it most euidently appeareth that blessing and thankesgiuing is all one thing And yet this is more manifest For whereas Saint Matthew and Saint Marke say as is before declared that our Sauiour when hee tooke bread blessed Saint Luke Luke â—2 19. 1 Cor. 10 24. â— Cor. 14. 16. and Saint Paul say hee gaue thankes Hereunto also pertaineth that plaine place of Saint Paul When thâ—â— blessest in the spiâ—it how shall hee that occupieth the place of the vnlearned say Amen to thy giuing of thankes seeing hee knoweth not what thou sayest Who is so blinde and so ignorant that heere seeth not blessing and thankesgiuing to be all one thing And therefore againe I say that by blessing is not here meant a secret whispering of fiue words to the conuerting of the substance of bread and wine into Christs body and blood as Priests foolishly vse and falsly teach but a thankesgiuing to GOD for so louing vs that hee hath giuen his onely begotten Iohn 3. 26. Sonne for vs that as many as beleeue in him shall not perish but haue euerlasting life For the which cause this Sacrament is of the ancient fathers called Eucharistia that is to say thankesgiuing As touching the breaking of bread which mâ—y resemble to vs the breaking of Christs body vpon the Crosse wee doe follow our Sauiour Christ therein and doe breake it when we distribâ—â—e it vnto the people the which the Papistes doe not but thrust in a whole vnbroken wafer into their mouthes Indeed I know that the Priest himselfe doth in his Masse breake his hoste into three parts One to signifie the Saints in heauen another the faithfull vpon the earth the third the soules in Purgatory But this deep diuâ—nity they haue found vpon the back side of the Bible But because this Gentlewoman or author of this scrole vrgeth eagerly the breaking of bread I would faine know what the Priest doth breake when he breaketh his Hosâ—e as they call it into three parts First hee breaketh not by their doctrine the substance of bread for they say there is none remaining to say that they breake Christs body wre blasphemy although it pleased that holy Pope Nicholas with his Councell to prescribe that godly and learned man Berengarius in his De consecra dist 2 â—go Berengariuâ— recantation to affirme the body of Christ Manibus Sacerdotum tractari frangi fidelium denâ—â—bus atterâ— i. To be handled with the Priests hands to be broken and torne with the teeth of the faithfull And to say they breake accidents without a substance were folly or rather madnesse These things before being considered let the indifferent reader vprightly consider how truely this Catholike Gentlewoman saith that we obserue none of these Now it followeth in the sayd paper The truth of the Catholike religion and of euery part thereof is proued euidently by the testimony and consent of all writers in all ages since Christ and his Apostles As for example the Real presence of Christ in the Sacrament the Sacrifice of the masse Purgatorie Prayer for the dead Prayers to Saints the vse of Images the signe of the Crosse Pilgrimage to holy Places and the rest now in controuersie Answere HEere bee things as boldly affirmed as they bee barely proued or rather cleane omitted and therefore they might without further proofe as well bee denied of mee as they bee affirmed of them And although I minde not long to stand vpon these particular poynts yet I will not let them goe so nakedly as they do but will somewhat touch them But heere let the Christian reader consider and marke that whereas this Catholike Gentlewoman saith that the truth of their Catholike religion and euery part thereof is prooued euidently by the testimonies of all writers in all ages since Christ and his Apostles they seeme to exclude from this proofe the Law and the Prophets the Gospell of our Sauiour Christ and the writings of the Apostles contained in the canonicall Scriptures For if they had meant otherwise they would haue sayd that the truth of the Catholike religion and euery part thereof is proued euidently by the testimony of the holy Scriptures and of all writers in all ages since Christ and his Apostles Therefore if their meaning bee as their words seeme to import to exclude from this proofe the canonicall Scriptures then they exclude the onely true triall of Christian religion for if the holy Scriptures Caâ—s 8. quest Nec suffâ— â—erâ— bee the onely rule of our faith and life as Beda saith in these words before alledged Nobis sacris literis vnica est credendi pariter viuendi regula praescripta i. The onely rule both of faith and life is prescribed vnto vs in the holy Scriptures then in the proofe of Christian religion we ought not to exclude them but chiefely yea onely to admit them And if Saint Aug. de natu â— grat cap. 60. Augustine doe truely say that wee ought without refusâ—ll to giue our consent onely to the Canonicall Scriptures then surely wee ought to trie and examine all matters by them Therefore I may say vnto you with the same Saint Augustine Auferantur ergo De vâ—itat Eccle cap. 2. c. Let these things bee taken away which wee recite and bring one against another not out of the holy Canonicall bookes but from else where And so let vs trie these points of your Catholike Religion by the holy Canonicall Scriptures the testimony whereof is sufficient and all other testimonies without the same bee of no force so saith the same Saint Agustine Qui diuina testimonia non sequuntur c. Arg. Epist 50. i. They that follow not the diuine testimonies haue lost the waight of mans testimonie Therefore I conclude this point with the same Saint Augustine Non audiâ—mus c. i. Let vs not heare This say I This sayest thou but Aug. de vnitat Eccles cap. 3. let vs heare This saith the Lord. There bee the Lords books whose authority we both consent vnto we both beleeue and wee both obey there let vs seeâ—ke the Church there let vs discusse our cause Bring then plaine proofes out of the holy Canonicall Scriptures for those your catholike points of Religion and I will yeeld And without them whatsoeuer testimonies you bring else where you shall nothing preuaile Well saith Saint Ierome Omne quod loquimur debemus affirmare Hier. in Psalm 98. de Scripturis sacris i. Whatsoeuer wee speake wee ought to affirme or proue it out of the holy Scriptures Idem ad Titum And againe Sine authoritate Scripturarum garrulitas non habet fidem i. Without the authority of the Scriptures pratling hath no credit Now to come to your particular points As touching your Real presence of Christ in the Sacrament if you meane thereby not a Real presence of Christ to the faith of the godly and worthy receiuer whereby wee affirme and beleeue that hee doth
and opinions were euen the same which as you haue heard were maintained by the good faithfull people called Waldenses Pauperes de Lugduno Maister Fox sheweth out of Nicholas Triuet who died anno 1328. that the Albingenses Act. monumen tom 1 p. 299. 2. edit onis denyed transubstantiation in the Sacraments of Christs body and blood and that matriymony was not a Sacrament and further writeth that in some Error hee found that they did deale against the wanton Iâ— il pag. 35. wealth pride and tyranny of the Prelates and denied the popes authority to haue any ground of the Scriptures and that they could not away with there ceremonies and traditions as images pardons purgatory of the Romish Church calling them as some say blasphemous occupyings c. Henry Pantalion in his Chronographie affirmeth out of P. Aemilius that they denied Christs body Pag 98. to be in the bread of the Eucharist And a little before he writeth that one Hoyry a learned Monke of Tolosa did Pag 92. teach that prayers for the dead and to the dead excomucations of priests Pilgrimages consecrations of Chrisme are all vnprofitable wherevpon he was condemned Thus I haue shewed to satisfie this mans longing desire what I haue read of their Albingenses by which I haue bene moued to conceaue a good opinion of them and to accompt them for witnesses of Gods truth for the which they were so cruelly presecuted and destroyed by that Beast to whom Apacâ— 13 7. it was giuen to make warre with the Saintes and to ouercome them I doe confesse that I haue also reade not onely in this pelting paper but also in lying and prating Prateclus and other malitious enemies of Gods truth of other filthy and false opinions asscribed to them But this is no new deuise of the diuell but an old stratageme to attribute to the faithfull and Godly faulse titles and slanderous and filthy opinions and practises to bring them into hatred and to moue the world to persecute and destroy them So was Iesus Christ the sonne of God intreated being called a Samaritane a deceauer of the people and by Belzebub Math. 27 63. Luke 23 2. Math 12. 24. 9. 34. Act 24. the Prince of diuels to cast out diuels So was Saint Paul vsed being tearmed a pestilent and seditious fellow and chiefe maiâ—tainer of the herisie of the Nazarens So were the Christians in the primitiue Church handled who were slandered to kill children to eate their flesh and to Turtull in Apolog. drinke there bloud and in there assembles hauing put out the candles to commit adultery and incests So doth Gabr. pratcoleleuch haerae lib. 14 13. paup ac Lâ—gd that lying companion Gabriel Prateolus and the writer of this scroule deale with the walldenses otherwaiâ—â—â—lled Pauperaes de Lugduno whome they affirme to hold that carnall copulation betwixt men and women when the lust of the flesh burneth is lawfull to wome Aeneas Siluius doth not ascribe any such opinion In those daies the Papists were not growne to such impudencie in lying as now they are Thus wee see that it ought not to seeme strange vnto vs for filthy facts and false doctrines to be by malitious enemies falsely imputed to Gods true Saints and seruantes It were rather a maruaile if the diuell being by name and long practise a Slaunderer should leaue his old occupation in slaundering and defaming the faithfull fauorers of Gods truth But this man saith that I dissent from those Bishops D. Cowper and Iewell I answere that as I doe reuerence the memory of them so I do nothing herein differ from them For concerning B Cowper I say that not he but Sir Thomas Eliot did sette downe in the dictionary all that therein is written of the Albingenses and Albanenses as appeareth by the first edition of it by Sir Thomas Eliot himselfe printed by Thomas Barthâ—let anno Dom. 15. 42. hauing this title Bibâ—otheca Eliotae Eliotes Librarie There the reader shall find all those thinges written of the Albingenses and Albanenses without addition detraction or alteration before D. Cowper did deale in it D. Cowper in supplying of wordes that there wanted did leaue these things and such like especially concerning proper names as he found them and not as he himselfe did iudge of them As for the difference in iudgement betwixt Sir Thomas Eliot and mee concerning these Albingenses although I doe greatly reuerence the memorie of him for his learning and for his good labours to the aduancing thereof yet I doe not thinke my selfe bound to stand to his iudgement therein who might bee to much carried away with the corrupt errors which ouer much swaied in his time whereby hee did to little espic the diuels accustomed deuise and practise before mentioned much credit the false reports of their malicious aduersaries As touching that pretious Iewell and most learned Bishoppe whereas D. Harding writeth thus If ye meane Hus Hierome of prage Wicklesse Almarâ—rke Abâ—lard the Apostolikes Consuta of the Apolâ—g Peterbuisians Berenâ—arians Waldenses Albingenses Image-breakers and such like which euer found fauâ—te with the Church c he answereth in these words Of Abailard Defens of the Apolâ—g and Almerike and certaine other your strange names if they haue taught any thinge contrary to the truth of God we haue no skill they are none of ours of Iohn Hus Hierome of Prage and Berengarius and other like vertuous men wee haue no cause to be a hamed c. This is all that Bishop Iewel saith in which words he doth not once name the Albingenses much lesse impute those filthy and false opinions to them Nether doth he absolutely affirme that Abailaâ—d and Almarike or any of the rest maintained any thing contrary to the truth of God but conditionly saith if they taught any thing coâ—trary to the truth of God we haue no skill they are none of ours to the which I say Amen But that B. Iewel did not accompt the Albingenses for wicked heretikes it may hereby appeare in that hee thought well of the See defens of the Apolo vt 1. cap. 2. diuis 1. part 4. â—â—p 1â— diuis 1. pag. 503. Waldenses which were the same that were the Albingenses as I haue before shewed but diuersly called in diuers places and did repute them for good and Godly men By this that I haue said the iudicious reader may see that there is no difference at all betwixt me and these reuerend and learned Bishops concerning the Albingenses as this ignorant Romanist doth vainely imagine And if there had beene some diuersity in iudgement herein betwixt vs I in thinking well and they in hardly iudging of them it had bene a matter of no great moment Heretofore vnder â—latiâ—a in Bonifac 8. Gabr. prateo pag. 206. Popery many worshipped Herman of Ferrara for a Saint whome Pope Boniface the 8. caused to be digged vp and burned for an heritike Some Popes
that Caluin of blessed memory well liked and allowed such authority in Kings and magistrates as wee acknowledge to bee in our gratious King and his Maiesty claymeth and vseth This Doctrine Caluine most soundly setteth downe both in many places of his workes and especially in his Institutions lib. 4 chap. 20. But Caluin iustly misliked that power and authority which that great enemy of Gods truth and parasitycall flatterer Stephen Gardiner did attribute to King Henry the same in effect which before they had acknowledged to be in the Pope to doe in a manner what he would in the seruice of God For Caluin saith that Gardiner being at In Amoâ— cap. 7. Ratisbone and dealing about matters of religion disputed not by arguments nether greatly cared for the testimonies of the Scriptures but said that it was in the Kinges will and pleasure to abrogate ordinances and to ordaine new rites and orders That the King might apoint the people to eate flesh this or that day that he might forbid Priestes to marry wiues that hee might take away the cup from the Lay people in receauing the Sacrament of Christes supper This was that which Caluin misliked and our gratious Soueraigne nether challengeth nor exerciseth He acknowledgeth him-selfe to be Gods minister and seruant and that it belongeth to his imperiall crowne and dignity which he hath receaued from GOD to see and prouide that GODS word bee truly preached that GOD according to his owne will therein reuealed bee rightly worshipped and serued and that such decent and holy orders bee vsed in the Church as truly tend to GODLY edifications Of the presbiteries dealing in Scotland I am ignorant But that they opposed them-selues against our Kings authority as though he had nothing to doe with the kirke you generally affirme but doe not particularly proue It may appeare by their subscribing to the second Heluetian confession of faith that they euer haue and alwaies will both subscribe See the 2. Heluet. conâ—ession cap. 30. and sweare to the doctrine of the Kinges authority ouer all persons and in all causes in such sort as here before is set downe Hereby I am moued thus to conceaue of them If any be otherwaies minded I approue them not nor their adherents The same I say of those whom you call praecisions at home who not denying the kings authority in eclesiastical causes yet forbeare the things here by you named because they be not perswaded of the Lawfulnes of them and for that as that most reuerend and learned father Bishoppe Iuell saith they haue bâ—ene of them of your part fouly abused to filthy purposes and because they would not gladly in any appearance shew themselues like vnto them that haue so Defen of the Apol. Part. 3. cap. 5. Diâ—â—s 1. Page 400. vntruly and of long deceiued the world c. But leauing these to their owne defence certaine it is that neither the Presbitery in Scotland nor these praecisians in England haue euer made any shew of such horrible barbarous and trayterous practises against the Kinges not onely authoritie but also life and safety as cursed Papists and diuelish Iesuits or rather Iebusites haue done As touching the second matter you obiect of the authoritie of Bishops I do know none that do so hardly and iniuriously iudge of it as you here do in calling it if your owne fingers or your Printer haue not deceiued you an hereticall order Howbeit we make it not so a matter of faith that saluation dependeth on it But wee beleeue that God may be glorified in that his holy word is truly preached and effectually receiued and good order in the Church vsed where the authoritie of Bishops is allowed and receiued and where the same is not obserued for as in the politicall estate there be diuers orders of gouernment as Monarchie Aristocratie and Democratie which haue bene and as yet are vsed to the good of the people so in the Ecclesiasticall estate there may be diuers formes of regiment vnder which God may be truly worshipped the people vnto saluation edified sin suppressed and good order in the Church obserued And although there bee some diuersitie of opinions amongst vs which is the best forme of Ecclesiastical regimeÌ„t yet in this we al concurre and consent that the meanest and worst which is in any of the reformed Churches is better and more to the glory of God and true comfort of the people then that exorbitant insolent and tyrannicall gouernment is which your great Monarch the Pope hath to the dishonour of Princes and calamities of countries long excersised For the third thing alleadged concerning our iarring it seemeth that you draw very low when you obiect vnto vs dissention about feastes and holy-daies I know neither Protestant nor as you distinguish them Puritane who accoumpt them the Sabboth day excepted as matters of faith and saluation but that they may be vsed or refused as to them in authoritie shall be thought meet Socrates the Ecclesiasticall Historiographer saith that neither Lib. 5. cap. 22. fol. 248. Christ nor his Apostles did command any thing concerning holidaies and that it was the scope and purpose of the Apostles not to giue lawes of holidaies but to bring men to good life and godlynesse Your owne friendes and fauourers haue misliked the multitude of your holy dayes Annot. in Math. 1. Erasmus saith that in the dayes of Saint Hierome there were but few Festiuall dayes Nunc feriarum neque finis neque modus est but now there is neither end nor measure of Ja argum in Tertul. de corona militis Hollidaies Beatus Rhenanus writing of these holydaies saith Quarum antiquitus mira paucitas Holydaies in old time were very few As for that you write of the Quarto-decimani I finde that the Councell of Nyce did take order that Easter day should vniuersally be kept after one sort and order and Ruffin lib. i. c. p. 6 that not vppon the fourteenth day of the Moone as the East Churches had vsed it and many did still obserue it But that the Councell did condemne them for heretikes Haeres 50. de Haeres 29. I finde not in the Canons of it expressed I am not ignorant that Epiphamus Augustinâ— do number the Quaterdecimans among heretiks The which it may seeme they did ouer obstinatly partly to much follow the fashion of the Iewes whose law concerning that matter was expired and nayled to Christâ— crosse partly resist the decree of that godly Councell which did therein seeke the peace and vnitie of the Church which had beene too much distracted and troubled by it especially by the meanes of Victor Lib 55. cap. 25. Bishop of Rome as appeareth by Eusebius Concerning your fourth matter of fasting neither you doe make proofe nor I doe accknowledge any controuersie in this Church of England but that all will willingly Defen of the Apol. part 1. cap. 2 diuis â—t part 2. cap. 14. diuis