wil declare and I shal endeuour to put yow in mynd therof now and then when I passe by it Hierome said as Bishop Iewel alleadgeth that in suspition of heresie no man must be pacient Iewel is aleadged heere with more honour then Hierome Iewel is named Bishop which he neuer was and Hierome is not called Saint which he was and is no place in eyther of them is cyted where the words may be read Hierome speaketh of heresy not of flatterie S.F. would excuse himselfe of flatterie not of heresy for in heresy he delighteth and how then do these things agree and if for further proofe I should aske him whether he or M. Iewel wil stand to S. Hieromes definition of heresy and hereticks euen in those very books where he hath this sentence of impacieÌ„ce against heresie to wit in those he wrote against Iouianus and Vigilantius whom he condemneth and calleth heretiks for the very same opinions that Sir F. M. Iewel do hold for ghospelyke good doctrine Heretikes out vvith S. Hierome I meane about Virginitie prayer to Saynts lights at Martyrs â—ombes and the like If I should aske them I say this questioÌ„ whether they would staÌ„d to S. Hieromes definitioÌ„ of an heretik all the worâ—d seeth they would fly froÌ„ it for so muche as he calleth them hereticks for holding those protestantical opinions contrarie to the vniuersal consent of the catholike Churche in those dayes as our men do at this day and how then do they alleadge S. Hierome in matter of heresie as though he were there frend or fauored them But to let passe this matter of heresie out of S. Hierome whom in deed of all Fathers they least can beare and do cal him often both borne papist and scoulding doctor Ievvel against D. Harding Fulke against D. Allen and D. Bâ—istovv Let vs see in particular what our knight answereth to the charge of flatteâ—ie for making EnglaÌ„d so happie by change of Religion Diuers shiftes of S. F. for his defence whervnto he deuiseth diuers defences for first he alleadgeth very solemnely the sentence of Antistenes and of some other Philosophers in reprehension of flatterie but what proueth this or what is this to the purpose nay rather is it not much more against himselfe if he cleare not wel the charge of flatterie layd vnto him for that the more Poets or Philosophers or other Authors do condemne flatterie the more is the K. condemnation also if he be found faulty therin Wherfore this first dedefence is no defence but impertinent wasting of words as yow see let vs behold his second which perhaps may proue worse or more impertinent then this His second defence is that greater flatterie may be found in Rome to the Pope then he vseth to the Queene and state of England I would send yow sayth he to the Popes pallace where a man may fynd more shameles flatterers then I thinke were euer to be found in any Christian Princes Court VVast-vvord Pag. 5. Wel suppose it were so Syr what doth this excuse yow why should a knight flatter in England for that a Courtier or Canonist doth flatter in Rome Yow know that company in euel doing excuseth not nor dedemâ—nâ—sheth the synne and S. Hierome whom yow alleadge sayth Hieron in Epist. ad caelantiam nihil agimus cum nos per multitudinis exempla defendimus we labour in vaine wheÌ„ we go about to defend our selues by the example of the multitude this in case it were as yow say but how do yow proue it Syr harken gentle Reader and heare his wordes Panormitan sayth he as by sundry learned men he is aleadged shameth not to flatter your Pope so farre VVast vvord Pag. 6. as to make him almost aequal with God saying Eccepto peccato Papa potest quasi omnia facere quae Deus potest Synne excepted the Pope can in a manner do all things that God can doe Thus sayth our knight wherin I would aske him first why he had not cyted the worke or booke of PanormitaÌ„ or at leastwyes some one of those learned men of his syde by whom he sayth that Panormitan is alleadged if he omitted the citation by negligence it was great ouersight in so weightie a matter if of wil and purpose it was fraud if he red noâ— the Authors himself but trusted Ministers notebookes it was lightnes and simplicite if his learned men that aleage Panormitan and accuse him as he doth do not cyte or quote the place no more then he it is the same fault in them and a signe that they are afraid to be taken tripping and this complaint I shal be forced to make often for that this shifte is ordinary among them not to cyte their Authors But now to the matter it self I say that after muche seeking in Panormitan Panorm part 1. decret de Elect. c. Licet I haue found at length the place and therein the woords by him and his alleaged but with this difference that Panormitan cyteth the sentence not as his owne but out of Hostiensis and sheweth the meaning to be that in matters of iurisdiction and spiritual authoritie for gouernmeÌ„t of his Churche vpon earth Christ hath lefte so great power vnto his substitute S. Peters successor as he may do thereby and in his name and vertue in a certayne sorte what-so-euer his Mayster and Lord might do in his Church if he were now conuersant among vs vpon earth I say in a certaine sort for that all both Deuines and Canonists do agree that potestas excellentiae wherby our Sauiour could institute Sacraments pardon synnes and impart the other effects of thesayd Sacraments without their vse and the like is not lefte vnto the Pope as not necessarie to the gouernment of his Churche but all the rest requisit to that end is gyuen to him according to that great commission in S. Mathew Matth. 16. I wil giue vnto thee the keyes of the kingdome of heauen whatsoeuer thow loosest shal be loosed and what soeuer thow byndest shal be bound c. vpon which commission Panormitan saith that Hostiensis founded his doctrine in these wordes Host. in c. Quanto de translat Episcoporum Panorm sup part 1. decret de Elect. cap. venerabilem Cum idem sit Christi atque Papae consistorium quasi omnia potest facere Papa quae Christus excepto peccato Seing that the Consistorie or Tribunal of Christ and the Pope is one and the same in this world as appeareth by the former commission it followeth that the Pope can do in spiritual iurisdiction whatsoeuer Christ can doe except lyuing free from synne This is the doctrine of Hostiensis expounded by Panormitan Panormitan and HostieÌ„â—is both abused and if it be rightly vnderstood it hath no more absurditie in it then if a man should say that the Viceroy of Naples can do all in that Kingdome which the king of Spaine himself can doe except being free from
reader should learne by proof and experience of the things themselues here to be handled then by my spech I wil proceed no further but remit my self to the insuing treateses beseeching almighty God that all this may redound to his glory and to their good for whose spiritual benefit I haue most willingly taken this smalle playnes Your harty freend that wisheth your greatest good N. D. THE FIRST TABLE OF THE PREAMBLES AND CHAPTERS CONTEYNED IN these two Encounters The first Encounter AN answere to a certayne vayne and arrogant Epistle of O.E. Minister vnto N.D. author of the Wardword Certayne breef notes and obseruations vpon S. F. Hastings Epistle to the Christian Reader Other obseruations vpon the Praeface of O.E. to the Reader conteyning a ful answere ther vnto A brief Summary of all that before hath byn sayd or now is to be added about this first Encounter of blessings and cursings by change of Cath. religion Cap. 1. Of the first charge of flattering the State of England laid to S.F. and of his owne coÌ„tradiction to himself therin about the deuised blessings of his new gospel Cap. 2. Proctor O. E. is called vp the stage to tel his tale and to help out S.F. in this matter of flattering the State and how he playeth his part far worse and more ridiculously then the knight himself Cap. 3. Often new blessings deuised and brought in by S. F. as peculiar to his gospel wherof the first is vnion in doctrine tearmed by him vnity in verity And how false vayne this is Cap. 4. The same matter is prosecuted and the dis-vnion of Protestants is prooued declared by diuers other meanes out of their owne books and wrytings especially of forrayne protestants Lutherans Zwinglians and Caluinists Cap. 5. The continuation of thesame narration about vnity in verity among riged and soft Caluinists named protestants and Puritans in England and Scotland Cap. 6. An answere to three fond obiections or interrogations of S.F. with an addition about O.E. Cap. 7. Of the second and third blessings which are reading of scriptures and publyke seruice in English Cap. 8. The second part of the answere about Churche seruice in English conteyning some authorities alleadged for it buâ— much corrupted and abused by the knight Cap. 9. Of the fourth and fifth blessings affirmed to haue byn brought in by Protestants which are aboundance of good works and fredome from persecution Cap. 10. Of the other fiue imagined blessings that remayne to wit deliuerance from exactions long peace povver in forrayne contreys vvelth of the land and multitude of subiects increased Cap. 11. How the contrary effects to blessings that is to say of cursings rather and calamities brought in by chaÌ„ge of Religion both spiritual and temporal and how S. F. and his minister do answere them Cap. 12. What Proctor O. E. sayth to this matter of cursings how absurdly he behaueth himself therin Cap. 13. That Protestants haue not only no agreement or vnity among themselues in matters of religion but also are depriued of all sure meanes and certayne rule wherby to attayne ther-vnto Cap. 14. What O. E. answereth to the former chapter about diuision and vncertainty in religion Cap. 15. Of the English rule of beleef set downe by O. E. and what substance or certainty it hath and how they do vse it for excluding puritans and other protestants And of diuers shamful shifts of O.E. Cap. 16. It is further shewed by diuers cleere examples that O. E. and his fellowes do plainly dispaire of all certayne meane or rule to try the truthe among themselues or with vs. Cap. 17. Of the fruits vertue and good works that haue followed by change of religion as also of eight temporal inconueniences which may be called curses or maledictions insued by the same And how O. E. behaueth himself in this controuersy Cap. 18. The Warning or admonition to S.F. Hastings and his frends as also to his aduocate and Proctor O. E. vpon this first Encounter of blessings Cap. 19. The second Encounter The summe of that which before was set downe betwene the Watch-man and the Warder Cap. 1. About the general charge of false dealing layd to S. F. in this Encounter and how euil he auoydeth thesame by committing new falshoods and treacheries Cap. 2. How long the Cath. Roman religion hath florished in England and of the authority of S. Bede and Arnobius abused by S.F. togeather with a comparison examined betweene our learned men and those of the Protestants And first of Iohn Husse bragged of by S. Francis Cap. 3. Of the learning and glorious disputations of Martyn Luther Symon Grinaeus Peter Martyr Beza and other Protestants boasted of by our knight Cap. 4. Of two notable vntruthes laid vnto S. F. his charge for a preface by the Warder before he come to the foure â—eigned positions And how the knight defendeth himself therin Cap. 5. The examination of that which O. E. hath written concerning the former points handled in the precedent fiue Chapters and that it is farre more impertinent and desperate then that which the knight himself hath answered Cap. 6. The second part of this Encounter conteyning foure absurd grounds of Cath. religion feigned by S. F. And first whether ignorance be the mother of deuotion as also about the controuersy of Fides explicita and implicita Cap. 7. The minister O.F. is called vpon to help out his knight in defence of this first forged position And how he performeth thesame Cap. 8. Of the second forged principle that lay-men must not meedle in matters of religion wherin is handled againe the matter of â—eading scriptures in English and why the Cat. Churche doth forbid some books purge others c. 9. About S. Thomas of Canterbury whether he were a traytor or no as malitiously he is called by S.F. O.E. his minister how notorious impostures both they and Fox do vse to disgrace him against the testimony of all ancient wryters Cap. 10. Of S. Thomas his miracles what may be thought of them and other such lyke with the malitious corruption falshood vsed by Iohn Fox S.F. to discredit them There is handled also the different manner of Canonizing saincts in their and our Churche Cap 11. The third forged position wherby Catholyks are said to hold that the Pope or any coming fâ—om him is to be obeyed though he command blasphemies against God disloyalties against Princes Cap. 12. The former matters are disputed with the minister O. E. especially whether Popes do commaund blasphemies against God and disloyalties against Princes and whether Popes may in some causes be repreheÌ„â—ed by their subiects and how falsly the minister behaueth himself in all these points Cap. 13. About the fourth forged principle wherby Catholyks are sayd to vse pardons for their cheefest remedy against all sinnes wherin the truth of Cath. Doctrine is declared and the manifold wicked falsifications of our hereâ—yks are detected Cap. 14. Of two other
and partaker of his golden purposes As for that which foloweth of recusant Catholikes that they do enioy their lands goods country and libertie notvvithstanding they are secretlie reconciled to the Pope and do adhere to her Maiesties enemyes as by a marginal note he sayth doth appeare by diuers letters of priests ready to be shevved Catholykes enioying their goodes and libertie for there enioying I would the ministers ioy were not greater in his benefices and then I doubt not but he would be more calme then now he is his hawty wyues hayre would soone grow through her french veluet hood but for their adhering to enemyes testified as he sayth by Priests letters we haue as litle reason to beleeue him against Priests not shewing their letters as they should haue to write any such vntruth which we beleeue not but take it as a stratageme deuised to set vs at diuision among our selues The whole discourse next ensuing is so bitter spiteful so ful of gore blood poyson as it needeth his visour of O. E. to vtter thesame for that the cunning compagnion though he be content to fawne and flatter be knowne vnderhand therby to gather vp some morsels for the present yet fearing perhaps somwhat the future and considering that both tymes and matters and men may change he thought good to pâ—euent afterclaps by couering his true name and to purchase securitie for tyme to come with the losse or diminishment of some prayse present And therfore walking out of sight in this behalf he playeth egregiouslie the syrebrand telling her Maiestie and her counsel O.E.A. notorious fyrebrand of sedition that too much extraordinarie fauour and remissnes tovvards Catholikes hath caused diuers rebellions both in England and Ireland and that it hath dissolued the very synevves of gouernment that it is more profitable and expedient to excute lavves then to pardon offenders c. All which this sycophaÌ„t chaunted out lustely at that very tyme and season to fil vp her Maiesties eares when his Lord and yong king Essex was most busy in plotting her Maiesties ouerthrow vnder pretence of meeting at puritane sermons and seing that this plot was layd in Ireland from whence this minister vnder pretence of running away for feare of punishment of some vntemperate words spoken came into England not long before his maister as heere is reported it may be he came about this negotiation and fearing least it might be discouered before due tyme he took in hand to write this book of all-arme against Catholikes to disguyse and shadow the other A treacherous deuise and to diuert mens eyes another way but for this let her Maiesties wyse counsel looke vnto and prouide as they shal fynd need I am only to proceed in refuting of his malice and folly let them punish his treacherie and knauery if they fynd it After his spite is spit ouâ— against the Catholikes he cometh to aduauÌ„ce highlie Sir F. Hastings wach-word Bragging of Sir F. book and sayth that the good knight of a zealous mynd tovvards religion gâ—ueth the vvord to his countrimen And I say N.D. giueth the Ward and who geueth or receyueth most venewes let our countrymen be iudges as they may also of this champion his successe who seing his good knight dryuen to the wal with more hast then good speed cometh running to his succour receauing for his gaine the first broken head as wrangling sticlers ar wont to do and so I suppose yow wil say also when ye see al that passeth Yet doth he with a conâ—ident interrogation commend vnto vs the whole worke saying vvhat one sentence in all the vvhole discourse can be noted vnvvorthy eyther a true Christian or a loyal subiect or a vvorthy knight wherto I answere that there wil so many sentences be found in the treatise folowing vnworthy of al three poyntes mentyoned to wit Christianitie loyaltie and chiualry as if this worthy champion can defend them he wil shew him selfe worthie to be knighted also and to haue a K. for the first letter of his title But to returne agayne to the prosecution of this mans inuectiue against Catholikes their liues honours liberty and goods all which he impugneth at one tyme and for some florish and shew of proof he alleageth first certayne examples of Scripture where kings of Iuda were reprehended for permitting vnlauful woorship and then out of the old Roman lawes recounted dy Cicero and Vlpian â— Reg. 1â— â— Paral. â—3 Cicero lib. 3. de legâ— bus Vlpian l. quo ties ff de poeâ—is which do prescribe diuers kyndes of punishments for malefactors and â—hirdly out of the lawes of ancient Christian Empâ—rors that willed heretikes to be punished and with this thinketh that he hath proued very substantialâ—y that Catholike men also may must be puniâ—â—ed in England But thus to reason at randome is much like to boyes argumenting in Sophistry Petrus iacet in lectulo ergo hâ—â—ulus siat in angulo these examples haue no affinity or coherence with our cause but only so much as they make against this Noddy His argumeÌ„t against him â—elfe and for vs for if old Roman lawes do gyue general authority to the body of the common wealth to punish particular offencers non è contra as Cicero signifieth in his booke de legibus then foloweth it in good reason that the Catholike christian churche being the vniuersal body of Christs common wealth vpon earth hath authoritie to punish ProtestaÌ„ts Puritanes Lutherans Arrians or any other sect that doth or shal aryse but not that theâ—e haue authoritie or may haue to punish the other for matter of religion though they sâ—ould get superiority of temporal power in any place of the world for that they are but particuler men and members of members at all and the other the body and true common wealth to whom only it appertayneth to punish And leâ— * O. â— Oules eie but sâ—ewe me one example from the beginning of Christendome that euer any man or woman in any age was punished as an heretike by the Christian common wealth for sticking to the religion of the Pope of Rome and it shal be sufficient for all I aske but one example out of all antiquitie As for the examples alleaged by him of Asa and Manasses kings of Iuda who notwithstanding 3. Reg. 15. 2 Paral. 33. Idolatrous vvorâ—hip on hils among the levves out of the Temple pre-figured heresves among Christians Hierem. in c. â— Amos in c. 12. O see Aux de vriâ—â—tate ieiunâ— cap. â— Deutt â—3 Aug. de ciuit Dei l. 1â— cap 51. Cypr. lib. de vn Eccl. Hier. in cap. â— Ezech. in c 1â— Osee in c. 1â— Zach. in c. 8. â— an Aug. enarrat in Psalm â—0 part â—9 sup lib Iosue cap. 27. their other good zeale did not remooue the vnlawful seruice and sacrifice accustomed on hils and high places they make nothing against vs but
that he committed Idolatrie when he called the Bishop of Rome God for the meaning was playne that he did it only in honour of Christ his Maister which was true God and had lefte his place and power vpon earth to this his seruant as the Bishop explayneth in the rest of the wordes following which the deceytful minister left out of purpose and corrupted also those fewe wordes he alleadgeth by shutting out the wordes à Constantino therby to make it seeme that Steuchus spake this of himselfe and so to make way to his lying calumnâ—ation saying as he doth Augustin Steuchus doth honour him as a God by this yow may see in what case men are that beleeue these lying lippes of conscieÌ„celes Ministers vpon their words in matters of their saluation which are commonlie at this day without controlment in England seing they dare aduenture to falsifie so openlie in points which they may probably doubt to be called to reckning for by their aduersaries as we do O.E. in this other maters wherin we are to charge him hereafter Diuers other places he alleadgeth and heapeth togither taken out of Ministers note books to proue the flatterie of later Catholiques Canonistes to the Pope but they are such as eyther make nothing to the purpose or are corrupted or peruerted by him or may haue a very true and pious sense in respect of the Popes authoritie and place giuen him by Christ if they be wel and truelie vnderstood and as much or more was vsed by the ancient Fathers which these compagnions do auoid to recite of purpose for their credit sake alleaging only later wryters as â—or example the very first place cyted by this fellow out of Cardâ—nal Cusanus is this Cusan epist. ad Eohem Mutato iudicio Ecclesiae mutatum est Dei iudicium The iudgment of the Church being changed about any matter the iudgment of God changeth also and heere the ministers mouth ouerruÌ„neth exceedingly saying these good fellowes for their bellies sake speake rayle Ouerlashing of the minister hold their peace wryte faune flatter and vnto the Popes pleasure tuâ—ne their style But ho Sir swash-buckler harken to others that had lâ—sse care of their belly then yow and yours this of the change of Gods iudgment after the iudgment of the Church and of the supreeme Pastor in particular is a common saying of all the Ancient Fathers vpon those wordes of Christ VVhose sinnes yow loose on earth shal be loosed in heauen and whose ye retayne shal be retaâ—ned Matth. 16. And S. Chrisostome goeth so farre therin who yet was neyther belly God nor flatterer as he attributeth this of drawing Gods iudgment after theirs not to the whole Churche and cheife Pastor onlie but to all euery lawful Priest also in absoluing from sinne whose power and dignitie he preferreth before Emperors Angels and whatsoeuer els but the only sonne of God which may answere also the ydle cauillations of S. F. among his other allegations of flatterie in the former chapter where he complayneth that some canonists preferre the Popes Authoritie before Emperors and Angels let him heare S. Chrysostome Qui terram incolunt saith he in his 3. book de sacerdotio A discourse of S. Chrisost. of Priests author tie l. â— de sacerdotiâ— To Priests that dwel and conuerse vpon earth is it committed to dispence matters that be in heauen an authoritie that God hath geuen neyther to Angels nor Archangels tyme in the Churche of God what are yow I say Yow are the great Priest the highest Bishop yow are Prince of Bishops and heire of the Apostles yow are in Primacy Abel in gouernment Noë in Patriarkship AbrahaÌ„ in order Melchisedech in dignity Aaron in authority Moyses in iudicature Samuel in power The iudgmeÌ„t of S Bernard about the Popes tytles of honour Peter in vnction Christ to yow are geuen the keyes and the sheepe are committed to your trust there are other porters of heauen other feeders also of flockes besydes your selfe but yow are so much more glorious then they by how much more different your tytle is which yow haue inherited aboue them all They haue their flockes assigned seuerally to them in seueral but to yow all vniuersally are committed that is one general flocke to one general Pastor neyther only are yow the Pastor of all sheepe but of all Pastors also do yow aske me how I can proue it I answere out of the word of God Thus farre S. Bernard and then goeth he on to shew diuers playne places of Scripture for his profe and those especially which S. Chrysostome and S. Hilary before mentyoned and now I feare me our minister Oedipus wil say heere that S. Bernard is become a flatterer of Popes also as wel as Card. Cusanus Bellarmin D. Stapleton and other like whose sentences he cyteth but eyther vnderstandeth them not or wilfully peruerteth their meaning to deceaue his reader therby to seeme to haue somewhat euer to say though he say nothing or worse then nothing And heere I would leaue now O.E. with his arte of cogging to him selfe but that he passeth on to a contumelious calumniation or two more against a freÌ„d of myne my selfe Pag 11 Gifford sayth he calleth Philip the second the K. of Spayne the greatest Monarch vnder the sunne to shew himselfe to be one of the gressest flatterers vnder the moone About D. Gifford Deane of Lile and I say yow shew yow selfe on of the veryest fooles vnder the 7. starres to print this for so grosse a flatterie which no man of knowledge iudgment in matters of story and cosmography can deny to be truth if he consider the multitude and greatnes of countryes vnder him and your selfe that haue byn a rouing theuing about the Indyes other his dominions how large and wyde they ly cannot speake this but of wilful insolency against your conscience And as for M. Doct. and deane Gifford who hath his deanery by true adoption and not by intrusion as some frend of yours and hath his learning by studie and not by borowing wandering he I say being often iniured by yow in this book wil answere for himselfe I doubt not for that yow brag much that yow haue set foorth if I mistake yow not a booke in Latyn intituled Turco-papismus which is nothing els but an apish imitatioÌ„ of M. Raynolds Caluino-Tâ—rcimus printed by M. D. Gifford after the Authors death and that yow require so earnestly to haue it answered I hold him obliged to satisfiâ— your demand so I make accompte that he wil take the payne to looke ouer your said worthy worke and geue both it and the Author the colours which both deserue And thus much â—or my frend now for my selfe I may be briefer It followeth this Noddy to shewe himseâ—fe a nâ—ble parasâ—e Pag. Ibid. vpoÌ„ whome the 〈◊〉 of his whole inuectiue against flatterers doth moâ—â— fâ—â—lâ— fal 〈…〉
we must obay kings whether they be good or bad Knokes appel fol. 26. they answere it is blasphemy so to say Againe when these obiect That God placed euil kinges and TyraÌ„ts sometymes to punish the people The others answere So he doth sometymes priuate men also to kill them Moreouer when they alleage S. Paule That he comandeth vs we should pray for princes â—uch de iure reg pag. â—7 1. Tim. 2. The other do answere we may punish theeues and pray for them also And when these reply that the same Apostle commaundeth expresly to be obedient to such a prince 1. Tim. 3. They answere Buch. Ibid. Pag. 50. That Paul wrote this in the infancy of the Churche but if he liued now he would say otherwise except he would dissent from himselfe Ibid. fol. 56.57 I leaue much more that might be alleaged to this effect And all this and much more is testified also by a brother of their owne of the softer sort in a book printed at London by publike authority in the yeare 1593. by Iohn wolfe the title wherof was Dangerous positions c. with this posy adioyned vnto it out of the epistle of S. Iude They despise gouernment and speake euil of them that are in authority And hauing geuen testimony to this which I haue cyted much more he giueth his censure of others also of the same profession beyond the sea Lib. 1. Pa. 12. This new diuinity sayth he of dealing thus with Princes is not only held by Knockes and Bucchanan alone that are Scots but generally for ought I can learne by most of the cheefe consistorians beyond the seas being of the Geneuian humor as Caluyn Beza Hotâ—maÌ„ c. And the same wryter in his second booke afterward doth shew at large how that M â— Goodman M r. Whittingham and other English Protestants that fled to Geneua in Q. Maries dayes haue left wrytten the same farre worse positions against the authority of princes as in their bookes and in the foresaid collection of this author may be read Here then these matters being so and of so great waight and the contradiction being open and notorious concerning princely authority and obedience thervnto belonging what wil our knight say here or how wil he defend vnity in verity to be amoÌ„g his brethreÌ„ in this so principal capital a poynt or how wil he satisfie her Maiestie herâ—n after all his faire speech for he doth not deny the PuritaÌ„s to be his brethren as O. E. doth afterward but rather defendeth them with main and might as after yow shal heare But if we leaue the Prince and come to Bishops which is the second principal member of their churche and body their disagreement is much more notorious then in the former For as the protestant speaketh honorably of them so doth the Puritan quite contrary calling them Dangerous posit lib. 20. cap. 12. the greatest and most pestilent enimyes that the state of England hath vnlawful false bastardly gouernours of the churche thrust in by ordenance of the diuel petty antechrists cogging cosening knaues profane paltery pernicious pestilent Prelates in respect of their places enymyes of God their calling meere Antichristian c. And this for their bishops and cheefe pastors whome they ought to presume according to S. Paules speech to be put ouer them yf any be by the holy Ghost Caluinian contradictioÌ„ about the Bish. cheefe Pastors Act. 20. But yf they be enymies of God cogging knaues petty Antichrists and ordayned by the diuel himselfe as these their owne children and brethren say and sweare then are English protestants wel directed by them and to a good end wil they come But let vs heare what they say of their immediate pastors and teachers I meane their ministers and present cleargie Our supposed ministers say they are a multitude of desperate and forlorne Atheists Ibid cap. 13. Of their ministers Ibid. cap. 11. accursed vncircumcised and murthering generation The cleargy is endighted as the followers of Antichrist they are wolues it is a Sinagoge of Sathan their only endeauour how to preueÌ„t Christ they are knowne to be enimyes vnto all syncerity Posir ibid. li. 2. cap. 4. c. And in another place Right puissant poysoned persecuting and terrible priests The holy league of subscripsion the crue of monstrous and vngodly wretches horned masters of the conspiration house Antichristian swynish rabble the conuocation of diuels vnder Belzabub of Canterbury cheeâ—e of diuels c. Thus of them And concerning the whole gouernment face Ibid. cap. 4. and corps of the Churche of England they say Antichrist raigneth amongst vs the established gouernment of the Churche is treaterous against the Maiestie of Iesus Christ it giueth leaue to a man to be any thing but a sound Christian c. And this of their whole Churche parts and pastors therof But I let passe what these fellowes say wryte of her Maiestie About the Q councel and parlament head of their Churche denying wholy her ecclesiastical authority and subiecting her to their pryuate excommunications when they please Dang posiâ— lib. â— c. Of the Lords of her priuy Counsel also charging them not to deale in matters ecclesiastical Of the Parlament in like maner and lawes made therby which in EnglaÌ„d is the highest court saying in particular therof Ibid. lib. 2. cap. 1. that as great indignity is offred vnto Iesus Christ in committing his English Churche vnto the gouernment of the common lawes as for hirâ—lings vnder any great king to commit his beloued spouse vnto the direction of the mistresse of the stewes c. Finally of their common book of seruice and administration of Sacraments established by Parlament The commâ—Ì„ book of Protestants wherin by name Sir F. in this reply braggeth so confidently VVast Pag. 12. that their is so great vnity amongst them these his brethren wryte thus Dang posit lib. 2. cap. 9. There prescript forme of seruice is ful of corruption in all the order of their seruice there is no edification but confusion The Sacraments are wickedly mangled and prophaned they eate not the Lords supper but play a pagent of their owne to blynd the people their publike baptisme is ful of childish and superstitious toâ—es c. All these fights warres and dissentions in most principal points of their religion are at this day in England betwene ridged or strayt Caluinists commonly called Puritans and the softer â—ort of the same Caluinian sect who are distinguished from the others by the name of moderate Protestants that do follow for their rule of faith and religion the prescript of Parlament and her Ma ties proceedings But now besides this contrariety of positions there is yet another dissention among these brethren more important then all the rest which is their disagreing and capital enimity about the interpretation of Scriptures VVarre in expounding scriptures wherunto
and discretion wil be of my opinion that whatsoeuer good effectes haue come to our common wealth by her Maiesties gouernment or rare partes of Princelie commendations A note to be diligently obserued and which truelie may be termed blessings might haue byn as great as all these or farre greater vnder Catholike religion and especiallie in her Maiestie if it had pleased almightie God to haue blessed her and the realme with the continuance therof and contrariwyse whatsoeuer cursings and calamities on the contrarie syde haue ensued or may ensue herafter by the change of religion these are proper effectes and necessary consequeÌ„ts of the new ghospel and not of any defect in her Maiesties gouernment and this foundatioÌ„ being presupposed in all that I shal say let vs passe on to examine in a word or two the most ridiculous vanitie of these fiue blessings folowing which he calleth corporal accompting his former spiritual For the first of them which is deliueraÌ„ce from intolerable exactions â— Blessing deliuerance from exactions if he meane it of the realme in general as his marginal note may seeme to importe which often yet disagreeth in sense from his text let the Escheker books be compared of the tributes payments contributions and exactions that were vsed in EnglaÌ„d in former dayes before this new ghospel came in and since I meane of the summes that were payd in old tymes when Catholike religion bare rule and protestants were not knowne those that later Princes by reason of troubles warres suspicions and other like occasions rysing especially by difference in religion haue byn forced to take of their subiects since the yeare of Christ 1530. or there about at what tyme K. Henrie began vpon the aduise incitation of Cranmer Cromwel and other Protestants to breake with the Pope and churche of Rome let these summes I say be coÌ„ferred and then our knight if he be a good Auditor or Eschequer man wil for very shame stryke out this blessing and mentyon it no more But yf he meane this blessing especiallie or principallie of our Clergie men this day in England for that they pay nothing now to the Pope as in the texte and prosecution of this blessing is set downe then let the wealth and ease of the old and new Clergie be compared togither or rather the pouertie and beggerie of the one with the honor and splendor of the other and so this controuersie wil quicklie be decyded and S.F. beaten from this first corporal blessing of his new Cleargie to a Spiritual which is Matth. â— Beati pauperes spiritu blessed are the poore in spirit for in body and purse they are already miserable as them-selues euery where complayne The pouertie and myserie of the protestaÌ„t cleargie none more grieuously or more spitefullie in secret as before hath byn touched then his champion O.E. alleaging these reasons that the most of them hauing much to pay both to Prince Patron in steed of the Pope and litle to receyue the gleebe lands of their benefices being commonlie swept to their hands and their charge of women and children so great as the parishes do commonlie feele when they dy their beggerie must needs be intollerable wheras on the other syde in Catholyke Countryes yf they contribute any thing to the Pope as to their head for better maintenance of his state and gouerment of the whole Churche it is neyther so great a matter and commonlie â—â—t out of the greater benefices that caÌ„ better beare it and in recompence of that agayne he defendeth them against the intrusion or vsurpation of seculer men vpoÌ„ their liuings which importeth them much more as by experience of Catholyke Countryes and Kyngdomes is seene then is the contribution they make to Rome though it were so great and greuous as our K. maketh it in K. Henrie the 3. his â—yme alleaging a certayne complaynt of our English Churche to Pope Innocentius 4. in a general Councel at Lions an 1245. against his collectors officers in England which being taken out of Iohn Fox whom this man yet wil not name maketh no more against the Popes Authoritie A calumniation of Ihon Fox act â—on Pag. 241.242 c. nor yet conuinceth him of abuse that way then yf at this day the same complaynt should be made by the Churche of Spayne as diuers tymes it is against the lyke collectors or officers there or when any complaint is made in England of any of her Ma ties officers that abuse themselues in their collections for couetousnes vpon the Clergie at this day wherof I presuppose there would not want complaints if all Ministers should be willed to vtter their greifes therin And what then doth Syr F. and Fox vrge so much against the Pope the complaynt of some in England against his officers at that tyme VVhy Pope Innocentius required a collection of mony for recouering the holy land when the publike necessitie of christendome oppressed by Turkes and Saracens inforced Pope Innocentius as general Father of all to lay some contribution vpon the cleargie of England and other countryes for defence therof to which effect also in the very same councel of Lions he had appoynted and declared king Lewes of France for Supreme general and yet was not the summe exacted such nor so great but that more money in these our dayes hath byn sent out of the realme in one yeare by these meÌ„nes liking and good approbation for defence of heresie and rebellion in France Flanders Scotland and other countryes theÌ„ was in this many other tymes in those dayes for maintenance of the whole Churche and Christianitie and yet coÌ„playneth not our knight of this which subiects now feele for that it is present but of the other past and gone which they feele not wherby is seene his indifferencie that they seek nothing but matter of complayâ—â— and cauilling against the Pope and hâ—â— doings As for long peace which is an other blessing of his both sweet profitable as he termeth it â— blessing long peace I know not what or why I should answere seing Aristotle teacheth that to go about to proue or improue by reasonâ— that which is open and manifest to our senses is to wearie reason and offer iniurie to sense who seeth not therfore what hath passed in England since protestant religion first entred in K. Henryes dayes for if we talke oâ— domestical styrres and tumultes among our people we haue had more within these 70. yeares to wit from the one or two and twentith of K. Henryes raigne downwards vnder him and his three children respecting religioÌ„ only then in a thousand before his dayes and more then in many ages for any cause whatsoeuer setting a syde the contention for the crowne betweene the two houses oâ— Yorke and Lancaster which cannot go by reason in this accompt for that it was a particular quarrel of certayne Princes of the bloud royal not rysing of
haue brought in being a matter that doth cleerlie coÌ„uince him his religioÌ„ of noueltie heresie For that GratiaÌ„ ValeÌ„tinian his sonne being Emperors of the west The decree of the 3. Emp. examined and Theodosius of the East all three do agree to commend to their subiects the romane fayth and bishop of thaâ— place to wit Damasus theÌ„ sitting in that chaire vnder payne of heresy infamy and other extreeme punishments which poynt for that the false minister after his fashion durst noâ— put downe clearly as the woords themselues do ly in the text least therby he should discouer ouer much the truth I meane to do it for him in this place without other fee for my labour then to proue him a cosening companion and alleaging them brokenly to his owne purpose Cod lib. 1. de summa Triâ—it c. CuÌ„ctos eâ— Cunctos populos sayth the decree quos clementiae nostrae regit imperium in tali rolumus religione vessarâ— quam diuinum Petrum Apostolum tradidisse Romanis religio vsque adhuc ab ipso iâ—sinuata declarat quamque Pontificem Damasum seqâ—â— claret Petrum Alexandriae Episcopum virum Apostolicae sanctitatis c. our wil is that all people whom the Empyre of our clemency doth gouerne shal lyue in that religion which diuine Peter deliuered vnto the Romanes as the religion by him taught and enduring to this day doth playnly shewe which religion lefte by S. Peter it is euident that Damasus bishop of Rome doth folow as also Peter bishop of Alexandria a man of Apostolical holynes c. to wit that according to Apostolical discipline and euangelical doctryne we all beleeue one deity of the Father the SoÌ„ne the holy Ghost with equal maiesty in holy Trinity and this law whosoeuer doth follow we command that they do imbrace the name of christiaÌ„ Catholikes the rest whoÌ„ we esteeme as mad and furious men we wil haue to beare the infamy of heretical doctryne and to be punished first by God then by vs. This is the decree of these three Emperors against heretiks for neere 1200. yeare agoe wherin yow see they remit themselues all three though one were of the east Empyre to the Romane religion and to Damasus the Pope his beleefe with whom the Patriarke of Alexandria for the east Churche did also agree and heere is nothing determined of religion as yow see by their owne authoritie but only that such as followed the Romane â—eligion and Pope of those dayes should be compted Catholikes and the rest heretikes which if the parlament of England had done in these our dayes as all ancient parlaments were wont to doe as appeareth by our statuâ—es then could not the religion authorized by â—hem be called parlament religion no more â—hen this can be called Imperial though pubâ—ished and protected by Emperors Now then gentle reader consider how many folâ—yes or Nodytismes which the minister obiected alwayes to me be by him coÌ„mitted in alleaging this one example of these Emperors and on whom they light but the principal is that being alleaged by himself and for himself it maketh wholie against him ouerthroweth quite his cause which may be accoÌ„pted doltisme also in the deane besydes Nodytisme for it sheweth first the whole difference betweene these Catholike Emperors decree Poynts of the Emp. decree contrary to O. E. for defence of religion and the modernal decrees of our Parlaments that take vpon them to appoynte and defyne religion in England it sheweth that the Romane religion was receyued by S. Peter and had endured so vntil their dayes which was more then 400. yeares it sheweth also that Damasus Pope of Rome was then the cheife gouernor of christian religion throughout the world it sheweth that these Emperours accounted him for their head and not he them in matters of religion it sheweth how humbly these Emperors did submit themselues to the decree of the councel of Nice made before their dayes about three persons in one God-head confirmed by Pope Siluester and continued by Damasus and it sheweth how obedientlie and christianly these Emperors did hold them for Catholike christiaÌ„s whom thesaid councel and Pope Damasus did hold for Catholiks and condemned those for infamous heretikes who did dissent from their obedience in religion and now whether our later Parlaments of England haue done the same by the councel of Trent and Popes confirming defending the same as our former parlaments were wont to doe I leaue to the reader to iudge and whether this law of these Emperors were wyselie brought in by O. E. or no but let vs passe yet further in examyning this rule for tryal of truth The minister hauing shifted of wittilie as it seemeth to him the exprobration of parlament religion by the foresaid example of the Emperors falleth to range and roue wyde far and to obiect to vs that in Q. maryes dayes our religion was established more by parlament then by authoritie of the Apostles that we are deuided among our selues and haue more then 200. diuers opinions about the Sacrament of the L. supper that the vniuersal Churche could not deliuer vs our fayth Diuers manifest false obiections quia â—â—tiones sunt suppositorum that our fayth is neyâ—her Catholyke nor hath any certayne grouÌ„d â—t all but is buylded vpon the particular opiâ—ions of this or that mutable and â—ulearned â—ope that it is not ancient but ful of late noâ—eltyes and old heresyes and other such stuffe â—ithout end prating much and prouing noâ—ing so as no Mountebank in Italie could â—â—ewe him-selfe lesse shameles or more ridiâ—â—lous And to say a word or two to euery one of â—â—ese fooleries before rehearsed the religion â—â—at the parlament established in Q. Maryes dayes was it any new religion VVhat religion vvas planted by parlament in Q. Maries dayes or differenâ— from the rest of Christendome or did the parlament then do any other thing then thâ— former edict or decree of the Emperors thaâ— commandeth men to hold the ancieÌ„t reâ—gâ—â— of Rome descended from the Apostles anâ— follow the Bishop of that Churche theÌ„ liuiâ—â— as head of all Christendome And as for the two hundred different oâ—â—nions that Catholykes are said to haue let â—â— E. and all his compagnions together proued two only that are real differences and tâ— maynteyned by Catholykes being opposâ—â—â— one to the other and that in poynts of fayth â—â—deed and I shal yeild and pardon all the othâ—â— hundred nyntie and eyght differences that 〈◊〉 obiecteth but if he cannot proue this of 〈◊〉 only as neuer he wil be able then are thâ— not two hundred differencies of ours but â—â— lyes of his and agayne do yow note for auâ—â—ding cauillations that I require two real â—â—ferences in matters of beleef for of other câ—â—â—cumstances that touch not preciselie belieâ—â— our schooles and learned men lawfully mâ—â— haue diuersitie of opinioÌ„s as about the manâ— how bread is conâ—erted into Christs flesh the Sacrament
Caluyn in matter of the Queenes Supremacy which he denyeth Beza in the whole gouernment of their Churche Or why should I beleeue S. F. or his new masters of EnglaÌ„d rather theÌ„ these that were more learned then he or his or what reason rule or foundation haue any of these men to beleeue their owne opinion more then others but only self wil and fancy This then is the first and greatest spiritual benediction or malediction rather that I fynd to haue happened to our realme and nation by this wooful alteration of religion that wheras before we had a direct rule squyre pole-starre to follow which was the vniuersal Churche now euery man being set at liberty holdeth beleeueth and teacheth what he listeth Nor is there any way or meane left to restrayne him for straight way he appealeth bodlie and confidentlie to the Scriptures and there he wil be both maister and Pilot boteswayne him-self to gouerne the bark at his pâ—easure for he admitteth no iudge no interpreter no authoritie no antiquitie nor any other manner of tryal which is the greatest madnes and malediction that euer could happen among men of reason And the very same cause that moued the Warder to be so liberal then in setting downe this poynt hath moued me now to repeat the same againe in this place And what do yow think that the knight his champion haue replyed to all this playne and manifest demonstration would not yow think that both of them for their credits sake should haue buckled vp them-selues to ioyne in this yssue with the warder shewing what certainty they haue or which of the two wayes they wil take proposed by him seeing he sayth there are no other or that they should theÌ„-selues at least appoynt some other way but consider good reader the force of euident truth they are so blanked and their mouthes so shut vp with this interrogation of the warder as the K t. thought it best to passe it wholie ouer with silence as before hath byn touched The minister with more shame then the K t. hath tatled somwhat Idle tatling in a grauâ— question telling vs that our religion is not Catholyke that the vniuersal Church could not deliuer it vnto vs quia actiones sunt suppositorum as yow haue heard that StapletoÌ„ teacheth that the Churche hath power to proue taxe and consigne the books of holy Scripture And that vniuersal tradition is the most certayne interpreter therof And finally that the fayth of Papists is buylt vpon the Popes fancie and opinion and it is ful of nouelties and old heresies and the like as before yow haue heard All these tatlings he hath vpon this discourse before rehearsed of the warder and almost in as many words as I haue recyted theÌ„ but to the matter it selfe about certainty or vncertainty in religion ne griquidem he answereth no one word at all only to the later parte or appendix of the discourse where the warder sayth that to make the matter more playne how protestants haue no other rule of beleef he asketh S. F. not of any Catholyke Doctors nor auncient Fathers whome he esteemeth not but of their owne new Doctors Luther Caluyn Beza and the like authors of their owne sects why English Protestants at this day should preferre their owne iudgments before these also whom they graÌ„t to haue had great store of the holy ghost in all matters doctrines and interpretation of Scripture where they dissent from them To this I say all the other storme being past it seemed good to the minister to make his answere in these wordes But sayth this Noddy why should yow beleeue more your owne opinions then Caluyn concerning the Q. supremacy Luther concerning the Real presence and Beza in the Churche gouernment I answere first that these mennes priuate opinions concerne not fundamental poynts of fayth Pag. 21. A most foolish ansvvere of O. E. about Luther Caluyn c. and therfore they are not to be brought foorth for instance in this cause where we talk of the foundations and reasons of Christian fayth Marke wel his answere good reader iudge who is the noddy he sayth two things the one that the iudgments of Luther Caluin and Beza be but priuate opinions among them the other that the poynts wherin they differ from them to wit the real presence in the Sacrament her Ma ties Supremacy ecclesiastical and the whole gouernemeÌ„t of the Churche are no fundamental poynts of their faith For the first I would gladly know what authority is auayleable among them in teaching preaching and interpretation of Scriptures yf Luther Caluyn and Beza be reiected as priuate and particuler men where they differ from them our Doctors and Churche they do defy the ancient Fathers they look not willingly after them their owne parlament this maÌ„ sayth a litle before doth not appoynt but admit their religioÌ„ only who then is hee or who are they that must determine and defyne in this case For the second yf the difference with Luther about the real presence of Christs real body in the Sacrament be no fundamental poynt of fayth seing they accuse vs of the highest cryme vnder heauen about the same that is of idolatry and holding a creature to be the creator and we them againe of most heynous blasphemy highest wickednes vpon earth in discrediting Christ in his owne words that said it was his bodie his whole Church that euer so vnderstood him vnto this day yf the matter of supremacy be no fundamental poynt of fayth VVhat pointes are fundamental in protestants doctryne wherby all their ecclesiastical hierarchie standeth at this day in England as their Bishops Deanes Archdeacons and other prelates and parsons of the Spiritualty who otherwise must needs be playne intruders and meere lay men If their whole gouernmeÌ„t of their Churche be not fundamental wherof dependeth whether they haue any true ministers preachers and teachers lawfully allowed or no consequentlie whether their Sacraments be Sacraments and be administred by them that haue authoritie so to doe if all these poynts I say be not fundamental in O.E. opinion what are fundamental And what Atheisme doth this Martial minister diuels deane bring in vpon vs But beleeue me good reader these good fellowes do only eate of the ministerie and beleeue as please them and this being a compagnion of many occupations wil liue by that which wil yeild him most according to that also shal be his doctrine and beleef Of their great grand-father fryer Martyn Luther he sayth here in the words folowing his former answere Pag. â—1 O. E. his contemptious speach of Luther and Caluyn VVe suspend our opinion and giue no approbation to Luthers opinion concerning the carnal presence of Christs body in the Sacrament for that we see the doctrine to be newe and not taught by the Apostolyke Churche nay we find yt to be repugnant to the Apostles doctrine deliuered in Scriptures
Bernard others hath in part byn seene but wil more appeare in the other incounters following especially the second and seauenth The other shifts also of repeating againe often the things before answered as though they had neuer byn answered of accusing others for excusing him-self of running behynd the cloath of â—tate thrusting her Ma ties person and gouernment betwene him his aduersary his bold impudent assertions of things manifestly knowne to be false as that the puritans and protestants are all one and that there is no difference of religion betwene them Admonition and conclusion and other such lyke all these poynts I say haue byn sufficiently layd open before as they fel out nor need they any new repetition here againe but rather admonition to wit that the K t. would with some indiffereÌ„cy coÌ„sider of these points and enter into contemplation of a good conscience remeâ—bring rather his eternal good theÌ„ his teÌ„poral honour and therwithal these words of S. Augustine to Iulian. Aug. cont Iul. lib. 5.6.7 Etst coram hominibus sit dura frons tua erubescat saltem coram Deo mens tua Albeyty our forehead be hard and blush â—ot before men yet let yow mynd at least blush before God which were noe lesse wholsome then holy counsel for him yf he would follow yt And this was my exhortation and Warn-word to S. F. before I saw the supplement of his proctor O. E. which being much more shamelesse bytter and false then any thing vttered by the K t. I was tempted to take this sentence of S. Augustine from him and bestow yt vpon the minister but in the end I resolued to leaue yt common to both and to the end yow may consider how fitly the foresaid sentence as wel of a shamelesse mynd as of a shamelesse forehead doth fal vpon the masked minister O. E. yow must remember how he hath behaued him-selfe in the former combat how euen at his very first calling vpon the stage he shewed vs a notorious cosening trik about falsifying a place of S. Augustine Vid. Cap. 3. Stechus Eugobinus in naming the Pope God and at his next goying vp he telleth certayne notorious lyes Cap. 13. which all the world cannot excuse adding ther-vnto a lyke falsification about the counsel of Lateran Cap. 15. his impudency also foolish inconstancy and contradiction to himself is to be remembred in his third admission to tel his tale further his egregious folly in setting downe his English rule of faith wherby he would exclude the a Cap. 16. in annot vpoÌ„ hiâ— epist. to the â—ead puritans and no lesse folly is discouered in alleadging Cath. Emperors decrees quite against himself And his grosse ignorance is laid forth by occasion of his argument Aâ—â—iones sunt suppositoruÌ„ therby to prooue that Catholyks receaue not their faith from the vniuersal Churche Finally his atheisme and irreligious iudgement is discouered and conuinced not only by that he saith the differences betwene Lutherans b Cap 17. Zwinglians Caluinists Puritanes not to be any essential points in matters of religioÌ„ but also by his coÌ„temptible speches of the first Doctors fathers of his owne religion especially yf any of those two books named by me before Cap 6 7. and wrytten against the Puritanes â— meane the Suruey of disciplinar Doctrine and Daungerous positions were written by him as some wil say wherin the whole story of the deformed Churche of Geneua by Caluyn VVickednes of Caluyn Pharellus Beza and others Pharellus Beza and others and their actions councels drifts and attempts about the same are so set downe and printed by publike authority in EnglaÌ„d that yf a man would study to describe notorious wicked men and catylines of their countrey without conscience he could not set it downe nor expresse it more liuely theÌ„ it is done in the foresaid books against the foresaid new prophets and their cheefest northen schollers to wit Iohn Knocks and his fellowes in Scotland and Goodman and his mates in EnglaÌ„d which argueth no faith or conscience in any of them but only to say and do for the tyme as the tyme serueth and as their proper lucar ease ambition and sensuality requireth and herby may be warned the discreet reader to look to his soule and saluation seing these men for them-selues do seeme to make that the last and least part of their care or cogitations feeding vs with many faire words of blessings but filling vs with myseryes The end of the first Encounter THE SECOND ENCOVNTER ABOVT FALSHOOD AND LYING OBIECTED TO SYR F. AND OF certayne absurd groundes and principles fayned by him to be in Catholyke doctrine And how he dischargeth him-self therof THE SVMME OF THAT which before was set downe betweene the watchman the warder CAP. I. AS in the former first Encounter the knight in his vaunt of vanitie VVatchvvord and vanitie therof height of heretical pryde went about to persuade vs yea to lay before our face the inestimable and innumerable blessings which our country for sooth had receyued by change of Catholyke religion into Protestancie so for better confirmation of this so loftie a dryft he took vpon him in this second Encounter to make declaration that in Queene Maries raygne and former tymes vnder Catholyke English Princes there was uothing els but darkenesse cloudes mistes shadowes ignorance blyndnes want of learning lack of light and other such calamities and miserable obscurities for proof wherof he setteth downe as it were by way of preface or preparation to his designed treatise certayne preambles forged by him-self as for example that the only desyre to read vpon the book of God the old or new testament was held for heynous heresie in former tymes so farre foorth that for this only act or desyre men were brandled to the slaughter and then passing further on to the depth of his discourse he setteth downe fower famous grounds or principles of Catholyke doctryne all put in order by him as most sure and consequent the one of the other which he calleth general grouÌ„ds and Maximes of our religion The first that ignorance is the mother of deuotion The second that lay men may not medle with matters of religion The third that the Pope and euery least masse-priest coÌ„ming froÌ„ him must be obeyed though he commaund that which is blasphemous before God The fourth that the Popes pardons are ready remedies for all synne among vs though neuer so greiuous euen immediatly committed against God him-self For answere of all which fancyes the Warder hauing made a competeÌ„t declaration to shew first how fond and ridiculous a maÌ„ner of proceding this was The VVarder his defence against the VVatchman the first parte and is in our K t. after so much folly and flatterie vttered in his former tale of blessings throughout the first EncouÌ„ter to enter now into so shameles a course of forging falsifying and lying for
substantially he must â—â—mayn conuinced of two great calumâ—â—tions For proof then of the first he alleadgeth â—â—ree reasons which are these First that Caâ—holyks do forbid vulgar translations not only of Protestants but also of their owne men 3. Reasons â—or S. F. his ansvvere and neuer a one concluding except the Bishop or Inquisitor giue special licence ergò we hold it for heresy Secondly that yt was obiected to Iohn Lambert for anâ— heretical opinion which he alleageth out of Fox though he name him not that he held Pag. 41. Fox act and monu Pag. 1006. col 1. num 65. That all heads and rulers are bound by necessitie of Saluation to giue the holy Scriptures to their people in theiâ— mother language His third argument is for thaâ— our Rhemists in their preface of the traÌ„slation of the new Testament say They do not publisâ— the Testament in English vpon any erronious opinioâ— of necessitie that the Scripture should alwayes be iâ— our mother tongue or that they ought or were ordaâ—neâ— by God to be read indifferently of all By which threâ— Reasons he thinketh it sufficiently proued that we hold the reading of Scriptures for heresy But who seeth not that no one of these reaâ—sons nor all together do conclude any thing to that effect The 3. reasons of S. F. examined For to the first though Catholyke do forbid men to vse their owne vulgar translations but with liceÌ„se yet do they not forbiâ— yt as heresy for then as I sayd they woulâ— graunt yt to none but they forbid it as a thinâ— wherof being abused heresy may follow as a Father should forbid his children that aâ—â— weak or indiscreet to drink strong wyne without water least they be dronckeÌ„ or catâ—â— an ague he sayth not that the drinking it seâ—â— is drunkennes or an ague but that being abuâ—sed it may cause the same And so to the second the reading of Scriâ—ptures was not obiected to Lambert as heresie but for that he was charged to hold it necessarie vnder payne of damnation to giue the said Scriptures in vulgar languages to all people which was an heretical and false assertion The Rhemists also which is the third obiection do cal the said opinion of Lambert about the necessitie of reading Scriptures in vulgar tongues by all sortes erronious and not the reading of Scriptures yt self Now then let vs heare and examine S. F. argument made vpon the words of our Rhemists before recited Pag. 47. The absurd vulearned manner of reasoning vsed by the Knight Now sayth he yf to think the Scriptures may be read indifferently of all he in your iudgement an heretical opinion then for men to read them is in your iudâ—ement an heretical action Mark good Reader â— F. manner of argument first he peruerteth the words alleaged by himself our of our Rhemists For they say It is erronious to put necessâ—tie for all to read But he sayth they affirme it heretical that all may read Now betweene must may erronious heretical there is much difference Then doth not this second proposition follow of his first for though it be erronious or heretical to hold necessitie of publishing the Scriptures in English to all as Lambert did hold yet followeth it not that â—he reading it self is heretical for a man may haue leaue to read and so auoyd all fault and â— Catholyke man vpon curiositie may chauÌ„ce â—o read without leaue and yet not beleeue heâ—etically that it is necessarie to permit them â—o be read of all And to the end good reader thou maist see the vanitie of his former consequeÌ„ce consider the same in an other exaÌ„ple It is an erronious and heretical opinion to say that all men and women may or must preach teach and administer Sacraments without ordination or licence ergo it is heresy or at least wayes an heretical action to teach preach administer SacrameÌ„ts who seeth not the folly of this consequence But now where-as the warder vpon this occasion entreth into the verie substance of the matter The cheefe substance of the matter omitted by Syr F. shewing at large how and in what sense reading of Scriptures in vulgar tongues is forbidden in the Catholyke Churche and vpon what causes and how farre and to what persons and to what end and with what limitations and how falsely heretykes do cauil and slaunder them in this behalf and confirmeth the same by many authorities arguments and euident reasons as also that the right vnderstanding of Scriptures is a peculiar gift of God and not common to all and that experience both of our and old tymes haue taught vs the great euils and daungers which had ensued by schismes heresies and varieties of opinions gathered out of Scriptures by euil interpretation alleaging also diuers examples for the same To all this I say being the pith and substance of the whole matter S. F. answereth not one word according to his shift of omission before mentioned when he hath nothing to answere and therfore vsing silence in this he passeth ouer to the second vntruth obiected that men are brandled to the slaughter for only reading vpon Gods book leauing the first sticking on his sleaue as yow see and much more confirmed then remoued by his answere For seing he affirmed it so stoutlie before that we held it heresy euen to think or desyre to read Scriptures in English why had he not alleaged some one playne text some Canon some one sentence some one Author of ours some book scrip or scrolle where we say so and where we do pronounce that first for heresie why runneth he to so blynd weake arguments and coniectures as yow haue heard Heerby yow may see what men of their wordâ— conscience and veritie they be and I may say of this K t. as Tertullian said of Marcion the heretyke Tertul. lib. 5. ad Marc. cap. 14â— num 231. quantas foueas fecit aufeâ—endo quae voluit how many great gappes hath he made in my book leauing out what he would or could not answer But now to the second vntruth whether men were put to death in deed for only reading scriptures About the second vntruth vvhether men vvere put to death for only reading scriptures VVastvvord Pag. 43. this dependeth of the first For yf it be euident that we hold not that the only reading of Scriptures is heresie as he affirmeth and we haue shewed the contrarie then followeth yt not to be likely that we brandle men to death with fyer for this fact which is a punishment due to heresie Let vs see then what the K â— sayth heere First of all he picketh a quarrel as though I had added somewhat to his wordes saying Pag. 43. Before I proced to the iustifying of my speach Pag. 43. geue me leaue to tel yow that this word onely by yow thrust into my words is one ly of your coyning though not the only one lye Heere
poynts contayned in this matter the one we haue gotten that in some cases spiritual prelates though subiects in temporalityes may reprehend and resist yea chasten also by Ecclesiastical punishment their liege lords and temporal princes without being traytors for the same The second whether the examples be like we are to examine a litle in this place And first I would aske our minister that denyeth the fitnes of the examples The comparison of S. Thom vvith S. Ambrose Hillary and other fathers as also his master that chafeth at them what and where about were the foresayd Saints contentions with their temporal Princes were they not for the defence of the lawes of Christ and his Churche did not S. Iohn Baptist withstand Herod his temporal Lord to his face for breaking the lawes of wedlock and was not the strife of S. Ambrose with Valentinian his Emperour first for that he would not deliuer vp a Catholike Churche to the vse of Arrians as he and his mother had commaunded and secondly for that he would not giue vp the treasure and vessels of his Churche into the Emperors owne hands as he required Heare his owne testimony thereof S. Ambr. in orat in AuxoÌ„ de Basilicia traden Cum esset proposituÌ„ saith hee vt ecclesiae vasa iam traderemus c. when it was proposed vnto vs in the Emperours name that wee should deliuer him the vessel of our churche I gaue this answere If any thing of my owne were demaunded eyther land howse gold or siluer I would easely yeild vnto him any thing that were belonging vnto mee But from the Churche of God I told him that I could take nothing for that I had receyued it not to deliuer but to keep And that with this I had respect also of the Emperours saluation For that it was neyther expedient for mee to giue nor for him to receyue Accipiat ergo vocem liberi sacerdotis c. Let his Maiestie then receyue the word of a free priest if he wil haue care of his owne saluation let him cease to offer iniury to Christ. Lo here the answeare of an ecclesiastical Prelate but a temporal subiect to his highest Prince doth not this seeme to bee speach of some Catholyke Bishop to a Protestant Prince that would inuade Churche goods possessions against which poynt S. Ambrose was so resolute to stand as he sayth in the same place that yf sorce were vsed towards him his flesh might bee troubled but not his mynd and that he was readie yf the Emperour would vse his kingly authority in offring violence to stuffer that which belonged to a good Priest to beare And what doth this differ now from the cause of S. Tho. of Canterbury who stood vpon defence of his Ecclesiastical iurisdictioÌ„ against K. Henry his temporal Prince that vsurped the same Heare the words of S. Thomas himself vsed to K. Henry in a CouÌ„cel at Chynon in FraÌ„ce as D. Houeden sets them downe Rog. Houe in vit Henr. 2. pag. 285. Non deberetis Episcopis praecipere absoluere aliquem vel excommunicare trahere Clericos ad saecularia examina iudicare de decimis de ecclesits interdicere Episcopis ne tractent de â—ransgressione fidei vel Iuramenti c. Yow ought not to take vpon yow to commaund Bishops to absolue or excomunicate any man neyther to draw cleargie men to the examinatioÌ„s of seculars neyther to iudge of tythes or of churches or to forbid Bishopâ— to treat of transgressioÌ„s against faith or against oathes broaken or the like c. Doe not wee seme to heare in this place the voice of S. Ihon Baptist to his K. Herod It is not lawful for the to haue the wyfe of thy brother S. Marc. 1â— Or is not this agreable to the speach of S. Ambrose to Valentinian that he could not force him to deliuer any churche or holy vessels thereof and that he would dy in that quarrel against him But let vs heare an other controuersy of his with another Emperour more deuout religious then the former The contention of S. Ambrose vvith Theodosius the Emperor to wit Theodosius the great in Millain for that he would not do publike pennance prescribed by this holy B. to him for the excesse in punishing those of Thessalonica and had not this beene rebellioÌ„ and treason by Protestants law for a priest to driue his king and Emperour that by their diuinity was head of their churche to publike penance and to go out of his Churche as S. Ambose did compel Theodosius to go out of the churche of Millan But let vs go forward and see the rest of examples before touched Pallad in vit Chrysost. was not the contention of S. Chrisostome with Arcadius and Honorius his Princes Emperours and with their wyues when he kept some of them by force out of his churche about ecclesiastical liberty and iurisdiction also And that also of S. Athanasius Hilarius against Constantius their Emperour and supreme head also according to the Protestants opinion in spiritual matters for that he fauored Arrians deposed Catholike Bishops and made himself vmpyre in ecclesiastical affayres as Protestants Princes doe now a dayes Did S. Tho. Primate of England say or write more to K. Henry at any tyme then S. Gregorie Nazianzen a particular Archbishop sayd vnto his Emperour that was present and angry with him Nazian orat ad Ciues Imper. â—rasceÌ„tem Vos quoque potestati meae meisque subsellijs lex Christi subiecit scio se esse ouem mei gregis sacri gregis sacram ouem Yow also o Emperour the law of Christ hath made subiect vnto my power and to my tribunal I know thee to bee a sheep of my flock a sacred sheep of a holy flock If Nazianzene had sayd this to an English King or should doe at this day how would our Protestants Prince-parasytes cry out and say that he were a proud Prelate as they say of S. Thomas The cheif and onelie contention of king Henry with the Archbishop as before in part you haue heard was about ecclesiastical iurisdiction as the articles set downe by all wryters doe testify The articles vpon vvhich S. Tho. disagreed vvith the king as namely that no Bishop might appeale to the Sea Apostolike without licence of the king that no seruant or tenant holding of the king might be excommunicated without his licence that no Bishop should bee able to punish any man for periury or breaking his faith that all cleargie men might bee forced to secular iudgments as all controuersyes also pertâ—yning to tythes and other like cases And now yf these controuersyes should haue fallen out as in part they did betweene the auncient christian Emperours and the holy Bishops before named would they not think you haue stood in them with no lesse feruour then S. Thomas did But now let vs heare and examine how Syr F. doth proue this holy Archbishop to bee a
The second is that this matter of miracles is an ordinary common place wherin the scurrility of incredulous and scoffing heretiks doth enlarge it self very much and often it being a subiect sit for that purpose seing that miracles being aboue the common course of natural things must needs haue some disproportion or improbability in the sense of ordinary vnderstanding that measureth all by that they see with their eyes and then being set forth also with mocks and moes in the most ridiculous sort that malice can deuise and the improbability increased commonly by such lying circumstances as are added by the reporter it serueth to entertayne and make mery the incredulous ignorant or light of hart and to bring them by litle aed litle to trust or beleeue nothing that passeth sense or excedeth the reach of euery particular mannes reason These two obseruations then being premised in this matter vve shal passe to examine what our vnbeleeuing knight bringeth in to discredit miracles And first to beginne withall and to make some path and preamble to the infidelity which heere he meaneth to teach he alleadgeth vs an old prouerbe as he calleth it which for more credit he setteth downe in different letter VVastvvord Pag. 58. That many are worshipped for Saints in heauen whose soules are burning in hel And for this in his margent he quoteth ex Auentino Ex Auentino but Auentinus his works and storie being verie great why did he not quote the book chapter or place For though Auentinus be not of much credit with Catholikes in his historie yet might we haue examined vpon what occasion and in what sense he said it for that in some sense it may be somwhat true and yet help nothing Syr F. his cause nor the infidelity he endeauoureth by his doctryn to establish For suppose yf that should fal out so that some christians were deceaued about the particular holines of some persons who being honored vpon earth for Saints were none in deed but rather damned as it is reported by some that S. Ambrose by reuelation discouered that two bodyes which had byn honored by some simple people for martyrs not to haue byn those martyrs but rather the bodyes of two malefactors which suppose it were true what hurted that the Churche of God or what hindred that the merit and deuotion of those simple people that being deceaued honored those memories as of special seruants and saincts of Christ and receaued no doubt the reward of their deuotioÌ„ according to their meaning and holy intention not according to the external error happened in the material obiect Material error in honoring saintes huâ—â—eâ—h not the deuout as yf when Christs body was rysen from the sepulcher the Iewes had put one of the two theeues bodies there that were crucified with him and S. Mary Magdalyn and the rest had annoynted that body thinking it to be Christs had this think yow diuinished their merit or made their act superstitious as heretyks cal it So as theÌ„ this material error litle importeth and consequently the place out of Auentinus yf it be there is nothing to the purpose For auoyding notwithstanding of the which and lyke errors great care was had in the primitiue Churche that the acts of Martyrs deathes and burials should be diligently obserued and distinctly coÌ„mitted to wryting for which cause not only the Bishops themselues were imployed therin euery one in his owne diocesse but a deacon also vnder euery Bishop The diligeÌ„ce of the primitiue Churche about Martyrs and S. and a subdeacon vnder euery deacon and a publyke Notarie vnder euery subdeacon were assigned to attend to this particular care And in Rome for that it was so big and deuided into 7. regions seauen deacons and seauen subdeacons with seueral notaries vnder them had this charge as appeareth in the Romane register ascribed to Damasus in the lyfe of Clement Damas. Pontifical in vit Clement Fab. c. Fabian Anteros Iulius and other Bishops of Rome And the-same to haue byn obserued also in the Churche of Millan testifieth Paulinus the Notarie of S. Ambrose Bishop of that cittie who wryting the lyfe of thesayd sainct sayth he was vnder the charge of Castus deacon to gather such things togeather of saincts Paul in vita Ambros. c. And before this agayne Pontius the deacon of S. Cyprian afirmeth that blessed Bishop and Martyr to haue byn so sollicitious in gathering the gests of Martyrs Pont. Diac in vita Cypriani as he would haue the very dayes exactly noted in which each one suffred which S. Cyprian testifieth also himself in his Epistle to the Priests Deacons of his Churche of Carthage Ep. Cyprian ad presb Diacon and of other Bishops before him Pont ibid. thesayd Potius sayth that they were so studious in this care as not only of all Baptised Christians but also of Catecumeni if they were martyred order was giuen to haue their acts written c. And this we read also put in practise by many other Churches of the world as by that of Vienna in Austria by Lions in France by AlexaÌ„dria in Egypt and the lyke as appeareth by their Epistles registred by Eusebius and other wryters This was the spirit of the ancient primitiue Churche and the very same diligence by lyke spirit hath byn continued by the Catholyke Churche euer since The processe needful to CanonizatioÌ„ of saincts not only in the acts and gests of martyrs but of other holy men also since martyrdome in great part hath ceased as may appeare by the long processe and most diligent examination of hundrethes of witnesses by lawful and indifferent iudges appoynted when any man is to be Canonized or declared for holy in the Churche after his death which thing for more certayntie and lesse partialitie is done by order and authoritie of the highest iudge and Pastor in spiritual causes and it is not done but vpon many yeares examination commonly except the cause be otherwayes made euident to all This is the practise of the Cath. Churche heere now let S r. F. or any other wrangler or calumniator equal to himself tel me if any meane of trying meÌ„nes merits holines be to be had in this lyfe what better or more indifferent way can be taken then this which is by the highest and most vniuersal Magistrate that we haue in our Churche Fox-made-saincts not to be compared to Pope-made-saincts wheras amoÌ„g them euery particular man as Ihon Fox for exaÌ„ple maketh saincts and vnmaketh them at his pleasure and putting them downe in his Calender in great red letters for martyrs or confessors or in black lesser letters for lesser saincts as he thinketh best without any other examination or approbration of superior authority and that which is most ridiculous of all he careth not of what fayth or religioÌ„ they were of among themselues so they were contrarie in any one part to the Catholykes yea
4. num 12. Protestants books and wrytings one against the other in general Enc. 1. cap. 5 6. per totum Protestants shal perish finally by diuision among themselues according to Luthers prophesy Enc. 1. cap. 7. nu 4. Protestants of how good lyfe commonly they be according both to Erasmus and Luther Enc. 1. cap. 10. num 1.2.3 c. Protestant cleargie poore and miserable Enc. 1. cap. 11. num 3. Puritans feare greatly toleration of Cath. Religion and why notes vpon the Epist. of S. F. num 8.9.10 c. Puritans books and iudgments against English Protestants Enc. 1. cap. 6. per totum Puritans do complaine greeuously of protestants for persecution Enc. 1. cap. 10. Puritans and Protestants contempt of their owne Doctors when they make against them Enc. 1. cap. 17. nu 13.14 c. R. ROman faith and the practise therof in visiting martyrs sepulchers in S. Hieromes tyme. Enc. 1. cap. 9. nu 3.4 c. Religious men corrupted by VVickliffe Enc. 2. cap. 2. num 10.11 c. Rule of faith what it is among Catholyks that protestants haue none at all wherby to haue any certainty Enc. 1. cap. 14. per totum What Rule of faith O. E. doth appoint by the parlament of England and what authority the Parlament hath or may haue in that case Enc. 1. cap. 15. per totum cap. 16. num 8. S. SAcrifice of the masse acknowledged by auncient Fathers by the Magdeburgians owne confession Enc. 1. cap. 13. num 13. Saints what processe is needful in the Cath. Churche for their Canonization Enc. 2. cap. 11. num 15.16.17 c Fox-made Saints not comparable to Pope-made Saints Ibid. Saints bloud and merit how it may be named in our prayers to God Enc. 2. cap. 12. num 9. Scriptures expounded diuersly by protestants and Puritans one contrary to the other Enc. 1. cap. 6. num 11. Scripture Reading in vulgar tongues hath byn occasion of ruine to many of the simpler sort Enc. 1. cap. â— num 2.3 c. Scriptures in the vulgar tongue permitted in England with moderation and licence in former ages Enc. 2. cap. 3. num 7. See thesame handled more largely ibid. cap. 6. nu 14.15 Et cap 9. per totum Intricate dealing of heretiks about vnderstanding of Scripture ibid. cap. 6. num 22. who are properly Lucifugi scripturarum heretiks or Catholyks ibid. num 25. How Scriptures must be interpreted ibid. nu 26. How the Iewes of Berrea did read the Scriptures act 17. Enc. 2. cap. 9. num 4. Sectaries sprong vp from Luther and their diuisions among them-selues Enc. 1. cap. 4. num 7.8 c. Sectaries burned by Protestants when they are against them though they condemne burning by the Catholyks Enc. 1. cap. 8. num 3.4 c. Stankarus a Polonian Sectary His contumelious woords against Peter Martyr Bullinger and others Enc. 1. cap. 5. num 6. Synods and Councels held by Protestants with more disagreement then before Enc. 1. cap. 4. num 11. 12. c. T. S. Thomas of Canterbury how egregiously he is abused by S. F. and Iohn Fox Enc. 2. cap. 10. nu 17.18.19.20.21 c. S. Thomas his constancy much lyke to that of S. Ambrose and Nazianzen and other Bishops with their Princes Ibid. num 13.14 c. S. Thomas his Miracles and how authentical they are proâ—ed Enc. 2. cap. 11. per totum V. VErtue what effects therof hath new religioÌ„ brought into England Enc. 1. cap. 18. n. 2. Vnity betwene Protestants and Puritans what noteâ— vpon the ep of S. F. n. 9.10 c. Vnion of doctrine among Protestants what it is and how falsely affirmed by Sir F. Enc. 1. cap. 4. n. 3.4.5.6 c. No meanes of vnion among Protestants ibid. n. 10. Vnity in Catholike Religion in S. Bedes tyme among different and opposite nations that were in warre with themselues A great argument for the truthe of that religion Enc. 2. cap. 3. n. 5.6 c. W. WArre of Protestants among themselues in matter of doctrine Enc. 1. cap. 5. per totum VVestphalus what he saith against Caluyn and Caluynists Ibid. n. 5. Good works are not only not profitable but pernitious also to saluation and iustification as Luther holdeth Enc. 1. cap. 10. n. 3. About good works what is the Catholike doctrine ibid. n. 6. Enc. 2. cap. 16. n. 11.12 c. Wickliffe his doctrine what horrible styrre it made in England at the very beginning Enc. 2. n. 10.11.12 c. Wickliffe not only made a saint by Iohn Fox but a martyr also though he died in his bed Encont 2. cap. num 13. THE FIRST TABLE OF THE CHAPTERS OF THE FIRST ENCOVNTER A Brief Summarie of all that before hath byn said or now is to be added about this first Encounter of blessings cursings by change of Catholike religion Cap. 1. Of the first charge of flattering the state of England laid to Sir Francis and of his owne contradiction to himself therin about the deuised blessings of his new ghospel Cap. 2. Procter O. E. is called vp the stage to tel his tale to help out Sir Francis in this matter of flattering the state and how he playeth his parte farre worse and more ridiculouslie then the knight himself Cap. 3. Of ten new deuised blessings brought in by Sir F. as peculiar to his ghospel wherof the first is vnion in doctrine tearmed by him vnitie in veritie And how false and vayne this is Cap. 4. â—he same matter is prosecuted and the disvnion of Protestants is proued and declared by diuers other meanes out of their owne books and writings especially of forraine Protestants Lutherans Zwinglians and Caluenists Cap. 5. The continuation of thesame narration about vnitie in veritie among ridged and soft Caluenists named Protestants Puritans in EnglaÌ„d ScotlaÌ„d Cap 6. An answere to three fond obiections or interrogatioÌ„s of Sir â—rancis with an addition about O.E. Cap. 7. Of the second third blessings which are reading of scriptures publike seruice in English Cap. 8. The second part of the answere about Churche seruice in English conteyning some authorities alleadged for it but much corrupted and abused by the knight Cap. 9. Of the fourth and fifth blessings affirmed to haue byn brought in by Protestants which are aboundance of good workes fredome from persecution Cap. 10. Of the other fiue imagined blessings that remayne to wit deliuerance from exactions long peace power in forraine countries wealth of the land multitude of subiects encreased Cap. 11. How the contrarie effects to blessings that is to say of great damages and cursings brought in by change of religion both spiritual and temporal and how Syr F. and his Proctor O. E. do answere them Cap. 12. VVhat Procter O. E. saith to this matter of cursings and how absurdly he behaueth himself therin Cap. 13. That Protestants haue not only no agreement or vnitie among themselues in matters of religion but also are depriued of all sure