fastidia detergeret Nihil enim fere de illis obscuritatibus eruitur quod non planissimè dictum alibi reperiatur The holie ghost hath magnifically and wholsomlie so tempered the holy scriptures that with euident places he might satisfie hunger and with more darke places might wipe awaie disdainfulnes For nothing almoste is found out of those obscurities which is not found els where most plainlie vttered It were no hard matter to heape vp manie testimonies of the auncient fathers to this purpose but that the va nitie of this answerer appeereth sufficientlie in all our bookes written against the papists in which not onely by the manifest places of the scriptures but also by most euident testimonies of the doctors of the church we confute them in the most and greatest matters of controuersie that ate betweene vs. But what saith our gallant answerer that the councels fathers and anciters of theChurch haue from time to timedeclared the true sense of the scriptures vnto vs hath none of these at any time erred in expounding the scriptures may we safely beleeue them whatsoeuer they say He wil I warrant you deny it except the Pope of Rome do alow their interpretations And therfore this flying from the only scriptures to the interpretation of Coun cels fathers ancetors of the Church is nothing els but an impudent shift to reserue vnto the Pope liberty authority to make what meaning of scripture they please thereby to giue colour to euery fansie they list to father it vpon the authority of the holie scriptures The third cause he affirmeth to be that by chalenging of onely scripture they maie deliuer themselues from all ordinan ces or doctrines left vnto vs by the first pillers of Christs Church though not expressely set down in the scripture c. In deede to deliuer our selues from the burthen of mens traditions the ordinances or doctrines of men we affirme the holie scriptures to be hable and sufficient to make vs wise vnto saluation by faith in Iesus Christ as the Apostles and principall pillers of the Church haue taught vs who haue left no such ordinances or doctrines but they be either expressely set down in the holy scriptures or by plaine and necessarie collection to be gathered out of the same For how will our aduersaries prooue that anie thing is receaued from the Apostles which hath not testimonie out of the writings of the Apostles who can be a sufficient witnes of such de liuerie seeing manie things were of olde referred to the Apostles tradition which euen our aduersaries do not admit to be Apostolical seeing the most auncient and immediate successors of the Apostles as Polyearpus Anicetus can not agree about a ceremony receaued from the Apostles namelie the celebration of Easter what certentie can there be of anie other ordinances or doctines fathered vpon the Apostles without witnes of their writings yea and some times directlie contrarie and repugnant to their writings But hereof saith our aduersarie they assume authoritie of allowing or not allowing whatsoeuer liketh or serueth their turnes for the time and hereof he bringeth example First of the number of sacraments whereof some protestants haue written diuerslie because the name of sacrament is diuerslie taken sometimes largelie for euerie holie signe sometimes strictlie for such holie signes onely as being instituted of God are seales of the dispensation of his generall grace in the new teftament perteining to euerie member of the Church somtimes for al holy mysteries or secrets c. But what doth it serue anie protestants turne whether there be more or fewer signes in number that maie be called sacraments seeing all protestants agree about the things themselues that are set forth in the scriptures to be visible signes of grace inuisible and the name it selfe Sacrament in that sense we speake of when we saie there are 2. 3. 4. or 7. sacraments is not once vsed This diuersitie therefore is but of a terme and that not vsed in scripture therefore it ariseth not of anie interpretation or peruerse vnderstanding of the scripture as our answerer would haue it seeme to be But let vs heare his example Martin Luther saith he after he had denied all testimonie of man besides himselfe he beginneth thus about the number of sacraments Principiò neganda mihisunt septem sacramenta tantúm tria pro tempore ponenda First of all I must denie seauen sacraments and appoint three for the time Marie this time lasted not long for in the same place he saith that if he would speake according to the vse of onely scripture he hath but one sacrament for vs that is baptisme In this sentence how manie lies and slaunders be packed together First he saith Martin Luther denieth all testimonie of man which is false for he alloweth all testimonie of man that agreeth with the testimonie of God expressed in the scriptures and often citeth the testimonies of the auncient fathers for confirmation of the trueth which he taught indeede he alloweth man no authoritie to institute sacraments or to make articles of faith or lawes to binde the conscience of man and he would haue all mans testimonies to be examined and iudged according to the word of God but this is not to denie all testimonie of man but to distinguish true testimonies of man from false An other slaunder is where he saith that Luther in denying all mans testimonie excepteth him selfe which is altogether vntrue For he requireth none other credit to be giuen to his owne testimonie then he alloweth to the testimonie of other Neither doth he arrogate any authoritie to him selfe which he derogateth from other men And namelie in this booke of the captiuitie of Babilon he taketh not vpon him absolutelie to teach euerie point but so farr forth as he did for the present vnderstand of them promising after greater study more diligent inquirie to intreat of diuers of them more certenly euen in this verie place of the number of the sacraments he saith he will admit three onclie for the present time intending to be further a duised whether there be fewer or more to be entituled with that name Wherein our answerer offereth him the third iniurie in translating tria pro tempore ponenda I must appoint three for the time as though Luther had taken vpon him to appoint how manie sacraments the Church should haue or would challenge power to appoint more or Jesse at his pleasure where as his wordes if the answerer did not wilfullie corrupt them by false translation do import no such thing but onelie as farr as he did presentlie see there were no more but three of those that were commonlie called sacraments of the new testament which were rightlie to be called by that name The fourth slaunder is that Luther hath but one sacrament for vs which is Baptisme if he would speake according to the vse of onelie scripture yea this is a double slaunder for neither doth
which is but a short section or Chap er doth not charge Luther with this opinion of heretikes not to be burned but the Donatists whose fansie is renewed againe in the Anabaptists and Libertines As for Luther Contra Latomum deincendiariis handleth not this controuersie at all but onelie expostulateth with the deuines of Louane which burned his bookes without examination or Conuiction of them out of the word of God Manie men haue complained and that moste iustlie of the crueltie of the Papists in burning as heretikes the true saints martyrs and members of the Church whose faith and religion they were neuer hable to conuince of heresie by the authoritie of gods word But that no blasphemer or obstinate heretike maintaining blasphemie against the expresse and manifest trueth of God is to be punished by death I am persuaded he can bring no booke or author of any accompt that so holdeth Fourthlie he addeth that Luther by onelie scripture found the sacramentaries to be heretikes D. Fulk by the same scripture findeth that both parties are good Catholikes But as Luther erred in his opinion of the sacrament so he was ouer rash in condemning those whome he calleth sacramentaries neuerthelesse seing he erred of ignorance and inconsiderate zeale he hath found mercie with God and is not to be adiudged as a blasphemous heretike For neither the error he maintained is blasphemie in it selfe neither did he hold it contrarie to his knowledge but as he was ignorantlie persuaded with zeale of trueth though deceiued with error How Doctor Fulke prooueth this not onelie by scripture but also by example of auncient fathers erring in like cases and yet not to be condemned for heretikes you maie reade in the place by this answerer quoted and in his confutation of Popish quarrels His last example is of manie things which Master Whitgift doth defend against Thomas Cartwright to be lawfull by scripture as Bishops Dcanes Archdeacons officialls holy daies and an hundreth more which in Geneua are holden to be flat conirarie to the scripture There are manie things lawfull by scripture which yet are not necessarie to be vsed The forme of external gouernment and discipline of the Church is not so expreslie set downe in holie scriptures but that euetie particulare Church hath libertie and must of necessitie appoint manie things for order decencie and gouernment which are not in expresse termes conteined in the scriptures euen as god shall giue them grace to see what is moste expedient according to the difference of times places and persons for the building vp of the Church in trueth and loue Wherefore although the Church of Geneua in the forme of outward regiment rites and discipline differing from the Church of England do not vse the same things that we do yet it followeth not that they holde them to be flat contrarie to the scripture neither is our answerer hable soundlie to prooue that he doth so boldlie asseuere To proceede he telleth vs what aduantage herctikes haue by onelie scripture they make them-selues therebie iudges of Doctors Councels histories presidentes cusiomes prescriptions yea of the bookes of scripture sense it selfe reseruing al interpretation to them-selues But this is nothing so for howsoeuerheretikes take vppon them to control al things according to their fantasie yet haue they noe aduantage by onelie scripture but therebie maie be are confounded when they come to examination tri all And as for the professors of the Gospell which acknowledge the scriprure to be sufficiente to teach all thinges needful to be knownevnto saluation although they are by god him selfe made Iudges of the spirits of al men by exacting them vnto the trial of the word of god which is the onelie certaine rule of truth yet doe they not by priuate authoritie iudge of Councells doctors fathers customs c. But by that charge which is laide vpon them to iudge cōdemne euen the Angels from heauen if they should bring anie other Gospell then that which the Apostles haue preached without al arrogancie or insolencie against the Angels Councels Doctors Fathers whatsoeuer but in giuing god the glorie to be onely true al men to be liers no Angel to be credited except they speake by the spirite of God of whose speach we haue no certaine demonstration but in the holie scriptures whatsoeuer is agreeable vnto them The discerning of the bookes of scripture of the true sense of them is also committed vnto the Church the faithful members thereof that doutful bookes be iudged by those that without doubt are indited by the holy ghost deliuered to the Church by faithfull witnesses instruments of the holy ghost to be of soueraigne and perpetual authority in the Church and so are knowne and taken of the true Church from time to time in such sorte that although the same truth maie be found in other bookes yet as Saint Augustine saith they are not of the same authoritie because there is not such certentie of trueth As for the sense and interpretation of the holie scriptures it must be taken out of the scriptures them-selues which are alwaies the best and surest interpretation of them-selues in all points necessarie to be knowne with the aide of the gift of tongues the gift of knowledge the gift of interpretation in them that haue labored in finding out the sense thereof according to the analogie of faith which is comprehended in the scriptures and that in places so plaine and euident as they neede no interpretation and therefore cannot be wrested by damnable heretikes without great impudencie and against their owne conscience for which cause Saint Paul willeth an heretike after the first second admonition to be auoided as one who though he will not acknowledge the truth yet he is condemned in his owne conscience and sinneth vnto eternall damnation Wherefore Councells Fathers Doctors customs examples are by vs admitted but not hand ouer head without distinction but such so farre forth as they be true and faithful interpreters of the scripture by matters and places plaine certenly knowne opening matters places obscure and vnknowne Which is the office of an expounder not to determine by his owne authority of anothers meaning whereof as among men euetie man is the best in terpreter of his owne so is the holy ghost of him-selfe in the scriptures by him inspired of whose meaning where they be hard to be vnderstood no man can be certaine but either by his own plaine wordes or by plaine necessary conclusion out of his plaine words Now touching the Papists whome our answerer saith to be restrained from chopping and changing affirming and denying at their pleasures because they binde them-selues to other things beside the scriptures to which they giue souereigne authoritie as to councells auncient fathers traditions of the Apostles and primatiue Church with the like the matter is farre otherwise For whatsoeuer they prate of the soueraigntie of the scriptures of the authoritie of councels auncient fathers traditions of the Apostles and primitiue Church they binde them selues to nothing but to the present Popes authoritie and
determi nation in thinges which he may choppe and chaunge at his pleasure against which they admitte neither scripture Councell Fathers nor Church For example brieflie The scripture moste plainlie forbiddeh the worshipping of Images will they giue soueraigne authoritie to the scriptures All the primitiue Church for six hundred yeares after Christ condemned the worshipping of Images euen Pope Gregorie that allowed the vse of them shall the authoritie of the primatiue Church or of Pope Gregorie in this point ouerrule them No I warrant you they will set them al to schoole and learne them a new lesson Theodoretus Bishop of Cyrus and Gelasius Bishop of Rome doe in plaine wordes affirme that the substance of bread and wine doth remaine in the Lordes supper after consecration doth either the antiquitie of these fathers or the determination of the Bishop of Rome which otherwise they affirme neuer to erre in doctrine preuaile with them against their new here sie of transsubstantiation The councells of Constantiople the first and of Chalcedon decreed that the Bishop of Constantinople should haue equall authoritie and dignitie with the Bishop of Rome The councells of Constans and Basill determined that the Councell is aboue the Pope The councels of Constantinople the sixt and Nice the second condemned the Pope for an heretike will the Papists of these daies trow you stand to the determination of these Councells you maie be assured they will not But the traditions of the Apostles they holde fast and binde them-selues vnto yea verilie as long and as much as they list What beareth a greater shew of the Apostles traditions then the Canons of the Apostles which excommunicate a Bishop priest or deacon that putteth away his wiffe vnder pretence of religion which excommunicate anie of the cleargie that is present at the communion doth not communicate except he shewe a cause whie he doth not Which admmitted him that is maimed in his eie or other partes of his bodie being otherwise worthie vnto the office of a Bishop because the maime of the bodie doth not pollute a man but the filthines of the soules These such like traditions of the Apostles how are they regarded of our Traditioners euen as much as they list and that is neuer a whit at this time and yet these men binde them selues to Councells Fathers traditions primitiue Church you see how farre Yea you see that while they raile vpon vs for appealing to onelie scriptures they themselues relie vpon the present Popes authoritie onelie Let all indifferent men therefore iudge whether it be more safe for a Christian man to bind him-selfe to the authoritie of scriptures onelie or to the Popes authoritie onelie and whether claime a priuiledge of ease they that will admitte no testimonie irrefragable but onelie the scripture or they which chattering of many other things in the end conclude vpon the Church onelie which when it commeth to triall is nothing els but the Pope onelie for if all the Church saie it and the Pope denie it it is nothing worth with them and if the Pope affirme it thoughe all the Church denie it it must stand for paiment But seeing the sense and interpretation of scripture is the cheefe matter we haue to speake of let vs consider whether Master Charke be iustlie charged by our answerer to haue abused that scripture by interpretation which is the chiefe ground of his preface and which he saith is a full and plaine rule whereby to discerne and trie the spirites namelie the text of Saint Iohn 1. Iohn 4. Euerie spirite which confesseth Iesus Christ being come in the flesh is of God and euerie spirite which confesseth not Iesus Christ being come in the flesh is not of God and this is that spirit of Antichrist c. This text Master Charke doth so expound as that it conteineth a confession not onelie of the person of Christ but also of his office for which office sake that wonderfull person of God and man Iesus Christ was ordeined and sent into the world to be a Prophet alone to teach a King alone to rule a Priest alone to sanctifie vs and to reconcile vs to his father by the obedience of faith And if any spiritte shall teach that Christ is not our onelie teacher by his Gospell but that we must admitte vnwritten beleefe and traditions from we know not whome to be of like authoritie with the written worde Secondlie if any spirite make not Christ alone our King and head to rule vs by his holie spirite but teach that a mortal and sinfull man must sit in our consciences and for hatred or gaine which is his practise binde or loose at his pleasure lastlie if anie spirite impeach the all-sufficiencie and entire vertue of Christes sacrifice offered vp once for euer and teach that themselues must enforce it from day to day by the continuance of their daylie sacrifice of the Masse offered for the quick and the deade it appeareth manifestlie that such spirits are not of God c. This interpretation of Master Charke saith the answerer conteineth manie absurdities For first the auncient fathers did expound this place as of it selfe it is moste euident against the Iewes which denied Christ to haue taken flesh also against Ebion Cerinthus and other heretikes that denied the Godhead of Christ. Note here by the aduersaries confession that some places of scripture are of them selues moste euident whereof this is one against the Iewes other heretikes that deny the godhead of Christ. And I hope you shall see it shortly as euident against the Papists that denie his offices To this interpretation of the auncient fathers we agree that whosoeuer denieth the person of Christ or any thing proper to his person is of Antichrist But none of the auncient fathers doe affirme that this text is to be vnderstood against such enemies onelie as denie the Godhead or manhoode of Christ. For Augustine and Oecumenius do interpret it against all heretikes and schismatikes which although they confesse this matter in wordes yet denie it in deedes and Oecumenius against all wicked persons which haue not the spirite of Christ mortifying their vngodlie lustes which carie not the mortification of Christ in their bodie c. Augustine also expoundeth the place against all that breake charitie Omnes negant Iesum Christum in carne venisse qui violant charitatem All they denie Iesus Christe to haue come in the flesh which doe breake or violate charitie whie so because not onelie the person that came but the end whie he came must be considered in the interpretation of this place as Saint Augustine rightlie iudgeth or els all heretikes will after a manner in tongue and wordes confesse that Iesus Christ came in the flesh But Quaeramus saith
the workes of nature or will which are in vs but by the he lie ghoste which is geuen vnto vs which both helpeth our infirmitie and worketh with our health for that is the grace of God by Iesus Christ our Lord. to whome with the father and the holie ghoste be ascribed eternitie and goodnes for euer In this discourse of S. Augustine is declared that the commaundements of God are made possible and not heauie to be fulfilled by the grace of God nor by the strength of man either of nature or will and that by two meanes faith and loue Faith by which we craue obtaine forgiuenes of our imperfection and loue by which we cherefully endeuour to accomplish in work so much as we can which we can not do perfectly in this life in as much asno mans heart is pure in this life no mans loue is perfect in this world yet faith purifying our harts that by themselues are vnclean obtaineth as the same 's Augustine saith that which the law commaundeth But how far is this from the popish assertion to wit The law is not abooue our abtlitie to keepe it The cursse that you cite out of Augustine Serm. 191. and Ierorme explan Symb. ad Damasum is but a crack of a broken bladder in stead of a thunderbolte For both the sermon and the explanation are counterfeit stuffe being all one word forword except a litle 〈◊〉 flue in the beginning and the end and yet are most impudentlieascribed both to Augustine and Ierome But that ne ther of both is author of that sentence I wil prooue by 〈◊〉 of Saint Ierome who expresselie affirm ah that which the sermon and explanation accurseet We cursse the blasphemie of them saie the counterfeiters which saie that anie thing impossible is commaunded by God to man and that the commaundements of God cannot be kept of euerie one but of all in common Saint lerome dialog aduers. Pelag. lib. 1. saith Possibilia praecepit 〈◊〉 ego fateer Sed haec possibilia cuncta singuli habere non possumus non imbeciliitate naturae ne calumniam facias deo sed animilassitudine quae 〈◊〉 simul semper non potest habere virtutes God commaunded things possible and that I confesse But all these possible thinges euerie one of vs can not haue through weakenes of nature lest thou shouldest slaunder God but through wearines of minde which can not haue all vertues together and alwaies And his whole discourse in that dialogue is to prooue that no man can be without sinne the contrarie whereof is flat Pelagianisine He expoundeth also at large how the commaundements of God are possible and how vnpossible which maie be seene of anie man that will read his writings against the Pelagians and therfore it is very iniurious vnto him to make him a patrone of that sentence which he put posedlie and plentifullie impugneth To conclude Chrysostome and Basile meane not that a perfect obseruation of Gods law is possible in this life but that God geueth grace in some measure to keepe them to those that are borne 〈◊〉 in Christ in whome onelie is performed that which was impossible by the law as the A postle saith These fathers and diuerse other whose authority the Pelagians abused as you do to vpholde their heresie by such speeches meant to accuse the negligence and slothfulnes of men in keepeing Gods commaundements not to extoll the power and abilitie of mans free will to keepe them as Saint Augustine prooueth by manie testimonies taken out of their writinges in his treatises against the Pelagians The eleuenth section of de facing the scriptures and doctrines by tradition THe Iesuites you saie do not vse these termes of defacing that the scripture is imperfect maimed or lame and thereof I will not contend but the same in effect they holde as Master Charke saith when they affirme that all things necessarte to saluation are not contained in the scripture Your similitude of a marchant leauing his commaundements partelie in writings and partelie by word of mouth and referring the resolution of doubtes vnto his wife is not sufficient in this case For our Sauiour Christ liueth for euer whereas his seruants and the men of whome his Church which is his spouse consisteth are changed in euerie generation So that there can be no certaintie of his commaundements but onelie by his writings which if they containe not all thinges necessarie to saluation they are imperfect lame and maimed And where you saie that Saint Augustine prooueth the contrarie at large lib. 1. cont Cresc c. 32. it is vtterlie vntrue For he saith expresselie concerning the question of rebaptising them that were baptized by heretikes Sequimur sanè nos in hac re etiam Canonicarum authoritatem certissimam scripturarum We truelie doe follow in this matter also the most certaine authoritie of the Canonicall scriptures whereunto he adioineth the consent of the Catholike Church after some disceptation about the matter whose counsell agreeable to the holie scripture no man doubteth bur it is to be followed Theverie same doctrine you saie teacheth the said father lib. de side operibus cap. 9. and also ep 66. ad Don. In the former is no worde to the purpose he speaketh of the Eunuch whome Philip baptized whose confession of Christ being verie shorte some thought to be sufficient for anie man that should receaue baptisme whereas there is a more distinct knowledge and particuler explication of this faith in other places of scripture set downe that is to be required of them that are catechised and come to baptisme In the last quotation I thinke there is a faulte either in your Printer or in your notebooke which setteth downe ep 66. for ep 166. which is directed to the Donatistes whereas the other is to Maximus But in this epistle to the Donatistes there is nothing that prooueth this matter that the scriptures containe not all things necessarie to saluation Onelie he exhorteth the Donatistes to vnitie shewing that out of the same scriptures which teach Christ to be the head his bodie the Church is to be discerned and learned Touching the twelue pointes of doctrine set downe by the Censure as not conteined expresselie in the scripture and yet to be beleeued Master Charke answereth that seuen of them are in scripture the rest not necessarie to be beleeued But here you saie the question is of expresse scripture and not of any farre fet place that by interpretation may be applied to a controuersie If you meane by expresse scripture that which is expressed in so many wordes as the thing in cōtrouersy we deny that we haue anysuch question with you For we holde that any thing which by necessary demonstration can be concluded out of the scripture is as true as necessary to be beleeued as that which is expressed in plaine wordes And so we meane when we saie all thinges necessarie to saluation are conteined in the holie scriptures And as for your
Secondlie he speaketh of the fourth daies or Wednesdaies fast to be appointed by the tradition of the Apostles which yet neuerthelesse the Romish Church doth not obserue Thirdlie that the Pente cosse or fiftie daies by the tradition of Apostles are exempted from the Fridaie fast which tradition is not kept in the Popes Church except you will saie that Pentecost is taken for whitson weeke and then the custome of the PopishChurch is directlie contrarie to the tradition of the Apostles for Wednesdaie and Fridaie that weeke are 〈◊〉 daies And as for the Wednesdaie fast as well as the Fridaie Epiphanius is so earnest that he addeth further Deinde verò st non de eodem argumento quartarum Prosabbatorum ijdem Apostoli in constitutione dixissent etiamaliter vndique demonstrare possemus Attamen de hoc exactè scribunt Assumpsit autem ecclesta in toto mundo assensus factus est c. And moreouer if the same Apostles in their constitutions had not spoken of the same argument of wednesdaies Fridaies we could otherwise throughly make proofe of it But they write exactly ofit and the Church hath taken it vp assent hath bin geuen in al the world You see he alledgeth not onely a decree of the Apostles but also the consent of all the world for the wednesdaie fast as well as the Fridaie fast So that if the Apostles tradition beside the scripture be necessarie for lent whie is it not also for wednesdaies fast And if wednesdaies faste is not necessarie no more is lent fast Further you affirme that Dionystus and Tertullian saie that praiers and oblations for the dead are traditions of the Apostles De Eccles. hier c. 7. de corona milit but Dionystus al beit we do not acknowledge him for a man of such antiquitie as the papists would obtrude him yet hath not any mention of traditions of the Apostles in that Chap ter touching praier for the dead but either of tradition in scripture orels at large endeuoring to prooue that he saith by scripture Tertullian in the place quoted speaketh onelie of oblations for the dead in that yearelie day which maie signifie thanksgiuing as pro nataliliis for their birth doth in in the verie same clause Not denying yet but Tertullian when he forsooke the Church and became a Montanist yealed to praier for the dead as a thing reuealed by the spirit aud new prophecie of Montanus Last of all you saie Saint Basill teacheth that the consecration of the fant before baptisme the exorcisme vpon those that are to be baptized their anointing with holie chrisme and diuerse like thinges are deliuered to vs by prescript of Christ and his Apostles lib. de spi. 5. cap. 27. Of consecration or blessing of the water to the holie vse of baptisme of those that are to be baptized there neede no tradition to be alledged the scripture is sufficient in the institution of baptisme whereby both the water and the perfon are dedicated to God aud his holie worke of regeneration The anointing with chrisme seemeth at the first to haue beene the signe of the giftes of the holie Ghost which were wont to be graunted with baptisme which though it had beene vfed by the Apostles in baptisme yet that particular grace being ceased which to signifie it was vsed it hath no longer anie profitable vse in the Church As for exorcisme vpon those that are to be baptized Is is your owne addition for Saint Basill hath it not But where you saie he hath diuers like thinges as deliuered by traditian it is verie true and among them this sor example that it is necessarie for the children of the Church to praie standing on the Lords daie But this necessitie euen in the popish Church is notacknowledged therefore whatsoeuer he saieth is a tradition of the Apostles is necessarieto be kept of all Christians although all the Church in his time beleeued it as that which Epiphanius reporteth of the wednesdaies fast before spoken of You demaund vpon what ground you shall discredit or reiect these traditions deliuered by such fathers cheife Doctors and pillers of the Church Euen by the same ground that you giue ouer other traditions deliuered by the same persones either because they are not true traditions or els because they are not necessarie for the Church albelt they were deliuered as no doubt some ceremoniall matters were euen by the Apostles them selues Your other reasons are friuolous That they were neerer the Apostles then we For the neerest and moste immediat successours to the Apostles Policarpus and Anicetus could not agree vpon the tradition of the Apostles one of them building vpon Iohn the other vpon Peter as is testified by Eusebius out of Irenaeus in the place before cited An other reason is that they were honest men and would not deceiue vs willinglie And so much we acknowledge yet might they be deceiued in ascribing the common practise of their time to Apostolike tradition and so deceiue vs vnwittinglie nor be controlled because the custome generall acceptation of that ceremonie restreined men Which things considered it is a great iniquitie as Master Charke saieth to adde traditions to the written word of God as if of it selfe it were not sufficient to instruct the Church in all thinges necessarie to saluation That which followeth of Doctor Fulkes handling the olde Fathers about traditions is answered by himselfe in his confutation of popish quarrells from pag. 55. to pag 61. After this you cite foure seuer all Doctors in defence of traditions vnwritten whereunto as some of auncient writers were too much inclined so haue you not so sure ground out of them for your popish traditions as you purpose And to beginne with Basill who by Apostolike traditiō defendeth the custome of the Church which was to sing Glorie be to the Father and to the sonne with the holie Ghost whereas the heretikes would haue it in the holie Ghost and cauilled that the other forme was not in the scriptures Saint Basil mainteineth it as agreeable to the scriptures by authoritie of auncient tradition although it were not expressed in so manie wordes in the scriptures as manie other thinges are which haue like force vnto pietie with those that are dilinered in expresse wordes as for example he alledgeth the confession of the faith in the 〈◊〉 which no man doubteth to be sufficientlie tanght in the scriptures although the verie wordes of our creed are not expressed in such for me As we rehearse our creede I omit 〈◊〉 things saieth he the verie confession of faith in which we beleeue in the father the sonne the holie Ghost in what scripture haue we it Againe And if they doe reiect the manner of glorifying of god as not written let them bring forth demonstration in writing of the confession of faith of other things that we rehearse By which it is manifest that the traditions he speaketh of are of two sortes the one
the next matter that you saie he prnoueth by tradition it is a question not so needefull to be decided although it may be prooued out of scripture that some of them which were Iohns disciples were baptized by him and so it is like were all the rest seeing Ierusalem and all Iurie and all the coast neere vnto Iordan were baptized by Iohn euen to the Pharisees and Saduces Publicans and souldiers it is not probable that the Apostles whoe before their calling by Christ were of honest and deuout conuersation did neglect that diuine institution which all men that would seeme to be religious made hast to receiue Furthermore you saie he prooueth by tradition the ceremonies of baptisme as deliuered by the Apostles lib. de fide Oper. cap. 9. The question is whether the Eunuch whome Philip baptized made such profession of his faith c. renouncing of the deuill as is required of them that are baptized when the scripture maketh mention onelie of a short confession that Iesus Christ is the sonne of God Where Saint Augustine sheweth that the holie ghost would haue vs to vnderstand that althinges were fulfilled in his baptisme which though they be not expressed in that scripture for breuities sake yet by order of the tradition we know that they are to be fulfilled Where tradition is not taken for that which is altogether beside the scripture but that which according to the scripture deliuereth what is to be obserued concerning the celebration of that sacrament which is the seale of mortification and regeneration That the Lordes supper should be receiued before other meates he thinketh of it as of other ceremontall matters that it came either from Apostolike tradition or from decrees of generall councell yet is it a thing not necessarie alwaies to be obserued for your selues doe housell sicke folkes at all times of the daie or night without respect whether they haue tasted any thing or no otherwise as a matter of order and decencie it is obserued of vs also to minister that sacrament before dinner and to them that be fasting if the case of necessity require not the contrarie Yet againe you saie he prooueth by tradition the exorcisme of such as should be baptized l. de nupt concu cap. 20. l. 6. cont Iulian. c. 2. But the truth is that by the ceremonie of exorcisme exsufflation and renunciation that is vsed in baptisme he goeth about to prooue that infantes before baptisme be in originall sinne and in the power of the deuill as is euident by both the places which prooue not exorcisme to haue beene receiued by tradition but by the end of that ceremonie vpon what beginning soeuer vsed in the Church at that time that infants are borne in originall sinne and subject to the power of Sathan before they be baptized The wordes of the former place are these In veritate itaque non in falsitate c. In truth therefore not in falsehoode the deuils power is exorcised in infants and they renounce him by the heartes and mouthes of their bearers because they cannot by their owne that beeing deliuered from the power of darke nes they may be translated into the kingdome of their Lorde Here is neuer a word of traditiō The second place hath these words Sedetsi nullaratione indagetur nullo sermone explicetur verum est tamen quòd antiquitas c. But although it originall sinne may be sought out by noe reason by no speach it may be expressed yet is it true that by true Catholike faith from auncient time is preached and beleeued thoroughout the wholl Church which would neither exorcise nor exsufflate the children of the faithfull if shee did not deliuer them from the power of darkenes and from the prince of death Here the auncient doctrine of original sinne is confirmed by the olde ceremonies of exorcisme and exsufflation which were vsed in baptisme to signifie that infants were by that sacrament deliuered from the guilt of originall sinne by which they were vnder the power of darkenes and death But that these ceremonies were Apostolike traditions he saith not or that they are of necessitie to 〈◊〉 vsed in baptisme when the one of them namelie 〈◊〉 is not vsed at this day for ought I know in the Popish forme of baptisme The Moscouites in place of it as it seemeth vse excreation For when the Godfathers and Godmothers answere that they renounce the deuil they spit out one the earth as it were in signe of detestation In Saint Augustines time they vsed to blow out In the last place you saie he prooueth by the same tradition that we must offer vp the sacrifice of the masse for the dead lib. de cura pro mort agenda cap. 1. 4. serm 32. de verbis Apostoli Of the sacrifice of the Masse Saint Augustine speaketh nothing but that praiers were offered for the dead at the celebration of the Lordes supper which he calleth sacrifice he saith it was by authoritie of the whol Church which was notable in that custome and that the wholl Church obserued it as deliuered from their fathers But seeing the elder Church for more then an hundred yeares after Christ had no such custome nor doctrine and especiallie seeing the same custome is against faith taught in the holie scriptures that the dead in the Lord are blessed that iudgement followeth immediatelie after death c. The authoritie of faith and trueth is to be preferred before the tradition and custome of men Neither is it to be thought to haue proceeded from the Apostles which is disprooued by the writings of the Apostles the onelie certaine witnes of the doctrine deliuered by them which is necessarie for vs to beeleeue and follow And therefore this new sir Censurer doth greatlie abuse the olde saints whome he would haue patrones of his vnwritten verities partely in charging them to referre vnto tradition many things that they doe not partlie in drawing to doctrine necessarie that which they speake of ceremonies mutable not the least in picking out one or two ouersightes to be pardoned vnder colour of them to maintaine all the grosse heresies of Poperie that are intollerable The fourteenth section Whether the Iesuites speake euil of scripture Art 6. intituled Nose of waxe IF you had ser downe Master Charkes replie betweene your Censure and your defense as reason would you should haue done for men to iudge indifferentlie betweene both you might haue spared more then two pages which you haue spent in charging him with a slaunder of the Iesuites where he reporteth that they saie the scripture is a nose of waxe when they saie it is as a nose of waxe For no reasonable man can make any other sense of those wordes the scripture is a nose of waxe but euen the same that you confesse to be the saying of the Iesuites the scripture is as a nose of waxe as Master Charke telleth you And moreouer that Paiua saith the fathers
aliquid dictum est sed vbi clara â—â—aperta sune testimonia id facere consueuerunt more quiaâ—â— haereâ—icorum etiam caetâ—rorum It is no maruel if the Pelagians endeuor to wrest our sayings into what senses they will when they are accustomed to do the same by the holie scriptures not where any thing is spoken darkely but where the testimonies are cleere and manifest after the manner indeede of the rest of heretikes These wordes of Saint Augustine doe as aptelie agree to the Papists as though they had bene by name vttered against them as in that which followeth you shall see verified in this Papist whoe both wresteth out sayings to such sense as himselfe pleaseth and also the holie scriptures themselues where they are most plaine and euident against him a right pranek of olde herenkes Note also by the waie that the scripture by Saint Augustines iudgement containeth most cleere and euident testimonies which though they be neuer so much wrested of herenkes yet in the conscience of all that loue the truth they doe manifestlie deliuer true doctrine and confute false and therefore be not as a nose of wax or a leaden rule by which no certentie maie be found or anie sure triall had by them as the Papists doe blaspheme The next quotation l. 3. cont Donat. ca. 15. is vncertaine because of diuerse treatises that S. Augustine did write against the Donatists but I gesse he meaneth his booke de Baptismo contra Donatistas where yet is nothing to his purpose or to anie purpose in hand but that the scripture of the Gospell If it be wholl is the same although it be alleadged by innumerable heretikes according to the diversitie of euerie one of their opinions and so Baptisme ministred by heretikes according to the institution of Christ is the same what opinion soever the heretikes haue of the wordes by which it is consecrated and ministred He saith also that the snares of heretikes and schismatikes are therefore very pernicious to carnal men because their proâ—ting in knowledge is shut from them their sentence of vanitie being confirmed against the Catholike trueth and their sentence of dissention being conâ—â—â—med agâ—inâ— the catholike peace These things are true of obstinate heretikes and consequentlie of Papists but they make nothing against Master Chark or for the triall of spirits which is the question now debated betweene him his aduersarie But that the scriptures are sufficient to beate downe al heresies and to reach all trueth necessarie to saluation and the onelie sure and certaine triall whereby all doctrine is to be examined and adiudged the same Augustine doth plentifullie and in manie places of his workes declare and euen in that same worke de Baptismo contra Donatistas lib. 2. Cap. 2. de vnitate Ecclesiae cap. 2 3. 16. de nup. conc lib. 2. cap. 29. de peccat merit remiss lib. 3. cap. 7. de natura gratia cap. 60. c. Three causes there be saith our answerer of appealing onelie to scripture The first to get credit with the people by naming of scripture to seeme to honor it more then their aduersaries doe by referring the wholl triall of matters vnto it To winne credit by cleauing to the authoritie of God expressed in his holie word written and to honor it by acknowledging the sufficiencie thereof for the triall of all matters of religion that maie comme in controuersie is no shift of heretikes or new teachers but the auncient practize of the best and most approoued Catholikes To pretend these things in shew and not to accomplish them in deed is the guise of hypocrites what religion soeuet they would seeme to mantaine The second cause saith he is by excluding Councells fathers and aunciters of the Church whoe from time to time haue declared the true sexse of scripture vnto vs to reserue vnto them selues libertie and authoritie to make what meaning of scripture they please and thereby to giue colour to euerie fansie they list to teach But Master Charke and his fellowes giuing the soueraigne authoritie to the onely scriptures do not at all exclude councells fathers and aunciters of the Church except it be in case where they teach contrarie to the manifest scriptures of god which doe either in expresse and plaine wordes or els by moste easie and necessarie conclusion deliuer vnto the Church all things needefull to be credited and knowne vnto eternall life as both the Apostle testifieth 2. Timoth. 3. and S. Augustine a worthie Father auncient of the Church consenteth Ep. III. Fortunatiano Neque enim quorumlibet disputationes quamuis CatholicoruÌ„ laudatorum hominum velut scripturas canonicas habere debemus vt nobis nonliceat salua honorificentia quae illis dcbetur hominibus aliquid in eorum scriptis improbare atque respuere si fortè inuenerimus quòdaliter senserint quà m veritas habet diuino adiutorio vel ab aliis intellecta vel à nobis Talis ego sum in scriptis aliorum tales volo esse intellectores meorum Denique in his omnibus quae de opusculis sanctorum atque doctorum commemoraui Ambrosij Hyeronimi Athanasij Gregorij siqua alioruÌ„ talia ita legere potui For we ought not to accompt the disputations of all men although they be catholike praise worthie as the Canonicall scriptures that it should not be lawful for vs sauing the reuerence which is due to these men to disalow and reiect something in their writings if perhaps we haue found out that they haue thought otherwise then the truth is of things by gods helpe either vnderstood of others or of our selues Such one am I in the writings of other men such would I haue other men to be vnderstanders of my writings Finallie in all these which I haue rehearsed out of the workes of holie and learned men Ambros Hicrott Athanasius Gregorie Andif I could so reade any like of other mens writings c. Also Ep. 112. Pauline 〈◊〉 scripturarum earum scilicet quae canonicae in Ecclesia nominantur perspicua firmatur authoritate fine vlla dubitatione credendum est Aliis verò testibus vel testimoniis quibus aliquid credendum esse suadetur tibi credere vel non credere liceat quantum meriti ea admonentem ad faciendam fidem vel habere vel non habere perpenderis What sceuer is confirmed by the plaine cleare authoritie of the holie scriptures of those truelie which are called in the Church canonicall without all doubt is to be beleeued But other witnesses or testimonies by which anie thing is counselled to be beleeued it is lawfull for thee to beleeue or not according as thou shale waigh what worthines he that counselleth those things hath to cause credit or els hath not Againe De doctrina christiana lib. 3. cap. 6. Magnificè salubriter spiritus sanctus ita scripturas sanctas modificauit vt locis apertioribus fami occurreret obscurioribus autem
conscience of men to sanctifie them by their worke whome Christ by his onelie oblation hath made perfect for euer They that holde these points denie Christ to be a perfect Prophet King and Priest But these be deepe mysteries of puritanisme saith the answerer Christ is a Prophet alone a King alone a Priest alone the ouerthrow of all gouernment No sir no to acknowledge Christe to be our onelie Prophet king and priest ouerthroweth not but establisheth all power that is ordeined vnder him to teach gouerne and sanctifie The scripture in deede Eph. 4. Acts. 5. doth allowe Prophets and teachers in the Church but not authors of new doctrine no makers of new articles of faith no traditions beside the Gospell of Christ which is written that we might beleeue and beleeuing haue eternall life in his name The scripture alloweth Kinges and rulers 1. Pet. 2. Act. 2. but the scripture giueth no authoritie to any king or ruler to dispense against the lawes of God nor to any Prophet or priest to discharge subiects of their oth made to their lawfull Prince to binde the conscience of man with new constitutions as necessarie to saluation c. But whereas you aske whether Priests may not sanctifie by the word of god 2. Tim. 4. you are neare driuen for proofes For to omitte that the Chapter you quote hath neuer a word either of priests or sanctifying and to take your meaning to be of 1. Tim. 4. verse 5. the Apostle speaketh not of the Priest or ecclesiasticall ministers power of sanctifying but of euerie Christian man and woman to whome euerie creature of God in the right vse thereof is sanctified by the word of God and praier and against them that forbid thinges consecrated and allowed by God as matrimonie and meates sanctifyed by his worde that hath giuen them to be receiued with thankesgiuing and by the praier of the thankefull receiuer as a mean to obtaine sanctification from God whoe onelie is holie and therefore hath onelie power properlie to sanctifie and to inioyne as more holie by their owne making and not by Gods sanctification virginitie then matrimonie fish then flesh yca take vpon them to sanctifie Gods creatures in an other vse then God hath appointed them as water fire garments boughs flowers bread and such like for religion and sanctifying of Christian men Againe he asketh what doe the traditions of Christ and his Apostles for of those onelie they talke when they compare them with scripture impeach the teaching of Christ and his Apostles I answere there are no traditions of Christ and his Apostles pertaining to a Christian mans dutie to obtaine erernall life but those that be comprehended in the holie scriptures as the spirite of God in the scripture which cannot lie doth testifie And therefore they are the traditions of men and not of Christ and his Apostles that areso called vnder which title all heresies fansies may be brought in without testimonie of the written worde of God Wherefore such traditions doe greatlie impeach the office of Christes teaching reproouing his Apostles and Euangelists of imperfection if they haue not comprehended the summe of all that Christ taught and did for our saluation which Saint Luke in the beginning of his Gospell doth professe that he hath done and that verie exactlie And further it is false that our answerer saith they talke of the traditions of Christ and his Apostles onelie when they compare them with scripture For they compare the decrees of their Pope and of their generall councells allowed by him to be of equall authoritie with the holie scriptures as well as traditions Secondlie he asketh what doth the spiritual authorttie of the Pope vnder Christ diminish the Kinglie power and authoritie of Christ I answere the Pope hath no spirituall authoritie vnder Christ by anie graunt of Christ but he vsurpeth authoritie aboue Christ when he will controll the lawes and institutions of Christ as denying the cuppe of blessing vnto the laie people and in taking vpon him to make newe lawes and to inioyne men to obserue them in paine of damnation as be his lawes of abstinence from mariage and meates for religions sake which Christ hath left free for all men euen for Bishops Priests and Deacons of the Church and in an hundred matters beside Last of all he asketh How doth the priesthood of men as from Christ or the sacrifice of the altar instituted by Christ disgrace Christs priesthood or his sufficient sacrifice once for all offered on the crosse I answere the priesthood of reconciling by sacrifice doth not passe from Christ to anie man because he hath by one sacrifice made perfect for euer all that are sanctifyed and liueth for euer to make intercession for vs therefore hath as the Apostle saith 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a priesthood that passeth not to any other in succession as Arons priesthood did whereby he is able to saue for euer those that come vnto God by hym Againe I denie that Christ did institute that sacrifice of the altar whereof there is no worde in all the scripture and therefore a new priesthood and a new sacrifice must needes be blaspemous against the eternal priesthood of Christ and that one sufficient sacrifice which he offered and therebie found eternall redemption The texts alledged by Master Charke Heb. 7. 9. he saith doe not impeach this dailie sacrifice of theirs because they graunt that sacrifice once offered c. in that manner as it was then done meaning bloodelie whereas they offer it vnbloodelie c. But the wholl discourse of the Aposile throughout the wholl epistle almoste excludeth all repetition of that sacrifice in any manner For therepetition of the same sacrifice should argue imperfection in it as it did in the Iewish sacrifices and without shedding of blood there is noremission of sinnes Is Christ shoulde be often offered he should often suffer All which being impossible it remaineth that as Christ offered himselfe but once and not often so no man hath authoritie or power to offer him anie more neither is there anie neede he should be more then once offered seing by that one oblation he hath made perfect for euer all that are sanctified and hath found eternall redemption for all that beleeue in him But for proofe that there must be such a daylie sacrifice in the Church vntill the end of the world he alledgeiu the prophecie of Daniell 12. Malachie 1. whereas Daniell speaketh of the dailie sacrifice of the Lawe which should cease in the persecution of Antiochus and be vtterly abolished by the death of Christ. And Malachic of the sacrifice of praise and thankesgeuing which by all nations is offered as a pure sacrifice and acceptable to him through Christ. The former exposition is allowed by S. Ierome to be verified of Antiochus in a type of Antichrist whoe shall forbid culium Dei the worship of God which doth not require any such
will so that she was among them baptized and tooke vpon her the forme of a Nunne whome her father would by force and stripes haue compelled to returne to the Catholike Church but he was forbidden by S. Augustine to vse such force if she would not come with a good will This maie touch Papistes also which haue and do professe nunnes monkes and Priestes yong vndiscret persons against the consent of their parentes but how it should be applied against vs I cannot see But here the notebooke was to blame to quote these places for such purposes the answerer I hope is not so impudent that if he had read the places him-selfe he would for shame haue noted them against vs or els haue added as he doth Finally he noteth it as heretical in the Arrians to appeall from traditions to onelie scripture lib. 1. Contra Maximinum In all which booke there is no such matter for neither doth Maximinus appeale from traditions neither is he noted for so doing by Saint Augustine In deede he often times boasteth of the authoritie of holie scriptures and in that conference he manie times calleth for testimonies of holie-scripture and professeth that he is wil be a disciple of the holie scriptures But for this he is not reproued of Saint Augustine but still pressed with the authoritie of holie scriptures whereof he falselie boasted and when he doth but once call to witnes the councell of Ariminum Saint Augustine in his answer telleth him plainlie that he ought not to alleadge with anie preiudice that Councell against him as neither him selfe the Councell of Nice against the Arrians but requireth that the matter be decyded by authority of the scriptures which are common to bothe partes But Irenaeus in deede doth note it as hereticall in the Valentinians to appeale from the holie scripture to traditions without the which they affirmed that the trueth could not be found in the scriptures which they accused to be diuerselie or doubtfullie written as the Papists do in comparing them to a nose of wax or a leaden rule So the contrarie to that he falselie saith was noted as hereticall by S. Augustine is in trueth noted as hereticall by S. Irenaee But Optatus before Saint Augustine saith he noted it as hereticall in the Donatistes to breake altars whereupon the bodie and blood of Christ were kept as the wordes of Optatus are You must vnderstand that these altars were communion tables made of wood and remooueable couered with a linnen cloth in the time of celebration of which in spite of Catholike Religion some they brake and some they seraped onelie for which follie they are derided by Optatus So plaied the Papistes with the communion tables in the beginning of Queene Maries raigne calling them in despite oister bordes and breaking them with as great furie and without lawfull authoritie as the Donatistes did The like parts they plaied with the communion cups of which he also complaineth as also challenging to them-selues the Church yeardes that the bodies of the Catholikes might not be buried in them So did the Papists in Queene Maries time But the wordes of Optatus are saith our answerer that the bodie and blood of Christ were kept vpon those altars He would haue vs thinke that the sacrament of the altar was kept in a pixe as among the Papistes But the wordes of Optatus are not so For albeit he calleth the communion table an altar as it was commonlie called at that time yet he saith not that the bodie and blood of Christ was kept vpon it his wordes are quid est enim altare nisi sedes corporis sanguinis Christi For what is the altar but the seat both of the bodie and blood of Christ And lest you should thinke that it was a permanent seat wherein the sacrament was kept as it is among the Papistes he saith further speaking of the breaking and scraping of these wooden altars Quid vos offenderat Christus cuius illic per certa momenta corpus sanguis habitabat what had Christ offended you whose bodie and blood at certaine moments of time did dwell there By which wordes he sheweth that the sacrament of the bodie and blood of Christ taried no longer there then vntil the time of the distribution of the same vnto the communicants As for breaking downe of Idolatrous altars and prophaning of all instrumentes belonging to them we haue the word of God as a sufficient warrant so that we cannot iustlie be likened to the Vandales that were Arrians or to Iulian the Apostata which defaced the Religion of the Christians so long as our Religion by the scriptures can not be conuinced of heresie or Apostasie For as heretikes and ethnikes destroied the Religion of Christ with the places and instruments vsed in the exercise thereof so did the Christians serue the Tempells of Idolls and all other monuments of gentilitie and heresie The Papists do no more spare our holie Bibles then we do their prophane bables They breake our tables and cuppes as we do their altars and challices they burne our bodies as we doe their Idolls Finallie it is the Religion that must iustifie or condemne these actions the actions are no sufficient trial of the trueth of Religon Here againe he appealeth to publike disputation or to any other indifferent waie of triall that we dare afford him As for publike disputation we dare if the Magistrates thinke it conuenient but a most in different waie of triall by writing their arguments in syllogismes Doctor Fulke offered for certaine yeares agoe before Campian crept forth with his seditious challenge the offer still remaineth take vp his gloue you Papists if ye dare As for the seditious commendation of Campian and Sherewyn condemned and executed for high treason where with he hath neuer done I will omitte That all heresie is beggerrie which he laboureth to prooue out of Saint Augustine and that the Maiestie of the Catholike cause is greater then heresie can oppresse we doe willinglie graunt Onely let not the maiestie of Christian religion be esteemed by the multitude or wordlie pow er of them which professe it wherein yet the Protestantes are not much inferiour to the Papists at this time but by the riches and glorie of Gods truth reuealed in his holie word wherein Poperie whensoeuer triall is made sheweth it selfe like a moste filthie roge and miserable beggar though she seeke cloakes of eloquence learning authoritie of men or any such like things to couer her And among all that in these times haue taken vpon them to defend her there is not a more beggerlie marchant then this proud answerer who hauing no reading of his owne nor any other good quality of a defender but a brasen face an heape of scornefull words is faine to scrape all his patches of learning out of some other mens notes or suggestions in which he is as voyde of knowledge as a beggar is of honor or riches The
the noble virgine Eustochium testified how litle he preuayled with such immoderate austerity to subdew the lust of his slesh vntil by importunitie of prayers he obteined rest of his vnquiet minde from Christ. Although his wordes be not as you haue set them downe that his skinne was as blacke as an Ethiopian but his deformed skinne was growen ouer with the hearines or scurffe of an Ethiopians flesh squalida cutis situm aethiopicae carnis obduxerat In the margent you note that we will saie Saint Hierome was noe Protestant I answere although we cannot allow Saint Hierome or any man that by hurting his bodelie health with immoderate rigour of austere life bringeth his natural life in daunger yet doe we imbrace S. Hierome as a member of the true Church of Christ whoe trusted not in any merite of such chaistisment but onelie in the mercie of God by Iesus Christ. The like we say of any examples of godlie men that are brought by Cassianus whoe is not altogether so olde as you make him Your rayling and seoffing at Peter Martyr I omitte as meete for such a Censurer but where you charge him to iest at Saint Basill and Saint Gregorie Nazianzen for hard handling of their owne bodies in cap. 16. lib. 3. Reg. your note boke deceiued you for in his comment vpon the Chapter he hath no such matter His iudgement els where may be to this effect That notwithstanding the examples of the auncient godlie fathers yet it is neither lawfull nor expedient for a man with such rigour to handle his bodie as it be not able to serue him in his calling For as chastisement of the bodie to bring it in subiection is sometime necessarie So weakening of the bodie to make it vnable to serue the spirit in such outward actions as require the vse of the bodie is neither wisedome nor godlines what examples soeuer be pretended For as it is not lawfull for a man vnder any pretense of mortifying his flesh to kill him selfe so it is not lawfull for any man to torment his bodie aboue the strength thereof wherby sicknes must needes follow and death may ensue For against all examples of godlie men that can be alledged to the contrary we will oppose the wisdome of the holy ghost in his elect vessel S. Paul whoe calleth Timothie from such austeritie wherebie his health was impaired vnto a moderate vse of gods creatures Drink no more water saith he butvse a litle wine because of thy stomach and often infirmities 1. Tim. 5. 23. According to the proportion of which rule if many of the examples before remembred were exacted they may perhapes declare a zeale in the persons but such as is not guided by knowledge of Gods will reuealed in the scriptures Where you saie If the Ministers of England would vse this cooling phisick there should be fewer Eatons and Hynches openlie punished or flie the countrie for incest rape you would insinuate that for lacke of chastisement of mens bodies so great enormites breake out and in part it may be true so you touch none but such as are guilty who when they be discouered by your owne confession are not winked at in our Church but openlie punished what discipline soeuer you vse when anie of your Iesuites are ouertaken with such offences The number God be thanked of such offenders among vs is not great how small chastisement soeuer you thinke the Ministers doe vse and therefore no cause why you should amplifie them in the plurall number as though for one Eaton or one Hynch there had beene ten of each sorte at the least Too manie we confesse of one but fewer then one there could not be except there had beene none Howbeit we praise God that so fewe haue geuen such offence in so long peace of the Church and praie God they be the last Yet are they a small matter for you to insult against vs if you looke homewarde where for two you may easilie finde two hundred and for two poore Ministers manie of your great prelates yea your Popes by confession of your owne historians haue not beene behind any examples of incontinencie and filthines But if we will not practise this remedie our selues for contristing or making sad the holie ghost within vs which you saie is our phrase yet you will vs not to impute it as schisme and heresie to them which vse it moderatlie as we maie imagine the Iesuites will being not fooles nor hauing iron bodies but sensible as ours are Hereto I answer that the remedie of incontinencie we learne out of the scriptures and haue no neede of your instruction for such matters if God geue vs grace to practise that which we learne out of his word The phrase whereat you scoffe is not ours but vsed by the holie Ghost him-selfe though in a farre other sense then you ascribe it to vs in which meaning you will sooner be hanged for a traitour then you are able to prooue that anie approoued Minister of ours hath euer vsed the same in speach or writing Among the familie of loue perhappes which are catercosins with you Papistes you may finde such blasphemous abusers of holie phrases of scripture The imputing to schisme or heresie ariseth of the Iesuites profession and practise which in such doinges pretend a greater merit and perfection then God requireth of Christians Otherwise we doubt not but many of the Iesuites can fauour them-selues wel enough in their voluntarie whipping especiallie those of our nation or of anie other except the Spaniardes among whome the reliques of the olde whipping heretikes haue continued so ranke in some that they haue beene seene in England to endure greeuous whipping for other mens sinnes that liked not to suffer such penannce in their owne persons The following of one mans rule you sate can make no diuision because it is but a particular direction of life and manners grounded one the seriptures and practise of the fathers and alowed by the superiours of the Church But here you assume more then wil be graunted for neither is the rule of Laiolas grounded one the scriptures neither haue the gouernours of the Church authoritie to allowe anie such rule and last of all it is so newe that it hath no practise of the auncient fathers to shadow it The first is prooued before the second dependeth vpon the first and the last of the newnes is manifest of it selfe But all this while you haue supposed that Master Charkes reportes of the Iesuites life and vocation were true which is false for there was neuer anie that tooke a vowe to whippe them-selues and much lesse to doe it after the example of a sect called by the name of whippers condemned long agoe Here beside a double cauill is nothing worthie the answering for Master Charke meaneth not that their vowe is to followe the condemned whippers but that this whipping is after the example of that condemned sect in that they wippe and torment
whereunto scripture is consonant And here you swell as much as anie to ade in the opinion of your deepe knowledge in these matters Neuertheles we ignorant and vnlearned Protestantes thinke it more safe to be ignorant of the manner of the sonnes generation with Saint Ambrose then to determine beside the scriptures thereof with Thomas Aquinas When Saint Ambrose was pressed with the same question that you set downe of the aduersaries how can God beeing a spirit beget a sonne and yet the same not to be after his father in time or nature but equall with him in both and how doth the father beget he answereth thus De side ad Gratian. lib. 1. cap. 5. Quaeris à me quomodo sifilius sit non priorem habet patrem quaero item abste quando aut quomodo putes filium esse generatum Mihi impossibile-est generationis scire secretum Mens deficit vox silet non meatantùm sed angelorum Supra potestaâ—â— supra angelos supra Cherubin supra Seraphin supra omnem sum est quia scriptum est pax autem Christi quae est supra ennem sensum Si pax Christi supra omnem sensum est quemadmodum non est super omnem sensum tanta generatio Tu quoque manum ori admoue scrutari non licet superna mysteria Licet scire quod natus sit non licet discutere quemadmodum natus sit Illud negare mihi non licet hoc quaerere metus est Nam si Paulus ea quae audiuit raptus in tertium coelum ineffablia dicit quomodo nos exprimere possumus paternae generationis ercanum quod nec sentire potuâ—â—mus nec audire Thou askest of me how if he be a sonne he hath not his father before him I ask likewise of thee when or how thou thinkest that the sonne was begotten For to me it is impossible to knowe the secret of his generation The minde faileth the voice stayeth not of me 〈◊〉 but euen of the Angells It is aboue powers aboue 〈◊〉 aboue Cherubim aboue Seraphim aboue all vnderstanding because it is written The peace of Christ which is aboue all vnderstanding If the peace of Christ be aboue all vnderstanding how is not so excellent a generation aboue all vnderstanding Thou also holde thy hande before thy mouth it is noâ— lawfull to search these high mysteries it is lawful to know 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 begotten it is not lawful to discusse after what manner he is begotten That to denie it is not lawfull for me this to inquâ—â— of I am afearde For if Paul saith that those things which 〈◊〉 being taken vp into the third heauen were unspeakeâ—â— how can we expresse the secret of the fathers generation 〈◊〉 we could neither vnderstand nor heare c. If thâ— determination were no lesse to be beeleeued 〈◊〉 other mysteries of the trinitie that are expressed in the scripture as you affirme Saint Ambrose was short in his faith of the trinitie as euerie man may see by his answere Neuertheles whatsoeuer is obiected that the soone should not be equall in time and nature with the father whereof ensueth the pluralitie of Gods is manifestlie confuted by al those scriptutes that affirme one onelie God and Iesus Christ to be God and the onelie be gotten 〈◊〉 of the father which must needes argue the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in nature time or eternity How this may be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the scripture affirmeth that it is Christians 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ought not or neede not to inquire If infidels in 〈◊〉 they are not to be answered by authoritie of 〈◊〉 scriptures which they beeleeue not much lesse 〈◊〉 the Church which they know not And then the 〈◊〉 is out of the matter in coÌ„trouersy whether 〈◊〉 things that are to be beleeued necessarie to 〈◊〉 be conteined in the holie scriptures Neuerthelesse 〈◊〉 to infidels that Philosophicall answer may be giuen how the generation of the sonne by the father 〈◊〉 be without inequality in time or nature but 〈◊〉 it is or must be onelie by vnderstanding of him selfe he thinke it for all your bragges you are not able to 〈◊〉 the determination of your Church to auow it 〈◊〉 for all is not defined by your Church that the 〈◊〉 haue wearied their heades to dispute of But if you could prooue it of necessitie to be so the scriptures that affirme Christ to be the wisedome of the father the word that was in the beginning with the father c. would giue as much light for the manner of his generation as is possible and profitable for man to know Beside this of the 〈◊〉 of the sonne you haue other questions of 〈◊〉 aduersaries what meane they you saie to holde that the 〈◊〉 ghost proceedeth from the father and that the sonne 〈◊〉 not but is begotten To this I answere That the 〈◊〉 ghost proceedeth from the father the text of 〈◊〉 is plaine Iohn 15. 26. that the sonne is begotten of the father Iohn 1. 14. That the sonne proceedeth not from the father albeit he is begotten it is heresie and blaspemie to affirme For he him selfe affirmeth Iohn 16. 28. I proceeded from the father and came into the world and Ioh. 8. 42. Another question you haue like vnto this whie is it heresie to say that the sonne proceedeth from the father or that the holie ghost is begotten I aunswere to saie the holie ghost is begotten it is heresie because the scripture teacheth that the sonne is the onelie begotten of the father But to saie that the sonne proceedeth from the father is no heresie but the contrarie is heresie because it is against the expresse words of Christ as I haue shewed before And Saint Augustine affirmeth expressely that whatsoeuer is begotten proceedeth so that you cannot denie the proceeding of the sonne from the father except you denie his begetting Neuertheleles although the sonne and the holie ghost do both proceede yet not both alike as the same Augustine sheweth de trin lib. 5. cap. 14. vbi illud elucescit vtpote quod solet multos mouere cur non sit filius etiam Spiritus Sanctus cum ipse à patre exeat sicut in Euangelio legitur Exiit enim non quo modo natus sed quo modo datus ideo non dicitur filias quia neque natus est sicut vnigenitus neque factus vtper Dei gratiam in adoptionem nasceretur sicutinos Where that also is made cleare which is wont to moue manie men why the holie ghost also is not the sonne seeing that he also proceedeth from the father as it is read in the gospell For he proceeded not as begotten but as giuen and therefore he is not called the sonne because he is neither begotten as the onely begotten nor made that by the grace of god he might be borne into adoption as we Here you see that proceeding is common to both the persons yet one manner of proceeding proper to the sonne and another to the holie ghost A
of Colene in a moste apt similitude called the scripture a nose of waxe and Pighius the leaden rule of the Lesbian building But now concerning the matter it selfe You would shift it of by saying The Iesuites doe compare the hereticall wresting and detorting of scripture vnso the bowing of a nose of waxe vpon certaine circumstances which are these First not in respect of the scripture it selfe but in respect of heretikes and other that abuse it and that before the rude people that cannot iudge thirdlie to the ende to flatter Princes or the people in their vices Thus much was said before in the Censure But it was replied that Andradius confesseth the fathers of Colene doe saie that the holie scripture is as a nose of wax So doth Pighius and it is a thing more commonlie knowen then that it can be denied Therefore the wresting of the scripture is not compared by them to the bowing of a waxen nose but the scripture it selfe to a nose of wax as that which is as easie to be drawne into any sense as a nose of wax may be turned euerie waie The wordes of Pighius are plaine Sunt enim scripturae velut caereus quidam nasus qui sicut hor sum illor sumque facilè se trahi permittit quo traxeris haud inuitus sequitur ita illae se flecti duci atque etiam in diuer sam sententiam trahi accomodarique ad quid-uis patiuntur nist quis veram illam inflexibilemque earundem amussim nempe Ecclesiasticae traditionis authoritatem communemque sententiam ilsdem adhibeat For the holie scriptures are as it were a certaine nose of wax which as it easelie suffereth it selfe to be drawne this waie and that waie and whether soeuer you draw it is followeth not vnwillinglie so also they doe suffer them selues to be bowed to be led and also to be drawen into a contrarie meaning and to be applied vnto what you will except a man lay vnto them that true inflexible rule of them namelie the authoritie and common vnderstanding of the Churches tradition These wordes declare if the sense of all Papists be the same that the Iesuites do not onelie compare the scripture it selfe but also that they make this comparison in respect of the scripture it selfe which suffereth it selfe as easelie to be wrested and abused as a nose of wax abideth to be bowed nor before the rude and ignorant onelie nor to flatter Princes and people in their vices alone but before any persons or to any purpose whatsoeuer and that there is not in them a certaine and infallible sense to iudge of the Churches doctrine or to finde out the true Church from all false congregations by the trueth taught in the scriptures but that the authoritie and common vnderstanding of the Popish Churches tradition is the onelie true sense inflexible rule of the holy scriptures wherebie also it is manifest though you denie it neuer so stoutlie that you doe impute the wresting of the scriptures vnto the imperfection of Gods worde set forth in them and not onelie to the malice of the wrester For if the will of God be but as well expressed in them as the will of princes is in their written lawes and proclamations the one maie as well be found out by reading and weighing of the holie scriptures as the other may be out of prophane writings especially where the spirit of God graunted vnto the praiers of the elect openeth their vnderstanding not onelie to conceiue as the naturall man maie by studie and ordinarie helpes the true scope and purpose of God vttered in them but also to beleeue and embrace whatsoeuer the Lord their God hath propounded in them Therefore though the scripture may be wrested to the destruction of the vngodlie as Saint Peter sheweth yet Master Charke telleth you that it cannot so be wrested but that still it remaineth the light vnto our feet and the lanterne vnto our steppes and euerie parte thereof is like the arme of a great Oke which cannot be so wreste but that with great force it will returne into the right position to the shame and perill of the wrester which answere of his you doe so dissemble as though you had neuer seene it And you doe wiselie seeing otherwise then by silence you could not auoid it But howsoeuer Master Charke storme you will defend your blasphemie of the nose of waxe not onelie in a kingdome where the Ghospell is preached but also in the kingdome of vs ministers where the letter of the scripture is worsse wrested by vs to all errors and licentiousnes then euerie waxen nose was yet bended to diuerse fashions O ye senseles papists had you neuer a man of moderat iudgement to set forth against vs but this loosetongued Gentelman which so he maie raile with full mouth against vs hath no care how his slaunders maie be coloured Doe we peruert the scriptures to all errors then surelie we holde no trueth there neuer was anie heresie neither can there be anie heresie but that with manie errors it maintaineth and holdeth manie truethes Yea the Deuill him-selfe the father oflies beleeueth some truethes and for shame dare not professe the maintenance of all errors We thinke verie hardlie of Antichrist and his brood the papists yet we maie not saie that they wrest the scriptures to all errors and licentiousnes for if they so did they should not deceaue so manie by shew of trueth in errors except they did professe some articles of trueth in deede As for the wresting of the Scripture to all licentiousnes let God and all the world of reasonable and indifferent men iudge how iustlie we maie be charged therewith If we be licentious in our liues God will finde it out and let man where he findeth it punish vs. But if we wilfully peruert the scriptures to the maintenance of all licentiousnes the Lord reward vs according to our deedes and be not mercifull to them that sinne of malicious wickednes But it is no fault in the scriptures saie you that they may be abused For Christ him-selfe was called the rocke of offence and the stone of scandall not for anie faulte or imperfection in him but through the wickednes of such as abuse that benefit So if the Iesuites had said no more but that the scripture maie be abused no man could haue found fault with them And Christ is called a stone of offence or stumbling not altogether in respect of the wicked that abuse him for he is called a stone moste precious and necessarie to build vpon of stumbling to those that refuse to build vpon him which meeting with him must either stumble and fall or els if it fall vpon them they must be ground to pouder But the the scripture is compared to a nose os wax because it is in their imagination that vse the comparison as pliant to follow euerie waie and to yeald as probable a sence one waie as an other as
a nose of wax is easie to be turned and shaped on euerie side or sort which if it were so must needes be a great fault in the scripture it selfe A hundred positiue lawes and statutes in England are so well penned as all the sophistical heads in christendome cannot finde a starting hole in them by anie peruerse interpretations but thatall they which haue but a meane skill in the lawes will laugh them to scorne And tha I we think so vnreuerently of the holy scriptures giuen by inspiration of god that euerie foolish heretike maie turne them about like a nose of wax but rather that in his said attempt of turning his folly shal be made manifest to al men Pighius saith expressely the scriptures are dumbe iudges as though Godspake not in them and by them vnto vs whose prophane comparison of the holie scriptures with prophane lawes which require Magistrates and iudges to punish the offenders of them euerie Christian man may perceiue to tende to the derogation of the maiesty of them As also euerie childe that hath studied logike but halfe a yeare maie vnderstand his beggerlie petition of the principle when appealing from the iudgement of the scriptures he will be iudged by none but by papists in controuersies and questions that we haue against the papists As for the blacke Gospell and Inkie diuinitie babled by Eccius against the written Gospell If Iesuits can maintaine as Catholike surelie Christians can not heare it without horror of blasphemie If there be no fault or imperfection in the scriptures how saith Pighius that euery man may euidently know without the scriptures in what order the Church is appointed by her author Againe of what moment is the holy scripture if it be not necessarie to decide all doubtes and controuersies in the Church for thus saith Pighius If we receaue the authoritie of the Churches tradition quam si recipimus omnis facilè etiam sine scriptur is inter nos componetur concertatio controuersia cùm de singulis nonfuerit admodum operosum inuenire quid Catholica ab initio Ecclesia senserit Which if we receiue all strife and controuersie betweene vs may easilie be compounded euen without the scriptures Seeing it is no very hard worke to finde out what the Ca tholike Church from the beginning hath thought of euerie question Thus the Ecclesiasticall tradition is set a loft and the holie scriptures excluded as superfluous and vnnecessarie seeing all questions may easilie be decided without them But to giue a better colour to your nose of waxe you saie Saint Ierome doth call the scriptures alledged corruptlie by Marcion and Basilides the diuells Gospell because the Gospell consisteth not in the words of scripture but in the sense But so doth not Christ call the scripture when it was alledged by the deuill neither doth Saint Ierome so call the scripture but the false sense feined by heretikes His wordes are these Grande periculum est in Ecclesia loqui ne fortè interpretatione peruersa de Euangelio Christi hominis fiat Euangelium aut quod peius est Diaboli It is great perill to speake in the Church least perhappes by peruerse interpretation of the Gospell of Christ be made the Gospell of man or that which is worse of the deuill And it is true which he saith The Gospell is not in the wordes but in the sense of the scriptures Yet it is also true that the sense of the scriptures is expressed in those wordes of the scriptures and not included in the Popes breast as the Papists would haue vs thinke that al labour bestowed in seeking the sense of the scriptures is in vaine except we take the interpretation of the Popish Church which sthe iudgement of the Pope as the sure rule to guide vs by But Saint Augustine you saie calleth the scripture the bowe of heretikes Which is not so for he compareth their wresting of the scriptures to the bending of a bowe Ecce inquiunt peccatores tetenderunt arcum credo scriptur as quas illi carnaliter interpretando venenatas inde sententias emittunt Beholde say they the sinners haue bent the bowe the scriptures I beleeue which while they interpret carnallie they send forth poysoned meaninges from them Further you saie Irenaeus compareth it abused by heretikes to a Iewel stamped with the forme of a Dogge or Fox Irenaeus speaketh not of the bodie of the scriptures but of wordes sentences and parables of scripture rent not onelie from their sense but also from their place and patched together with olde wiues fables to make a shew for heresie which is all one as he saith as if a man should breake an excellent Image of a king and when he hath fashioned the peeces beeing pearles or precious stones into the shape of a Fox or Dogge he would yet be so impudent to saie this is that excellent Image of the king which was made by a not able workman This soundeth nothing like the nose of waxe Likewise you saie Gregorie Nazianzen compareth the scripture to a siluer scabberd with a leaden sworde in it The comparison you speake of is in his poemes which I verelie am perswaded that you neuer read but were mocked by your notebooke as many times before For Gregorie compareth not the scriptures as you slaunder him but an hipocrite a man that hath nothing but an externall shew of religion to a leaden sworde in a siluer scabberde his verses are these if you could haue construed them 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 To these that you might seeme bountifull though you be a verie begger of your owne reading you adde Tertullian and Vincentius Lirinensis of which the former you saie compareth the scripture to the deceitfull ornaments of harlottes the other to poysoned hearbs couered in the Apothecaries shops with faire titles Wherein you slaun der them both for they compare not the wholl scripture as you doe in your nose of waxe but the hereticall bragges of scripture which as they may abuse a peece for a shew so are they confounded by the wholl when the same is rightlie weighed Therefore the comparisons of these auncient Doctors are no more like to your nose of waxe then your nose of waxe is like to the holie scriptures Neither doth the example of Luther calling the scriptures the booke of heretikes expounding him selfe why he so calleth it namely because it is depraued by heretikes defend the Iesuites which to the deprauation of the scriptures vse that similitude as Luther did not in his albeit he might as well haue forborne that title as his rash iudgement against those whome you call sacramentaries for as the one was vnprofitable so the other was vniust But if the Iesuites saie you had reiected any one booke of the scripture as the Protestantes doe many we might iustlie accuse them It is as great a fault to adde to the worde of God as to take from it The Protestantes reiect no booke
in one person both God and man be perfectlie vnited in him and therefore much more prerogatiue might be and doubtles was giuen to his humanitie as to him that was both God and man in respect of his baser nature then to anie other of his brethren beeing but meere men yet this is assuredlie to be beleeued that he which could without derogation to his Godheade communicate with the sonne of man and graunt him in consideration of his assumpted nature the rule and redemption of his people the assoyling of our sinnes and to worke all wonders in the power finger and force of the holie ghost the same God without all doubt through his sonne and our sauiour may at his pleasure without all vnseemelines or derogation to his eternall honour andso it shall be prooued that he doth giue power to the gouernours of his Church and houshodle to pardone and giue penaunce to iudge and rule the people in the right of our said Sauiour to the edefying of his bodie and making perfect of his saints FVLKE We doe Christianly confesse according to the scripture and with the Church of Christ that our sauiour Christ not onelie by power equall to his father concerning his diuine nature but also by graunt of God his father in his humane nature which is farre inferiour to his father doth remit sinnes absolutelie and of soueraigne authoritie in respect of his diuinitie as the mediatour God and man and that he did the same vpon earth also as a minister and preacher of repentance and reconciliation according to his humanitie But hereupon it followeth not by any order or necessitie of consequence that whoesoeuer denyeth meere man to haue authoritie or power to forgiue sinnes is iniurious to Christs person and the dispensation of his flesh or mysterie of his holie incarnation For although that man haue this authoritie which is God yet it followeth not that such mē as are onely men are capable of the same authoritie The diuersitie betwixt the state of our sauiour Christ and others is so great that nothing can be communicated to others which is proper to him in respect of his diuine nature And such a thing is the absolute power to forgiue sinnes for which he hath made satisfaction to the iustice of God which whensoeuer we speake of the remission of sins may not be forgotten For the mercie of god forgiueth no sinne but that for which his iustice is thorouglie satisfied in the obedience and iustice of our Lord and redeemer Iesus Christ. Therefore as no other man hath the dispensation of his satisfaction but himselfe so no other man can giue absolute forgiuenes of sins but him-selfe But as all his ministers haue power to pronounce forgiuenes of sins to the penitent which is noe more but to expresse his will and pleasure concerning the remission of sinnes and in what sort and condition he bestoweth the same so haue they power to teteine sinnes not of them whome he will pardon but of such as doe not repent and therefore by his worde are denied of forgiuenes so that man in this case followeth the iudgement and authoritie of God not God the iudgement and authoritie of man For if a trew priest elder or minister of the gospell lawfullie authorized would forgiue the sins of an hypocrite that faigneth repentance they are not forgiuen before God and if man would reteine the sinnes of a true penitent yet are they forgiuen before God For to man is giuen no absolute power to forgiue sins any more then there is giuen to man an vndouted iudgement to discerne betweene hypocrites and true faithfull persons But where you saie that God could without derogation to his godheade communicat with the sonne of man and graunt him in consideration of his assumpted nature the rule redemption of his people the gouernment of our soules the assoyling of our sinnes c. I must know how farre you extend your consideration For if you meane therebie that God in respect of or according to this assumpted humane nature did communicate to our sauiout Christ none other but such power as he might without derogation to his deitie haue communicated vnto Moses Samuel or any other which was a meere mortall man for the redemption of our soules and forgiuenes of our sins I doe vtterlie abhorre your Nestorian and worsse then Nestorian blasphemie but if you meane that such pow er as might without the derogation of his godhead be communicated to the sonne of man is by him deliuered to the ministers of his Church which execute the office of shepheardes and teachers in his place I doe gladlie confesse that without all vnseemelinesse and derogation to his eternal honour the ministers of the Church haue power by his graunt to reteine and forgiue sinnes that is to declare the iudgement of God in forgiuing or reteining of sinnes according to such conditions as he hath expressed in his holie worde which iudgement according to those conditions is so ratifyed by God him-selfe that it is as certaine as if it were pronounced and vttered by his owne voice out of heauen But where you speake of pardoning and geuing of penance I must once againe distinguish of your meaning For if you meane by your Popish terme of penance repentance so that you saie man hath power to giue repentance which is a conuersion of the heart vnto God and a chaunge of the minde from sinne to obedience of God I spit at your blaspemous saying For it is proper onelie to God to giue repentance to Israell and to all true Israelites of the gentiles his elected children as the holie ghost teacheth Acts. 5. and 11. in which places your pupills the Rhemists durst not for gal of conscience and shame of the world translate the latine worde paenitentia as they doe commonly els where except it be taken in the euil part penance but repentance Yet if by the word penance you meane a time or exercise of trial of true repentance which the aunciēt writers do sometimes metonimically cal 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and paenitentia which was graunted by the elders of the Church to such as had greeuouslie fallen that they might haue some experience of their true conuersion before they were admitted into the communion of the faithful I may yeald to your terme And further I will not denie but that God hath geuen power vnto the gouernours of his Church and household to pardon such penance thatis to remit vpon due and good consideration some part or the wholl of that time and exercise which to such penitents by them is enioyned but that any mortall creature hath power to pardon penance in such sorte that the partie which is to receiue the pardon neede not to be penitent for his sinnes I stand still to the flat deniall Neither must we here make any great account of such as shal obiect to the priests of gods Church as the Scribes did vnto Christ him-selfe when they saw him
of necessarie collection For Logicke would stil iudge whether such meaning could be necessarilie gathered out of such wordes Seeing we are not bound to creditte any writings since the diuine inspired scriptures but so farre as they agree with the scriptures and receiue the light of trueth from them But those auncient writers to whome he would haue vs to referre our selues liued so many hun dred yeares after the Apostles and Euangelists the writers of the new testament as they could no more declare to them then to vs their meaning in their writings and therefore those auncient fathers which ground purgatorie prayer to saintes sacrifice of the altar vse of the crosse c. beside tradition vpon the scriptures as the answerer saith must shew the necessarie collection of them by the iudgement of demonstration seeing they neuer sawe the writers neuer heard them speake nor possiblie could liuing so long after them or els they can carie no credit of necessarie collection outof the expresse wordes of holy scripture As for tradition without scripture since God hath giuen the holie scripture is as good as the credit of men may be without a warrant from God A fourth waie of triall of spirites with him is Councells by which olde heretikes haue beene tried and they are content to referre themselues to all the Christian Councells that euer haue beene since Christ died We acknowledge Christian councells to be a godlie meane to exa mine and trie the spirites but according to the scriptures onelie for matters of faith as in the example of the first Councell of Christendome Act. 15. where the question was determined by authoritie of the scriptures But that the Papists dare abide the triall by al Councells it is false for they admit none but by the Popes consent they admitte nothing in them but that the present Pope doth allow Many Councells in Aphrica forbad appellations to Rome the general Councell of Chalcedon made the Bishop of Constantinople of equal dignitie with the Bishop of Rome the Bishop of Constantinople condemned and accursed a Pope sor an heretike the Pope of that time confirmed it yet now it is not holden for Catholike But I will spare examples vntill this lustie gallant dare aduenture the triall whereof he maketh the challenge But seeing there are many points of controuersies betweene vs and the Papists which in no auncient councell came in question he bobs vs with the last most learned Godlie and generall Councell of Trent which was gathered of purpose for triall of hercticall spirites whereunto all safe conduct being offered we refused to come for triall As though the Catholikes would haue come to the Councell of Nice if nothing might haue beene therein determined but that which pleased Arius or to the Councell of Constantinople if nothing might haue beene concluded but that Macedonius would allow Or to the Councells of Ephesus and Chalcedon if when all had beene saide that which liked Nestorius and Eutiches must haue bene holden for Catholike Such is our case we accuse the Pope to be an heritike yea and to be Antichrist the Pope will admit no councell but where he him selfe is iudge nor any to haue any voice determinatiue but onely such as are sworne to maintaine his heresies and ambition It is great pitie but the Protestants must come to such a councell Such were many councells holden of olde time by heretikes but for the most part not frequented by the Catholikes Some of our profession were at Trent but what entertainement had they euen such as their aduersaries could afforde them they were not permitted to haue any speach but as pleased their enemies wherefore when they saw noe equitie vsed as they could looke for no better before they came they left the heretikes to consult among them-selues by example of auncient fathers in like Chapters of heretikes The sift waie of triall is to referre the matter to the olde Doctors which liued before the controuersies began of which we haue spoken latelie and this we haue often vsed and still vse against the Papists in most controuersies although the authoritie of man is no certaine rule to trie which is the truth of God Augustine against Iulian vsed this waie rightlie first confuting the Pelagians by the authoritie of the holie scripture and then by the testimonie of the auncient fathers also Theodosius also in a case determined by the holie scripture did politikelie circumuent the heretikes after the aduise of Sisinius the Nouatian by the suggestion of Nectarius the Catholike to put them to a foile which had good successe because the others cause was naught But Epiphanius hath a hard saying against vs as our answerer thinketh It is enough to say against all heresies the catholike church hath not taught this the holy fathers haue not admitted this But I wene Epiphanius doth not meane that it is enough to saie so except men can prooue it to be so For els it is aseasy for heretikes to saie so against Catholikes as for Catholikes against heretikes And here out answerer voucheth Epiphanius quoting onelie lib. 2. contra haere but no Chapter of so long a booke wherebie knowing him to be a common foyster we maie well suspect his honestie in this voucher vntill he shew vs in what Chapter we shall finde it The sixtwaie of triall with him is to consider which is the Catholike or vniuersall Church or great multitude of Christians out of which the other part first departed But to consider which is the Catholike or vniuersal Church is no waie of triall but the matter to be tried And the description that he maketh of the Church is as vncerten the great multitud of Christians out of which the other part first departed For the Catholike Church is not alwaies the greatest multitude When the East Church was deuided from the West the one was as great a multitude as the other yea considering the number of prouinces of the East and the largenesse of them it was the greater And one heresie some times departeth out of another as the Rogatians from the Donatists the Eunomians from the Arrians the Iacobites from the Eutichians c. Neither doth Saint Augustine against the Manichecs make the consent of people and the name of Catholike of them-selues to be a sufficient waie of trial but among many thinges which altogether held him beside the authoritie of the holie scriptures he accounteth these which with the truth are a good confirmation but can be no preiudice against the manifest truth as he confesseth in the same place To the iudgement of Vincentius we will subscribe to holde that which euerie where which alwaies which of all hath beene beleeued so hath no point of Poperie Hoc est etenim verè proprièque Catholicum quòd ipsa vis nominis ratioque declarat quod omnia verè vniuersaliter comprehendit For that is truelie and properlie Catholike saith Vincentius which thing the verie force and reason of the name declareth
testament Sozomenus in the place by you cited after he hath commended the Philosophie or contemplatiue life of the solitarie men in those daies hath these wordes of this excellent Philosophie was the beginner as some saie Elias the Prophet and Iohn Baptist so that it is not so absolute as you sett it downe but as some saie and it is of a Philosophicall studie and life in which if comparison be made with Popish Monkes for one thing which they haue like they haue three things vnlike or contrarie to the profession and practise of those auncient Monachi which might haue some resemblance with the manner of Elias life in some thinges and were more agree able to the example of the sonnes of the Prophets which were students in diuinitie as those olde Monks of the primitiue Church readie to serue in the place of teachers whensoeuer they were called That antiquity onely should let the Prophets to be examples of monasticall life it is your owne vaine collection and as vaine is your comparison of Adam to be a paterne of marted men Abel of sheepherdes Caine of husband men c. For M. Charke asketh what you are able to bring out of the word of God why Elias should after more then two thousand yeares be brough in for a patrone of friers which for so manie yeares could neuer be espied in the Church either of the Iewes or of the Christians As for the estate of maried men sheepherds husbandmen citizens Tentdwellers musitians smithes c. is either necessarie or otherwise commendable then by the examples of those auncients of which some in respect of their antiquitie are not to be followed at all as Cain and the rest of his cursed line who yet were inuenters of profitable artes by the gift of God and not by the worthines of the persons As for the slate of the Munkes and friers such as we striue about is neither necessarie nor profitable to the Church but a great infection and poison of the same Nowe whether Iohn Baptist were a president to Monkes whome Master Chark saith to haue beene an extraordinarie and perpetuall Nazarite whose example is not now laid vpon them that teach in the Church you answere that he doth wilfullie mistake the question for that you affirme not that such extraordinarie austeritie is laid vpon anie man of necessitie but that it is lawfull and maketh no sect when it is voluntarilie taken and vsed You do wilfullie omit the pith of Master Charkes argument who is not ignorant of your pretense of voluntarie but addeth that the seuerall offices of those that teach in the Church are expressed in the word of God and therefore there can be no new order of Ministers by anie title or voluntarie assumption but it is a suspitious sect howsoeuer seuerall persons maie as they see iust cause more or lesse prescribe vnto them-selues some extraordinarie austeritie of life for their priuate exercise or chastisment That Saint Iohns austeritie was for the moste parte voluntarie and not of necessitie of the vocation of a Nazarite it is fondlie proued of you by example of the superstitious sect of the Essenes described by Plinie and Iosephus of which Plinie speaketh verie little but Iosephus at large and in some points of austeritic noteth them to exceede any thing that we read in scripture of Saint Iohn Baptist as of their continuall exercise in labour of their handes their forbearing to spitte in the assemblies of men their forbearing to ease their bodies on the sabboth daie and such like superstitious toies Now the austeritie of Saint Iohn in that he did willinglie and not by compulsion vndergo it maie be called voluntarie otherwise in that it was appointed by the wisdome of god whose spirit directed him it was necessarie and especially for the forerunner of Christ to sing the dolefull song and to call the people to repentance and therefore not without presumption drawne into example by them that are neither led with the same spirit nor called to the same office and so no example nor platforme for the superstitious order of Monkes and friars albeit they alwares kept as great austeritie in deede as they professe in wordes But it is a wonderfull argument for your Monkes that the Nazarites did make a religious vow for their dedication to God as your religious people do also vse For it were somewhat that you saie if you could bring as good warrant for the vowes of your Popish votaries to be prescribed and accepted of God as you bring for the vow of the Nazarites otherwise it maie be said vnto you by God as he speaketh by the Prophet quis requisiuit c. who required these things at your handes which if it were said of those things which in some manner and to some end were required how iustlie maie it be spoken of these that in no manner nor to anie end are by God required at your handes but that Saint Iohn was a Monk of the new Testament and a patron of monasticall life although you confesse it to be more then you were bound to prooue so manie fathers as you name do testifie with one consent And what if he were an example followed of those Monkes that liued in moste of those fathers times is he therefore a patrone to your Popish Monkes of these late daies and new orders it will be more then hard for you to prooue that Now let vs consider your authorities which you affirme to testifie that Saint Iohn was a Monk of the new testament and a patterne of monasticall life First Gregorie Nazian orat de S. Bas. 1. hath this testimonie onelie he compareth Basill with Saint Iohn Baptist as resembling him in some thinges as he doth with Peter Paul Iohn the Euangelist and Stephan except you will saie theese were all Monkes Chrisostome in deed Hom. 1. in Mark. calleth Saint Iohn prince of the Monasticall life but not a Monke of the new testament as I haue shewed before in answer to your preface Neither doth Saint Ierome epist. ad Eustoch saie that Saint Iohn was a Monke and patterne of Monasticall life but speaking of the life of an Anachoret which liued by him-selfe alone in the wildernesse he saith huius vitae auctor Paulus illustrator Antonius vt ad superior a conscendam princeps Iohannes Baptista fuit Of this life Paul was the author Anthonie the beautifier and that I maie ascend higher the Prince or cheefe was Iohn Baptist. Where is Iohn Baptist the Monke or patterne of your Papisticall monkish life when they liued not in the wildernes but in cities populous townes not in caues and tents but in gorgious palaces Although Saint Iohn be the cheife of them that liued in the wildernes the same Ierome in the life of Paule the Heremite whome before he calleth the author of the Anachorites life hath these wordes Inter multos saepe dubitatum est à quo potissimùm monachorum eremus habitari
though you had not done him iniury enough alreadie you adde that in an other place he sayeth that if a man haue ten wiues or more fledde from him vppon like causes he may take more and so may wiues doe the like in husbandes Whereupon Alberus one of your owne religion noteth that Iohannes Leidensis tooke many wiues and one Knipperdolling tooke thirteene for his parte so that this doctrine was not onelie taught but also practized vpon Luthers authority I wil here like wiseset down the whol discourse of Luther in the place by you quoted Exegesi ad c. 7. ep 1. ad Cor. that the world may see whether there be a sparke of honestie or shamefastnes in Papists that make such impudent reports which may so easilie be disprooued For that which Luther speaketh of ten wiues fled from him is in a farre other cause then the cause of impotencie and nothing in the world fauoureth the pluralitie of wiues practized by the Anapabtistes whatsoeuer Alberus or any other hath written of whome there is iust cause to dout what he bath written because you are so false almost in all your reports of writers of our side As for the Anapabtistes it is certaine they practised not their polygamie vpon Luthers authoritie whome they did vtterlie abhoore and in open printed books accounted him for a notable false teacher Againe it is not like that Alberus beeing a Lutherane would father so grosse a lie vpon Luthers authoritie But let the reader marke what Luther writeth vppon these wordes of the text but if the vnfaithful depart let him departe a brother or sister is not in bondage subiect to such Hoc loci Paulus saith he fidelem coniugatum sententiam pro illo ferendo liberat vbi infidelis compar discesserit aut concedere non vult vt Christum sequatur eique copiare facit iterum cum alio matrimonium contrahendi Quòd verò hic diuus Paulus de Ethnico compare dicit idem de falso Christiano intelligendum est vs si alter coniugum alterum ad impietatem adigeret necilli permitteret Christum vita imitari tum liber hic sit solutus vt quicum libuerit se despondeat Quòd si hoc Christiano iure non liceret cogeretur fidelis infidelem suam comparem sequi vel inuitus repugnante natura viribus suis caelebs permanere magno cum animae suae periculo Id ipsum D. Paulus his denegat inquiens Quòd si eiusmodi frater aut soror seruituti non sit obnoxius neque captus neque venundatus sit ac si dicat in aliis causis vbiconiuges vnâ commorantur vt in debita coniugij beneuolentia id genus similibus alter alteri obligatus est nec sui 〈◊〉 est In 〈◊〉 vbi alter alterum ad impiam vitam cogit vel ab altero discedit ibiverò non est captiuus neque 〈◊〉 isti adhaerere porrò Quòd si captiuus non tenetur liberatus manumissus 〈◊〉 despondere se alters potest velutisi matrimonio coniuncius sibimortem oppetiissit Quid si 〈◊〉 coniugium non opportunè cederes vt alter alterum maritus vxorem vel è contra gentium in morem adeoque impiè viuere cogeret vel si alter ab altero fugeret donec tertium 〈◊〉 quartum coniugium attingeretur dareturne viro toties 〈◊〉 ducere quoties alia eiusmodi vt iam dictum est esset vt decem velplures 〈◊〉 viuentes transfugas haberet Et rursum licebitne vxori dectm aut plures qui iam omnes 〈◊〉 esse maritos Responsio D. Paulo non possumus obstruere os neque cumillo 〈◊〉 eius doctrina quoties necessum fuerit vti volunt verba eius aperta sunt Fratrem aut sororem liberos esse a coniugij lege si alter discesserit vel cum hoc habitare non consenserit Neque vt semeltantùm stat hoc dicit sed liberum relinquit vt quottes res postularit vel pergat vel consistat Neminem enim incontinentiae discrimine couictum vult vt eo captus teneatur alienae temeritatis malitiae causa In this place Paul setteth at libertie the faithfull maried person geuing sentence one his side where the vnfaithfull match shall departe or will not graunt that the other may follow Christ and giueth him leaue to contracte matrimony with another And that Saint Paul here sayeth of a heathen yokefellow the same is to be vnderstood of a false Christian that if any of the maryed persons would compell this other to impietie and not permit to follow Christ in life then is the party free to match in maryage with whome he listeth Which thing if it were not lawfull by Christian right the faithfll man should be compelled to followe his vnfaithfullmate or els against his wil his nature and strength repugning to remaine vnmaried with great daunger of his soule But that Saint Paull here denieth saying in such a brother or a sister is not subiect to bondage nor captiue nor solde as a slaue as if he said in other causes where man and wife dwell together as in the due beneuolence of mariage and such like cases the one is bound to the other and is not at libertie But in such where the one compelleth the other to impietie or departeth awaie there the other is not captiue nor compelled to cleaue to this person anie longer And if he be not holden as a captiue he is set at libertie and made free he may betroth himselfe to an other as if the other party that was ioyned in matrimonie to him were dead But what if the second mariage fall not outrightly that the one would compell the other the husband the wife or contrariwise to liue after the manner of the Gentiles and that impiouslie or if the one fledde from the other vntill the third or forth mariage were come vnto should the husband haue license so often to mary a new wife as the other is such a one as we haue said alreadie so that he should haue tenne or more wiues 〈◊〉 awaie from him yet liuing And againe shall it be lawfull for the wife to haue tenne or more husbands which are all come awaie from hit The answer We cannot stoppe Saint Paules mouth nor wrestle against him they that will vse his doctrine his words are plaine that a brother or a sister are free from the lawe of wedlock if the one depart or do not consent to dwell with the other Neither doth he say that this may be done once onelie but leaueth it free that as often as the case shall require he may 〈◊〉 proceede or stay For he will haue none to be cast into the daunger of incontinencie that he should be holden in 〈◊〉 thereby through cause of the rashnes or malice of another By this long discourse of Luthers own words let the reasonable reader iudge what occasion the Anabaptistes might iustlie take to defend their beastlie keeping of
peece of Gods worde and traditions are an other peece and this peece must be added to that or els it is not a perfect or sufficient instruction of itselfe for Gods Church The comparison you make of ioyning S. Lukes Gospell to that of Saint Matthew or Saint Paules epistles to them both to resemble your patching of traditions to the written word of God is both odious and vnlike and without begging the wholl matter in question gaineth nothing For the adding of the writings of one Euangelist to another or of an Apostle to the Euangelistes is but the heaping of heauenlie treasure to the further inriching of the Church in all light of spirituall knowledge so the accession of the bookes of the new testament is as it were the vnfolding or laying open of the same diuine riches that was perfectlie contayned in the olde testament for the saluation of all Gods elect that liued vnder that discipline But your traditions as you maintaine them argue an insufficiencie of the holie scriptures which allso you confesse your selfe and are not a more plaine or plentifull application of the mysteries comprehended in them Therefore though you can for manners sake otherwhile forbeare odious speeches aginst the dignitie of holie scriptures yet euen that odious conclusion gathered by Gotuisus must needes follow of your doctrine concerning the insufficiencie of scriptures and the necessitie of traditions That your traditions are Gods word and of equall authoritie with the scriptures you promise to shew more largelie in the twelft article together with certaine meanes how to know and discerne the same Sed haec in dicm minitave Parmeno You haue taken a pretie pause of three yeares long since you were interrupted as you 〈◊〉 in the end by a writte de remouendo But the daie will come that shall paie for all Whether anie cause or matter hath beene ministred by you of odious speeches against the dignitie of holie scriptures Mastet Charke declareth by one example out of Hosius which with all the rest that he saith you omit to answer as trifling speech to litle purpose So whatsoeuer by anie colour of reason you can not auoid by your censorious authoritie you maie contemne and passe ouer But his conclusion seemeth worthie the answer which he maketh in these wordes To conclude it is a great iniquitie to adde traditions or your vnwritten verities to the written word of God whereunto no man maie adde because nothing is wanting from which no man maie take because nothing is superfluous But to him that addeth shall the curses written in the booke be added for euer Against this conclusiō you note in the margent great iniquitie to adde one veritie to another or to beleeue two verities together A fine ieste but a grosse begging of the wholl cause For who shal graunt that your vnwritten vereties be truth and not falsehood falselie by you termed verities vnwritten There is no veritie of matters necessarie to be knowne vnto saluation which is not written in the holie scriptures that are hable to make vs wise vnto saluation But good Lord what a sturre you keepe because M. Chatk noteth in the margent Apoc. 22. ask how this place is alledged against you c. As though that which is true of one booke yea of euery booke of the scripture maie not iustlie be verefied of the wholl bodie and boke of the the Bible Because adding to the word of god argueth imperfection in the word of god Your stale obiection of Saint Iohns Gospell written after the Reuelation is alreadie answered For al bookes of scripture that haue beene written since the fiue bookes of Moses are no addition to the word of God but a more cleere explication of the 〈◊〉 first com mitted to writing by inspiration of God Neither do they teach an other waie of saluation then Moses did but set forth the same more plainlie by demonstration by examples of Gods iustice and his mercie by threatenings by exhortations by explication of his promises by shewing the accomplishment and the manner of perfourmance of them in Christ and his Church And this they do moste absolutelie sufficiently and plentifully to the saluation of Gods people These things saith S. Iohn are written that you should beleeue that Iesus is Christ the sonne of God and that beleeuing you maie haue euerlasting life in his name Here you maie as well cauill that not onelie the Gospell of Saint Iohn or the miracles written in the same is necessarie to be beleeued vnto saluation but all the rest of the scripture also foolishlie opposing thinges that are no waie repugnant but the one including the other For the beleeuing of Saint Iohns Gospell doth not exclude but include all other bookes and partes of holie scripture which teach the same meane of saluation or any thing thereto pertaining But how holdeth this argument saie you no man maie adde to the booke of Apocalips ergo no man maie beleeue a tradition of Christ or his Apostles Maie we not as well saie ergo we maie not beleeue the actes of the Apostles No sir for we make our argument in this man ner No man maie adde to the booke of the Apocalips much lesse may anie man adde to the wholl Bible of the olde and new testament And consequentlie there are no traditions of Christ and his Apostles to be credited as needefull to saluation which are not contained in the holy scriptures Thus we alledge scriptures and thus we argue vppon them not as it pleaseth you to deseant vpon our allegations and to dissigure our arguments But it is lamentable you saie to see the 〈◊〉 dealings of these men in matters of such importance It is verie true vnderstanding you and your complices to be the men that vse such fleightes in 〈◊〉 waightie causes As for our doctrine is plaine without any seame that the scriptures are sufficient to saluation therfore al tradition besides them are 〈◊〉 to that purpose But let vs see who 〈◊〉 sleightes by your iudgement First you aske Master Charke what he 〈◊〉 by adding Who doth adde Or in what sense as though his meaning and sense of adding were not manifest as also his accusation that the I suites the Papistes do adde to the word of God their traditions a necessarie to saluation yet not expressed or contained in the word of God But if God saie you left anie doctrine by tradition vnto the Church and our ancetours haue deliuered the same vuto vs especiallie those of the 〈◊〉 Church what shall we do in this case Shall we refuse it It seemeth dangerous and I see no reason The question is not whether we should refuse anie thing that God hath left but whether God hath left anie such tradition to be beleeued vnto salua tion which is not contained in the holie scriptures But if our ancetours of the primitiue Church haue deliuered anie such tradition vnwritten as left by Christ what shall we doe you
of his godhead which is proper vnto it Andwhatsoeuer in holie scripture is read to be exercised of him through the might of Gods spirit by the vertue of his annointing by the finger of God by the sending of the Father by power receiued from aboue by Priesthood praiers or sacrifice by the Sonne of man of the head of the Church or iudge of the liuing and dead whatsoeuer is in this sort said to be done it is not otherwise lightlie meant but in respect of Christs humanitie by which and in which he worketh the same not as by the proper and naturall power or force thereof but as by iurisdiction receiued of the blessed Trinitie and imploied vpon the sonne of man for the procuring of saluation to his people whereof he is become in our very nature the head FVLKE This generall rule is so abridged with the exception lightlie that it is hard to bring anie instance against it but Allen would haue his starting hole in it Neuerthelesse seeing he concludeth the examples before remembred to be included within this rule we maie be bolde to charge him with a spice of Nestorianisme seeing those workes which are certaine to haue beene the workes of the Mediator God and man he ascribeth to the onelie humanitie by iurisdiction receiued from the blessed Trinitie whereby it should followe that the worke of Christe in this respect should not differ from the workes of Moses Elias Dauid or anie of the Prophets whoe receiued iurisdiction from the blessed Trinitie whereby they performed manie workes which the same blessed Trinitie had appointed for the procuring of saluation vnto his people ALLEN Therefore no Christian man maie doubt but as our Sauiour by the omnipotent power of his Godhead might and did forgiue sinnes to the penitent so likewise that as he was Priest the sonne of man he might by the right of his office vnction and ministerie in the vertue of the holie Ghost remitte sinnes also And for that cause principallie in the Prophet Esay it is said Spiritus Dominisuper me eò quòd vnxerit me ad annunciandum mansuetis misit me vt mederer contritis corde praedicarem captiuis indulgentiam clausis apertionem The Spirit of the Lord vopn me because he hath annointed me and sent me to signifie vnto the meeke that I should heal the contrite in heart to preach pardon to the prisoners and freedome to the closed The which place of the Prophet our Sauiour applied vnto him selfe in the Church of Nazareth and is to be vnderstanded onelie of preaching and pardoning by the holie vnction of the Spirit of God and his Fathers calling And therefore it must needes according to Saint Augustines iudgement concerne the shape of his seruice and manhood taken on him in which he preached so that yet it pleased him to affirme that his Doctrine was not his owne but his Fathers that sent him and healed the contrite in heart which is nothing els but to forgiue sinnes to the penitent after such a sort that it might well appeare to be receiued and practised by the vnction of the Spirit of God and sending of his Father whereby the Sonne of man might doe that as Gods minister in his manhood in earth which both he and his eternall Father with the holie Spirit of them both doe worke by their owne one and equall authoritie in heauen euerlastinglie FVLKE And seeing he willeth vs to note the ground of the cause which is that Christ as he was Priest and the sonne of man might remit sinnes by a ministeriereceiued by vnction of the holie Ghost it is not lightlie to be passed ouer That the sonne of man had power vpon earth to forgiue sinnes he him-selfe affirmeth Mat. 9. 6. but this was the power of his godhead which was not restreined nor abased by the shape of a seruant in which he appeered on earth That he was authorized by vnction of the holie Ghost to preach remission of sinnes vnto the penitent it pertaneth indeede vnto him in respect of his manhood although Saint Augustine in the place by Allen quoted saieth not so but citeth the place of Esaie to prooue that Christ in respct of his humanity was inferior to the holy Ghost but that this is all the power that Christ had vpon earth to remit sinnes it is not prooued by anie argument For this ministerie of reconciliation to remit sinnes by preaching of the Gospell doth remaine still with the Church the other that was proper to his Deitie no mortall man without Sacriledge can arrogate or vsurpe ALLEN And though God hath neuer 〈◊〉 mans fall vsed the meanes and seruice of man to his restore againe and to the reliefe of his lackes and therefore hath giuen authority by his holie spirite and vnction to diuerse of the olde law to offer sacrifice praier and procure remission to the people of all their offences and no lesse 〈◊〉 occasion serued and the matter required to correct their misdeedes by iudgement and iurisdiction giuen vnto them for which soueraigne calling they were called the annointed of God an externall ceremonie of anoyting being solemnelie annexed thereunto yet our Lord an Master whether you consider his high Priesthoode by which in moste ample manner through commission receiued he maie procure our pardone or his calling to be head of the Church by which he ruleth and keepeth all the bodie in due subiection and order or his ministerie of preaching whereby farre aboue all the Prophets and preachers of the olde law he openeth to his flock the Church the secret mysteries of Gods trueth Christ I saie in all these respectes being man is yet much more abundantlie blessed and anointed without comparison aboue all his fellowes and copartners as the holy Prophet Dauid doth testifie Vpon whose wordes touching that matter Saint Hilarie writeth thus Vnxit te Deus Deus tuus oleo exultationis prae participibus tuis non secundùm sacramentum aliud quà m secundùm dispensationem assumpti corporis Vnctio enim illa non beatae illi incorrupt in natura dei man enti natiuitati profecit sed sanctificationi hominis assumpti Nam in Actis ait Petrus vnxit illum Deus in spiritu sancto virtute Thus he meaneth in English God etien thy God hath anointed thee with the oile of ioy farre aboue thy copartners not in anie other meaning but according to the dispensation of a bodie receaued For that vnction could not be beneficiall to the holie vnspotted and euerlasting natiuitie in the nature of his Godhead but onelie it was agreeable to the mysterie of his manhood and flesh assumpted in his temporal natiuitie whereof Saint Peter speaketh in the Actes that God hath annointed him with the holie ghost and with power The holie Father also Saint Cyrill agreeth hereunto confessing that all this honour power and authoritie which the Prophets haue signified so long before by the annointing of the sonne of God came vnto Christ in consideration
creature can haue except he be also creator and God himselfe therefore Christ truelie as man receiueth that which is giuen but in respect and right of his godheade he is able to receiue and exercise that power which none can haue but God onelie These thinges indeede maie seeme vnto the simple to be farre fetched and farre from the question of priests power to remit sinnes but they are much farther from the truth of our Catholike faith and Religion that our sauiour Christ in respect of his Diuine nature should be spoiled of his authority or els should thereby worke nothing in a manner in the cheife most necessarie partes of our redemption that Popish priests might be made equall or not farre vnlike him in the power of pardoning sinnes ALLEN For as the due consideration of Christes authoritie and excellent office touching his manhood will helpe vp the decaied honour and iurisdiction that the guides of Gods Church by the right of his high calling do iustlie challenge so it shall expresse the boldnesse of certaine miscreants of this age who to further their sundrie euil in tents and detestable doctrines haue dishonoured Christes dignitie touching his incarnation and office of his redemption exceeding much both in himselfe and in persons of his Pristes and substitutes some of them fearing as I take it lest the honour and office of Christes Priesthood might by participation descend to the Apostles and Priestes of the Church letted not to hold that Christ was his fathers Priest according to his diuine nature of which blasphemie Iohn Caluine was iustlie noted wherein the wicked man whiles he went about to disgrace the dignitie of mortall men became exceeding iniurious to the second person in Trinitie One other of that schoole and of his owne neast denied that Christ in his manhoode should iudge the world lest there might seeme to be some force of punishment and correction of wickednes practized by mans ministerie in this life for the resemblance of Christes iudgement to come And so taught one Richerius of a Carmelite a Caluinist Other deny Christ being now in heauen to make praier for vs according to his manhoode because it tendeth towardes the intercession as Saint Paulin expresse wordes recordeth of him Quòd saluare in perpetuum potest accedens ad Deum per semetipsum semper viuens ad interpellandum pro nobis That for euer he is of power to giue saluation hauing accesse to God by him-selfe and alwaies Iiuing to make intercession for vs. Yea most of the Sacramentaries for the aduantage of their vngodlie assertion that Christ in his owne person as he is God and man should not be present in the sacrament doe couertlie blaspheme the blessed and highlie sanctified fleshof our sauiour auouching it to be vnprofitable whereby they vnaduisedlie dishonour the dreadfull incarnation of Christ and all the workes wrought by the meane of his flesh and blood and ministerie of his manhoode for the remission of our sinnes and purchasing saluation to his Church FVLKE The due consideration of Christes authoritie and excellent office touching his manhoode will nothing helpe to restore the decaied honour and iurisdiction of Popish priesthoode except you can both prooue your Popish priests capable of such honour and power as the sonne of God is and also bring forth the recordes out of the holy scriptures for that high calling whereof you boast That any faithful Christian whome you to maintaine an Antichristian authoritie call Miscreantes haue dishonoured Christs dignitie touching his incarnation and office of his redemption it is a slaunder stronglie aduouched but slenderlie prooued For first Caluine affirming Christ to be a priest in his wholl person God and man derogateth nothing from that dignitie neither is he iniurious against the second person in trinitie for Christ is an high priest after the order of Melchesidech and our redeemer not as a minister and seruant onelie but as the sonne as the King os peace and righteousnes without father without mother without genealogy hauing neither beginning of his daies nor end of his life al which things can not be restrained to the humanitie of Christ but are proper to him as he is equall and eternall with his father That Richerius should denie that Christ in his manhoode should iudge the world it might well be a slaunder of that grosse potheaded Cyclops Villegagnon which when he durst not abide the inuasions of the barbarous people in Gallia antarctica where he had enterprised a conquest he quarelled with Richerius and other godlie persons to haue a colour of returne and a wellcome of the Papists And as touching his slaunderous libell that you send the reader vnto I referre you them to the answere confutation of Richerius Thirdlie that Christ doth make praiers for vs according to his manhoode it is not sufficiently prooued by the text of the Apostle to the Heb. 7. because he may and doth make continuall intercession for vs by the vertue and worthines of the sacrifice of his death although he conceiue no prayers for vs in forme of wordes as men vse vpon earth And if it be graunted that Christ so praieth for vs yet it tendeth nothing towardes the intercession of Saints but rather against it because the interceffion of Christ is sufficient without them yea if the intercession of Saints were prooued it draweth not of necessity praier vnto Saints after it and therefore there were smal purpose in them that denie Christ in such forme to praie for vs to controul the inuocatiō of Saints which thing being either graunted or denied prooueth neither too nor fro that Saints are to be praied vnto or 〈◊〉 That any one of those whome you cal Sacramentaries doth either ouertly or couertly blaspheme the blessed flesh of our Sauiour auouching it to be vnprofitable otherwise then our sauiour Christ himselfe auouched if it were separated from his diuine and quickening spirite doth profitte nothing you are not able to iustifie and therefore you send vs in the margent to Cyrill vpon Iohn lib. 4. Cap 14. whoe sheweth in deede that the flesh of Christ as it is the flesh of the sonne of God hath quickening vertue and power in it to our eternall redemption but otherwise affirmeth nothing thereof that we all are not readie to subscribe vnto ALLEN Let vs therefore Christianlie confes with the scripture and with the Church of Christ that our sauiour not onelie by power equall to his father concerning his diuine nature but also by the sending and graunt of his father and vnction of the holie spirit beeing farre vnder them both in his humane nature doth remit sinnes Whereupon it orderlie followeth that whosoeuer denyeth man to haue authoritie or that he maie haue power graunted him by God to forgiue sinnes he is highlie iniuriouse to our sauiours owne person dispensation of his flesh and mysterie of his holie incarnation For though there be great diuersitie betwixt his state and others because
the sonne of man which was proper to him-selfe so he might well giue the other Your argument in à posse adesse which is not worth a strawe among them that knowe that argumentes doe meane That power which God might giue to meere mortall men whoe doubteth but God might also giue to Christ his sonne to exercise according to his humaine nature but that he did exercise the same onelie as man not as God by what argument is it prooued we knowe that in casting out of deuilles he vsed his diuine authoritie and in his owne name commaunded them to come forth and they obeied Marke 1. 27. he raised the dead by his owne authoritie as God and in his owne name Luke 7. 14. Saint Iohn restifieth that of the eternall worde which was made flesh and dwelt among vs he and his fellowe Apostles did see the glorie as the glorie of the onelie begotten Jonne of God full of grace and trueth From whence come you therefore with a Ghospell to teach vs that Christ did forgiue sinnes heale the sicke cast out deuills and doe miracles but as a man onelie by power receiued from God whereby you shew your selfe to be a good procter for the Arrians if those works which were proper to Christ in respect of his diuinitie you wil draw downe to his humanitie so that he raised the dead clensed the leapers c. not otherwise thē by power receiued frō god as Elizeus did or as anie of his Apostles which did al things in his name whose dignitie you are so careful to further that you care not how you abase the honour of their Master al to bring in a popish that is an Antichristian tyrannie ouer mens soules which is blasphemous against the authoritie of God For if the plaine text of the scripture Iohn 20. 23. whose sinnes you forgiue they are forgiuen c. would yeald you so much authority as you would gladly excercise you would not trouble your selfe to make such impertinent and inconsequent collections by which you would haue it seeme as though Christ in respect of his diuine nature was vnoccupied as concerning the worke of our redemption in the world but that he did all thinges in respect of his humane nature by power receiued from God But Saint Augustine you saie prooueth that by the spirit of God in respect of his manhood Christ wrought miracles which although it be not the matter in question yet you drawe S. Austen to another matter then euer was in his meaning For although it be true that Christ did cast out Deuills in the spirit of God as man yet it followeth not that he did not cast out deuills by his owne authoritie as God seeing the workes of the Trinitie are vndeuided and Saint Augustine in the place by you quoted distinguisheth between those sayings that speake of him as in the forme of God and those that pertaine vnto him in respect of the shape of a seruant But an other argument you haue of that the Iewes which seeing themselues thus ouercome in their vaine cogitations waxed afraid and glorifyed God who gaue such power to men That the Scribes and Pharises which first mooued the question of forgiuenes of sinnes were mooued with reuerence of our sauiour Christ or yealded glorie God I finde not but that al the rest of the people glorifyed to god which had giuen such power to men What power saie you to forgiue sinnes The text saith not so but of working such miracles to heale the man sicke of the palsie so that he was presentlie changed from extreame weaknes to perfect strengh whereof as S. Luke reporteth they said we haue seene sirange things to day and as S. Marke rocordeth it they said we neuer sawe it thus But as for the ordinarie power of making attonement for sinnes which the Priests vsed according to the lawe it was no strange thing vnto them and they had seene it often times before These therefore are the best interpreters of S. Math. which did write by the same spirit But because mans authority with you is many times preferred before god you shal heare what S. Hilarie saith in that place which ere while you affirmed to make nothing against your meaning his interpretation of the text Et honorificauerunt deum quòd tantā dedit potestatem hominib c. is this Conclusa sunt omnia suo ordine cessante iam desperationis timore honor Deo redditur quòd tantam dederit hominibus potestatem sed soli hoc Christo erat debitum solide communione paternae substantiae hoc agere erat familiare All thinges are concluded in due order and the feare of disperation now ceasing honour is rendered to God because he hath giuen so great power to men But this was due onelie to Christ to him alone it was familiar or accustomable to doe these thinges by the communion of his fathers substance These wordes doe plainelie shew that Saint Hilary dissenteth euerie whit from your meaning and that you arme your schollers with no armour of proofe when you wil them to looke for the like power of remitting sins in Christs humanity which he did exercise according to the authoritie of his diuinitie ALLEN Let the proud cogitations of men here attend that so highlie disdaine the ministerie of mortall men in the remission of their sinnes let them controulle the wounderfull wisdome of God which would no otherwise saue the pitifull sores of our soules but by the seruile forme of our owne nature ioined meruelouslie in our person to the worde and eternall Sonne of God the father let them reprehend the vnsearchable secret councell of the holie Trinitie which being of power infinite to worke their wil in al creatures yet would not repaire the world nor remit our sinnes anie otherwise but by the seruice of the Sonne of man let them mislike that flesh blood and the soule of our blessed sauiour being al creatures should ioyne with the onelie almightie creator of all thinger in the remission of all our offences let the presumptuose thus doe and let vs humblie reuerence Gods ordinance and glorifye him in his Sonnes high calling in our kinde through whose singular prerogatiue we shall vndoubtedlie finde exceeding power to be giuen to his bodie and brethren in earth to his moste deare spouse the Church FVLKE The ministerie of mortall men in remission of sinnes no man I hope is so madde to disdaine when Christ him-selfe in so plaine termes hath authorized the same But where you saie that the wisdome of God would no otherwise salue the pittifuli sores of our soules but by the seruile forme of our nature ioined meruelouslie in one person to the word and eternall sonne of God I cannot but maruaile at your Nestorian blasphemie For although it be moste certaine that in the forme of a seruant the wisdome of God preformed that which to the glorie of his iustice was expedient yet that the deitic was altogether idle
or vnoccupied in the worke of our redemption yea that the godhead did not worke the principall and moste necessarie part thereof it is too too abominable and intollerable heresie Out of the like stinking puddle it proceedeth that you saie that the holie Trinitie being of infinit power to worke their will in all creatures yet would not repaire the world nor remit our sinnes anie otherwise but by the seruice of the sonne of man That the seruice of the sonne of man was necessarie to be vsed it is moste true but that authoritie of the sonne of God was not necessarie for so great a worke as wel as the seruise of the sonne of man it is such an impudent blasphemie as I thinke the Pope him-selfe would condemne it if his opinion without partialitie thereof might be knowne As for the worke of Christes humanitie ioyned in one person to his deitie and the commission graunted to his ministers to remit sinnes are nothing hindred by acknowledging that God onelie doth properlie and absolutelie forgiue sinnes euen when his ministers according to his commaundement doe forgiue sinnes as S. Ambrose saith and all antiquitie doth accord Here it is declared by the scripture that the same power of remitting sinnes which God the Father by commission gaue vnto his Sonne as he was man was also by Christ bestowed on the Apostles after his resurrection THE SECOND CHAP. ALLEN IN what high reputation man hath euer bene with god his maker it is not my purpose now to treat of neither will I make anie tediouse talke though it be somewhat more neere the matter how estimation is encreased by the honourable and most merueilous matching of Gods onelie sonne with our nature and kinde whereof whosoeuer hath anie conside ration he shall nothing wonder I warrant him at the soueraingtie of such as be placed in the seat of iudgement and gouernement for the rule of that comonwealth whereof Christ is the head These thinges though they be well worthie our labour and deepe remembrance and not verie far from our matter yet so will I charge my selfe with continuance in my cause that I will onelie seeke out the dignitie of priesthood touching the right that the order laimeth in remission and retaining of mans sinnes In all which cause I take this a grounde that our Masters messenger stood vpon when his disciples grudged that Christ had his followers and practized Baptisme no lesse then him selfe did which is That no man can rightlie receiue anie thing that is not giuen him from aboue Therefore if it may be sufficientlie declared that the order holdeth by good warrant this their preheminence of pardoning or punishing of the peoples offences and that by commission from him who without al controuersie is the head of the Church then the contrarie must learne to leaue their contentious reasoning and vniust contempt of that order which is honoured by power and prerogatiue proceeding from Christ Iesus FVLKE That God of his meere goodnes and mercie hath vouchsafed man of so great honour that of him selfe deserueth eternall shame it is more reason to wonder at Gods mercie then to insinuate anie peece of mans dignitie or worthines That it hath pleased god to aduaunce some men to the gouernment of his Church vpon earth we haue cause to magnifie his maiestie that disdaineth not our base condition but putteth his honour and authoritie vpon them driueth vs not from them by the excellencie of their nature aboue ours but familiarly inuiteth vs to obedience of his wil that we may attaine to his promis of eternal happines The title of this chapter That our sauiour Christ gaue vnto his Apostles the same power of remitting sinnes which God the father by commission gaue vnto his sonne as he was man we do all agree but that Christ did exercise a more soueraigne authoritie in forgiuing sinnes then he did bestow vpon his Apostles or their nature was capable to receiue it is prooued sufficientlie in the Chapter going before Neuerthelesse I will examin all partes of this chapter and if in anie thing I dissent from you I will shew that you dissent from the trueth And first where you professe onelie to seeke out the dignitie of Priesthood touching the right that the order claimeth in remission and retention of mans sinnes you should haue done better to haue sought and set out the duetie of such persons also to whome such dignity is committed lest as it falleth out in your bastarde Popish Priesthood the dignitie be onelie sought for the labour and duetie almost or altogether neglected The ground you take out of Saint Iohn is infallible and therefore your Popish priesthood doth blasphemouslie vsurpe a pretended power to offer vp our sauiour Christ vnto his father as a sacrifice propitiatorie for the sinnns of the quick and the dead for graunt of which power from aboue you can shew no warrant out of the written word of God the onelie true record of Gods graunt and sufficient euidence for so great an authoritie ALLEN And of two or three places in holie scripture pertaining to this purpose that shall be first proposed which with moste force driueth downe falsehood and most properlie pertaineth to the pith and principall state of the cause which we haue in hand Thus then we finde of Christes wordes will and behauiour concerning the commission graunted out to his holy Apostles for the remission and punishment of our sinnes in the 20. Chapter of the Gospell of Saint Iohn Where the Euangelist thus reporteth that Christ after his glorious resurrection came into a secret chamber where his disciples were together the dore being shut for feare of the Iewes and there after he had giuen them as his custome was his peace and his blessing and she wed him self to their infinite comfort that he was perfectlie risen againe in the same bodie that so latelie was buried he then straight afterwarde to make worthie entrance to so high a purpose gaue them this peace againe in manner of a solemne benediction and therewith said Sicut misit me Pater ego mitto vos Euen as the father hath sent me so I do send you And when he had so spoken he breathed on them and said Accipite spiritum sanctum quorum remiseritis peccata remittuntur eis quorum retinueritis retenta sunt Receaue you the holie ghoste whose sinnes soeuer you shall forgiue they are forgiuen them and whose sinnes you shall retaine they be retained This is the place lo in which the iudgement and rule of our soules with all authoritie in correcting our sinnes in moste expresse and effectuall termes and in moste ample manner is giuen to the Aposiles and their successours Christ him seife doth communicate vnto them the iurisdiction that he receiued of his Father he giueth them in a solemne ceremonie that same spirit of God by which in earth him-selfe did remitte sianes hemaketh them an assured promis that whatsoeuer they pardoned or corrected in mans
life the same should stand in force before God FVLKE Our sauiour Christ in this place doth first of all authorize his Apostles to execute the office of publike preaching of the Gospell in all the world vnto the which he had before chosen appointed them Then doth he furnish them with giftes of the holie Ghost meete for so high and painfull a calling last of all he ratifieth the effect of their ministerie to be accomplished in the remission of the sinnes of all them that beleeue their preaching and in the retaining of their sinnes that do not obey the voice of the Gospell to beleeue it For the power of remitting sinnes must not be separated from the office of teaching whereunto it is annexed by our sauiour Christ who doth not giue his Apostles authoritie to remit sinnes so that he would transferre into them anie thing that is proper vnto him-selfe For it is proper to him to remit sinnes which honour so farre forth as it pertaineth to his onelie person he doth not resigne to his Apostles but commaundeth them in his name to testifie the forgiuenes of sinnes that he might reconcile men to God by their ministerie For I haue shewed before in the words of S. Hilarie that to speake properlie God onelie by men remitteth sinnes not following the sentence of man but man following the iudgement of God which is to pardon all penitent sinners and to retaine the sinnes of vnbeleeuers vnto eternall condemnation Therefore it is much more then the place doth afforde that you affirme the iudgement and rule of our soules with al authoritie in correcting our sinnes in most expresse and effectuall tearmes and in moste ample manner is giuen to the Apostles and their successors in this place For Christ in this place doth constitute Apostles and not Iudges messengers and declarers of his good pleasure and will vnto men not rulers of mens soules he giueth them power to remit or retaine sinnes in his name to the inestimable comfort of all penitent sinners and to the terrour and in crease of damnation of all vnbeleeuers he giueth them not al authoritie and that in moste ample manner in correcting our sinnes neither are there in the place anie expresse or effectual tearmes our of which such omnipotent authoritie can be concluded as afterward when we come to your syllogisme we shall platnlie declare Againe there is no mention in the text of anie iurisdiction communicated vnto them but of the office of teaching whereunto Christ was sent for a time which he committeth to his Apostles and their successours For these wordes of our sauiour As my father hrth sent me I also do send you can not be enlarged generallie to all such purposes as God sent Christ but must be vnderstood according to the matter he speaketh of that is of the office of Preaching teaching which Christ at that time did cease to execute in his humanitie remaining yet still the onelie doctor and teacher of his Church because he is author of the doctrine that is taught and by his holie spirit teacheth continually in giuing effect to the labours of his Apostles Euangelists Prophets Pastours teach ers which he hath giuen vnto his Church for the external ministerie of instructing the same in al truth necessarie to the eternall saluation of his elect He substituteth therfore his Apostles in that necessarie office of preaching the Gospell he enableth them by his spirit which he testifieth vntothem by an holy signe to proceed from him He maketh an assured promis that they should not labour in vaine but that in pardoning retaining sinnes according to the doctrine of his Gospel whatsoeuer they did should stand in force before God ALLEN What dignitie could euer be giuen more in what tearmes more plain by what order more honourable for surelie if either Christ could remit sinnes as we haue at large prooued that he could by commission and sending of his father or if the holie spirit of God maie remit sinnes or if Christes word will procure man anie power to remit sinnes then vndoubtedlie maie the Apostles remit sinnes For they haue the expresse warrant of them all Much said Paul when he affirmed in the Apostles name and person of all Priestes Quòd 〈◊〉 erat in Christo mundum reconcilians sibi posuit in nobis verbum reconciliationis Pro Christo ergo legatione fungimur That God was in Christ reconciling the world to him selfe and hath put in vs the word of reconcilement therfore our calling is to serue as an Embasy in Christes owne stead These wordes be of great waight and exceedinglie set forth the vocation of the spirituall gouernours as of those that holde by the warrant of Gods sending and thereby occupie Christes owne roome Marie the place for all that appertaineth to their calling generallie as wel to preach as otherwise to guide the people of God in the behalfe of their Master to whome we al be subiect but this present text whereupon we now treat doth properlie concerne the commission giuen to the Apostles for the sacrament of penance and remission of sinnes For it doth in moste cleere and vndoubted sense giue to them the like right in that case that Christ him selfe had by the sending of God the father that is to saie the very same authority that he had in respect of his mediation and manhoode A Equalem patri filium nouimus saith Saint Augustine sed bîc verba Mediatoris agnoscimus medium quippe se ostendit dicendo ille me ego vus We know the sonne to be equall with the father but here we must acknowledge the wordes of a mediator For he shewed him selfe to be as a meane when he said He sent me and I send you That is to saie as Theophilact expoundeth it Take vpon you my worke and function and doe it with confidence For as my father did send me so I send you againe and I will be with you to the ende of the worlde FVLKE There is no dout but the Apostles had power to remit sins but yet for al your thetorical interrogations none other then I haue expressed before nor greater then may stand with the glory of Christ who maketh not men equal with him when he authorizeth them as his seruants to be ministers of his mysteries and stewardes of his gracious giftes And Paul trulie said much when he affirmed that god was in Christ recōciling the world to himselfe not imputing to them their offences which clause I know not why you haue omitted hath put in vs that word of recōciliation We are therfore embassadours for Christ c. For he said that it is proper to god to reconcile the world to forgiue sins or not to impute them that is but a ministery of reconciliation which he hath geuen vnto men she weth how this ministerie is executed namely by preaching reconciliation as the embassadours of God to desire men to be reconciled vnto God
which only meane of preaching expressed in this place you with a Marie for all that fumble vp with I cannot tell what guidance because you cannot content your selfe to be a minister a seruant a subiect but you must be a Lord a Prince a ruler But the other text of Ioh. 20. yousay doth properlie concerne the commission giuen to the Apostles for the sacrament of penaunce and remission of sins But whether I praie you in the scripture shal we read of this your sacrament or the institution thereof what is the visible worde or element thereof yet you saie that this text doth in moste cleare and vndoubted sense giue to them the like right in that case that Christ him-selfe had by the sending of God the father that is to saie the verie same authoritie that he had in respect of his mediation and manhood So that be like Christ as Mediator hath no authority peculiar to himselfe in respect of the excellency of his person but that which is communicable vnto others and is communicated to his Apostles But that is a strange doctrine neuer heard of before in the Church of God except it were from the mouth of Nestorius or any of his disciples For our sauiour Christ receiued in his manhoode that which no other man is able to receiue because he one lie is God and man he receiued the spirit not according to measure Iohn 3. 34. as all men muste do that receiue it therefore no man can receiue such power by the spirit in measure which he receiued by the spirit infinitelie or without measure But Saint Augnstine is called to witnes that this text doth giue theverie same authoritie to the Apostles that Christ had in respect of his mediation and manhoode Whereas Saint Augustines words import no such thing but onelie shew that Christ though equal to his father in respect of his Godheade yet as he is our Mediatour is sent of his father in respect of his manhood But of the verie same authoritie that Christ had in respect of his mediation giuen to the Apostles he speaketh not a word That you ioyne his māhood to his mediation as though the mediator were nothing but man or as though the man Iesus Christ which is our onelie mediator were not Immannell that is God with vs it is not without some smack of Nestorian heresie wherebie you seeme so to separate the man from God as though any thing might be verified of the man which in respect of the vnitie of person might not be verified of God or as though there were not such a perfect vnion of the two natures in one person that although they both continue vnconfounded reteining their essentiall properties yet any part of the office and authoritie of Christ which he exercised in his humanitie might as latgelie as fullie and with the verie same authoritie be committed ouer to any other mortall man to be exercised as it was by Christ himselfe But Theophilact is cited to be an interpreter of Saint Augustine whoe saith vpon these wordes as the father hath sent me c. in the person of Christ take vpon you my worke and be sure that I will be with you meaning that he committeth to them the office of teaching whereunto he was sent by his father but of equall authoritie with him he speaketh no worde Which place you haue verie licentiouslie translated to draw it to your purpose For the words are no more but these as Philippus Montanus hath translated them Meum opus inquit suscipite confidite quod vobiscum sum futurus And in the ende he willeth men to consider the dignitie of priests that it is diuine For it perteineth to God to remit sinnes so therefore are they to be honoured as God For although they be vnworthie what is that they are the ministers of Gods giftes and grace worketh by them euen as he spake by Balaams asse For our vnworthines hindreth not grace so because by meanes of priests grace is graunted they are to be honoured Thefe wordes of Theophilact declare that although he ascribe much to the dignitie of Priests yet he doth not allowe them the verie same authoritie that Christ had in respect of his mediation but a farre inferior ministerie And excellentlie to our purpose wrote the holie father Cyril as well for the dignitie of the Apostolike vocation as for the honourable legacie in these wordes Ad gloriosum Apostolalatum Dominus noster Iesus Christus Discipulos suos vocduit qui commotum orbem firmarunt sustentacula eius facti vnde per Psalmistam de terra de Apostolis dicit quia ego firmaui columnas eius Columnae enim robur veritatis discipulisunt quos ita dicit se mittere sicut à patre ipse missus est vs Apostolatus dignitatem ostenderet magnitudinem potestatis eorum aperiret These wordes and the residue following concerning the same purpose goe thus in english Our Lord and master Christ Iesus promoted his disciple to a glorious Apostleship whoe becing made the proppes and staies of all the earth haue established the wauering worlde whereupon the Psalmist sayeth thus of the earth and the Apostles I haue surelie and firmelie set the pillers thereof For the disciples no doubt be the verie pillers strength and staie of trueth whome Christ saith that he doth send euen as his father did send him that thereby he might declare to the worlde as well the dignitie of their Apostleship as open to all men their excellencie and the might of their power and no lesse signifie vnto them what way they had to take in all their life and studies For if they be so sent as Christ him selfe was sent of the father it is requisite to consider for what worke purpose the father euerlasting sent his sonne in flesh to the worlde And that him selfe els where declareth saying Non veni vocare iustos sed peccatores ad poenitentiam I came not to cal the iust but sinners to repen tance in another place it is said God sent not his sonne into the world to iudge the worlde but that the worlde shold be saued by him al these thinges and other he touched brieflie in these few wordes Sicus misit me pater ego mitto vos vt hinc intelligant vocandos esse 〈◊〉 ad poenitentiam 〈◊〉 corpore simul spiritumale habentes Like as my father sent me so I send you that sinners should be called to repentance and be healed both in bodie and soule Thus farre spake S. Cyril of the excellent calling of the disciples of the cause of their large commission not restricted by any streighter tearmes then Christs owne commission was which he receiued from his euerlasting Father FVLKE The wordes of Saint Cyrillus declare no more then I haue said before that the Apostles were sent of Christ as Christ was sent of his father to call sinners to repentance by their ministerie of preaching not
that they were sent with as large commission in euery respect as Christ was sent to be our mediator and redeemer The wordes of Cyrill which you haue mangled and chopped at your pleasure I will recite wholl together that the reader may see how iniutiouslie you would draw to farre other meaning then his saying wil yeald In Ioh. lib. 12. C. 55. vpon these words Dicit ergo eis iterum pax vobis sicut misit me pater ego mitto vos He writeth thus Ordinauit his verbis orbis doctores c. He ordeined thē by these words teachers of the world ministers of the diuine mysteries whome he sent as lightes to the lightening not of the region of the Iewes onelie which according to the measure of the legall commaundement extended from Dan to Bersebe as it is written but he commaunded them to lighten the wholl worlde Therefore Paul saith truelie that no man taketh honour vpon him except he be called of God For our Lord Iesus Christ called his disciples vnto the glorious Apostleship which staied the world that was moued beeing made the pillers thereof Whereof by the Psalmist he saith of the earth and the Apostles I haue strengthned the pillers thereof For his disciples are the pillers and strength of truth Whome he saith that he doth so send as he him-selfe is sent of his father that also he might shew the dignitie of their Apostleship and open to all men the greatnes of their power and with all might shew what way they ought to follow in their studies and in their life For if they be so sent as Christ is sent of his father how is it not necessarie to consider vnto what the father sent his sonne for so not otherwise they may be able to follow him But if expounding to vs the cause of his sending many waies one while he saide I came not to call the iust but sinners to repentance an other while The holl haue no neede of the Phisitian but such as be diseased And moreouer I came downe from heauen saith he not that I might doe mine owne will but the will of him that sent me And againe God sent not his sonne into the worlde that he should iudge or condemne the world but that the world might be saued by him All which thinges he signified in most few wordes saying that he doth so send them as he was sent by his father that hereof they might vnderstand that sinners are to be called to repentance that they which ar diseased might be healed both in bodie and in minde And in the dispensation of thinges they must not doe their owne will but the will of him that sent them and that the world by preaching and the doctrine of faith must be saued All which things with what great diligence they performed you may learne with small labour in the booke of the Acts of the Apostles in the Epistles of Paul Thus farre Cyrillus whose saying if you had not clipped and gelded for your aduantage would haue made no colour for your purpose but against it ALLEN And truelie it was the singular prouidence of God that beforē the graunt of the gouernment of mens soules to his Disciples beeing but mortal men mention should be made of his owne right therein that the wicked should neuer haue face to disgrace the authoritie of them that dependeth so fullie of the soueraigne calling and commission of Gods owne sonne This high wisedome was practized also to the vtter confusion of the wicked and wilfull persons at their calling to the office of preaching and baptizing The which function lest any contemptuous person should in such base men disdaine Christ alledgeth his owne power and preheminence to which the dignitie of priesthoode is so neere and so euerlastinglie ioyned that euerie dishonour and neglecting of the one is great derogation to the other And therefore he saith Omnis potest as data est mihi in coelo in terra All power in heauen and in earth is giuen to my handes Therefore goe you forward and teach all natious babtizing them in the name of the Father and of the Sonne and of the holie Ghost Thus before the institution of sacraments whereof God him selfe must onelie be the author as saith Saint Cyprian Christ voutchsafed for the quiet instruction of the world to declare his authoritie and prerogatiue that all men might farther vnderstand thereby that the ministerie and excllent founction in the vse of the same did orderlie proceed of that authoritie and supreame power that Christ hath receiued ouer all mankind FVLKE Cyrillus telleth you there is none other graunt of the gouernment of mens soules contained in these wordes but to be teachers of the Gospell and to be ministers of the diuine mysteries to preach remission of sinnes to the penitent and to seale it vp with the sacraments to denounce vengeance to the impenitent vnbeleeuers in all things to attend that they do not their owne wil but the wil of him that sent them And in so doing their authoritie is exceeding great deriued from God him selfe the onelie author of their Doctrine and of the sacraments they doe minister Wherein you seeme somewhat to forget your selfe which hitherto haue mainteined and still affirme that Christ did remit sinnes and gaue his Apostles authoritie to doe the same by power receiued from God in his manhoode and that the holie Trinitie would not remit our sinnes otherwise then by the seruise of the sonne of man But now you confesse with S. Cyprian that God himselfe must be the onelie author of Sacraments Wherefore if this power of remitting sins be a Sacrament as you holde Christ must be the onelie author of it as God himselfe not as man by power receiued from God by the holie Ghost ALLEN And this sequel of Christes reason hath maruelous efficacie and force if we will consider thereof All power is giuen to me both in heauen and earth therefore goe you and preach and baptize and remit sinnes If a man would aske the Priest or Apostle how he dare be so bold to exercise any of these functions he might vpon Christes word be so bolde to make him this answere marie sir I baptize because all power is giuen to Christ I preach because all power is giuen to Christe I remit sins because all power was giuen to Christ. For in my ministerie he practiseth daielie all these functions in his power I am become the lawfull worker of all actions that are so proper to Christ him selfe Therefore it was Christ saith Saint Augustine that baptized and had moe Disciples then Iohn and yet Christ baptized not but his Disciples onelie So saie you to all contemners of Gods ordinance it is Christ that pardoneth and enioyneth penance for mans sinnes and yet he doth it not him-selfe as in his owne person but Christ doth it daily by the power which he established after his resurrection and which
continueth for euer in the high ministerie and seruice of the Church Thus I saie doth he remit sinnes Hunt principem Saluatorem exaltauit dextra sua ad dandam poenitentiam Israeli remissionem peccatorum This our Prince and Sauiour hath God exalted with his right hand to giue penance and remission to Israell of all their sinnes This power hath our high priest de serued for his obedience therfore as he receiued it so he hath left it in his Church his owne holie wordes dot protest that same For vpon his power and sending which he did receiue of his father all the Priestes doe euerlastingly hold the right of al holy functions which ells but by Christes owne commission and sending they could neuer nor neuer durst haue practized so long FVLKE It were a more direct sequele for a Priest or Elder of the Church to maintaine and defend his power that he practizeth in preaching baptizing and remitting of sinnes by the calling of Christ who hath all power in heauen and in earth for otherwise it followeth not because Christ hath all power therefore man without calling and authoritie receiued from Christ maie execute anie part thereof But in your application where you saie that Christ pardoneth and enioineth pennance for mans sinnes in the ministerie of the Church I graunt he pardoneth where the power which he hath giuen to the Church is duelie executed But for enioining penance in that sense that papistes doe speake it which is a peece of satisfaction for mens sinnes you are neuer able to prooue that Christ either in his owne person enioyned anie or by meane or ministerie of anie man doth enioine such penance and therefore the text you cire Acts the 5. is wretchedlie writhen from the true meaning and falselie translated as I haue shewed before by testimonies of your owne translaters the English Rhemists who read it thus This Prince and sauiour God hath exalted with his right hand to giue repentance to Israell and remission of sins Where the text is so plaine of the 〈◊〉 conuersion of the Iewes vnto Christ that they were ashamed to turne the worde poenitentia as they doe moste commonlie penance by which they meane some workes of satisfaction which are enioined to them that commit sinne after baptisme As likewise Acts. II. where it is said God then to the Gentills hath giuen repentance vnto life Where by as good reason and in like sense you might saie that God hath giuen penance to the gentiles taking penance in your popsh meaning or els you haue greatlie abused the scripture to prooue that Christ enioineth penance by popish Priests by that saying of the Apostles Actes 5. whereby they meane that God hath exalted Christ to conuert the Israelites from Iudaisme to the Gospell and to giue them saluation in the free remission of sinnes which of it selfe excludeth all other satisfaction then such as Christ him-selfe hath made to answere the iustice of God whose obedience hauing satisfied for our disobedience vpon our true and vnfained repentance which will appeare by the fruites thereof we are receiued into fauour all our sinnes being freelie forgiuen for Iesus Christes sake ALLEN And whosoeuer seeth not how the power iurisdiction of so excellent actions passeth from God the Father to his onelie Sonne and from him againe to such as he hath sent and made the messengers of his blessed minde and disposers of mysteries he hath no feeling at al of the waies that he wrought for mans redemption he can not atteine to the intelligence of Christs vnction whereby he is made our head priest he in the middest of the glorious light of the Church can not beholde the practize of so he auenlie mysteries and therefore such things as he knoweth not he blasphemeth saith S. Iude. But to worke all in light and order I will build vpon the forsaid the intended conclusion that the a duersaries maie see and behold the force of our faith and the singular weaknes of their assertions I thus ioyne with them in arguments barelie and plainlie without couert That power and commission which was giuen to Christ by his heauenlie Father concerning remission or retaining of sinnes was giuen to the Apostles at his departure hence But Christ him selfe did truclie effectuallie and in proper forme of speach by his Fathers sending and and commission remit sinnes Ergo The ministers of Christ maie and doe truclie and perfectlie remit sinnes Or thus more briefilie As Christ was sent of his Father so are the Apostles sent by Christ But Christ was sent to forgiue sinnes Ergo the Apostles be fent to forgiue sinnes also The second part of the reasons which is that Christ had power of his Father to remit sinnes and was sent for the same purpose is sussicienlie prooued in the Chapter before The first part of the argument standeth vpon the sure ground of Christs owne wordes which be these Like as my Father sent me so I doe send you Which wordes were so plaine and so deepelie noted for this intent of Saint Chrysostome that with admiration of the dignitie and excellent calling of Priesthood he thus trimlie discourseth vpon them I will report his saying in Latin as Germanus Brixius hath translated it all that speaketh for that purpose hereafter shall be recited but now no more but this Quid hoc aliud esse dicas nisi omnium rerum coelestium potestatem illis à Deo esse concessam Ait enim Quorumcunque peccata retinueritis retenta sunt Quaenam obsecro potestas hac vna maior esse queat Pater omnifariam filio potestatem dedit caeterùm video ipsam eandem omnifariam potesiatem à Deo filio illis traditam Nam quasi iam in coelum translati ac supra humanam naturam positi atque nostris ab affectibus exempti sic illi ad principatum istum perducti sunt And in English thus it is What e's canst thou make of this or what lesse then that the power and iurisdiction of all heauenlie things is by God graunted vnto them for it is said whose sinnes soeuer you doe holde or reteine they be retained For Gods loue what power can be giuen in the world so great the Father bestowed all manner of power vpon his Sonne I finde the verie selfe same power of all thinges to be deliuered to the Apostles by God the Sonne For now as though they were al readie translated out of this life to heauen and there promoted aboue mans nature and discharged of all our feeble affections they are aduanced to the Princelie soueraigntie whereof we now haue said Thus farre Chrysostome So doth this worthie father helpe our cause and so doth he thinke of the excellent authority giuen by the father to his Sonne deriued from him to the ministers of his holy will testament in earth Whose iurisdiction so highlie holden so truely obteined so neerely ioyned vnto Christs honour and so dailie practized no
otherwise but in his right name whosoeuer shall controlle or cōremne they not onely irreuerently touch gods annointed but they sacrilegiously laie handes on ipsum Christum Domini euen on him that is annointed aboue all his fellowes Well I conclud vp this matter with these few wordes of Saint Ambrose Vult Dominus plurimum posse discipulos suos Vult á seruis suis e a fieri in nominesuo quaefaciebat ipse positus in terris Our lordes pleasure is that his disciples should haue great prerogatiue he will haue the same thinges wrought by his seruants in his name that him-selfe did in his owne person when he was in earth FVLKE He that seeth not the difference of the ministerie of man from the power of God in those actions wherein God worketh by man gropeth in the darke seeth nothing as he ought to see Therefore let vs come to the light of your logick and thereby consider if we can the distinction of the one from the other If the maior or first proposition of your former syllogisme be vnderstood of a power or commission graunted to the manhood of Christ such as might haue beene graunted by God to anie other meere man then your Minor is not true that Christ by such a power and commission onelie setting his Godhead aside though truelie and effectuallie yet not in proper forme ofspeach by his fathers sending and commission remitted sinnes for then could he not be the author of remission of sinnes but onelie a minister thereof and therefore in proper forme ofspeach he could not be said to forgiue sinnes which is proper onely to god but to preach the forgiue nes of sinnes in Gods name or to testifie that God did forgiue sinnes as the ministers of the Church do Butif the Maior be vnderstood of such power commission as was giuen to Christ as the Mediator in respect of his manhood but yet such as he couldnot receiue exercise but in respect of his godhead such as could not be graunted to any but vnto that person which is God man such is the absolute principall power of remission of sinnes then I denie that such power was giuen to the Apostles at his departure For when Christ him-selfe did truelie effectuallie and in proper forme of speech remit sinnes he did it as God hauing equal and principall authoritie with the father and the holie ghost so to do The conclusion of your second syllogisme I graunt that the Apostles were sent to forgiue sinnes but retaining the former distinction of the authoritie of God and the ministerie of man For as Christ was sent of his father to preach the remission of sinnes so were the Apostles sent by Christ to preach remission of sinnes therefore such power as he had by preaching onely of remission of sinnes to forgiue sinnes such power be graunted to his Apostles whome he ordained preachers in his place but the proper pow er of his deity he graunted not nor any power which is proper to the person of the Mediator God and man Theresore these wordes of Christ As the father sent me so send I you must not be extended further then our sauiour Christ in that place meaneth For els infinite absurdities might be concluded thereof as that he sent his Apostles to redeeme the world to die for the sinnes of the world to be sauiours of the world c. or that he sendeth all ministers of the Church to whome this commission extendeth to clense leapers to raise the dead to giue sight to the blinde and to do all other miracles that he was sent to do According to this distinction that Rhetoricall amplification of Chrisostome is to be vnderstood and doubtles wonderfull great is the authoritie that man doth exercise in the name of God although that which is peculiar to God be not attributed to men The similitude that Chrysostome vseth in the same chapter Lib. 3. cap. 5. of a King graunting power to one of his subiects to imprison men and to release them sheweth that he knew the difference of the Lord from the seruant who if he abuse the authoritie committed vnto him deserueth sharpe punishment and therefore hath not absolute authoritie to do all things as his Lord and can not transgresse in doing And in the next Chapter he sheweth that Priestes do exercise this power of forgiuing sinnes by teaching admonition and by praier Not onelie by teaching and admonishing but also by the helpe of praiers and a manifest difference sheweth Saint Ambrose when he saith Christ would haue his disciples to do in his name the same thinges which he did on earth partlie in his fathers name and partlie in his owne name The power of priesthood touching remission of sinnes prooued by the solemne action of Christ in breathing vpon his Apostles and giuing them thereby the holie Ghost THE THIRD CHAP. ALLEN THe commission and power that our Master Christ receiued of his euerlasting father being in moste ample manner communicated with the Apostles made great proofe and euidence for the right that they claime in remission of sinnes but the present power of Gods spirit breathed by Christ vpon them and giuen vnto them for the ministerie and execution of that function helpeth our matter so much that whoso euer now denieth this authoritie of the Apostles concerning the pardoning of our offences doth not so much sinne against the sonne of man which of it selfe is greeuous inough as he doth controll the worke of the spirit of Christ which is the holie Ghost in whome both he and his Church doth remit sinnes The more plaine and more exact our master Christ was in the bestowing of that power to remit and retaine sinnes the more is our contempt in the disobedience and deniall thereof He sendeth them 〈◊〉 with his owne authoritie in this case he giueth them the verie spirit of God by whose diuine power they maie execute the function to which he called them he giueth them the expresse warrant of his owne word that sinnes they might pardon and punish and yet we make doubt of their vsurpation But how they might forgiue sinnes by Christes sending we haue alreadie said Now for the holie Ghostes power and prerogatiue in the same action which was breathed on the Apostles we must further conferre with such as call in question matters so plaine And first I am in goodhope that no man will denie but Christ gaue them the holie ghost for no other purpose so much as to remit sinnes Secondlie I doubt not of their faith and beliese in this point but they will confesse the holie ghost to be of power by nature and proprietie to forgiue sinnes Thirdlie I claime of their sinceritie thus much more that Christ being as well God as man was well able for the furniture of their calling to giue them the holie ghost all which being confessed of all men and denied of no Christian aline how the conclusion so beset with all
warrant of Christ his power receiued by the holy ghost maie as ministers seruants remit or retaine sins we do most willinglie consent and confesse But then they practise this power as seruants when they beinterpreters and declarers of the Lordes will and pleasure and require not that God should followe their sentence or attend how they be affected to forgiue or retaine and so to subscribe vnto their doing for that is an Antichristian vsurpation farre from the meaning of that power which Christ did graunt to his A postles ALLEN Some holie writers vpon this text of S. Iohn in which the order of Christes authorizing his Apostles for the remission of sinnes is described doe dispute of the difference of giuing the holie Ghost then to his Disciples and afterward on Whitsondaie some note the eternall ceremonie that our Master vsed when he gaue them the holie spirit which was by breathing on them that such outward actions might both be an euidence to them of that excellent gift which they inwardlie then receiued and should further be an euerlasting instruction to the Church that Gods grace and giftes be often ioyned to externall elements for the solace of our nature that delighteth to haue our outward man schooled as wel as the inward man nourished These and manie things moe be of profitable remembrance and consideration but not so much to our purpose Therefore let vs see whether the iudgement of the holie Fathers doe not wholie helpe our present cause prouing the Priests ministerie through the holie Ghostes authoritie that our declaration standing on the plaine wordes of scripture with their vndoubted sense maie obtaine inuincible force against the aduersaries worthie credit of the true beleeuers FVLKE If you had expressed what the writers are that thus dispute or discourse vpon this text we might better haue considred how pertinent or impertinent their opinions are to our matter in controuersie S. Chrysost. seemeth to allowe the opinion of some and Euthymius plainely affirmeth the same that the Apostles at this time did not presentlie receiue the holie ghost but onelie were prepared or made capable thereof which if it were true is contrarie to the title of your Chapter I like better of Cyrillus iudgement which thinketh they presentlie receiued the holie Ghost in some measure but not so plentifullie nor with such diuersitie of giftes as on the daie of Pentecost That the grace of God is testified assured and sealed vp vnto vs for the help of our infirmitie by outward signes and externall elementes ioined thereto we know confesse but as for the solace of our nature or delight to haue our outward man schooled I knowe not what they meane It is great mercie of God to beare with our weakenes but it agreeth not with the discipline of the Gospell that we should delight in outward thinges but rather to exercise our faith in spirituall and heauenlie meditations ALLEN We will make our entrance first with Saint Cyrill whoe debating with himselfe vppon the incomparable authoritie and power giuen to the Apostles for remission of sinnes standeth first as in contention with him selfe and with Christs words how it maie be that they being but men should forgiue the sinnes of our soules being sure of this that it is the propertie onelie of the true liuing god to assoile vs of our sinnes against whom onlie all sins be properlie committed And therfore being not of stomake as men be now a daies to denie that which Christes words so plainelie do import he made answere that the Apostles were in deed deified and made as you would saie partakers of Gods nature to worke Gods owne office in the world Qua igitur ratione saieth he diuinae naturae dignitatem ac potestatem discipulis suis saluator largitus est Quia certè absurdum non est peccata remitti posse ab illis qui Spiritum sanctum in seipsis habeant Nam cùm ipsi remmittunt aut detinent spiritus qui habitat in eis remittit detines By what meanes did our Sauiour giue vnto the Apostles the preheminence and power of Gods owne nature Surelie because it agreeth verie well that they should rimit mans sins that haue in themselues the holie Ghost For when they assoile or retaine sins it is the holie spirit that dwelleth in them which by their ministery doth remit or retaine sins Thus he I maruell not now whie this same father termeth the Apostles sometimes protectores curatores animarum corporum the protectors curers both of bodies soules it is not strange whie S. Ambrose should call the order of priestood Ordinem 〈◊〉 Neither that he should terme Officium Sacerdotis munus S. S. The Priests office to be the function of the holie Ghost No I doe not wonder at some of our forefathers that in the admiration of Gods Maiestic which they same to be so present in the execution of so high in office they did simplie and plainely terme the principall Pastours of the Church halfe Gods and not meere men not hauing respect to their persons which be compassed with infirmities as other the sinfull sort of people in the world be but casting eie vpward to the holie and excellent function which they practised by the spirit of God which dwelleth in them and deifieth their persons to make them of habilitie to exercise the workes of God FVLKE Saint Cyrill is farre from that blasphemie to saie that the Apostles were in deede deified and made partakers of Gods nature to worke Gods owne office in the world For ascribing to God that which is proper to him incommunicable to anie meere creature he maketh this obiection how our sauiour did graunt to his disciples the dignitie power of his diuine nature answereth that they were only made ministers instruments of the holy ghost to expresse his power in remitting sinnes by baptisme and repentance whereof S. Chrysostome also saieth vpon the same text that the Priest giueth onelie his tongue and his hand but the Father the sonne and the holie Ghost doth all things in this case I will rehearse the whole saying of Cyrillus that his iudgement maie more fullie appeare vpon this text Et certè solius veri Dei est c. And suerlie it pertaineth to the onelie true God that he is able to loose men from their sinnes For to what other person is it lawfull to deliuer the transgressors of the law from sinne but to the author of the law him-selfe for so in mennes affaires we see it to be done For no man without punishment doth reprooue the lawes of Kings but the Kinges them-selues in whome the crime of transgression hath no place For it is wiselie said that he is implous which shall saie to a King thou doest vniustlie By what meanes then did our Sauiour graunt to his disciples the dignitie and power of the diuine nature because trulie it is not absurde that sinnes may be remitted
holie ghost was God by whose authoritie and proper power they did alwaies since Christs word was spoken remitte the same The which beeing true as it cannot be false that is so agreeable both to scriptures and to all our fathers faith the heresy of our time must needes directly impugne the vertue and power of Gods owne spirit For as the proofe of mans ministerie in this foresaid function induceth the true and euerlasting Godhead of the holy ghost by whome they practize that power so the denial thereof and robberie of priesthoode of this their moste iust claime doth directlie spoile God of his honour and of the euerlasting right that he hath in remission of sinnes So whiles these goodmen seeke to abase man vniustlie they blaspheme God highlie and together with mans ministerie they bring vnto vtter contempt Gods owne authoritie FVLKE Your deifying of popish priests doth altogether weaken the force of that argument which our fathers vsed against the auncient heretikes to prooue the diuinitie of the holie Ghost For it were an easie matter for Eunomius Macedonius or anie other heretike that was against his godhead to replie that by ministerie of God the holie Ghost might as properlie forgiue sinnes as Priestes do by the ministerie of Christ and of the holie ghost yea so farre forth as thereby they are made halfe Gods yea deified and made Gods in deede But you vtter repugnancie when you saie that by Gods authoritie and proper power Priestes do forgiue sinnes Where you make it not proper to God which is common to others with him Therefore you should speake more properlie to saie that God the holy ghost by his owne authoritie and power proper to the deitie doth forgiue sinnes in their ministery men thereto authorized do no more in proper speach and sense but testifie and declare what God doth for which declaration and testification seeing they are the embassadours and messengers of God vnto the world to declare his pleasure of reconciliation or condemnation they are said to forgiue sinnes or to retaine them which they do not properlie but pronounce the sentence of God concerning the remission or retention of mens sinnes And that this was the meaning of the Auncient fathers concerning the authoritie and power of Gods ministers it is moste manifest by this argument whereby they choke the enuier of the holie ghostes diuinitie from which you cutte of all the sinnewes and force it hath to prooue it when you communicate to men that which is proper to God and aduance men aboue the nature of meere men when you deifie their persons by meanes of the giftes of the holie Ghost giuen to them and make them of abilitie to exercise the proper workes of God As for the deniall and robberie that you ascribe I can not tell to what heretikes of this time we detest as much as ye not seeking to abase man beneath the nature and condition of man norseeking to extoll him by robbing God of his glorie and proper effects to magnifie menne to deifie the persoas of men as you do in plaine termes Whereby it is manifest we are as far from blaspheming god or making mans ministerie contemptible which he exerciseth in the name of God as you are from sobrietie thus to iudge if your meaning be of vs or thus to reason if you would defend the argument of the auncient fathers against the auncient heretikes ALLEN But for the readersease and more light of our cause I ioyne thus in argument with them againe vpon the second part of Christes owne wordes and action had in the authorizing of his Apostles Whatsoeuer the holie Ghost maie doe in this case by the proper power of his Godhead that may the Apostles and Priestcs do by seruice and ministerie through the power of the holie Ghost But the holie Ghost properlie and rightlie doth remit sinnes Therefore the Apostles doe rightlie remit sinnes by their ministerie in the said holie Ghost All partes of this conclusion stand vpright and feare no falsehood they be guarded on euerie side by Christes action by wordes of scripture by the Doctors plain warrant and by all reason With all which whosoeuer is not contented but will needes extinguere spiritum extinguish Gods spirit and violentlie take from the Church the greatest comfort of all mans life that in this infirmitie of our flesh standeth in moste hope by his gift in remission of sinnes for which especiall cause the said spirit was mercifullie breathed vpon the Apostles peculiarly before the mare common sending of the same from heauen aboue If all this reason and iust demonstration of trueth will not serue them I will charge them with this graue conclusion of S. Augustine vttered partlie against the Nouatians especallie against the desperate that would not seeke for Gods mercie by the Churches ministerie in the sacrament of penance To be briefe I will speake it in English Whosoeuer he be that beleeueth no mans sinnes to be remitted in Gods Church and therefore despiseth the bountifulnes of God inso mightie a worke if he in that obstinate minde continue til his liues end he is guiltie of sinne against the holie Ghost in which holy ghost Christ remitteth sinnes FVLKE I doe greatlie commend you that you haue such regard of the readers ease and it seemeth you haue good confidence of your cause that you flie not the light of Logicall iudgement by which the trueth shall more plainelie appeere to all sortes of men then by anie discourses at large vnder which many great errors may be often couered vnder sophistical cloudes ambiguity of words which in a briefe syllogisme is soone and easilie espied To answere your argument therefore First I distinguish of your Maior for if you meane by seruice and ministerie the expressing and declaring of the will and pleasure of the holy ghost wherunto they are authorized I acknowledge your Maior proposition to be true whatsoeuer the holie Ghost maie doe in this case by the proper power of his godhead that maie the Apostles and Priestes doe by seruice ministerie through the power of the holie Ghost But if you meane by seruice and ministerie that the proper power of God is communicated to men I denie your Maior as false and absurde For the Apostles and Priests maie not by seruice and ministerie through the power of the holie Ghost forgiue sinnes properlie which the holie ghost by proper power of his godhead may doe for this is a proper power not com municable vnto any creature but a declaration of the will of him that hath such power is the ministeriall authoritie by which men forgiue sinnes Secondlie I answere that your conclusion is deceitfull For your Minor Extreame or Assumption is not perfectlie ioyned with your Maior or Proposition in the conclusion For your Minor is that the holie ghost properly rightlie doth remit sinnes So your conclusion should be therefore the Apostles properlie and rightlie doe remit sinnes by their ministerie
same worke of binding and loosing of such sheepe of Christes folde as to them were committed And so did Saint Thomas who then was not there so did Saint Matthew who then was no Apostle so did Barnabas so did Timothie and Titus who were ordeined by Saint Paul and so did Paul him selfe of whome Saint Ambrose saith that he did remit sinnes without all derogation The good studiousereader must marke wel then that al these holie functions or passing preheminencies are not giuen to the priuate persons in respect of themselues neither of Peter nor of Paul nor any other but they are bestowed vpon them for the vse of the Church which dieth in their persons and therefore must be honoured with the same offices by other after they be dead by perpetuall succession they shall neuer cease And that caused Saint Augustine and other holie fathers to saie the keies were giuen to the Church and authoritie to remit sinnes to baptize and to enioyne penance not because the wholl Church by gathering all her children together must giue sentence vpon euerie sinner or els the priests iudgement to be nothing as some foolish seditious heades haue now to the distrurbance of the world deuised but because it is our common wealth and house of faith which is so beutified in her ministers with all kinde of sacraments and good orders for the gouernment of her children and because all men may see it was the earnest loue and carefull prouidence for this his spouse and not the persons of the Apostles in respect of them selues which mooued his wisedome to the institution of such perpetuall offices in the Church FVLKE Your conclusion is true that the power extended to al the Apostles successors but it is not strongly prooued by the example of Thomas Matthew Paull and Bernabas who were Apostles them-selues in the highest degree and therefore I like better the solution of Cyrillus which vnderstandeth the intention of Christ to haue beene of the wholl order of the Apostles and their successours although more then Thomas had beene absent at such time as he gaue that power alledging the examples of Eldad and Meldad which being of the number that were chosen to be gouernours to assist Moses although they were not present with the rest before the tabernacle yet they were indued with the spirit of prophesie because they were of the number appointed Where you saie that no doubt a Sacrament was instituted by these wordes of Christ and often haue so saide you onelie saie it and bring no proofe thereof neither doe you declare what is the visible signe of the inuisible grace nor what 〈◊〉 the element to which the worde commeth that we might acknowledge a sacrament with you That the keies are giuen to the Church although it prooue 〈◊〉 that euerie member of the Church should execute them yet it prooueth that Peter had no soueraigne nor singular authoritie of the keies aboue the rest of the Apostles but that the Pastour of euerie Church hath the same not of the gift graunt commission or permission of Peter but of the graunt and immediate commission from Iesus Christ him-selfe Whether the power of excommunication perteine to all the Church or to certaine chosen gouernours thereof it is a question not incident to this to be handled ALLEN Hereupon therefore and in consideration that the keies of opening and shutting heauen by binding and loosing mans sinnes shall euer remaine for the vse and honour of the Church the saied holie Saint Augustine hath these wordes Claues dedit Ecclesiae suae vt quae solucrit in terra soluta essent in coelo quae ligauerit in terra ligata essent in 〈◊〉 Christ deliured the keyes to the Church that whoesoeuer shee loosed in earth should be loosed in heauen and whatsoeuer shee bound in earth should be bound likewise in heauen And Optatus his equall striuing with the Donatistes for all holie giftes which Christ bestowed vpon his Church challengeth all other sacraments and namelie the keies for the Catholike and vniuersall Church from the part of Donatus the heretike as in the right of Peter He saieth exceeding pithely Claues darae sunt Petro non haereticis And afterwade Cathedram Petri quae nostra est per ipsam caeteras dotes apud nos esse probamus etiam sacerdotium The keies are giuen to Peter and not to heretikes by the chaier of Peter which is ours we prooue all other giftes of the Church to be ours yea euen priesthoode Thus he hath in sense in diuerse places By which we see the inrisdiction and power giuen to the principall Apostle yet to remaine and by it all other the Churches notable preheminences which he calleth Ecclesiae dotes The douries of the Church through his wholl discourse against the Donatists So doth Epiphanius attribute the power of penance and pardon to the Church likewise not onelie in baptisme which he calleth the moste perfect penance but also afterwarde vpon the parties relapse in which case the heretikes called Cathari affirmed that the Church had no authoritie to pardon them any more Against which pernicious sect he sayeth If any man fall after his baptisme the Church will not be vnmercifull to him Dat enim reuersionem post poenitentiam For shee giueth him leaue to returne and hath penance after penance By which he noteth that the Church hath two sacraments for remission of sinne the one is baptisme which he termeth perfect penance with Saint Paul to the Hebrewes And Saint Augustine doth call it in his En. chiridion Magnam indulgentiam a graund pardon And afterward The Church hath an other kinde of remission which Epiphanius calleth poenitentiam post poenitentiam But of these two more shal be said anon After this 〈◊〉 doth Lactantius 〈◊〉 to the true Church confession penance and profitable healing of our woundes and such sores as be found in our soules By all which euerie man may conceiue easelie that this honour and commission of priesthoode for the remission of our sinnes did not decaie with the Aposties appointed by Christ nor shall cease till Christes comming to 〈◊〉 the worlde FVLKE These testimonies needed not to be heaped vp in vaine but that you would beare the ignorant in hand most iniurioslie that Caluin and the better learned of the protestants do holde that the power of binding and loosing ated with the Apostles and continueth not in the Church Saint Augustines wordes are as you cite them but there followeth immediatlie an explication which you haue omitted Scilicet vt quis quis in Ecclesia eius dmitti sibi peccata non crederet non eidimitterentur quisquis autem crederet seque ab his correctus auerteret in eiusdem Ecclesiae gremio constitutus eadem fide atque correctione sanareiur Quisquis enim non cred it dimitti sibi posse peccata fit deterior disperando quasi nihil illi melius quà m malum esse remanear
Christ gaue them the holie Ghost But Caluinsaith notso but that authoritie to remit sinnes is graunted to be exercised by preaching both priuatelie and publikelie that is to assure men that God doth remit their sinnes and that the giftes of the holie Ghost were graunted to the Apostles that they might be inabled to exercise that high office and function which giftes no man hath power to giue but onelie God neither doth anie man at this daie receiue them in such plentifull measure but that he maie erre of whomesoeuer he be ordeined or sent to preach Neither doth Caluin require that power of not erring but onelie in them that arrogate vnto them-selues an absolute power to remit sinnes as properlie as the holy Ghost doth forgiue them who we knowe cannot erre in binding him that is to be loosed or loosinge him that is to be bounde as popishe pristes doe which yet presumptucusly and blasphe mouslie arrogate vnto them-selues such power and authoritie That it standeth well with Gods houour that mortall men should ren it sinnes and that Nouatus the heretike was of olde condemned for denying the same and that he was the father of this heresy which denyeth the Priests authoritie THE SEVENTH CHAP. ALLEN Now by all our former discourse the right of remission of sinnes sufficiently prooued to pertain to priesthood some will perhaps count it vaine labour to make more declaration of that which is so plaine or further to establish that by reason which standeth so fast on scriptures But if anie so thinke they see net the wyde waies of heresie nor the manifolde shifies that she attempteth euen there where shee maie seeme to be fullie beaten The simple and the sinfullstand moste in her danger that can not in their lack of intelligence compare reason to reason nor gather one trueth of an other and therefore to their mouthes we must chew all meates verie small els there could be no great need of their further information how this claime of remission of sinnes or the vsisall practize thereof could stand with Gods glorie For being answerable to his ordinance it can not but be agreeable with his honour But because in desperate cases our aduersaries haue taught their fellows there to wrangle vncurteouslie where they can not mantaine reason pithelie I will not onelie serue my cause but sometimes pursue their follie though I doubt not but the wisdome of God shal more and more appeare touch ing his meaning in our matter not alonelie by our defence but a great deale the rather by their discontentation Now therefore intending to declare that this preheminence of priesthood doth nothing abase or derogate to Gods aignitie I think it not amisse to match our new doctours of whome I heare often this complaint with other their forefathers that at once both trueth maie fullie be serued and a yoke of aduersaries ioyntlie drawing against the Church and our saluation may be almost with one breath refuted Our yong masters may be glad to grow so high in gods Church as to be reprooued with them who were condemned thirteene hundreth yeares since and though they be so modest that lightlie they list not crack of their auncestours yet we will not defraud them of that glorie nor healpe our cause by dissimulation of their great antiquitie It is their pusillanimitie I know that they will not often in distresse of their doctrine call for aid of their forefathers who were doubtlesse verie auncient and manie of them within the first six hundred yeares In other causes Vigilantius might healpe in some Iouinian would attend vpon them Manes might do them often high pleasure Iulianus the apostata a prince for their purpose Simon Magus one of the Apostles age would stand by them surelie if our aduersaries had 〈◊〉 they would well neere winne of vs by antiquitie And truelie I can not dissemble with them in this cause that now is in hand they haue one patron against vs of yeares very auncient and of reason much much like vnto themselues Nouatus is his name of whome the followers were called of the Church Nouatians but them-selues liked to be called Cathari that is to saie cleane and vndefiled persons Their opinion was that such as did fall into anie mortall sinne after Baptisme could not by anie man or meanes be assoiled thereof and for that they dissalowed the Churches wholl practize of mercie and remission of sinnes in the sacrament of penance nothing dissagreeing from Caluin that condemneth the saying of Saint Ierome as sacrilegious where he writeth that penance is as a second beord of refuge whereby after shipwrack a man may be saued Neither did Nouatus denie but himselfe might haue mercie and giue pardon after mansfall but the Church could not therein meadle as he thought without singular iniurie to Christ and his onelie prerogatiue And that he ioyneth in this matter fullie with our men that they maie take more comfort on him you shall perceiue by Socrates one of the writers of the Tripartit historie who saith thus Nouatus scribebat Ecclesus ne eos qui Daemonibus immolauerant ad sacramenta susciperent sed inuitarent quidem ad poenitentiam remissionem verò Dei relinquerent potestati cuius solius est peccata remittere Nouatus wrote his letters to diuerse Churches that they should not admitte anie man to the Sacramentes that had sacrificed to Diuelles but that they should onelie mooue them to doe Pennance and committe to God the remission of their sinne who onelie can forgiue mans offences And therefore though in some other point Nouatus did ouerpricke his children yet herein they fullie meet in one Epiphanius writeth that he denied saluation to those that did fal to greeuous crimes after their Christendome and therewith did holde that there was but one penance which was done in baptisme after that the Church to haue none How hansomelie he defended this error and vnmercifull heresie ye shall see anone by Saint Ambrose who learnedlie followed and chased him or his followers in an wholl worke written for that purpose In the meane time it were good for the more credit of the man and his cause to note with the auncient Doctors of his daies his conditions his comming vp his proceeding and practizes S. Cyprian who was most molested with him knew him best geueth him this praise Nouatus was a man that delighted much in nouelties and newes of insatiable auarice a furious rauin with pride and intollerable arrogancie almoste puffed past him selfe knowen and taken of all Bishoppes for a naughtie packe condemned by the common iudgement of all good Priestes for a faithlesse heretike curious and inquisitiue them to betraie for to deceiue alwaies readie to flatter in loue neuer faithfull nor trustie a match euer fired to kindle sedition a whirle winde and storme to procure the shipwrake of faith and to be short an aduersarie to tranquilitie and an enimie of peace These were his conditions then FVLKE In the latter
were by them Baptized it seemeth they take it of their Master Nouatus who because he had contemned he ceremonie vsed in that time of the Church him-selfe taught his schollers to doe the same left it should hawe beene reputed a want in him Although not the omission of the ceremonie but the contempt of the vsage of the Church being not impious in it selfe was chiefelie condemned in him For at such times as he was ordained Elder or Priest of the Church of 〈◊〉 it was thought by the Bishope a matter that might be remitted in him that for other respectes seemed meete for the office neither was it thought necessarie that he should receiue that cerimonie so by him omitted but not yet as it was thought in despight of the Church refused The Fathers oflater time as Theodoret writeth decreed that such as came from his heresie and would be incorporated into the Church should by receiuing that cerimonie which in time of their heresie they despised declare that they were truelie conuerted from it and willinghe submitted themselues to the Catholike Church and her Doctrine But of late daies when that ceremonie of anointing hath beene accounted a Sacrament yea and a greater Sacrament then Baptisme and thought necessary to eternall saluation whereas yet it hath no institution of Christ set forth in the holie Scriptures the reformed Churches haue iustlie abrogated that custome according to that libertie which the Church hath in all ceremonies not commaunded by God according to the example of the Church in former ages which hath abrogated manie ceremonies vsed of auncient times aswell as that of anointing with oile them that are Baptized ALLEN And first because generallie all the foresaid ioyne together against the trueth in this argument that it is dishonour to god and great presumption in a mortall man to claime the power so proper to God let the studious reader well consider that no function power ne dignitie be it neuer so peculiar to God him-selfe by naturaii excellencie but the same maie be occupied of man secondarilie as by the waie of seruice ministery or participation so that man challenge nor vsurpe it not as of him selfe or when it is not lawfuliie receaued nor orderlie giuen All the workes that extraordinarilie and miraculouslie were wrought either by Christ in his humanitie or by the Prophets or Apostles wordes or by their garments or by what other instrumēt so euer they were donne were the works of god no lesse then to remit sins yet al these things other the like brought to passe by man through the power of god that worketh by mans ministerie the same nothing derogateth to gods glorie but infinitelie augmenteth his honour euen so the power of pardoning mans sins being emploied by God the father vpon Christ his sonne by Christ vpon his Church ministers practized by them not of their owne might heades but in the 〈◊〉 of the holie ghost which by the sonne of god was 〈◊〉 vpon them this authoritie I saie is no derogation but an euident signe of his mightie power of saluation left for the faithfulls sake in the Church When the person that was lame from his birth begged of Peter and Iohn somewhat for his reliefe at the Temole dore as his manner was Peter answered him that golde and siluer he had none to giue but that which he had he would willinglie bestowe which was power to heale him of his incurable maladie for proofe whereof he bad him arise and walke and so he did at his word in the sight of all that there were gathered which being done and the people wondering thereat the Apostle thus instructed them Brethren faith he why wonder you at vs as though we had brought this strange worke to passe by our owne strength and power it is the God of Abraham Isaac Iacob that hath glorified his sonne Iesus whome you refused and betraied to Pontius Pilatus to be crucified in his name and faith this poore man is recouered Marcke well that the same thing which peter said him selfe had to giue quod habeo tibi do the same yet he professeth that he holdeth not as of his owne right or might but as of Christ Iesus in whose name he willed the lame to walke euen so the the power of pardoning sinner is truely and properly in the Priestes as the power of working miracles is properly in Peters hands neither the one noryet the other holden as of their owne might and power but both practized for the glory of God in the name of Iesus of Nazareth by their appointed ministery And as truly as Peter might saie to the feeble in body that which I haue I giue thee rise and walke in the name of iesos of Nazareth so surelie may the Priest saie to the sicke in souie that which I haue I giue thee in the name of Iesus thy Ennes my sonne be forgiuen thee No lesse is the one the peculiar worke of God then the other no more doth one dishonor god then the other FVLKE Nothing that is proper or peculiar to God can be communicated to man but it ceaseth to be proper to God For it is against the nature of properties to be made common to any other subiect then to that whereof they are proper adiuncts And yet I denie not but that which is proper to God he doth exercise often times by the seruice or ministery of men in which they are but instrumental causes he him selfe is the principal efficient otherwise man maie not occupie or execute secondly or thirdly or last of all by waie of participation that which is proper or peculiar to God So that it remaneth still an vndoubted truth that God onelie doth forgiue sinnes properlie and man doth not forgiue sinnes properlie but is the instrument of God to vtter and declare the good pleasure of God in forgiuing sinnes to all and euerie one that repent and beleeue the Gospe ll Your general negatiue that there is no function power nor dignitie be it neuer so peculiar to God by naturall excellencie but it maie be occupied of man secondly as by the waie of seruice ministery or participation if it were vrged against you would breed horrible absurdities To omit all other the power of creating thinges of nothing by what meanes maie man be partaker thereof occupie it or exercise it But let vs consider your induction All Miraculous workes worught by Christ in his humanitie the Prophets or Apostles were no lesse proper to God then the power to remit sinnes Yes verilie for manie miraculous workes that God did by Moses the inchaunters of Egipt did the like by the power of the deuill whereby it appeareth that although ail power be deriued from God as from the first cause thereof euen that power which the deuill hath yet it is otherwise communicated to creatures then the power of remission of sinnes is For that remaineth onelie in the hande of God and is not properlie
therefore conforme himselfe to Gods will whose place he there occupieth For as the Priest in the olde lawe could not make the cleane person to be vncleane no more can the Priest of the new lawe bind the innocent or absolue the person that continueth in sinne Neuertheles the Priest worketh more properly vnder god touching the remission of sinnes because he is appointed the minister of grace and reconciliation then the Priest in the olde lawe For there in the making of any man whole of the leprosie or other vncleanes the Priest had not to do at all but onelie when one was made whole by god it was the priestes office to discerne the same to shewe it vnto the people and to admit him againe into the fellowspip of theresidue after oblation made for that purpose For to them it was not said whome-soeuer you punish with leprosie or make vncleane or whome-soeuer you heale make cleane he shal be whole no such promise was made vnto them For it was enough that it might represent and haue resembling of our sacrament of penance and of the maruelouse authoritte giuen in the new law to our Priestes concerning the remission of sinnes For to ours it was not saide you shall discerne whome I haue loosed alreadie in heauen and shewe to the world whom I haue retained bound or not forgiuen in heauen but as Hilarie saith the Priests sentence is made preiudiciall to God in heauen not the Priestes forgiuing is first and then Gods afterward as two distinct actions in time but because the Priestes is prius quoad nos as the Philosophers doe tearme such thinges and by the Priestes worke which is plaine to vs we streight come to the knowledge of Gods like worke of remission in heauen which is prius natura because Gods action is the principall and mans must necessarily depend theron But eis both Gods worke and mans runne ioyntly together in remission of sins as al infirmental secondarie causes neuer make a seuerall action from the principal but they concur ioyntly to euery effect as it is most plaine in all sacraments whereby god worketh grace the which grace as it proceedeth from god so it commeth by mans seruice not by distinct operation of the principall and the seruing and secondarie causes but in one worke vndeuided operation of them both For in baptisme God worketh the remission of originall or actuall sinnes first and then sendeth the partie to the fount afterward that the Priest therein may declare what god hath wrought before or to worke the same againe that so the partie might haue a double grace of remission first by Ggd and then by the Priest for that were foolish to surmise But god by the Priests ministerie and the sacrament doth rewit sinnes so that the action hereof at once sitly may fall vpon them both FVLKE The power of remitting sinnes as you saie is often compared by the auncient Fathers to that authoritie which the priests of the old law had in discerning and pronouncing who were lepers and who were cleane which is to giue a sentence declaratorie to pronunce who was striken or healed by God not a proper power to strike or heale and yet the words of the lawe are that the Priest should make him cleane or vncleane meaning that he should so declare him with authoritie to be either seperated or receiued as the case required according to those directions and descriptions which he had in the lawe of God For though other men by the instruction of the law might descerne a leaper from a clean person yet no man had authority to put him out or to receiue him into the congregation but the Priest In citing the authoritie of Saint Bede and Saint Chrisostome you vse such confusion as I know not whose words you pretend to alledge sauing that Bede hath written vpon Saint lames epistle Chrisostome hath not In cyting therefore of Saint Bedes testimonie it may seeme that you follow some other mens dictates collection or notebooke and not your owne reading For Bedes wordes vpon that place of the 5. of Saint Iames are these differing both in wordes and sense from your allegation Si ergo infirmi in peccatis sint haec presbyteris ecclesiae confessi fuerunt ac perfecto corde ea relinquere atque emendare sategerint dimittentur eis Neque enim sine confessione emendationis peccata qucunt demitti unde recte subtungitur Confitemini ergo alterutrum peccata vestra orate pro inuicem saluemini In hac autem sententiailla debet esse discretio vt quotidiana leuiaque peccata alterutrum coaequalibus confiteamur corumque quotidiana credamus oratione saluari Porro grauioris leprae immunditiam iuxta legem sacerdoti pandamus atque ad eius arbitrium qualiter quanto tempore insserit purificari curemus Therefore if the sick be in sinnes and shal confesse them to the elders or priests of the Church and with perfect heart shall indeuour to forsake and amend them they shall be forgiuen to them For without the confession of amendment sinnes can not be forgiuen wherupon it is rightlie added Confesse therefore your sins one to an other that ye maie be saued Now in this sentence this diseretion ought to be that we confesse our daily light offences to our equalls one to another that we should beleeue that by their daily praier we are saued But the vncleanes of the more greeuous Leprosie according to the law let vs open to the priest according to his arbitrement how and how long time he shall commaunde let vs haue regard to be purified In this testimonie of Saint Bede though I doe not altogether allow his iudgement and euerie man may see how he restreineth in some case to the priest that which the Apostle speaketh of confessing one to another in all cases mutual offered yet we may see his sentence contrary to your citation quamuis Leprae c. although you haue amended it in your translation Also that it is confession acknowledging or purposing of amendment that Saint Bede counteth necessarie for them that shall obteine remission of their sinnes and not a particular declaration of all sinnes counted in a priests eare Thirdlie that the text of Saint Iames is to be vnderstood directlie of mutuall confession of one man to an other although in cases of greeuous sinnes he allude to the law of Leprosie In translating the place ofIerome you render for peccatorum sinnes where you should rather translate it sinners that peccatorum may be the antecedent to the relatiue that followeth but as for auricular confession or distinct reckoning of euerie of our particuler mortall sinnes this place maketh nothing in the worlde as verie plaine as you say it is The reason you adde of doing iustice in punishing or pardoning is of your owne imagination For Ierome saith that by hearing the diuersitie of sinners speaking of them that haue openly offéded and finding some to be penitent
some to be obstinate or dissemblers he may know who is to be bound and who to be loosed which he cānot do by hearing the diuersity of their sins For if their sins be as red as scarlet if they be truelie penitent they are to be loosed and if they seeme neuer so small if they be not repentant nor humblie contrite in heart for them they are to be bound While you seeke to make a difference betweene the authoritie of the minister in the Ghospell of pardoning sinnes more properlie then the priest clensed the Leper you declare that you are not content with the sentence of Saint Ierome nor of so many of the auncient fathers as made the case all alike And where you saie it was not said vnto them as vnto ours whomsoeuer you punish with Leprosie or make vncleane he shal haue a Leprosie you speake beside the booke For this authoritie was giuen to them that they should make cleane or vncleane and whomesoeuer they made cleane he was admitted into the congregation and whomesoeuer they made vncleane he was so accounted of all men Yet properlie they made neither cleane nor vncleane but declared them so to be according to the institution which they had of Gods law in exercise whereof although they erred and so the partie might be receiued or refused according to their error yet was he neither cleane nor vncleane in deede by their sentence but by the work of God and so be sinners The blasphemie that you ascribe to Saint Hilarie I haue confuted before Your distinction of prius natura and quoad nos is foolish sophistrie in this case For except God first worke in our hearts by his holie spirit faith of forgiuenes we can haue but small comfort in the priests absolution That God doth alwaies wörke at the instant in which Baptisme is ministred it is false if Saint Augustines doctrine be true who reacheth that Baptisme may be receiued out of the Church but cannot haue effect but in the Church that is if the partie came from heresie and submit him selfe to the Catholike Church ALLEN And so it is in penance where God the principall and the priest the secondarie or seruisable cause ioyntlie forgiue together For so the words of institution of this sacrament doe moste plainlie conuince whose sinnes you shall forgiue they beforgiuen he speaketh in the present tence as though he would saie as you forgiue them or reteine them ipso facto I forgiue them or reteine them And therefore sauing the honour of the Master of the sentences he had not good consideration when he did holde as some other did after him that first mans sinnes be remitted by God in his contrition and purpose to come to the sacrament and afterwarde the same remission to be declared by the priests and as it were confirmed by his approbation in confession being therein partlie deceiued by the saying of Saint Hierome before alledged whome he tooke perchaunce to haue compared in all respects the office of the olde Priest for the viewe of the vncleane and ours of the new law in the iudgement vsed vpon mans sinnes and partlie as I take it by a sentence of Saint Augustine which compared together the receiuing of Lazarus by Christ and the Disciples loosing his bandes to Christes pardoning of sinnes first and then the priests loosing the same afterward in the face of the Church This to be shorte is a peece of Saint Augustines sentence Quid ergo facit Ecclesia cui dictum est Quae solueritis in terra erunt soluta nisi quod ait Dominus soluite illum sinite abire What doth the Church then to whome it was said vhatsoeuer you loose it shall be loosed Marie she doth that which our Lorde saied loose him and let him goe Wherein Saint Augustine meaneth nothing els but that Christ is the principall agent and that he properlie doth giue life to the soull the Priest for all that beeing his seruant and minister therein and therefore by nature is a latter agent in the same worke which els as I haue prooued ioynilie perteineth to them both for that the effect of a Sacrament commeth not to any man till it be receiued except it be in certaine cases of necessitie where the parties can not obteine the externall rse of the appointed element though they earnestlie desire the same But how the olde Priests office touching the Lepers of the law representeth our sacrament of the priests ministerie in the new Testament and how farre ours which is the truth excelleth that which was but a shadow of ours Saint Chrysostome doth excellentlic declare and therewith fullie may put out of doubt all men that our Priests properlie worke remission of sinnes as ministers in the same diuine action and not as declarers or approouers of that effect which before was wrought by God himselfe Thus he saith Corporis lepram purgare seu veriùs dicam haud purgare quidem sed purgatos probare Iudaeorum sacerdotibus solis liccbat at verò nostris sacerdotibus non corporis lepram verùm animae sordes non dico purgatas probare sed purgare prorsus concessum cst Quamobrem mco iudicio qui istos despiciunt contemnuntque multò sceleratiores ac maiori supplicio digni fuerint quà m fuerit Dathan vnà cum suis omnibus That is to saie To purge the Leprosie of the bodie or ells to saie as it was in deede not to purge but to discerne who were cleane was graunted onelie to the Priests of the olde law but it is fullie graunted to our Priests not to purge the bodilie lcprosie nor to snew who are cleaner purged but vtterlie to purge the verie filth of mans soull Therefore by my iudgement whosoeuer doe contemne or despise them they are much more worthie punishment then the disobedient Dathan with all his companie Thus saith this holie Father with many wordes moe which were worthie all consideration and rememberance in this case if the matter were not so abundant that it may not suffer ouer long abode in one place lest iniurie be done to other braunches of the cause no lesse necessarie to be knowne for full vpholding the truth thereof FVLKE Your argument taken of Christs speaking in the present tense is vaine and of no force to prooue that the forgiuenes or reteining of God and man concurre in one instant For in the latter sentence of reteining the verbe is of the preterperfect tense 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but in the same sense that the verbe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the former sentence which is of the present tence proouing Gods forgiuenes to goe before mans declaration thereof The Master of the sentences is litle beholding to you that doc so flatlie condemne him of error whereas he did write nothing in this point which was not commonly receiued in the Church of Rome in his time and long after For among the articles in quibus Magister non tenetur there is
you We maruaile not why Christ hath giuen authoritie to man to forgiue sinnes whose ministerie he hath vsed in all times both by preaching his worde and by administring his sacraments to dispense his misteries vnto the rest of his Church vpon earth But that God doth not ordinarilie remit sinnes but by the ministerie of the priest nor any way ells for the moste parte but by externall acts we maruel how you are able to prooue it seeing God often times vseth many other occasions then the priests ministerie to bring men to repentance and without all waies of externall acts or sacrifices to assure men of the remission of their sinnes by faith But this admiration altogether passeth the reach of our capacitie to vnderstand how it may be conuinced That all priestes by warrant hereof may challenge all manner of interest in the gouernement of our soules It were much to challenge any interest in gouernment of our soules which is proper to our Sauiour Christ but to challenge all manner of interest in gouernment it sauoureth to stronglie of Antichristian presumption that any Christian should abide it The Apostles in exercise of their calling acknowledged them selues not onelie to be the seruants of God but also of the Church for we preach not our selues saith the Apostle but Iesus Christ and our selues to be your seruants for Iesus Christ. It is a ministerie and not a Lordeship that we must exercise not as temporall Princes who although they may be saide after a sorte to serue the common wealth yet they are so seruants as they are also Lordes But the ministers of the Church in their spirituall gouernement are seruants and not Lordes as Saint Peter testifieth therefore they cannot iustlie challenge all manner of interest in the gouernement of our soules For if they might we should haue many Lordes of our soules and denie God our onelie lorde our Lorde Iesus Christ our onelie sauiour ALLEN Much more might be said out of diuerse holie fathers much out of the decrees as well of Bishopes as Councells the authoritie wherof no Christian Catholike did euer reiect In Lateran in Florence and in Trent Councells Penance is decreed to be a sacrament and of necessitie to all such as fall into deadelie sinne after Baptisme The minister thereof by their holie determination is a Priest lawfullie ordered the remission of sins is in them all challenged to be his right not onelie by declaration that God hath or will pardon them nor by the preaching of the Gospell nor any other waies newlie deuised by the Deuill to delude Christes ordinance and misconstrue his plaine wordes But properlie is the priest prooued to be the minister vnder God of reconciliation and therefore may by his wordes absolue men in the saide sacrament of their sinnes as in Christs owne steade whose honourable iudgement seat byhis commission and the holie ghosts assistance he doth lawfullie possesse And so surelie doe Gods ministers holde this power and preheminence that no power or dignitie of man could euer be so well warranted and approoued by Gods owne worde and practize of all ages and nations christened as this is All the Princes in earth though they reigne full righteouslie can not yet shew the tenth part of the euidence that Gods priests can doe for their title of remission of sinnes and it booteth not mee in this my base state to admonish them though I hartelie wish they would consider it that the contempt of spirituall iurisdiction and the dignitie of priesthoode salleth at length to the difobedience of all temporal power and wicked contempt of ciuil gouernement also as in these disordered daies we may to our great griefe beholde when vnder pretence of religion and Gods worde whereof they haue no more respect surelie then the Deuil him selfe hath they haue disobeied not onelie Peters keies but also Cesars sworde Neither let any man thinke that where the bands of conscience the awe of gods maiestie the feare of hell and damnation the hope of heauen and saluation is remooued that there can be any ciuil obedience long Feare of man is much flatterie of man is more but bond of conscience passeth them both Thiu therefore haue Gods priests made account of their calling and long practised power of remitting and reteining the peoples offences FVLKE Whatsoeuer you can saie out of any auncient fathers will not prooue your intent of shrift and pardons your sacrament of penance is but a young beginner that can shew no auncienter councells for her authoritie then Lateran Florence and Trent the eldest of which is not much aboue 300 yeares olde and yet in the place you send vs vnto Confession is straightlie commaunded but penance is not decreed to be a sacrament Declaration of the pastour by preaching that God wil pardon al penitent sinners you count to be awaie newlie deuised by the diuil to delude Christes ordinance and misconstrue his plaine wordes as though your deuelishand blasphemous witte and tongue were hable to prooue out of Christes wordes your popish shrifts penance and satisfaction to be of Christes ordinance whereas it hath beene the doctrine and practize of all the Prophetes and Apostles to preach remission of sinnes to all that truelie repented and were turned vnto God and by authoritie of their commission receiued from God to assure all such of perfect forgiuenes of all their sinnes To compare the euidence wherby they holde this authoritie with the right of princes wherby they holde their croune so farre to preferre it is a point of antichristian and anabaptisticall presumption For ciuill Princes haue as cleere euidence in the scripture to auouch al their lawful authority as priestes haue to exercise that whereunto they be called Otherwise the particuler calling of euerie priest must leane vpon aiust title as well as the aduancement of princes into their throne and much more or els they haue not so great euidence as you talke of For a Prince being in the throne by what right soeuer he possesseth it is to be obeied But a minister of the Church except he be lawfullie called is not to be regarded You haue great cause to complaine of these daies that vnder pretense of Gods word and religion temporall and ciuill power is disobeied and contemned where there is no such manifest examples of such disobedience contempt as in your popish Northern rebellion and in an hundreth other vile attemptes to wring the scepter out of the hands of Gods anointed and your most lawful Prince vnder pretense in the Deuils name of religion and the Catholike Church But such religion and such a Church as aloweth in Italian Priest to depose anie Christian Prince from his throne God of his infinite mercie deliuer this Ileland and graunt all true subiectes of the same to yealde their faithfull obebience to their Godlie Prince not onely for feare but alfo for conscience Here it is prooued that b mitting sinnes the duety the right of the Priest
to vs. So that after that daie no sinnes mortal could ordinariely be loosed but by theÌ„ that sacrament which in their ministery he then did institute FVLKE Now you come towarde the point when you promis to let vs see how your popish confession is of Christes institution It dependeth you saie directly vpon Christes owne wordes whose sinnes you doe forgiue c. That would we faine see how For you your selfe though you make a very disorderly syliogisme cannot tel which way to infer it vpon your premises But thus you reason If Christ gaue power to Priestes to forgiue or retaine sinnes then there must needes be some subiect to their power and iudgement I answere you that euery power draweth not a iudgement with it and therefore you foist in the word iudgement vnreasonablie although I graunt also a kinde of iudgement vnto them and that men are subiect to this power and iudegment of the ministers by whome is declared the infallible sentence of God Then saie you it is a cleare case that in the verie same words that power was deliuered to them the bond of obedience was also prescribed to vs. Of what obedience I pray you that we should obay them in any thing they shal speake or only when they speake in the word of the Lord If the latter only for no man wil graunt the former shew vs if you be able the Lords word and commaundement for sacramental confessoÌ„ as you terme it to be necessary Your conclusion hangeth as wel by your premises as confession dependeh vpon Christs words That after that date no sins mortall could ordinarilie be loosed 〈◊〉 by them and in that sacrament which in their ministery he then did institute All sin is mortall and deseruing death The wages of sinne saith the Apostle is death But your conclusion is confuted by your selfe afterward graunting sinnes to be remitted by baptisme and as for other sacraments I dare saie you will not exempt them but that sinnes are forgiuen by them And that which is the chiefe matter in controuersie namelie that a sacrament was there and then instituted you alwaies affirme but neuer are able to prooue And whereas you affirme that the necessitie of auricular confession standeth not vpon positiue lawes but by Christes institution it is maruell that this institution should so manie hundreth yeares be vnknowne in the Church The Master of the sentences can saie nothing for it but alledgeth diuers authorities to and froe and in the end hath no certaine argument to perswade vs that it is of Christes institution Gratian likewise in his decrees after diuers testimonies producted on both sides whether it be necessarie or no concludeth in these words Quib authoritatibus vel quibuslibetrationum firmamentis vtroque sententia satisfactionis confessionis innitatur in medium breuiter exposuimus cui autem harum 〈◊〉 adhaerendum sit 〈◊〉 is iudicio referatur viraque enim 〈◊〉 habet sarientes religi osor viros Vpon what authorites and what fundations of reasons both the iudgement of satisfaction and confession doth leane we haue briefely brought forth and declared But to whether of these we ought chieflie to sticke it is reserued to the iudgement of the reader for either of both opinions hath wise and religious men fauorers of it If the Romish Church in Gratianstime had receiued the opinion of the necessitie of shrift to a Priest to be grounded vpon the institution of Christ neither he nor the Master of the sentences would haue bin in such a mamering about it wherfore it appeereth to be but young ware the institution whereof was so vncertaine to those principal pillers of popery In so much that the glosse vpoÌ„ the 5. aistinct In penitentia was bolde to vtter these wordes which should haue prooued him an heretike if the popish Churh in his time had held that confession was of Christs institution and not vpon any positiue laws In hac distinctione in aliis duabus sequentibus agitur 〈◊〉 de illa parte poenitentiae que dicitur oris confessio operis satisfactio quà m de aliis ider videndum est 〈◊〉 oris confessio fuerit instituta virum necessaria sit vel 〈◊〉 voluntaria qualiter sit facienda cui et quando dicunt quidam institutam fuisse in Paradiso 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 peccatum dicente Donino ad Adam Adam 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ideo enim 〈◊〉 vt ipso conficente peccatum 〈◊〉 sorma aliis in posterum confitendi Sed quoniam in ille interrogatione dominus minùs expressè videbatur adconfirendum 〈◊〉 idro post exquisiuit á Cain fratricida expressiâ—s vbi est Abel frater tuus Alij dicunt quód sub lege primò instituta quando Iosua percepit Aâ—hor â—rimen sâ—um confiteri â—â— lapidatus est 45. dist secundum illud Alij dicunt quód in Novo testamento á Iacobo dicente consitemini alterâ—â—â—um peccata vestra c. Sed melius dicitur eam institutam fuisse a quâ—dâ—m vniuersale Ecclesiae traditione potius quám ex nouo vel veteri testamento authoritâ—s traditio Ecclesiae obligatoria est vt preceptum ait 1.1 di in his rebus Ergo necessaria est confessio in mortalib apud nos apud graecos non quoniam non emanauit apud illos traditio talis 〈◊〉 nec confisiunt in 〈◊〉 sed in firmentatis 5. di cap. 1. si illud ergo 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 alteruâ—rum peccata vestra 〈◊〉 consilium primó aliâ—â—uin liâ—oret et Grecos non obstanto eorâ—â— consuetudine In this distinction and the other two that follow it is intreated as well of that part of penance that is called confession of the mouth and satisfaction of the worke as of other partes And therefore it is to be seene when confession of the mouth was instituted whether it be necessarie or onelie voluntarie How it is to be made and to whome when Some say it was instituted in paradise immediately after sin committed when the Lord saide vnto Adam Adam where are thou for therefore he enquired that he confessing his sinne a forme of confessing should be giuen to others afterwarde But because in that confession the Lord secmed not so expresselie to haue warned him to confession therefore he enquired afterward of Cain the murtherer of his brother more expresselie where is Abel thy brother Other say it was first instituted vnder the law where Iosua commaunded Achar to confesse his fault and he was stoned 45. di sed illud Other saie that it was instituted in the new Testament by Saint Iames saying confesse your sinnes c. But it is better to saie that it was institutad by a certaine vniuersal tradition of the Church rather then by authoritie out of the new or olde testament And the tradition of the Church is of authoritie to binde as it is commaunded ar 11. di in these things Therefore confession in mortal sinnes is necessarie with vs but not with the Greekes because such tradition hath
place of Saint Matthew spoken first and principallie to Saint Peter and then to other Apostles vniuersallie Now if anie list be assured by the Doctours interpretation that the wordes of our Sauiour of binding and loosing doe directlie giue power to the pastours of his Church to punish the offenders and release their sentence of seueritie againe let them read Saint Augustines 75. Epistle where they shall finde much of this matter and thus amongst other thinges spiritalis poena de qua scriptum est Quae ligaueritis in terra erunt ligata in coelo ipsas animas obligat The spirituall punishment whereof Christ spake when he said what-soeuer you binde in earth it shall be bound in heauen do fast binde the soules themselues And Saint Chrysostome disputing excellently vpon these wordes of binding or loosing compareth the iurisdiction of Princes temporall vnto the spirituall power herein and maketh this to excell that as farre as heauen passeth the earth and the soule in dignitie surmounteth the bodie If anie King saieth Chrysostome should giue vnto some subiect such authoritie vnder him that whome whosoeuer he would he might cast into prison and againe release him when he list all men would account that subiect moste happie But he that hath receiued not of an earthlie King but of God him selfe a power that passeth that other as farre as heauen is from the earth and the soule excelleth the bodie I trow him euerie man must both wonder at and highlie reuerence Thus farre said the Doctor acknowledging that as some by Princes grauntes maie prison or pardon the bodies so the Priestes maie punish mens soules and loose or pardon them againe For the proofe whereof he applieth fitlie both the woordes of Christ spoken to S. Peter aud the like afterward to all the Apostles concerning binding and loosing FVLKE Whether all the bands of the Church be medicinable if the partie list to take them Doctors doe dour seing there is a sin vnto death not to be praied for And S. Paul layed such a band vpon Alexander the copper smith that he desired the Lord to requit him according to his workes which could be no lesse then eternall damnation without hope of true and faithfull repentance for which Esaw found no place though he sought the blessing with teares For true repentance is not a matter of mens list but an excellent gift of God That case excepted it is out of question that the Church hath power as well to loose as to binde what or whome soeuer and God in heauen doth ratifie that which the Church vpon good cause doth on earth And therefore to prooue this whereof there is no doubt there needed neither Ambrose Augustine nor Chrysostmes authoritie to be cited except it be to shew how prodigall you are of proofe where there is no neede and howe drie and barren where there is most necessitie vnlesse you will haue your wordes and sayings go without al warrantize as euen in this section that this power or iurisdiction as you call it is giuen principallie to Peter that the sacrament of penance is grounded vpon Christes words spoken to his Apostles after his resurrectiō which of the Doctors affirmeth Contrariwise Chrysostome in the place by you cited as you your selfe confesse doth fitlie applie the words of Christ spoken to Saint Peter and the like to al the Apostles concerning binding and loosing vnto all priests alike therefore no principalitie in Peter For these and such like matters of controuersie the Doctors serue not your true but you would haue the ignorant suppose that as you can cite the Doctors full and direct for manie thinges whereof we doe not contend so in all matters of contention the Doctors are full on your side But if anie papist haue but halfe an eie he will or maie espie your insirmitie though you doe neuer so cunninglie dissemble it ALLEN Againe Saint Cyprian and other holy bishoppes of Affrike which had inioyned long penance to certaine that had fallen in time of persecution from their faith for flatterie or feare of the worlde and had thought to haue giuen them anie Indulgences peace or pardon for that then they called dare pacem which we now tearme to giue a Pardon til the houre of death came Statueramus saie they vt agerent diu plenam poenitentiam we had verilie determined that they should haue done out all their full inioyned penance but now vpon other great respectes we doe agree to giue peace of pardon to those that haue earnestlie done some penance alreadie and lamented bitterlie their former fall But marke well here by what authoritie they chalenge this power and what they doe chalenge They chalenge pardie power to giue penance to the offenders and they claime by right the release thereof Againe they clearelie take vpon them in consideration of the fault to inloine what they list and how long they list and vpon like iust respect by their wisdomes to pardon some peece of the same againe either after death or else if good matter mooue them long before But by what Scripture doe they claime such iurisdiction that they maie giue discipline to offenders euen without the 〈◊〉 of penance onelie by their iurisdiction and right of regiment and then by their onelie letters to giue them in absence peace and pardon of their inioyned penance againe Saint Cyprian and all his honorable fellowes shall answere you in the same place for there they giue a reason of that their proper right Quia ipsepermisit qui legem dedit vt ligata in 〈◊〉 is etiam in coelo ligata essent solui autem possent illic qui hic prius in Ecclesia soluerentur That is to saie he doth permit vs who made this lawe that whatsoeuer we bound on earth should be bound in heauen and those thinges should be loosed in heauē aboue which the Church here beneath releaseth before Let vs therefore be bolde also to answere our aduersaries with the said holie Fathers if they aske vs by what right the Pope or Bishoppe giue pardon or what is that he doth forgiue by his pardon let vs answere for them and for our Mother the Church that they pardon onelie the penance inioyned or other paine due for greeuous sinnes after they be remitted in the sacrament of penance And that they maie so doe by good authoritie we alleadge Christes owne worthines with the named holie Fathers whatsoeuer you binde in earth it shal be bound in heauen and if you loose it in earth before it shall also be released in heauen But vpon this practise of Gods Church I will charge them further hereafter FVLKE This authoritie of Saint Cyprian is no more necessarie then the former of Chrisostome Augustine Ambrose For we doubt not but the Church with the gouernours thereof haue sufficient power by Christes graunt to release such time of penance or parte therof as is enioyned to offenders to prooue their repentance and to
giuing pardons I will recite the saying of S. Clement him selfe in time the Apostles equall expert in their regement and priuie to al their doings He liuelie expresseth the dignity of the chiefe pastours power of their gouernment vnto which he applieth the power of binding and loosing in such sort as we haue said But heare his owne wordes as Carolus Bouius hath translatedthë O Episcope stude munditie operum excellere cognoscens locum tuum ac dignitatem tanquam locum Dei obtinens eò quod praees omnib Dominis Sacerdotib Regib Principih patrib filiis magistris atque subditis simul omnib sicque in Ecclesia sede cùm sermomen facies vt potestatem habens iudicandi eos qui peccauerunt quoniam vobis Episcopis dictum est quodcunque ligaueritis super terram erit ligatum in coelo quodcunque solueritis super terram erit solutum in coelo Iudica igitur o Episcope cum potestate tanquam Deus sed poenitentes recipe In English O thou that art a Bishop studie and endeuoure to excell other in the beutie of good works in respect of thy place dignitie consider thou sittest in Gods owne roome being promoted aboue al Lords Priestes Kinges Princes Parentes children Masters seruants euerie one Therfore so sit in the Church when thou doest speake as one that hath power to iudge al those that haue sinned For to you Bishops it was said whatsoeuer you binde in earth it shal be bound in heauen and whatsoeuer you shall loose in earth it shal be loosed in heauen Iudge then O Bishop with power and maiestie as God but yet haue mercie on the penitent Thus saith S. Clement By whose wordes you may preceiue Gods right to be in a manner conferred vpon his ministers by the tearmes of binding losing not onlie giuen for the remitting or retaining of sins in the sacrament of penance but also for the correcting or giuing pardon by supreame iurisdiction out of the said sacrament FVLKE And now to make vp a number and a shew of antiquity S Clements constitution is alledged which is neither authenticall nor any thing to the purpose in controuersie if it were as auntient as he whose name it beareth For watsoeuer is said in this whole clause if it be rightly vnderstood is true of the dignitie of Bishops in their spirituall authoritie and power of preaching the worde and exercising of discipline But for that blasphe mous conclusion that you draw out of it Gods right to be in a manner conferred vpon his ministers by the tearmes of binding and loosing with the rest that followeth can neuer be gathered of these premises Gods right remaineth whole and absolute vnto him selfe for any power of binding or losing that he hath committed to his seruantes As for the sacrament of penance and giuing pardon by supreame iurisdiction out of the said sacrament how can they be deduced out of the wordes of this pretended Clemens ALLEN Now then let Caluine or his auncient Luther come sorth and denie all spirituall iurisdiction of holie Bishops touching temporall punishment or release of paines appointed for sinnelet them writh the plaine place both of binding and loosing to the preaching of the ghospel as their fashion is rather thē they would graunt this soueraignty to the Church of Christ let them saie that Christ when he whipped out the vnlawfull occupiers of marchandies in the temple did nothing else but preach the Gospell let them hold that this was a sermon and not an act of iurisdiction when he said to diuers thy sins be forgiuen thee or when he with power and terror gaue to Iudas the soppe by which it is thought that he excommunicated him and gaue him vp whollie to the Deuill and seperated him from the companie of the Apostles and from his Church For then the Deuill entred into him and he went out as the gospell saieth But saie Master Luther was this the power of preaching only or an exercise of moste high iurisdiction giuen him of his father euerlasting as he was he head of the Church No no vaine fellowes this is no preaching which you would haue onelie to be the Churches propertie that you might being void of all other authoritie in Gods Church compare with his Apostles in your prating because your glorie amongst the people standeth on your glafe tongues Cores had a ticling tongue and Moses tongue was tied yet God gaue sentence on his seruants side and reuenged the disobedience of the contrarie No no I tellyou if all the Bishoppes and Priestes of the Christian world were as rude as simple in their preaching as you thinke your selues eloquent yet their onelie iurisdiction and Maiestie of their power assisted by Christ perpetuallie by whome it was giuen them shall beare you downe and your vaine name of preaching the word And God be thanked beside the right of the cause there be in the Churchmany that are honoured with the gift of true preaching to whome God giucth the worde in deed with great and vnspeakeable force and encrease of the truth and daily decaie of your vaine shade of preaching His name be blessed for euer that hath giuen such a guard to his Church that hell gates nor the eloquence neither of man not Angell shall preuaile against her FVLXE Now then let Allen or al his auncients punies the papists in Rome or Rhemes shew out of either Caluines or Luthers writings anie place where they or either of them denied all power of binding and loosing other then by preaching of the gospell where they affirmed that excommunication and receiuing againe into the Church was nothing but preaching of the gospell If Allen be not able to prooue with all his complices that Caluine and Luther denied the discipline of the Church or haue not established the same in the Churches by them reformed then is he an impudent slaunderer and detestable deceiuer to beare simple men in hand that they acknowledge not discipline either in binding or in releasing of open offendours but preaching of the gospel His further storming and malitious rayling as also his vaine bragging and threatening I passe ouer as vnworthie of anie other answere then silence as bewraying sufficientlie the sincerity wisdome honesty of the author Neither wil I disrusse that waighty argument of giuing the soppe to Iudas whereby the prooueth the exercise of Christes iurisdiction as head of the Church Wise men may easely see what arguments he hath to prooue things in question when he hath no better demonstration of a matter out of all controuersie The Apostles bishops haue euer besides the preaching of the Gospel punished mens sinens and practized iudgement vpon mens soules both in binding loosing THE 5. CHAP. ALLEN CHrist then hauing not only the preaching of the Gospel to punish pardon by but iurisdiction also to giue discipline and to release the same in that he was made the supreame gouernour of al Christian people did
dare saie of all other actes that be exercised in Christes name in the Church doth not onelie no whit abase Gods excellency but was purposelie instituted to honour the maiestie of God in the face of all people and to set out the glorie of his house how dare any man for feare of Gods high indignation controlle the worke of Christ in remitting mans sinnes by such a visible sacrament as to the honour of God is most conuenient and to our saluation most necessarie If they will not let pristes remit sinnes for feare of offending God and dishonouring his name then let them not baptize not preach not teach not doe miracles not giue the holie ghost not correct faultes not giue orders nor doe any other functions For these euerie one be no lesse proper to God then remission of sinnes FVLKE You ground your argument vpon a sacrament before you haue prooued any The power of remitting sinnes is graunted to be perpetual in the Church and nothing derogatorie to the honour of God But that there is any other sacrament whereby men are assured of the forgiuenes of their sinnes by any externall ceremonie except the sacraments of Baptisme and of the Lordes supper which is the cheife matter in controuersie you goe not once about to prooue If Christs Church were like your Popish Church wherein all thinges are taught by Images dumme ceremonies and the worde of God neuerpreached it might come to passe as you say that it would be forgotten that such power is giuen by God to Christ. But in the Church of God many thinges are remembered by meanes of preaching the Gospell and word of God whereof there is no visible sacrament or ceremony although to helpe our weakenes the mercy of God hath by his sacraments sealed vp the moste necessarie and generail pointes of doctrine of our regeneration to be the Children of God and of our spirituall feeding or norishment to continue vs perpetuallie in the same But whereas you saie that if both sinnes of mans soull and sores of his bodie could not visiblie by externall meanes he healed in the glorious inuoration of Gods name it would surclie be forgottenin the Church of Christ that such power is giuen by God the father to his onelie sonne c. I praie you what externall meanes haue you visiblie to heale the sores of mans bodie by inuocation of Gods name lest it should be forgotten in the Church that the father hath giuen such power to his sonne Will you now send vs to the mocke miracles lying signes regestred in your Legendes wrought at your pilgramages Idolls or in an other worlde by the Iapponical Iesuites These because they are not seene mooue nothing the inwarde man whose minde you saie ful learnedlie will not reach to that inwardelie whereof he hath no proofe nor assurance outwardelie As though faith were not a substance of things that are hoped for and an euidence of things that are not seene Where of the minde of man hath no assurance outwardelie For the sacramentall seales but by faith make no assurance outwardelie Can I gather an assurance but by faith of Gods promise that my bodie being washed outwardelie my soull is clensed inwardelie Is it the receiuing of the outward elements in the Lordes supper that assureth me of my spirituall nourishment to eternall life or faith graunted vpon the worde which comming to the elements maketh them the seales of assurance of gods promises The question you aske of the Prophets foreseeing of things so long before things that afterwarde did fall whether it was graunted with dishonour of God or to his glorie I answere that the propertie of God alone to whome all things are present was not ne could not be communicated to men But God to his glorie by the instrument of their mouth did foreshew those things which he had reuealed vnto thē by his spirit in prophetical vision or dreame Neither could Elizeus see the heart inward thoughts of Gihezei his seruant which is gods onelie propertie but God did reueale and declare vnto him what hipocrisie was hid in the heart of Gihezei so that Elizeus knew no more properlie what was in the heart of Gihezei then any other man to whome Gihezei him-selfe might open his thoughtes sauing that Elizeus knew more certenlie and by 2 more wonderfull meane For to man Gihezei might ly but god who onely searcheth the heart the reines reuealed the truth to Elizeus Neither was Peter and the rest hable by laying on of handes to giue the holy ghost that is the visible gists of the holv ghost but according to gods good pleasure will For Acts. 8. Peter and Iohn sent by the Apostles into Samaria praied for them that were baptized that they might receiue the holie Ghost and after laide their hands vpon them and they receiued from god the sensible graces of the holie ghost as speaking with tongues interpretation of tongues healing of sicknes casting out of deuills and such like Therefore in such wonderfull effects as followed laying on of hands nothing that is most proper to god passed to men But it pleased God who is the onelie author of such graces and gifts to bestow the same by his faithfull stewards at their praier whereunto they were mooued and assisted by him and with that visible sacrament or ceremonie But such ceremonies we haue not for remission of sinnes or reteining of them by Gods institution Therefore no sacrament but a doctrine of remitting or reteining of sinnes ALLEN O heresie most shamefull that then goeth about to dishonour God most when she most pretendeth gods honour whereof shee is so tender and so carefull that shee hath barred his owne spouse of his blessed bodie of remission of sinnes of the spirit of God of all sacraments of all holie ceremonies of memories of miracles of all holie functions and to be short of all gifts and graces and all this for Gods honour so honourable a thing it is for Christ to be the king of so beggerlie a common wealth as they make of the Church such glorie it is for Christ to haue his onelie spouse robbed of the treasures of his giftes and graces so comelie it is for Christ to haue such sacraments as neither conteine him-selfe nor his grace so worthie a thing it is for Christ to haue ministers that vpon his owne warrant can neither pardon nor punish mans misdeedes Gloriosa dicta sunt de te Ciuitas Dei Glorious thinges haue beene reported of thee thou Citie of God and how arte thou now so barrenne and so contemptible that thy honour must needes redound to the dishonour of him by whome all thy honour onelie standeth But I cease to pursue the Churchces enemies now in mine owne wordes I will rather ioyne with the holie fathers for their ouerthrow whose not onelie reason and sufficient answere to this their vaine replie founded on the pretence of Gods honour but also their onelie
name and authoritie shall sufficientlie beate downe these mens boldnes Saint Ambrose in this case is moste plaine and standeth with the Nouatians as I doe now with the Zuinglians euen in the verie same argument in these wordes Sed aiunt se Domino deferre reuerentiam cui soli remittend orum oriminum potestatem reseruent imò nulli maiorem iniuriam faciunt quà m qui eius volunt mandata res indere commissum munus refindere nam cùm ipse in Euangelis suo dixerit Dominus Iesus accipite Spiritum sanctum quorum remiseritis peccata c. quis est ergo qui magis honorat Vtrum qui mandat is attemperat an qui resistit Ecclesia in vtroque seruat obedientiam vt peccatism alliget laxat That is to saie These Nouatians saie that they denie penance or power to remit sinnes in earth in respect of the maintenance of such honour as is due to God to whome onely they will reserue the pardoning of mans sinnes But in deede none doe so much iniury to Gods glory as those which breake his commaundements and make a diuision of that charge and commission which he giueth For seeing our Lord Iesus by his owne mouth spake these words Receiue ye the holy ghost whose sinnes you doe forgiue they be forgiuen and whose sinnes you holde they beholden who in this case more honoureth God He that obeieth his commaundement or he that resisteth the same The Church obeieth in both as well in binding as in loosing Thus there And a litle after Looke to whome this charge was giuen and that person may lawfullie and with Gods good leaue vse the same Au l therefore the Church may lawfullie both binde and loose heresie and her attendants can rightlie doe neither This right is onelie committed to priests and therefore the Church rightlie challengeth that authoritie because shee hath lawfull priests and so heresie cannot doe because shee hath not the priests of God in her cursed congregation Thus said Saint Ambrose for the answere of the Nouatians in his daies and so say I now in the Churches behalfe against the like affected enemies of Christs honour which whiles they in face of scripture and Gods word would seeme to defend they are become sworne aduersaries of his honour and open contemners of his commaundements and holy ordinance Saint Ambrose here taketh it for a ground that it is Gods ordinance that Priests should remit sinnes he is bolde to call the contrarie doctrine heresie he maketh a principle of this that it neuer dishonoureth God that man should doe that which God giueth him either commaundement or commission to doe in his behalfe he taketh it for a knowne trueth that as the Church of God hath true and lawfull priests so shee may by them vpon Christes warrant bath loose and binde and contrariwise that heresie may well enough giue ouer that right of remission of sinnes because shee hath lightlie no lawfull priests by whome shee may practize the same FVLKE First you make a vaine exclamation or outcrie as though heresie hath spoiled the Church of her treasures vnder pretence of Gods glorie but such rhetoricall vamties all wise men will deride The Church is not spoiled of her treasures when neither Christ nor his grace is conteined in the sacraments but when Christ her onelie treasure is spoiled of his glorie of sole redemption and fatisfaction for our sinnes or of any other parte of the office that belongeth to the mediator Therefore it is her greatest honour that Christ may haue his true honour in whome with whome she hath al things not to the glory of flesh bloode but to the glorie of God to whome all glorie of right belongeth what Saint Ambrose did write against the Nouatians pertaineth not to vs who denie neither the power of remitting nor of reteining of sinnes but graunt both But that Saint Ambrose did not meane of such a power as the Papists doe claime I haue shewed before out of his owne wordes in the same place where he saieth that our Lord hath chosen such Disciples as should be interpreters of their Lordes will This power is graunted to all true ministers of the Church that they are the Legates or embassadors of god to declare his wil pleasure vnto men aswel for remitting as for reteining of sins And therefore Nouatus or Nouatianus did very absurdlie by Saint Ambrose his iudgement that did arrogate vnto himselfe power to reteine sinnes while he pronounced that they which fell into Idolatrie after Baptisme might not be receiued into the Church vpon any trial of their repentance and would not yeald that the ministers of the Church by the same authoritie might pronounce that they which were truelie penitent of their former wicked behauiour were forgiuen in the iudgement of God which was to remit their sins vpon earth with faith in Gods promise that they shall be forgiuen in heauen Thus the answere of Saint Ambrose vnto the Nouatians doth nothing in the world make against vs which denie no power that Christ hath graunted to his Church vnder collour of maintenance of Gods honour ALLEN And surelie it is a maruclous force of trueth or rather the might of Gods prouidence that driueth Heretikes to disdaine destroie and dissanull the graces and manifold giftes of Christes Church that impugning them where the verie right of such holie actes doe lie they may plainlte confesse and to their shame acknowledge that they haue none such themselues nor cannot by Gods warrant challenge any such giftes which with all their might they would wholie if they could together with Gods spirit and Church extinguish Alas into what miserie hath this forfaken flocke willfullie cast them selues and their adherentes which can forsake Gods house vbi mandauit Dominus benedictionem vpon which God hath bestowed his blessing abide there where by their owne confession there is no Priesthood no penance no host no sacrifice no remission where they can let of sinnes no grace in sacramentes nor no gift of the holie Ghost All other herisies lightlie by force of the Fathers Doctrine and iudgement lost either their Priesthood because they had no waie out of the Church to make Priestes as Saint Hierome writeth of Hilarie the Deacon or els the vse and function of Priesthood by reason the workes of God cannot be orderly nor benefi iallie vsed out of the house of God and yet they euer claimed to themselues not onlie the order but for moste parte all other functions that by Christ and his Church were annexed to that order but ours wherein they passe all their forefathers in a manner willinglie giue ouer the wholl profession freelie and without compulsion denie them selues with Nouatus to be priestes denie to sacrifice denie to enioyne penance denie to giue the holie ghost either by imposition of handes or by Chrisme or by any other solemne right of Gods Church To be short take nothing from these fellowes that belongeth