the cup indifferent more then the bread The words in the institution sound alike for both the companie to whom he ministred receiued both and were bidden to vse both If the cup be not necessarie because no lay people were among them then by the same argument neither is the bread necessary I will onely vse the testimonie of Cyprian to proue that our Lord left not this mattter mutable or indifferent he a Ep. 68. edit Morel sayes Know ye that we are admonished in offering the cup to keepe the Lords tradition that nothing be done by vs but that which the Lord did for vs that the cup which is offered be offered mingled with wine Here Gregorie * Pag. 1002. A. answers that Cyprian affirmes no more but that when the cup is giuen it must be giuen in the same matter that Christ did not affirming the cup should be giuen to all This that the reader may haue a taste of his doings because the Reply referres me to him is but a tricke for he affirmes both not onely that we must offer it in such matter but that we must offer it For if that which Christ did were the reason why it should be offered in such a matter then is it also a reason why it must be offered And that this was Cyprians mind appeares by b Ep. 54. 63. another text where he and diuers more to the number of fortie Bishops appointed the Communion to be giuen in both kinds to the Christians in persecution giue this reason For how do we teach or prouoke them in the confession of his name to shed their bloud if we denie them the bloud of Christ when they are readie to fight or how shall we make them fit for the cup of martyrdome if we do not first admit them in the Church to drinke the cup of our Lord by the right of communion They thought the cup necessary for such as should shed their bloud for Christ but such are all men and at all times the cup therefore they thought necessary for all Againe all haue right to it it is not therefore indifferent 3 The reasons why the Church of Rome restraines the cup are needfull to be knowne I will take onely them that Tolet c In 1. Ioh. 6. ann 27. confirmed by Suarez Quia vix posset