consideration_n that_o in_o this_o century_n tertullian_n persuade_v to_o defer_v both_o the_o baptism_n of_o child_n and_o other_o who_o be_v of_o age_n do_v thereby_o intimate_v that_o it_o be_v the_o custom_n of_o the_o church_n at_o that_o time_n to_o baptise_v the_o one_o as_o well_o as_o the_o other_o otherwise_o there_o be_v no_o reason_n why_o he_o shall_v desire_v that_o they_o will_v defer_v the_o one_o as_o well_o as_o the_o other_o concern_v tradition_n which_o mr._n danvers_n say_v be_v the_o principal_a ground_n that_o have_v be_v urge_v for_o infants-baptism_n with_o a_o answer_n thereto_o sect._n 2._o to_o make_v out_o this_o he_o quote_v austin_n who_o call_v it_o a_o apostolical_a tradition_n to_o which_o i_o say_v in_o my_o answer_n that_o ancient_o the_o great_a point_n of_o faith_n be_v by_o the_o father_n name_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d so_o they_o be_v call_v by_o the_o apostle_n 2_o thes._n 2._o 15._o which_o be_v all_o one_o with_o divine_a doctrine_n or_o ordinance_n for_o so_o the_o word_n be_v render_v 1_o cor._n 11._o 2._o and_o to_o make_v this_o more_o full_o appear_v the_o magdiburgs_n tell_v we_o that_o bazil_n call_v the_o manner_n of_o baptise_v in_o the_o name_n of_o the_o father_n son_n and_o holy_a ghost_n a_o tradition_n by_o which_o he_o mean_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o lord_n christ._n magd._n cent._n 4._o c._n 4._o p._n 235._o egregie_n &_o basilius_n hâc_fw-la de_fw-la re_fw-la scribit_fw-la lib._n 3._o contra_fw-la eunomium_fw-la baptismus_fw-la noster_fw-la est_fw-la secundum_fw-la traditionem_fw-la domini_fw-la in_o nomine_fw-la patris_fw-la etc._n etc._n that_o be_v our_o baptism_n be_v according_a to_o the_o tradition_n of_o the_o lord_n in_o the_o name_n of_o the_o father_n etc._n etc._n again_o bazil_n in_o his_o book_n de_fw-fr spiritu_fw-la sancto_fw-la by_o tradition_n mean_v the_o scripture_n as_o hermannus_n hamelmannus_fw-la observe_v de_fw-la tradit_fw-la apost_n &_o tacitis_fw-la p._n 355._o certum_fw-la est_fw-la quod_fw-la basilius_n per_fw-la vocabulum_fw-la traditionis_fw-la aliquando_fw-la scripturam_fw-la intelligit_fw-la it_o be_v certain_a that_o bazil_n do_v sometime_o understand_v by_o the_o word_n tradition_n the_o scripture_n for_o so_o he_o speak_v to_o amphilochius_n in_o his_o 10_o chapter_n of_o the_o abovementioned_a book_n of_o the_o holy-spirit_n hanc_fw-la traditionem_fw-la quae_fw-la i_o perduxit_fw-la ad_fw-la lucem_fw-la ac_fw-la dei_fw-la cognitionem_fw-la largita_fw-la est_fw-la etc._n etc._n if_o austin_n then_o mean_v the_o same_o that_o bazil_n do_v by_o tradition_n viz._n the_o scripture_n he_o say_v true_a when_o he_o tell_v we_o that_o infants-baptism_n be_v not_o to_o be_v believe_v unless_o it_o be_v a_o apostolical_a tradition_n and_o although_o he_o intend_v the_o word_n otherwise_o in_o that_o famous_a speech_n of_o he_o in_o his_o four_o book_n against_o the_o donatist_n chap._n 24._o which_o mr._n danvers_n do_v ill_a in_o curtail_v namely_o that_o if_o any_o do_v inquire_v for_o a_o divine_a authority_n for_o the_o baptise_v child_n let_v they_o know_v what_o the_o universal_a church_n hold_v nor_o be_v institute_v in_o council_n but_o always_o retain_v be_v most_o right_o believe_v to_o have_v be_v deliver_v by_o no_o other_o than_o by_o apostolical_a authority_n to_o which_o this_o be_v add_v in_o the_o next_o word_n tamen_fw-la veraciter_fw-la conjicere_fw-la possumus_fw-la quid_fw-la valeat_fw-la in_o parvulis_fw-la baptismi_fw-la sacramentum_fw-la ex_fw-la circumcisione_n carnis_fw-la quam_fw-la prio_fw-la populus_fw-la accepit_fw-la that_o be_v nevertheless_o we_o may_v conjecture_v how_o much_o the_o sacrament_n of_o baptism_n be_v available_a to_o child_n by_o the_o circumcision_n of_o the_o flesh_n which_o the_o former_a people_n receive_v his_o next_o instance_n be_v from_o bellarmin_n that_o it_o be_v a_o apostolical_a tradition_n etc._n etc._n but_o mr._n danvers_n be_v not_o ignorant_a that_o bellarmin_n say_v satis_fw-la aperte_fw-la collâ—gitur_fw-la ex_fw-la scripture_n to_o which_o purpose_n we_o have_v he_o tom._n 3._o lib._n 1._o c._n 8._o the_o sacrament_n it_o be_v clear_o gather_v from_o scripture_n a_o three_o passage_n mr._n danvers_n bring_v from_o dr._n field_n in_o his_o book_n of_o the_o church_n chap_n 20._o where_o speak_v of_o the_o several_a sense_n in_o which_o the_o word_n tradition_n be_v take_v he_o say_v that_o infants-baptism_n be_v therefore_o call_v a_o tradition_n because_o it_o be_v not_o deliver_v in_o the_o scripture_n that_o the_o apostle_n do_v baptise_v infant_n or_o that_o they_o shall_v do_v so_o and_o be_v it_o fair_a deal_n for_o mr._n danvers_n to_o stop_v here_o when_o the_o follow_a word_n will_v have_v clear_v the_o point_n which_o be_v these_o yet_o be_v not_o this_o receive_v by_o bare_a and_o naked_a tradition_n but_o that_o we_o find_v the_o scripture_n to_o deliver_v unto_o we_o the_o ground_n of_o it_o lib._n 4._o p._n 375._o and_o the_o more_o inexcusable_a be_v our_o antagonist_n be_v former_o mind_v of_o this_o unfaithfulness_n in_o our_o infant-baptism_n assert_v etc._n etc._n and_o when_o i_o show_v to_o a_o friend_n that_o have_v a_o great_a respect_n for_o the_o anabaptist_n how_o he_o have_v serve_v dr._n field_n the_o say_a person_n present_o say_v certain_o mr._n danvers_n be_v either_o weak_a or_o wicked_a the_o last_o instance_n be_v from_o the_o convocation_n at_o oxford_n and_o he_o deal_v unfair_o with_o they_o likewise_o by_o alter_v and_o disorder_v their_o word_n for_o he_o quote_v they_o thus_o that_o without_o the_o consentaneous_a judgement_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n they_o shall_v be_v at_o a_o loss_n when_o they_o be_v call_v upon_o for_o proof_n in_o the_o point_n of_o infant-baptism_n whereas_o they_o be_v express_v in_o another_o strain_n and_o less_o advantageous_a to_o mr._n danvers_n purpose_n be_v thus_o that_o the_o consentient_a judgement_n and_o practice_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n be_v the_o best_a interpreter_n of_o scripture_n in_o thing_n not_o clear_o express_v and_o then_o they_o say_v that_o without_o it_o they_o shall_v be_v at_o a_o loss_n in_o sundry_a point_n of_o faith_n and_o manner_n believe_v and_o practise_v when_o by_o socinian_o and_o anabaptist_n they_o be_v call_v upon_o for_o proof_n instance_v in_o the_o trinity_n and_o coequality_n of_o person_n in_o the_o godhead_n baptise_v infant_n â—â—e_v observation_n of_o the_o lord_n day_n and_o even_o the_o canon_n of_o the_o scripture_n itself_o etc._n etc._n mr._n danvers_n have_v as_o he_o think_v clear_v his_o position_n proceed_v to_o draw_v a_o parallel_n between_o papist_n and_o protestant_n to_o show_v that_o there_o be_v no_o great_a difference_n between_o they_o after_o the_o manner_n as_o i_o have_v represent_v the_o protestant_a sentiment_n in_o the_o point_n to_o which_o i_o reply_v 1._o that_o the_o papist_n hold_v many_o thing_n that_o be_v orthodox_n and_o sound_n especial_o in_o doctrinal_n but_o be_v very_o corrupt_a in_o discipline_n and_o abominable_o unsound_a in_o the_o point_n of_o tradition_n for_o they_o equal_v it_o with_o scripture_n and_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n determine_v that_o tradition_n be_v to_o be_v entertain_v pari_fw-la pietatis_fw-la affectu_fw-la with_o the_o like_a affection_n as_o the_o scripture_n etc._n etc._n the_o protestant_n abhor_v this_o as_o may_v be_v see_v at_o large_a in_o the_o aforementioned_a author_n hamelmannus_fw-la in_o his_o book_n of_o tradition_n where_o dispute_v against_o staphilus_n and_o cassander_n and_o speak_v particular_o of_o infants-baptism_n p._n 818._o he_o say_v non_fw-la nobis_fw-la satisfaeceret_fw-la nisi_fw-la peteretur_fw-la probatio_fw-la paedobaptismi_fw-la ex_fw-la scripture_n tradition_n will_v not_o satisfy_v we_o unless_o we_o have_v scripture-proof_n for_o it_o now_o for_o his_o parallel_n 1._o do_v the_o papist_n say_v he_o maintain_v that_o the_o ecclesiastical_a tradition_n of_o infants-baptism_n as_o it_o be_v gather_v from_o the_o scripture_n and_o appoint_v by_o the_o church_n be_v of_o equal_a authority_n with_o scripture_n itself_o so_o say_v he_o do_v mr._n will_n assert_v for_o protestant_a doctrine_n that_o the_o tradition_n of_o infants-baptism_n prove_v by_o consequential_a argument_n from_o the_o scripture_n aught_o to_o be_v esteem_v as_o firm_a and_o good_a as_o the_o scripture_n itself_o and_o to_o prove_v that_o i_o say_v so_o mr._n danvers_n refer_v the_o reader_n to_o p._n 117._o of_o my_o book_n where_o there_o be_v nothing_o speak_v of_o tradition_n but_o only_o a_o position_n quote_v from_o mr._n baxter_n scripture-proof_n viz._n that_o evident_a consequence_n or_o argument_n draw_v by_o reason_n from_o scripture_n be_v as_o true_a proof_n as_o the_o very_a word_n of_o a_o text._n and_o be_v there_o any_o hurt_n in_o this_o can_v any_o man_n that_o be_v rational_a deny_v it_o do_v not_o dr._n owen_n positive_o assert_v it_o nay_o do_v not_o mr._n danvers_n himself_o tell_v we_o we_o admit_v of_o plain_a consequence_n reply_v p._n 69._o though_o he_o will_v not_o
esteem_v authentic_a quote_v erasmus_n for_o it_o and_o for_o this_o mr._n danvers_n fall_v foul_a on_o i_o this_o be_v another_o of_o his_o great_a charge_n in_o his_o preface_n that_o i_o abuse_v erasmus_n who_o say_v quite_o contrary_a to_o what_o he_o say_v i_o father_n on_o he_o as_o 1._o that_o the_o translation_n of_o the_o homily_n on_o the_o roman_n appear_v to_o he_o to_o be_v ruffinus_n and_o not_o jerom_n 2._o that_o the_o preface_n to_o the_o translation_n which_o represent_v it_o as_o jerom_n be_v a_o cheat_n of_o the_o bookseller_n as_o erasmus_n note_n to_o this_o i_o answer_v one_a that_o erasmus_n do_v not_o say_v that_o the_o homily_n upon_o the_o roman_n set_v forth_o as_o translate_v by_o jerom_n be_v ruffinus_n homily_n and_o not_o origen's_n 2._o the_o magdeburg_n reckon_v up_o the_o legitimate_a work_n of_o jerom_n in_o the_o story_n of_o his_o life_n do_v mention_n that_o of_o translate_n origen_n on_o the_o roman_n to_o be_v one_o and_o that_o according_a to_o the_o judgement_n of_o erasmus_n cent._n 4._o cap._n 10._o p._n 1218._o extant_a inter_fw-la origenis_n opera_fw-la latinè_n facta_fw-la quaedam_fw-la quorum_fw-la interpres_fw-la fuit_fw-la hieronimus_fw-la erasmi_fw-la judicio_fw-la that_o be_v among_o the_o work_n of_o origen_n some_o be_v translate_v into_o latin_a by_o jerom_n in_o the_o judgement_n of_o erasmus_n and_o then_o they_o name_n which_o they_o be_v as_o follows_z as_o the_o homily_n upon_o jeremy_n which_o have_v jerom_n preface_n to_o they_o the_o homily_n upon_o ezekiel_n the_o 39_o homily_n upon_o luke_n cum_fw-la praefatione_fw-la hieronymi_n with_o jeroms_n preface_n and_o ten_o book_n of_o origen_n comment_n upon_o the_o roman_n there_o be_v that_o which_o will_v clear_v i_o against_o all_o mr._n danver_n reproach_n cum_fw-la ejusdem_fw-la praefatione_fw-la with_o jerom_n preface_n i_o appeal_v now_o to_o the_o reader_n whether_o i_o have_v not_o good_a authority_n for_o what_o i_o say_v that_o according_a to_o erasmus_n judgement_n jerom_n translate_v origen_n on_o the_o roman_n you_o see_v from_o whence_o i_o have_v my_o information_n the_o magdeburg_n affirm_v that_o both_o translation_n and_o preface_n too_o be_v jerom_n and_o mr._n danvers_n know_v it_o to_o be_v so_o for_o in_o my_o answer_n i_o direct_v he_o to_o the_o century_n and_o page_n in_o the_o magdeburgensian_a history_n from_o whence_o i_o have_v it_o and_o therefore_o it_o be_v a_o sorry_a trick_n of_o he_o to_o slur_v i_o as_o he_o have_v do_v in_o this_o thing_n and_o make_v such_o a_o exclamation_n against_o i_o what_o credit_n be_v to_o be_v give_v unto_o mr._n will_n let_v all_o man_n judge_v he_o may_v rather_o have_v say_v what_o credit_n be_v to_o be_v give_v to_o the_o magdeburg_n and_o their_o excellent_a history_n as_o mr._n d._n call_v it_o let_v all_o man_n judge_v for_o if_o i_o be_v deceive_v they_o deceive_v i_o 3._o i_o have_v yet_o further_o to_o say_v and_o that_o be_v that_o i_o have_v another_o to_o speak_v on_o my_o behalf_n dr._n hammond_n of_o no_o small_a note_n for_o his_o knowledge_n in_o antiquity_n and_o perhaps_o not_o inferior_a to_o erasmus_n who_o tell_v we_o in_o his_o letter_n of_o resolution_n p._n 215._o that_o though_o we_o have_v not_o origen_n upon_o the_o roman_n in_o greek_a yet_o be_v translate_v by_o jerom_n and_o so_o own_a by_o he_o in_o his_o epistle_n to_o heraclius_n prefix_v before_o the_o commentary_n we_o have_v his_o authority_n to_o secure_v we_o that_o the_o word_n about_o infant-baptism_n be_v origen_n and_o let_v it_o be_v suppose_v that_o jerom_n do_v not_o translate_v those_o on_o the_o roman_n and_o that_o the_o homily_n themselves_o be_v spurious_a and_o none_o of_o origen_n yet_o those_o on_o luke_n pass_v for_o current_n without_o control_n and_o there_o the_o point_n of_o infant-baptism_n be_v as_o full_o assert_v as_o in_o the_o other_o place_n on_o the_o roman_n against_o this_o also_o mr._n danvers_n have_v borrow_v a_o scrap_n from_o mr._n tomb_n who_o find_v nothing_o in_o erasmus_n censure_v have_v yet_o by_o good_a hap_n hit_v upon_o a_o word_n in_o erasmus_n comment_n on_o luke_n 1._o 3._o the_o word_n of_o erasmus_n be_v for_o so_o he_o seem_v to_o think_v whosoever_o he_o be_v who_o commentary_n be_v extant_a upon_o luke_n under_o the_o title_n of_o admantius_n which_o show_v say_v mr._n tomb_n that_o erasmus_n take_v they_o not_o to_o be_v origen_n or_o at_o least_o doubt_v thereof_o it_o be_v very_o remarkable_a that_o mr_n tomb_n shall_v spy_v out_o this_o passage_n much_o more_o that_o he_o shall_v comment_v thus_o upon_o it_o for_o what_o erasmus_n speak_v of_o origen_n upon_o luke_n may_v as_o well_o be_v say_v of_o every_o book_n nor_o can_v any_o man_n say_v posative_o these_o be_v the_o book_n write_v by_o justin_n martyr_n or_o tertullian_n so_o that_o to_o interpret_v that_o passage_n of_o erasmus_n for_o a_o doubt_n be_v but_o a_o mere_a cavil_v but_o that_o he_o doubt_v not_o that_o jerom_n translate_v origen_n on_o luke_n take_v his_o own_o clear_a word_n for_o it_o in_o his_o censure_n homil._n in_o lucam_n dubium_fw-la non_fw-la est_fw-la quin_fw-la 39_o homilias_fw-la in_o lucam_fw-la verterit_fw-la hieronimus_fw-la quod_fw-la ipse_fw-la palam_fw-la in_o praefatione_fw-la profitetur_fw-la there_o be_v no_o doubt_n to_o be_v make_v of_o it_o say_v he_o that_o jerom_n translate_v the_o 39_o homily_n on_o luke_n and_o if_o jerom_n translate_v they_o as_o there_o be_v no_o doubt_n according_a to_o erasmus_n than_o we_o need_v not_o doubt_v but_o he_o do_v it_o from_o the_o original_a copy_n of_o origen_n judge_n now_o reader_n what_o mr._n d._n have_v get_v in_o this_o business_n notwithstanding_o all_o the_o clutter_n he_o have_v keep_v with_o his_o boasting_n and_o defame_n we_o see_v by_o what_o be_v say_v that_o we_o have_v infants-baptism_n own_v as_o from_o the_o apostle_n by_o origen_n on_o luke_n whatever_n become_v of_o that_o on_o the_o roman_n and_o translate_o by_o jerom_n of_o which_o erasmus_n do_v not_o in_o the_o least_o doubt_n so_o that_o the_o fabric_n stand_v yet_o upright_o never_o like_a to_o be_v demolish_a by_o mr._n danvers_n whatever_o great_a exploit_n he_o have_v do_v heretofore_o in_o the_o day_n of_o his_o colonelship_n our_o last_o testimony_n be_v from_o cyprian_a against_o who_o also_o he_o have_v something_o to_o say_v though_o methinks_v that_o of_o vossius_fw-la be_v enough_o to_o silence_v all_o ☞_o cavil_n viz._n that_o the_o testimony_n of_o cyprian_a for_o infants-baptism_n both_o in_o his_o time_n and_o before_o be_v beyond_o all_o exception_n and_o grotius_n speak_v to_o the_o same_o purpose_n viz._n that_o the_o epistle_n of_o cyprian_a to_o fidus_n make_v the_o matter_n plain_a that_o there_o be_v then_o no_o doubt_n of_o infants-baptism_n against_o this_o he_o give_v in_o three_o exception_n ☞_o in_o his_o treatise_n of_o baptism_n present_v again_o in_o his_o reply_n as_o first_o infants-baptism_n be_v not_o urge_v by_o cyprian_a for_o a_o apostolical_a tradition_n nor_o upon_o any_o authority_n of_o scripture_n but_o upon_o his_o own_o and_o bishop_n argument_n though_o if_o he_o shall_v have_v say_v it_o be_v a_o apostolical_a tradition_n his_o word_n he_o say_v will_v have_v no_o more_o be_v take_v than_o when_o he_o tell_v we_o chrysm_n be_v so_o to_o which_o i_o reply_v in_o my_o answer_n that_o though_o cyprian_n do_v not_o say_v it_o be_v apostolical_a yet_o it_o follow_v not_o he_o do_v not_o own_o it_o as_o such_o yea_o to_o put_v it_o out_o of_o doubt_n the_o magdeburg_n tell_v we_o he_o do_v own_o it_o as_o apostolical_a cent._n 1._o l._n 2._o c._n 6._o p._n 496._o but_o what_o though_o the_o magdiburgs_n tell_v we_o so_o say_v he_o that_o be_v no_o more_o than_o if_o mr._n will_n have_v say_v it_o strange_a that_o such_o venerable_a person_n as_o those_o famous_a divine_n be_v that_o have_v write_v such_o a_o excellent_a history_n as_o mr._n danvers_n elsewhere_o term_v it_o shall_v be_v of_o no_o more_o credit_n with_o he_o than_o myself_o who_o he_o so_o much_o vilifi_v but_o have_v he_o not_o forget_v what_o he_o speak_v just_a before_o that_o cpyrian_a hold_v chrysin_n to_o be_v a_o apostolical_a tradition_n and_o be_v it_o not_o strange_a that_o he_o shall_v not_o hold_v the_o same_o of_o pedobaptism_n but_o whether_o he_o do_v or_o not_o be_v not_o material_a to_o the_o point_n which_o be_v now_o before_o we_o for_o we_o be_v inquire_v the_o facto_fw-la what_o be_v do_v in_o cyprian_n time_n as_o to_o the_o baptise_v child_n not_o the_o jure_fw-la upon_o what_o ground_n they_o do_v it_o or_o whether_o it_o be_v esteem_v apostolical_a if_o the_o practice_n be_v own_v it_o be_v as_o much_o as_o we_o need_v to_o put_v by_o mr._n danvers_n cavil_v and_o that_o it_o be_v so_o mr._n tomb_n his_o great_a
leguntur_fw-la yet_o they_o add_v in_o the_o very_a next_o line_n that_o origen_n and_o cyprian_n affirm_v that_o even_o in_o the_o apostle_n day_n infant_n be_v baptize_v &_o since_o these_o father_n live_v in_o the_o next_o century_n after_o the_o apostle_n they_o may_v very_o well_o be_v think_v to_o understand_v what_o the_o apostle_n do_v in_o the_o 2d_o century_n mr._n danvers_n quote_v from_o the_o magdiburgs_n some_o of_o justin_n martyr_n word_n in_o his_o apology_n to_o antoninus_n pius_n where_o mention_n be_v make_v of_o instruction_n and_o fast_v and_o prayer_n before_o baptism_n but_o withal_o conceal_v what_o in_o the_o same_o place_n the_o magdiburgs_n tell_v we_o that_o this_o be_v the_o method_n which_o be_v use_v in_o reference_n to_o alien_n upon_o their_o conversion_n to_o christianity_n for_o these_o be_v their_o word_n cum_fw-la qui_fw-la ad_fw-la fidem_fw-la christianam_fw-la conversus_fw-la esset_fw-la sit_v instructus_fw-la etc._n etc._n that_o be_v when_o any_o one_o be_v convert_v to_o the_o christian_a faith_n he_o be_v sufficient_o instruct_v before_o baptism_n in_o the_o 3d_o century_n he_o do_v egregious_o prevaricate_v in_o tell_v we_o that_o the_o magdiburgs_n say_v as_o to_o the_o rite_n of_o baptism_n they_o have_v no_o testimony_n of_o alteration_n for_o hereby_o he_o do_v suggest_v to_o the_o reader_n that_o in_o this_o age_n as_o well_o as_o in_o the_o former_a there_o be_v no_o baptism_n own_v but_o that_o of_o the_o adult_n whereas_o 1._o those_o word_n as_o to_o the_o rite_n of_o baptism_n they_o have_v no_o testimony_n of_o alteration_n be_v his_o own_o word_n and_o not_o the_o magdiburgs_n who_o say_v only_o this_o viz._n baptizandi_fw-la ritus_fw-la in_o ecclesiis_fw-la asianis_fw-la observatos_fw-la hoc_fw-la seculo_fw-la quia_fw-la omnium_fw-la ferme_fw-fr doctorum_fw-la asiaticorum_fw-la scriptis_fw-la destituimur_fw-la commemorare_fw-la non_fw-la possumus_fw-la that_o be_v we_o can_v rehearse_v the_o rite_n of_o baptise_v observe_v in_o the_o asiatick-churche_n because_o we_o want_v for_o the_o most_o part_n the_o write_n of_o the_o asiatic_a doctor_n 2._o he_o silent_o pass_v by_o what_o they_o do_v express_o say_v be_v in_o use_n in_o this_o age_n namely_o that_o adult_a person_n of_o both_o sex_n and_o also_o infant_n be_v baptize_v baptizabantur_fw-la in_o utroque_fw-la sexu_fw-la adulti_fw-la simul_fw-la et_fw-la infant_n cent._n 3._o c._n 6._o p._n 124._o 3._o further_n under_o this_o head_n he_o pervert_v the_o sense_n of_o mr._n baxter_n word_n and_o carry_v they_o quite_o off_o from_o the_o intent_n and_o scope_n of_o his_o discourse_n as_o you_o may_v see_v in_o his_o saint_n rest_v part_v 1._o c._n 8._o sect_n 5._o for_o what_o be_v there_o speak_v from_o origen_n and_o cyprian_n of_o a_o express_a covenant_v before_o baptism_n be_v mean_v of_o adult_n stranger_n nor_o be_v mr._n baxter_n treat_v there_o of_o baptism_n but_o something_o else_o and_o at_o this_o rate_n what_o author_n can_v be_v secure_a from_o the_o violence_n of_o his_o interpretation_n and_o if_o he_o have_v think_v on_o it_o he_o may_v have_v urge_v for_o adult_n baptism_n that_o of_o the_o magdiburgs_n cent._n 3._o c._n 6._o p._n 124._o where_n have_v say_v as_o before_o that_o person_n of_o both_o sex_n both_o age_a and_o infant_n be_v baptize_v the_o word_n immediate_o follow_v be_v these_o adultorum_fw-la autem_fw-la aliquandiu_fw-la antequam_fw-la baptizabantur_fw-la fides_fw-la explorabatur_fw-la i._n e._n but_o as_o touch_v the_o adult_n they_o inquire_v after_o faith_n and_o repentance_n before_o they_o be_v baptize_v thus_o much_o for_o the_o 3_o first_o century_n wherein_o as_o you_o see_v mr._n danvers_n be_v sufficient_o faulty_a and_o yet_o as_o if_o he_o be_v most_o innocent_a he_o do_v in_o the_o preface_n to_o his_o innocency_n and_o truth_n most_o confident_o address_v himself_o to_o the_o reader_n and_o compliment_v he_o in_o a_o high_a strain_n say_v that_o at_o his_o 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which_o he_o have_v so_o much_o abuse_v for_o in_o his_o treatise_n of_o baptism_n in_o both_o edition_n he_o thus_o speak_v in_o this_o age_n they_o the_o magdiburgs_n tell_v we_o that_o it_o be_v the_o universal_a practice_n to_o baptise_v the_o adult_n upon_o profession_n of_o faith_n if_o he_o quote_v it_o not_o to_o show_v that_o it_o be_v the_o practice_n to_o baptise_v only_o the_o adult_n it_o be_v impertinent_a but_o his_o grand_a assertion_n both_o in_o his_o treatise_n of_o baptism_n and_o in_o his_o reply_n p._n 4._o that_o adult_a baptism_n be_v only_o practise_v in_o the_o four_o century_n denote_v in_o what_o sense_n we_o be_v to_o understand_v he_o now_o for_o mr._n danvers_n thus_o to_o father_n on_o the_o magdiburgs_n what_o they_o never_o speak_v and_o also_o to_o pervert_v what_o they_o do_v speak_v render_v he_o chargeable_a with_o falsehood_n and_o prevarication_n for_o 1._o they_o say_v no_o such_o thing_n that_o it_o be_v the_o universal_a practice_n to_o baptize_v only_o the_o adult_n upon_o profession_n of_o faith_n but_o of_o this_o in_o its_o proper_a place_n when_o we_o shall_v make_v good_a the_o charge_n of_o falsehood_n against_o he_o in_o divers_a other_o thing_n as_o well_o as_o this_o 2._o they_o do_v indeed_o tell_v we_o that_o in_o the_o church_n of_o asia_n the_o baptise_a be_v for_o some_o time_n first_o instruct_v and_o be_v call_v catechuman_n wherein_o then_o lie_v the_o prevarication_n why_o 1._o because_o the_o instance_n there_o give_v by_o the_o magdiburgs_n be_v alien_n for_o they_o tell_v we_o of_o some_o jew_n take_v it_o from_o athanasius_n that_o be_v new_o convert_v to_o christianity_n prostrate_v themselves_o at_o the_o foot_n of_o the_o bishop_n and_o desire_a baptism_n narrat_fw-la de_fw-la judeis_fw-la berythi_fw-la athanasius_n in_o lib._n de_fw-fr passione_n domini_fw-la quod_fw-la ad_fw-la episcopi_fw-la ejus_fw-la vrbis_fw-la genua_fw-la advoluti_fw-la baptisma_fw-la petierint_fw-la quos_fw-la ipse_fw-la cum_fw-la clericis_fw-la suis_fw-la suscipiens_fw-la per_fw-la dies_fw-la multos_fw-la in_o doctrina_fw-la christianae_n pietatis_fw-la erudierit_fw-la which_o jew_n after_o they_o have_v be_v for_o many_o day_n instruct_v in_o the_o doctrine_n of_o christian_a piety_n the_o say_a bishop_n with_o his_o clark_n baptize_v 2._o because_o a_o little_a before_o in_o the_o same_o chapter_n the_o magdiburgs_n have_v these_o word_n baptizabantur_fw-la autem_fw-la aquâ_fw-la publicè_fw-la in_o templis_fw-la cujuscunq_fw-fr sexus_fw-la aetatis_fw-la et_fw-la conditionis_fw-la homines_fw-la man_n of_o all_o age_n sex_n and_o condition_n be_v baptize_v public_o in_o the_o temple_n how_o can_v this_o be_v by_o dip_v and_o lest_o it_o shall_v be_v think_v child_n be_v not_o comprehend_v under_o those_o universal_a term_n they_o say_v in_o the_o same_o chapter_n de_fw-fr asianis_fw-la ecclesiis_fw-la nazianzenus_n loquens_fw-la infant_n baptizandos_fw-la esse_fw-la ait_fw-la etc._n etc._n nazianzen_n speak_v of_o the_o church_n of_o asia_n say_v that_o child_n be_v to_o be_v baptize_v and_o note_v here_o by_o the_o way_n reader_n that_o because_o in_o my_o answer_n i_o have_v not_o go_v on_o with_o the_o follow_a word_n of_o nazianzen_n si_fw-la aliquid_fw-la immineat_fw-la periculi_fw-la that_o be_v in_o case_n any_o thing_n of_o danger_n happen_v mr._n danvers_n do_v in_o his_o preface_n exclaim_v against_o i_o for_o curtail_v that_o father_n but_o the_o judicious_a reader_n may_v understand_v that_o he_o quarrel_n at_o i_o without_o a_o cause_n for_o my_o business_n be_v to_o prove_v that_o infant_n baptism_n be_v own_v in_o that_o century_n as_o to_o matter_n of_o fact_n and_o not_o to_o discourse_v the_o ground_n of_o it_o or_o to_o inquire_v in_o what_o case_n it_o be_v do_v and_o therefore_o he_o may_v have_v spare_v his_o frivolous_a charge_n about_o that_o matter_n it_o be_v true_o observe_v by_o one_o of_o the_o anabaptist_n party_n that_o my_o antagonist_n be_v so_o tenacious_a that_o he_o will_v stand_v in_o a_o thing_n although_o all_o the_o world_n gainsay_v
be_v so_o bold_a as_o to_o say_v that_o the_o magdiburgs_n tell_v we_o it_o be_v the_o universal_a practice_n to_o baptise_v the_o adult_n upon_o profession_n of_o faith_n treatise_n of_o baptism_n edit_n 1._o p._n 64._o when_o they_o say_v otherwise_o namely_o that_o person_n of_o all_o age_n be_v baptize_v in_o the_o temple_n and_o cite_v nazianzen_n for_o baptise_v of_o infant_n in_o the_o church_n of_o asia_n to_o which_o also_o we_o have_v add_v the_o testimony_n of_o hillary_n ambrose_n jerom_n chrisostom_n austin_n all_o of_o the_o four_o century_n and_o for_o infant_n baptism_n last_o he_o bring_v the_o canon_n of_o the_o 3_o council_n of_o carthage_n laodicea_n and_o neocaesaria_n which_o have_v not_o a_o word_n in_o they_o against_o infant_n baptism_n and_o what_o be_v decree_v about_o confession_n before_o baptism_n relate_v to_o stranger_n as_o i_o presume_v i_o have_v make_v it_o appear_v beyond_o all_o doubt_n in_o the_o two_o last_o of_o they_o if_o that_o of_o neocaesaria_n ever_o have_v a_o be_v but_o i_o must_v proceed_v on_o and_o follow_v mr._n danvers_n for_o he_o tell_v we_o he_o be_v not_o alone_o in_o his_o opinion_n and_o therefore_o bring_v in_o divers_a authority_n to_o confirm_v it_o that_o only_o the_o adult_n upon_o confession_n of_o faith_n be_v the_o subject_n of_o baptism_n in_o the_o first_o time_n p._n 14_o 15._o he_o begin_v with_o strabo_n that_o say_v in_o the_o first_o time_n baptism_n be_v wont_a to_o be_v give_v to_o they_o only_o that_o can_v know_v and_o understand_v what_o profit_n be_v to_o be_v get_v by_o it_o but_o it_o seem_v by_o the_o story_n that_o strabo_n his_o firsttime_n go_v no_o high_a than_o augustine_n day_n for_o he_o instance_v in_o his_o be_v baptize_v at_o age_n when-as_a we_o have_v testimony_n that_o child_n baptism_n be_v in_o use_n in_o the_o church_n above_o a_o hundred_o year_n before_o austin_n be_v bear_v and_o austin_n that_o live_v about_o four_o hundred_o year_n near_o the_o primitive_a time_n than_o strabo_n affirm_v that_o the_o church_n always_o have_v it_o and_o always_o hold_v it_o beside_o the_o testimony_n of_o strabo_n be_v not_o to_o be_v value_v be_v condemn_v by_o vossius_fw-la and_o other_o for_o a_o false_a historian_n we_o have_v former_o in_o our_o answer_n give_v instance_n thereof_o and_o particular_o we_o note_v that_o gross_a mistake_n of_o he_o that_o surety_n call_v godfathers_n and_o godmothers_n be_v first_o invent_v in_o augustine_n day_n when_o tertullian_n speak_v of_o they_o above_o a_o hundred_o year_n before_o next_o follow_v beatus_fw-la rhenanus_fw-la rupertus_n boemus_n dr._n hammond_n and_o mr._n baxter_n the_o elder_a of_o who_o live_v but_o in_o the_o 12_o cent._n according_a to_o mr._n danvers_n and_o have_v no_o other_o way_n of_o know_v what_o be_v do_v in_o the_o first_o time_n than_o we_o and_o therefore_o let_v they_o affirm_v what_o they_o please_v unless_o they_o can_v prove_v it_o by_o the_o record_n of_o those_o time_n it_o signify_v no_o more_o than_o if_o mr._n danvers_n tell_v we_o so_o and_o the_o contrary_a to_o what_o he_o assert_n be_v apparent_a from_o antiquity_n but_o because_o mr._n danvers_n shall_v not_o say_v i_o slight_a his_o authority_n i_o shall_v particular_o examine_v they_o and_o as_o for_o b._n rhenanus_fw-la who_o live_v in_o 15._o cent._n what_o mr._n danvers_n make_v he_o say_v be_v very_o impertinent_a to_o his_o purpose_n for_o his_o business_n be_v to_o prove_v that_o only_o the_o adult_n be_v then_o baptize_v which_o his_o quotation_n affirm_v not_o and_o what_o then_o do_v it_o signify_v but_o to_o help_v to_o swell_v his_o book_n but_o i_o shall_v make_v it_o appear_v that_o mr._n d._n have_v shameful_o mistake_v rhenanus_n sense_n and_o thereby_o exceed_o abuse_v he_o for_o b._n rhenanus_fw-la in_o his_o annot._n upon_o tertullian_n corona_n militis_fw-la on_o those_o word_n aquam_fw-la adituri_fw-la say_v thus_o p._n 500_o baptizandi_fw-la ritum_fw-la ostendit_fw-la qui_fw-la in_o usu_fw-la veterum_fw-la fuit_fw-la de_fw-la quo_fw-la consuetudo_fw-la quaedam_fw-la mutavit_fw-la nam_fw-la tum_fw-la adulti_fw-la regenerationis_fw-la lavacro_fw-la tingebantur_fw-la quotidie_fw-la externis_fw-la e_fw-la paganismo_fw-la ad_fw-la nostram_fw-la religionem_fw-la confluentibus_fw-la siquidem_fw-la id_fw-la temporis_fw-la ubique_fw-la reperire_fw-la erat_fw-la ethnicos_fw-la christianis_fw-la admixtos_fw-la postea_fw-la statis_fw-la temporibus_fw-la nempe_fw-la bis_fw-la in_o anno_fw-la celebrari_fw-la baptismus_fw-la caeptus_fw-la ejus_fw-la enim_fw-la rei_fw-la nullam_fw-la hic_fw-la facit_fw-la mentionem_fw-la alioqui_fw-la non_fw-la omissurus_fw-la qui_fw-la mos_fw-la antiquus_fw-la etiam_fw-la per_fw-la tempora_fw-la caroli_n magni_fw-la et_fw-la ludovici_n augusti_fw-la servatus_fw-la est_fw-la judicant_fw-la hoc_fw-la leges_fw-la ab_fw-la illis_fw-la sancitae_fw-la quibus_fw-la cavetur_fw-la ne_fw-la quemquam_fw-la sacerdotes_fw-la baptizent_fw-la excepto_fw-la mortis_fw-la articulo_fw-la praeterquam_fw-la in_fw-la paschate_n &_o pentacoste_n that_o be_v he_o tertullian_n show_v the_o rite_n of_o baptise_v that_o be_v in_o use_n among_o the_o ancient_n from_o which_o a_o certain_a custom_n have_v make_v a_o change_n for_o then_o for_o the_o most_o part_n the_o adult_n be_v baptize_v stranger_n daily_o flock_v from_o paganism_n to_o our_o religion_n because_o at_o that_o time_n heathen_n be_v everywhere_o to_o be_v find_v mix_v among_o the_o christian_n afterward_o baptism_n begin_v to_o be_v celebrate_v at_o state_v time_n to_o wit_n twice_o in_o the_o year_n for_o of_o this_o thing_n the_o two_o state_v time_n of_o baptism_n he_o tertullian_n make_v no_o mention_n here_o otherwise_o have_v it_o be_v in_o use_n he_o will_v not_o have_v omit_v the_o mention_n of_o it_o which_o ancient_a custom_n to_o wit_n of_o celebrate_v baptism_n at_o two_o state_v time_n of_o the_o year_n be_v also_o observe_v in_o the_o day_n of_o charles_n the_o great_a and_o ludovick_n the_o emperor_n as_o appear_v by_o the_o law_n make_v by_o they_o whereby_o care_n be_v take_v that_o the_o priest_n baptise_v none_o except_o those_o at_o the_o point_n of_o death_n but_o at_o easter_n and_o whitsuntide_n by_o this_o it_o be_v apparent_a one_a that_o by_o the_o adult_n he_o mean_v only_a heathen_n new_o convert_v and_o 2._o by_o the_o ancient_a custom_n baptise_v at_o the_o two_o state_v time_n of_o easter_n and_o whisontide_n and_o not_o the_o baptise_v those_o that_o be_v come_v to_o their_o full_a growth_n as_o mr._n d._n say_v and_o to_o assure_v he_o infant_n be_v not_o hereby_o exclude_v rhenanus_fw-la present_o add_v hoc_fw-la sic_fw-la accipiendum_fw-la ut_fw-la sciamus_fw-la infant_n post_fw-la pascha_fw-la natos_fw-la ad_fw-la baptismum_fw-la pentacoste_n reservatos_fw-la et_fw-la natos_fw-la post_fw-la pentacostem_fw-la ad_fw-la paschatem_fw-la festum_fw-la diem_fw-la bapismo_fw-la offerri_fw-la solitos_fw-la excepta_fw-la seu_fw-la dixi_fw-la necessitate_v una_fw-la cum_fw-la adultis_fw-la catechumenis_fw-la qui_fw-la de_fw-la externis_fw-la nationibus_fw-la danorum_fw-la etc._n etc._n &_o similium_fw-la populorum_fw-la christianae_n religioni_fw-la initiabantur_fw-la that_o be_v this_o be_v so_o to_o be_v understand_v that_o we_o may_v know_v that_o these_o infant_n that_o be_v bear_v after_o easter_n be_v reserve_v to_o the_o baptism_n of_o whitsuntide_n and_o those_o that_o be_v bear_v after_o whitsuntide_n to_o the_o easter_n follow_v except_o in_o case_n of_o necessity_n etc._n etc._n and_o now_o i_o persuade_v myself_o mr._n d._n for_o very_a shame_n will_v take_v no_o more_o notice_n of_o this_o quotation_n unless_o it_o be_v to_o acknowledge_v his_o inadvertency_n in_o produce_v it_o his_o next_o author_n be_v rupertus_n in_o his_o four_o book_n of_o divine_a office_n c._n 18._o here_o mr._n d._n be_v guilty_a of_o most_o notorious_a forgery_n for_o in_o his_o second_o edition_n p._n 73._o he_o have_v the_o same_o quotation_n and_o there_o he_o tell_v we_o rupertus_n say_v that_o in_o former_a time_n the_o custom_n be_v that_o they_o administer_v not_o the_o sacrament_n of_o regeneration_n but_o only_o at_o the_o feast_n of_o easter_n and_o pentecost_n and_o here_o in_o his_o reply_n p._n 15._o he_o alter_v the_o word_n and_o make_v he_o say_v that_o they_o administer_v but_o only_o to_o the_o catechuman_n etc._n etc._n if_o mr._n d._n must_v have_v the_o liberty_n thus_o to_o deal_v with_o author_n i_o confess_v there_o be_v no_o stand_v against_o he_o but_o i_o hope_v the_o reader_n will_v hereby_o be_v satisfy_v that_o this_o signify_v no_o more_o as_o to_o his_o purpose_n than_o the_o former_a but_o deserve_o render_v he_o unworthy_a of_o belief_n in_o his_o quotation_n of_o author_n boemus_n follow_v who_o live_v in_o the_o 16_o cent._n tho_o m._n d._n bring_v he_o into_o the_o 12_o 2._o ed._n p._n 73._o and_o he_o tell_v we_o there_o that_o he_o say_v that_o in_o time_n past_o the_o custom_n be_v to_o administer_v baptism_n only_o to_o those_o that_o be_v instruct_v in_o the_o faith_n and_o seven_o time_n in_o the_o week_n before_o easter_n and_o
of_o they_o and_o that_o be_v to_o the_o three_o and_o what_o be_v speak_v by_o i_o with_o respect_n to_o one_o of_o they_o he_o represent_v as_o speak_v of_o all_o the_o better_a to_o accommodate_v his_o quibble_n query_n it_o be_v sad_a to_o see_v how_o much_o he_o do_v abuse_v those_o confession_n how_o he_o do_v wiredraw_v they_o as_o if_o they_o be_v homogeneal_a with_o anaxagoras_n his_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d upon_o aristotle_n record_n how_o he_o draw_v quidlibet_fw-la ex_fw-la quolibet_fw-la every_o thing_n out_o of_o any_o thing_n never_o be_v any_o confession_n in_o the_o world_n so_o prostitute_v to_o a_o corrupt_a fancy_n for_o thus_o he_o begin_v 1._o do_v all_o the_o pedobaptist_n believe_v that_o baptism_n and_o preach_v the_o word_n be_v join_v together_o to_o instruct_v the_o baptize_v party_n and_o that_o thereby_o they_o have_v union_n with_o christ_n and_o partake_v of_o his_o benefit_n observe_v how_o mr._n danvers_n stumble_v at_o the_o threshold_n how_o he_o prevert_v the_o article_n for_o look_v back_o upon_o the_o article_n and_o you_o will_v find_v it_o do_v not_o say_v that_o baptism_n and_o preach_a be_v join_v together_o to_o instruct_v the_o baptise_a party_n baptism_n be_v not_o mention_v in_o the_o article_n though_o it_o be_v include_v in_o the_o word_n sacrament_n afterward_o the_o article_n speak_v thus_o that_o we_o be_v instruct_v by_o the_o word_n and_o then_o that_o god_n have_v ordain_v the_o sacrament_n to_o be_v join_v with_o it_o as_o a_o mean_n to_o unite_v we_o to_o he_o 2._o do_v they_o indeed_o say_v he_o believe_v the_o lord_n supper_n to_o belong_v in_o common_a with_o baptism_n to_o all_o the_o member_n of_o the_o church_n why_o then_o do_v not_o infant_n partake_v of_o one_o as_o well_o as_o the_o other_o since_o it_o belong_v to_o they_o in_o common_a if_o member_n of_o the_o church_n why_o if_o mr._n danvers_n will_v know_v the_o reason_n it_o be_v this_o because_o though_o the_o child_n have_v a_o right_a as_o a_o member_n to_o all_o the_o ordinance_n yet_o he_o be_v not_o in_o a_o capacity_n to_o enjoy_v his_o right_n thus_o that_o person_n may_v have_v a_o right_n to_o ordinance_n and_o yet_o in_o no_o capacity_n to_o enjoy_v they_o appear_v in_o such_o as_o be_v sick_a or_o those_o that_o lose_v their_o reason_n that_o be_v church-member_n 3._o do_v paedobaptists_a indeed_o with_o the_o waldenses_n believe_v that_o water_n in_o baptism_n be_v the_o usual_a sign_n represent_v to_o the_o subject_n thereof_o the_o invisible_a virtue_n of_o god_n operate_n in_o they_o viz._n the_o renovation_n of_o the_o spirit_n and_o mortification_n of_o their_o member_n and_o can_v it_o be_v true_o say_v it_o be_v so_o to_o a_o infant_n that_o be_v not_o capable_a to_o put_v forth_o any_o act_n of_o faith_n repentance_n or_o mortification_n or_o discern_v the_o least_o sign_n in_o the_o water_n yes_o it_o may_v be_v say_v it_o be_v so_o to_o a_o infant_n very_o well_o and_o that_o upon_o as_o good_a a_o ground_n as_o circumcision_n shadow_v forth_o mortification_n of_o sin_n regeneration_n though_o the_o israelitish_n babe_n understand_v none_o of_o this_o but_o mr._n danvers_n do_v ill_a again_o in_o alter_v the_o article_n as_o you_o may_v perceive_v by_o look_v back_o for_o it_o be_v not_o as_o he_o represent_v it_o the_o article_n run_v thus_o we_o believe_v that_o in_o the_o sacrament_n of_o baptism_n water_n be_v the_o visible_a and_o external_a sign_n which_o represent_v to_o we_o not_o represent_v to_o the_o subject_n for_o unless_o i_o mistake_v as_o it_o be_v so_o word_v it_o serve_v more_o to_o his_o purpose_n 4._o we_o agree_v with_o the_o waldenses_n in_o the_o four_o article_n for_o we_o have_v tell_v mr._n danvers_n former_o that_o baptism_n itself_o be_v a_o real_a though_o implicit_a profession_n of_o faith_n and_o the_o express_v verbal_a confession_n of_o the_o parent_n be_v repute_v by_o god_n to_o be_v the_o child_n and_o so_o it_o be_v under_o the_o law_n when_o the_o parent_n humble_v themselves_o and_o confess_v their_o sin_n and_o bring_v their_o little_a one_o with_o they_o even_o they_o also_o be_v say_v to_o be_v humble_v before_o the_o lord_n 5._o the_o 5_o query_n be_v precarious_a take_v that_o for_o grant_v which_o we_o utter_o deny_v and_o that_o be_v that_o the_o baptise_v child_n be_v a_o antichristian_a humane_a invention_n 6._o do_v they_o believe_v say_v mr._n danvers_n that_o antichrist_n ground_n all_o christianity_n and_o religion_n in_o the_o baptise_v of_o child_n attribute_v regeneration_n to_o the_o outward_a work_n do_v contrary_a to_o the_o holy-spirit_n why_o then_o say_v he_o do_v they_o baptize_v child_n which_o as_o acknowledge_v be_v the_o basis_n and_o foundation_n of_o the_o false_a church_n and_o contrary_a to_o the_o spirit_n and_o for_o which_o there_o be_v nothing_o but_o the_o doctrine_n of_o pope_n and_o antichristian_a council_n to_o warrant_v it_o not_o to_o say_v any_o thing_n of_o these_o unworthy_a reflection_n let_v the_o reader_n once_o more_o take_v notice_n how_o he_o have_v also_o pervert_v this_o article_n look_v back_o and_o you_o will_v see_v what_o a_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d he_o make_v of_o it_o and_o metamorphose_v the_o article_n into_o another_o thing_n for_o do_v but_o observe_v 1._o they_o do_v not_o say_v antichrist_n ground_n all_o christianity_n in_o baptise_v child_n but_o if_o they_o have_v speak_v it_o it_o have_v not_o be_v against_o infants-baptism_n but_o against_o place_v too_o much_o in_o it_o 2._o they_o say_v antichrist_n attribute_n regeneration_n to_o the_o dead_a outward_a work_n of_o baptise_v child_n and_o that_o regeneration_n must_v be_v have_v thereby_o and_o herein_o they_o say_v he_o ground_n all_o christianity_n 3._o it_o be_v extreme_o scandalous_a and_o false_a for_o mr._n danvers_n to_o say_v that_o there_o be_v nothing_o for_o infants-baptism_n but_o the_o decree_n of_o pope_n and_o antichristian_a council_n when_o we_o have_v so_o full_o prove_v the_o use_n of_o it_o some_o hundred_o of_o year_n before_o the_o come_n of_o the_o pope_n in_o the_o sense_n that_o the_o word_n be_v common_o take_v viz._n for_o ecumenical_a bishop_n challenge_v to_o himself_o and_o usurp_a authority_n over_o the_o whole_a church_n have_v we_o not_o before_o tell_v he_o of_o cyprian_a and_o nazianzen_n and_o chrysostom_n etc._n etc._n and_o be_v there_o not_o a_o canon_n for_o it_o in_o the_o milevitan_a council_n and_o that_o before_o the_o pope_n come_v in_o or_o any_o of_o his_o decree_n so_o that_o now_o upon_o consideration_n of_o the_o premise_n i_o suppose_v the_o unprejudiced_a reader_n may_v be_v confirm_v that_o the_o waldenses_n be_v for_o infant-baptism_n by_o those_o very_a confession_n which_o mr._n danvers_n cite_v against_o it_o we_o shall_v now_o give_v you_o some_o account_n of_o some_o of_o their_o confession_n which_o speak_v they_o express_o for_o it_o there_o be_v a_o ancient_a confession_n that_o we_o meet_v with_o in_o dr._n usher_v succession_n of_o the_o church_n c._n 8._o p._n 242._o make_v by_o the_o waldenses_n about_o the_o year_n 1176._o as_o he_o take_v it_o from_o jacobus_n gretserus_n his_o proleg_n in_o script_n edit_fw-la contra_fw-la waldenses_n c._n 1._o and_o hovenden_n annal._n fol._n 329._o the_o word_n be_v nos_fw-la credimus_fw-la unum_fw-la deum_fw-la trinum_fw-la &_o unum_fw-la patrem_fw-la &_o filium_fw-la &_o spiritum_fw-la sanctum_fw-la etc._n etc._n and_o in_o the_o body_n of_o the_o confession_n there_o be_v this_o article_n credimus_fw-la parvulos_fw-la salvari_fw-la per_fw-la baptismum_fw-la we_o believe_v child_n be_v save_v by_o baptism_n which_o though_o it_o speak_v error_n according_a to_o the_o darkness_n of_o those_o time_n be_v about_o five_o hundred_o year_n since_o yet_o it_o prove_v they_o be_v for_o infant-baptism_n for_o gretserus_n say_v they_o be_v waldenses_n that_o make_v this_o confession_n and_o not_o as_o be_v false_o suggest_v that_o it_o be_v the_o inquisitor_n confession_n for_o it_o be_v make_v before_o the_o inquisitor_n to_o purge_v themselves_o from_o the_o arrian_n and_o manichean_a heresy_n of_o which_o they_o be_v accuse_v another_o confession_n be_v that_o publish_v by_o balthasar_n lydias_n which_o be_v present_v to_o uladislaus_n king_n of_o hungary_n where_o after_o they_o have_v give_v a_o account_n of_o their_o faith_n in_o other_o point_n they_o come_v to_o that_o of_o baptism_n and_o have_v speak_v of_o adult_n baptism_n they_o add_v professio_fw-la ista_fw-la nostra_fw-la etiam_fw-la in_o pueros_fw-la extenditur_fw-la our_o profession_n concern_v baptism_n extend_v also_o to_o child_n but_o against_o this_o mr._n danvers_n object_n that_o this_o confession_n say_v to_o be_v make_v by_o the_o waldenses_n in_o bohemia_n to_o king_n uladislaus_n be_v not_o waldenses_n as_o they_o themselves_o acknowledge_v in_o the_o preamble_n and_o further_o tell_v we_o
be_v not_o to_o be_v credit_v have_v abuse_v the_o world_n with_o such_o palpable_a falsehood_n neither_o be_v twisk_n another_o of_o they_o find_v to_o be_v a_o true_a chronologer_n all_o which_o we_o shall_v sudden_o make_v appear_v when_o we_o come_v to_o show_v their_o aberration_n 5._o yea_o some_o be_v of_o opinion_n that_o this_o dutch_a martyrologie_n wherein_o we_o have_v such_o a_o collection_n of_o pretend_a martyr_n for_o anabaptism_n be_v design_o calculate_v for_o the_o meridian_n of_o anabaptistery_n which_o whether_o it_o be_v probable_a i_o leave_v to_o the_o reader_n to_o judge_v when_o he_o have_v ponder_v the_o meaning_n of_o one_o passage_n which_o mr._n danvers_n have_v quote_v in_o his_o treatise_n of_o baptism_n edit_n 2._o p._n 232._o viz._n sebastian_z frank_n one_o of_o the_o principal_a author_n frequent_o name_v in_o the_o martyrologie_n say_v that_o about_o the_o year_n 610_o childrens-baptism_n be_v hold_v in_o many_o place_n of_o little_a esteem_n by_o the_o learned_a endeavour_n of_o adrianus_n and_o other_o and_o therefore_o the_o pope_n set_v themselves_o to_o uphold_v it_o by_o the_o braceren-council_n that_o the_o vanity_n and_o falsehood_n hereof_o may_v appear_v let_v it_o be_v consider_v 1._o that_o there_o be_v nothing_o of_o adrianus_n extant_a against_o infants-baptism_n in_o the_o century-writer_n but_o only_o the_o magdeburg_n say_v he_o be_v complain_v against_o by_o gregory_n to_z john_n bishop_n of_o larissa_n that_o he_o turn_v away_o young_a child_n from_o baptism_n but_o we_o have_v show_v before_o that_o he_o be_v not_o against_o their_o baptism_n but_o only_o remiss_a in_o look_v after_o the_o same_o in_o his_o diocese_n so_o that_o many_o child_n die_v unbaptise_v which_o be_v then_o judge_v dangerous_a and_o from_o hence_o he_o be_v report_v to_o have_v turn_v they_o away_o from_o baptism_n 2._o there_o be_v none_o else_o in_o this_o age_n so_o much_o as_o suspect_v against_o the_o baptism_n of_o child_n mention_v by_o the_o century-writer_n and_o how_o gross_o then_o be_v it_o say_v of_o sebastian_n frank_n that_o the_o practice_n thereof_o be_v of_o little_a esteem_n in_o this_o century_n 3._o how_o weak_o and_o false_o be_v that_o say_v that_o the_o pope_n set_v themselves_o to_o uphold_v infant-baptism_n in_o the_o braceren_a council_n in_o the_o seven_o century_n because_o it_o be_v of_o so_o little_a esteem_n when_o the_o magdeburg_n make_v mention_n of_o so_o many_o for_o it_o in_o this_o century_n as_o maxentius_n gregory_n and_o bishop_n of_o larissa_n else_o gregory_n will_v not_o have_v complain_v to_o he_o about_o adrianus_n and_o beside_o particular_a person_n they_o mention_v the_o council_n of_o matiscon_n 3_o canon_n for_o it_o cent._n 6._o c._n 9_o p._n 613._o and_o by_o this_o we_o see_v what_o a_o false_a historian_n sebastian_n frank_n be_v and_o jacob_n mern_v who_o mr._n danvers_n bring_v as_o avouch_v the_o same_o quote_v the_o 204_o pag._n of_o the_o dutch_a martryology_n for_o it_o and_o as_o for_o sebastian_n frank_n osiander_n cent._n 16_o p._n 121._o tell_v we_o in_o plain_a term_n he_o be_v a_o ringleader_n of_o the_o anabaptist_n from_o who_o his_o follower_n be_v call_v frankists_n and_o they_o teach_v omnia_fw-la in_o sacris_fw-la literis_fw-la incerta_fw-la dubia_fw-la &_o contradictoria_fw-la esse_fw-la that_o be_v all_o thing_n in_o the_o holy_a scripture_n be_v uncertain_a doubtful_a and_o contradictory_n which_o be_v a_o most_o horrid_a blaspheme_n of_o the_o holy_a scripture_n but_o may_v be_v true_a when_o apply_v to_o his_o own_o history_n have_v thus_o find_v these_o dutch_a author_n so_o tardy_a we_o shall_v leave_v they_o for_o the_o present_a and_o conclude_v with_o what_o we_o find_v relate_v from_o our_o own_o countryman_n the_o famous_a bishop_n usher_n in_o his_o succession_n of_o the_o church_n chap._n 7._o sect._n 23._o p._n 196._o be_v a_o say_n of_o windelstinus_n qui_fw-la hodie_fw-la dicuntur_fw-la protestant_n novi_fw-la sunt_fw-la waldenses_n they_o who_o at_o this_o day_n be_v call_v protestant_n be_v new_a waldenses_n which_o be_v confirm_v by_o another_o say_n of_o poplinerus_n who_o tell_v we_o that_o albigensium_fw-la religionem_fw-la parum_fw-la admodum_fw-la ab_fw-la ea_fw-la discrepasse_n quam_fw-la hodie_fw-la profitentur_fw-la protestant_n etc._n etc._n the_o religion_n of_o the_o albigenses_n do_v very_o little_o differ_v from_o that_o which_o the_o protestant_n at_o this_o day_n profess_v as_o appear_v by_o the_o fragment_n and_o monument_n of_o history_n write_v in_o their_o ancient_a language_n and_o then_o he_o further_o say_v that_o it_o appear_v by_o very_o ancient_a manuscript_n that_o their_o article_n of_o faith_n be_v doctrinae_fw-la protestantium_fw-la usquequaque_fw-la conform_v tout_fw-fr conformez_fw-fr a_fw-fr ceux_fw-fr des_fw-fr protestans_fw-la altogether_o agree_v with_o the_o protestant_n usher_v succession_n chap._n 10._o sect._n 19_o p._n 308._o mr._n danvers_n pretend_a witness_n bear_v by_o the_o donatist_n against_o infants-baptism_n confute_v mr._n danvers_n be_v full_a of_o complaint_n of_o the_o great_a injury_n he_o have_v receive_v and_o among_o other_o this_o be_v one_o that_o i_o tell_v he_o he_o have_v nothing_o in_o his_o treatise_n of_o baptism_n to_o prove_v that_o the_o donatist_n be_v against_o infants-baptism_n but_o his_o ipse_fw-la dixit_fw-la whereas_o he_o say_v he_o have_v give_v we_o divers_a authority_n for_o it_o and_o the_o reason_n of_o my_o say_n so_o be_v because_o the_o magdeburg_n that_o do_v in_o a_o particular_a manner_n set_v before_o we_o what_o the_o donatist_n hold_v from_o point_n to_o point_n do_v not_o charge_v they_o with_o antipedobaptism_n nor_o do_v any_o of_o the_o church-historian_n eusebius_n socrates_n theodoret_n sozomen_n or_o evagrius_n mention_v it_o neither_o do_v any_o of_o our_o modern_a writer_n give_v any_o hint_n of_o it_o further_o i_o tell_v he_o in_o my_o answer_n that_o danaeus_n who_o give_v we_o the_o sum_n of_o their_o tenant_n and_o of_o all_o augustine_n dispute_n with_o they_o in_o his_o opusculum_fw-la mention_n not_o one_o word_n of_o their_o deny_v infants-baptism_n neither_o do_v zanchy_a who_o treat_v of_o they_o and_o show_v what_o they_o hold_v in_o divers_a place_n of_o his_o work_n nor_o mr_n fox_n in_o his_o act._n and_o mon._n nor_o mr._n clark_n in_o his_o martyrology_n where_o there_o be_v a_o great_a story_n of_o they_o speak_v any_o thing_n of_o their_o be_v against_o infants-baptism_n no_o nor_o any_o other_o that_o ever_o i_o can_v hear_v of_o but_o only_a mr._n danvers_n and_o therefore_o i_o say_v as_o i_o do_v and_o if_o our_o antagonist_n have_v not_o be_v extreme_o tenacious_a of_o his_o opinion_n this_o have_v be_v as_o be_v conceive_v enough_o to_o have_v take_v he_o off_o from_o his_o mistake_a conceit_n but_o all_o the_o thanks_o i_o have_v for_o endeavour_v to_o rectify_v he_o be_v still_o more_o and_o more_o reproach_n mr._n will_n say_v he_o deal_v according_a to_o his_o wont_a manner_n very_o disingenuous_o with_o i_o but_o wherein_o i_o pray_v 1._o that_o i_o say_v he_o have_v give_v so_o many_o authority_n and_o of_o such_o antiquity_n to_o prove_v it_o he_o yet_o tell_v i_o as_n before_o to_o which_o i_o answer_v i_o must_v needs_o say_v the_o same_o still_o be_v not_o in_o the_o least_o convince_v by_o mr._n danvers_n reply_n for_o whereas_o he_o say_v he_o have_v give_v many_o authority_n and_o of_o great_a antiquity_n to_o prove_v it_o most_o of_o they_o mention_v not_o only_o in_o the_o treatise_n but_o reply_n be_v but_o of_o yesterday_o viz._n seb._n frank_n jac._n mern_v and_o twisk_n if_o i_o mistake_v not_o three_o german_a anabaptist_n vicecome_fw-la spanhemius_fw-la osiander_n fuller_n and_o bullinger_n as_o for_o the_o three_o first_o it_o be_v sufficient_a to_o say_v concern_v they_o istis_fw-la authoribus_fw-la non_fw-la stamus_fw-la we_o own_v they_o not_o because_o they_o speak_v false_o in_o many_o thing_n and_o that_o which_o none_o of_o the_o ancient_a writer_n do_v affirm_v as_o for_o instance_n mr._n danvers_n tell_v we_o seb._n frank_n and_o twisk_n affirm_v that_o donatus_n teach_v that_o no_o infant_n shall_v be_v baptize_v but_o only_o those_o that_o believe_v and_o desire_v it_o which_o be_v false_a and_o neither_o they_o nor_o mr._n danvers_n can_v prove_v it_o out_o of_o austin_n or_o any_o ancient_a writer_n but_o suppose_v donatus_n himself_o have_v be_v against_o infant-baptism_n yet_o una_n hirundo_fw-la non_fw-la facit_fw-la ver_fw-la one_o swallow_n do_v not_o make_v a_o spring_n it_o will_v not_o follow_v that_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o donatist_n be_v so_o likewise_o no_o more_o than_o because_o mr._n tomb_n the_o head_n of_o the_o anabaptist_n do_v conform_v therefore_o all_o the_o anabaptist_n of_o england_n do_v conform_v again_o jac._n mern_v say_v that_o cresconius_n oppose_v austin_n in_o that_o point_n viz._n of_o infants-baptism_n but_o in_o the_o whole_a dispute_n between_o austin_n and_o