of_o this_o church_n five_o i_o desire_v to_o be_v resolve_v 22._o ibidem_fw-la q._n 22._o whether_o all_o the_o error_n of_o barrowisme_n do_v not_o follow_v and_o may_v be_v conclude_v of_o m._n cartwrights_n and_o his_o consort_n assertion_n and_o whether_o it_o be_v a_o matter_n fit_a that_o these_o man_n shall_v deal_v with_o that_o sort_n of_o sectary_n and_o not_o rather_o be_v constrain_v public_o to_o recant_v their_o own_o foul_a error_n all_o these_o question_n m._n cartwright_n answer_v with_o silence_n six_o 24._o ibidem_fw-la q._n 24._o i_o move_v a_o question_n whether_o m._n cartwright_n and_o his_o consort_n do_v not_o either_o flat_o deny_v or_o call_v in_o question_n the_o principal_a point_n of_o her_o majesty_n supremacy_n and_o whether_o they_o take_v not_o from_o her_o power_n to_o ordain_v rite_n and_o order_n for_o the_o church_n likewise_o authority_n to_o nominate_v bishop_n to_o appoint_v ecclesiastical_a commissioner_n and_o to_o delegate_v learned_a man_n to_o hear_v the_o last_o appeal_n from_o ecclesiastical_a court_n to_o call_v synod_n and_o other_o authority_n give_v to_o the_o prince_n by_o the_o law_n of_o england_n and_o endevoure_v to_o bring_v in_o foreign_a law_n and_o jurisdiction_n repugnant_a to_o the_o statute_n of_o the_o princess_n supremacy_n and_o prerogative_n and_o the_o law_n and_o liberty_n both_o of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o of_o her_o majesty_n subject_n if_o m._n cartwright_n mean_v to_o have_v satisfy_v the_o doubt_n concern_v his_o opinion_n and_o conceit_n of_o her_o majesty_n supremacy_n as_o he_o go_v about_o it_o he_o ought_v to_o have_v answer_v this_o question_n direct_o and_o particular_o not_o do_v it_o who_o see_v not_o that_o he_o slide_v away_o in_o cloud_n of_o generality_n and_o private_a conceit_n of_o his_o own_o fancy_n concern_v this_o matter_n seventh_o it_o be_v demand_v 29._o answer_v to_o the_o petit_fw-fr q._n 26._o &_o 29._o whether_o by_o m._n cartwrights_n rule_n in_o those_o place_n where_o they_o be_v receive_v the_o church_n good_n be_v not_o spoil_v and_o the_o live_n of_o the_o ministry_n divide_v and_o reward_n of_o learning_n take_v away_o and_o also_o whether_o if_o the_o same_o shall_v here_o be_v receive_v the_o like_a wrack_n will_v not_o be_v wrought_v and_o her_o majesty_n deprive_v of_o tenthes_o and_o subsidy_n and_o a_o great_a part_n of_o her_o revenue_n and_o of_o many_o faithful_a and_o loyal_a servitor_n which_o by_o those_o law_n be_v make_v unable_a to_o live_v will_v also_o be_v make_v unable_a to_o do_v her_o service_n he_o have_v nothing_o to_o answer_v that_o will_v make_v for_o he_o eight_o it_o be_v ask_v 30._o ibidem_fw-la qu._n 30._o whether_o m._n cartwright_n and_o his_o follower_n have_v not_o in_o all_o place_n where_o they_o have_v be_v receive_v make_v sect_n and_o division_n and_o harden_a man_n heart_n and_o fill_v their_o mind_n with_o pride_n and_o humorous_a vanity_n to_o which_o he_o say_v nothing_o percase_o he_o know_v it_o be_v no_o slander_n nine_o 31._o ibidem_fw-la qu._n 31._o i_o demand_v whether_o it_o be_v not_o dangerous_a for_o this_o state_n that_o m._n cartwright_n and_o his_o partaker_n have_v so_o much_o urge_v this_o church_n to_o imitate_v the_o example_n of_o geneva_n and_o scotland_n consider_v the_o dangerous_a course_n which_o they_o take_v and_o the_o hard_a effect_n that_o follow_v of_o they_o it_o can_v be_v deny_v and_o therefore_o m._n cartwright_n hold_v his_o peace_n 10._o 33._o ibidem_fw-la qu._n 33._o the_o question_n be_v ask_v whether_o that_o the_o subversion_n of_o the_o state_n of_o the_o church_n which_o follow_v necessary_o of_o m._n cartwrights_n disciplinarian_a devise_n be_v not_o a_o great_a scandal_n and_o hindrance_n to_o the_o reformation_n of_o true_a religion_n in_o other_o place_n it_o be_v most_o apparent_a and_o therefore_o m._n cartwright_n forbear_v to_o answer_v 11._o 34._o ibidem_fw-la q._n 34._o it_o be_v demand_v whether_o m._n cartwright_n do_v not_o as_o well_o subject_a prince_n to_o excommunication_n as_o sander_n or_o allen_n or_o other_o papist_n and_o whether_o his_o doctrine_n be_v not_o as_o pernicious_a to_o princess_n authority_n as_o they_o it_o must_v needs_o be_v grant_v and_o therefore_o he_o pass_v by_o and_o say_v just_a nothing_o 12._o 49._o answer_v to_o the_o petit_fw-fr qu._n 49._o a_o doubt_n be_v make_v whether_o m._n cartwright_n do_v believe_v that_o subject_n may_v rebel_v against_o such_o king_n as_o they_o account_v papist_n or_o tyrant_n as_o some_o of_o that_o side_n have_v teach_v and_o he_o pass_v by_o in_o a_o grave_a silence_n 13._o 51._o ibidem_fw-la qu._n 51._o it_o be_v ask_v whether_o m._n cartwright_n and_o his_o fellow_n have_v not_o assemble_v in_o synod_n or_o rather_o conventicle_n and_o there_o enact_v &_o decree_v certain_a rule_n &_o order_n contrary_a to_o her_o majesty_n law_n and_o also_o subscribe_v they_o &_o procure_v other_o to_o subscribe_v they_o and_o by_o all_o possible_a mean_n go_v about_o without_o authority_n to_o put_v the_o same_o in_o practice_n and_o to_o discredit_v and_o disgrace_v the_o law_n of_o her_o majesty_n and_o ancient_a government_n of_o christ_n his_o church_n this_o be_v most_o true_a and_o therefore_o pass_v over_o in_o silence_n 14._o idemaund_v also_o whether_o they_o have_v not_o in_o their_o say_a order_n 52._o ibidem_fw-la qu._n 52._o which_o they_o call_v holy_a discipline_n take_v all_o authority_n in_o church_n cause_n from_o the_o christian_a magistrate_n and_o give_v it_o to_o their_o consistory_n and_o synod_n in_o so_o much_o that_o the_o magistrate_n be_v not_o once_o mention_v in_o that_o platform_n and_o further_o i_o will_v know_v how_o the_o sufferance_n of_o these_o proceed_n may_v stand_v with_o the_o majesty_n of_o a_o prince_n and_o with_o government_n likewise_o it_o may_v be_v demand_v of_o m._n cartwright_n how_o he_o that_o have_v bind_v himself_o to_o this_o form_n of_o discipline_n by_o his_o word_n &_o subscription_n may_v be_v think_v to_o allow_v of_o her_o majesty_n supreme_a government_n which_o the_o law_n of_o this_o land_n do_v give_v unto_o she_o in_o this_o case_n he_o be_v as_o silent_a as_o harpocrates_n 15._o 53._o ibidem_fw-la q._n 53._o i_o desire_v to_o know_v whether_o m._n cartwright_n have_v not_o teach_v that_o the_o authority_n which_o they_o challenge_v to_o their_o eldership_n and_o synod_n by_o their_o holy_a discipline_n as_o they_o call_v it_o be_v neither_o increase_v nor_o diminish_v whether_o the_o prince_n be_v christian_n or_o heathen_a and_o likewise_o if_o he_o do_v not_o think_v or_o have_v not_o teach_v that_o the_o authority_n of_o a_o christian_a and_o heathen_a prince_n be_v all_o one_o and_o that_o a_o christian_a king_n have_v no_o more_o to_o do_v with_o the_o church_n government_n than_o any_o pagan_a prince_n or_o emperor_n have_v but_o he_o will_v tell_v we_o nothing_o 16._o 54._o ibidem_fw-la q._n 54._o i_o ask_v m._n cartwright_n whether_o he_o &_o his_o adherent_n have_v not_o put_v the_o great_a part_n of_o their_o discipline_n in_o practice_n without_o her_o majesty_n consent_n authority_n or_o allowance_n and_o likewise_o without_o her_o authority_n or_o knowledge_n have_v not_o both_o make_v secret_a meeting_n and_o establish_v diverse_a new_a order_n and_o broach_v new_a opinion_n and_o all_o contrary_a to_o the_o doctrine_n faith_n and_o government_n of_o this_o church_n of_o england_n this_o string_n m._n cartwright_n dare_v not_o touch_v 17._o 55._o ibidem_fw-la q._n 55._o i_o ask_v he_o whether_o he_o be_v not_o presumptuous_a if_o no_o more_o in_o do_v these_o thing_n and_o whether_o he_o ought_v not_o to_o be_v bring_v public_o to_o submit_v himself_o for_o his_o fault_n likewise_o it_o may_v be_v here_o ask_v of_o he_o whether_o have_v both_o in_o fenner_n book_n and_o his_o reply_n and_o writing_n teach_v write_v and_o allow_v diverse_a point_n of_o false-doctrine_n he_o be_v not_o to_o be_v bring_v to_o a_o public_a recantation_n for_o satisfaction_n of_o those_o weak_a one_o that_o he_o have_v offend_v will_v it_o please_v he_o yet_o to_o answer_v this_o question_n direct_o 18._o 57_o answer_v to_o the_o petit_fw-fr qu._n 57_o i_o demand_v whether_o m._n cartwright_n swear_v true_o in_o the_o star-chamber_n when_o he_o affirm_v on_o his_o oath_n that_o he_o never_o affirm_v or_o allow_v that_o in_o every_o monarchy_n there_o ought_v to_o be_v certain_a magistrate_n like_v to_o the_o spartaine_a ephori_fw-la with_o authority_n to_o control_v and_o depose_v the_o king_n and_o to_o proceed_v further_o against_o he_o see_v he_o call_v m._n fenner_n book_n wherein_o these_o point_n be_v express_o set_v down_o the_o principle_n and_o ground_n of_o heavenly_a canaan_n and_o do_v not_o only_o without_o all_o exception_n allow_v it_o but_o also_o high_o commend_v it_o this_o be_v also_o a_o point_n which_o he_o dare_v
so_o you_o count_v the_o prince_n as_o a_o simple_a fellow_n and_o as_o a_o poor_a gardener_n among_o the_o magnifico_n in_o your_o eldership_n you_o say_v he_o may_v have_v a_o voice_n call_v a_o counsel_n and_o appoint_v time_n to_o meet_v but_o he_o 156._o he_o 2._o lib._n 2._o p._n 157._o &_o 156._o may_v neither_o judge_v nor_o make_v order_n but_o aught_o to_o confirm_v and_o execute_v the_o decree_n of_o the_o counsel_n and_o do_v not_o the_o papist_n the_o like_v it_o be_v most_o apparent_a both_o in_o our_o own_o countrymen_n writing_n as_o in_o 3._o in_o devisib_n monar_fw-mi lib._n 2._o c._n 3._o sander_n and_o 304._o and_o confut._n ap_fw-mi p._n 304._o harding_n and_o in_o magistr_n in_o bellar._n de_fw-fr magistr_n other_o also_o if_o then_o the_o papist_n sure_o you_o have_v no_o good_a conceit_n of_o her_o majesty_n supremacy_n and_o this_o reply_n this_o in_o a_o certain_a epistle_n concern_v m._n cartur_fw-la reply_n m._n whitaker_n and_o other_o have_v note_v 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you_o be_v not_o bind_v to_o answer_v by_o which_o it_o appear_v that_o you_o think_v the_o injunction_n restrain_v her_o authority_n and_o that_o so_o far_o as_o you_o dare_v not_o tell_v we_o what_o you_o think_v wherefore_o if_o in_o deed_n your_o opinion_n be_v sound_a concern_v her_o majesty_n supremacy_n answer_v these_o matter_n direct_o and_o tell_v we_o what_o she_o may_v do_v &_o what_o she_o may_v not_o do_v by_o the_o law_n of_o your_o discipline_n and_o whether_o you_o mean_v to_o hold_v your_o former_a opinion_n or_o renounce_v they_o for_o whatsoever_o you_o swear_v your_o book_n and_o the_o queen_n authority_n give_v she_o by_o the_o law_n of_o this_o land_n can_v stand_v together_o m._n cartwright_n answer_v be_v charge_v to_o have_v high_o commend_v m._n fenner_n book_n which_o 187._o which_o fenneri_fw-la theolog_fw-la sac._n lib._n 5._o p._n 187._o give_v authority_n to_o inferior_a person_n to_o restrain_v their_o sovereign_n as_o do_v the_o ephori_fw-la in_o 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you_o deny_v that_o you_o commend_v his_o rule_n as_o ãâã_d ãâã_d ãâã_d ãâã_d ãâã_d coelestibus_fw-la i_o cancanaan_n i_o cancanaan_n may_v not_o or_o do_v not_o differ_v from_o he_o in_o some_o thing_n contain_v in_o his_o book_n beside_o he_o himself_o confess_v that_o by_o oath_n in_o the_o star-chamber_n i_o have_v disavow_v the_o allowance_n of_o any_o such_o opinion_n which_o he_o father_v of_o m._n fenner_n let_v it_o be_v consider_v with_o obedience_n with_o with_o a_o good_a mind_n to_o show_v your_o contradiction_n and_o how_o hardly_o you_o be_v draw_v to_o obedience_n what_o mind_n he_o so_o often_o rub_v upon_o this_o point_n and_o both_o for_o this_o and_o the_o former_a charge_n i_o leave_v it_o to_o be_v consider_v with_o what_o matter_n what_o what_o civil_a honesty_n have_v you_o to_o charge_v i_o with_o slander_v you_o or_o urge_v i_o to_o move_v these_o matter_n christian_a modesty_n m._n sutcliffe_n may_v now_o the_o time_n the_o if_o you_o quiet_v not_o 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not_o only_o dispute_v it_o but_o resolve_v it_o also_o and_o say_v how_o other_o think_v that_o to_o charge_v m._n cartwr_n with_o ignorance_n be_v mere_a impudency_n so_o many_o university_n church_n and_o nation_n be_v able_a to_o control_v it_o and_o that_o he_o may_v with_o equal_a reason_n be_v charge_v with_o disloyalty_n and_o ignorance_n a_o matter_n sound_v very_o harshlie_o i_o think_v in_o m._n cartwrights_n ear_n for_o which_o i_o refer_v the_o man_n over_o to_o be_v bastonate_v and_o correct_v by_o m._n cartwright_n that_o which_o he_o say_v against_o i_o who_o he_o suppose_v to_o have_v charge_v m._n cartwright_n both_o with_o ignorance_n and_o disloyalty_n remain_v of_o i_o to_o be_v answer_v he_o say_v first_o that_o other_o think_v mean_v his_o own_o consort_n but_o if_o the_o prefator_n will_v not_o believe_v what_o honest_a man_n upon_o just_a cause_n report_n it_o skill_v not_o much_o what_o such_o companion_n think_v he_o give_v m._n cartwr_n the_o title_n of_o 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c._n 8._o socrates_n be_v govern_v elder_n but_o he_o shall_v remember_v they_o give_v no_o definite_a voice_n and_o shall_v have_v be_v exclude_v from_o the_o company_n of_o their_o wife_n if_o paphnutius_fw-la have_v not_o resist_v the_o purpose_n of_o those_o that_o will_v have_v that_o decree_n pass_v which_o to_o interpret_v of_o elder_n only_a governor_n be_v mere_a ignorance_n in_o matter_n of_o history_n and_o direct_v against_o m._n cartwr_n plot_n his_o ignorance_n in_o the_o father_n appear_v both_o by_o the_o former_a argument_n and_o by_o his_o continual_a misallegation_n and_o misconstrue_v of_o they_o to_o go_v no_o further_o examine_v that_o chapter_n or_o reply_n or_o 1._o reply_n section_n which_o he_o have_v frame_v to_o prove_v that_o the_o election_n of_o minister_n ought_v to_o be_v make_v by_o the_o people_n and_o also_o 100_o also_o 1._o reply_n p._n 99_o &_o 100_o those_o place_n where_o he_o will_v prove_v that_o bishop_n whereof_o the_o ancient_a father_n 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latin_a and_o be_v full_a of_o soloecismes_fw-gr in_o the_o beginning_n there_o be_v a_o gross_a solecism_n in_o these_o word_n tua_fw-la legens_fw-la etc._n etc._n subijt_fw-la mentemde_v mose_n viro_fw-la dei_fw-la historia_fw-la likewise_o a_o improprietie_n in_o these_o word_n coelestibus_fw-la canaan_n axiomata_fw-la for_o axiomata_fw-la signify_v rule_n of_o art_n not_o law_n of_o state_n these_o word_n ut_fw-la i_o adomnia_fw-la mea_fw-la officia_fw-la quae_fw-la in_o te_fw-la proficisci_fw-la possunt_fw-la arctius_fw-la devinxeris_fw-la have_v bad_a sense_n and_o a_o barbarous_a phrase_n in_o the_o 2._o page_n lin_v 14._o communices_fw-la be_v put_v for_o communicaris_fw-la nay_o as_o it_o seem_v he_o understand_v not_o latin_a well_o cyprian_n have_v sportulantes_fw-la fratres_fw-la in_o a_o certain_a epistle_n this_o he_o eldership_n he_o 2._o reply_n tract_n eldership_n imagine_v to_o be_v brethren_n of_o the_o basket_n where_o it_o may_v appear_v cyprian_a meanâ_n 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suppellectilem_fw-la habet_fw-la rerum_fw-la omnino_fw-la nullam_fw-la quantum_fw-la ego_fw-la iudicare_fw-la possum_fw-la deinde_fw-la non_fw-la modo_fw-la perversè_fw-la de_fw-la principis_fw-la in_o rebus_fw-la sacris_fw-la atque_fw-la ecclesiasticis_fw-la authoritate_fw-la sentit_fw-la sed_fw-la in_o writing_n in_o m._n whitaker_n touch_v he_o aswell_o for_o disloyalty_n as_o unlearned_a writing_n papistarun_n etiam_fw-la castra_fw-la transfugit_fw-la à _fw-la quibus_fw-la tamen_fw-la vider_n vult_fw-la odio_fw-la capitali_fw-la dissidere_fw-la verùm_fw-la nec_fw-la in_o hac_fw-la causa_fw-la ferendus_fw-la &_o alijs_fw-la etiam_fw-la in_o partibus_fw-la tela_fw-la à _fw-la papistis_fw-la mutuatur_fw-la denique_fw-la ut_fw-la de_fw-fr ambrosio_n dixit_fw-la hieronymus_n verbis_fw-la ludit_fw-la sententijs_fw-la dormitat_fw-la &_o planè_fw-la indignus_fw-la est_fw-la qui_fw-la à _fw-la quopiam_fw-la docto_fw-la refutetur_fw-la that_o which_o i_o say_v in_o general_a he_o say_v in_o 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such_o fellow_n or_o so_o lewd_a as_o to_o say_v that_o he_o shall_v be_v convent_v or_o commit_v an_o other_o question_n be_v likewise_o demand_v quest_n 22_o whether_o ordinary_n have_v not_o contrive_v promulgate_v and_o publish_v article_n he_o mean_v order_n in_o their_o own_o name_n without_o her_o majesty_n assent_n yet_o i_o doubt_v whether_o he_o will_v stand_v to_o affirm_v so_o much_o he_o ask_v whether_o ecclesiastical_a judge_n be_v not_o in_o the_o praemunire_n quest_n 27._o &_o 34._o yet_o dare_v he_o not_o avouch_v it_o like_o wise_a the_o distract_a abstractor_n do_v frame_v many_o odious_a interrogatory_n which_o albeit_o he_o be_v as_o they_o say_v a_o mad_a fellow_n yet_o he_o will_v not_o affirm_v neither_o i_o hope_v will_v m._n cartwright_n make_v affirmation_n of_o they_o he_o ask_v whether_o the_o bishop_n have_v not_o make_v unle_fw-mi arn_v and_o criminous_a minister_n and_o suffer_v they_o to_o continue_v all_o her_o majesty_n reign_n and_o whether_o the_o archbishop_n have_v not_o dispense_v contrary_a to_o god_n word_n and_o may_v exercise_v absolute_a authority_n and_o whether_o the_o archbishop_n be_v a_o excommunicate_a and_o simoniacal_a person_n may_v resort_v to_o the_o pope_n for_o absolution_n yet_o i_o think_v the_o man_n have_v more_o shame_n and_o modesty_n then_o to_o affirm_v any_o such_o matter_n be_v it_o not_o then_o a_o matter_n very_o ridiculous_a that_o m._n cartwright_n will_v have_v question_n to_o be_v affirmation_n beside_o that_o it_o be_v very_o dangerous_a to_o his_o faction_n that_o have_v move_v so_o many_o dangerous_a question_n but_o to_o affirm_v that_o a_o question_n do_v more_o strong_o avow_v then_o a_o affirmation_n as_o do_v m._n cartwr_n be_v most_o strange_a and_o absurd_a neither_o do_v i_o so_o reason_n against_o the_o petitioner_n as_o if_o every_o word_n of_o his_o question_n be_v by_o he_o aver_v and_o affirm_v but_o first_o because_o his_o question_n be_v for_o the_o most_o part_n ground_v 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out_o of_o his_o high_a throne_n of_o the_o eldership_n to_o speak_v to_o i_o a_o poor_a christian_a desirous_a to_o learn_v of_o his_o worship_n well_o therefore_o do_v he_o to_o add_v that_o sometime_o a_o question_n do_v more_o strong_o avow_v than_o a_o affirmation_n for_o it_o be_v some_o what_o to_o much_o to_o say_v that_o it_o do_v so_o at_o all_o time_n and_o not_o true_a that_o it_o do_v so_o at_o any_o time_n but_o be_v it_o true_a yet_o shall_v he_o win_v nothing_o but_o discredit_n to_o reason_n thus_o of_o particular_n for_o although_o sometime_o m._n cartwright_n do_v say_v well_o yet_o he_o do_v not_o so_o always_o but_o suppose_v that_o indeed_o i_o have_v signify_v that_o m._n cart_n have_v purchase_v land_n and_o buy_v lease_n more_o in_o value_n than_o 3._o or_o 4._o good_a lordship_n yet_o shall_v it_o be_v no_o slander_n and_o that_o first_o because_o it_o be_v true_a and_o next_o because_o it_o be_v no_o dishonesty_n to_o purchase_v or_o provide_v by_o honest_a 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that_o he_o sell_v or_o else_o have_v some_o other_o to_o do_v it_o for_o he_o either_o to_o his_o own_o use_n or_o to_o his_o wife_n or_o child_n use_n and_o all_o this_o albeit_o i_o desire_v not_o to_o be_v acquaint_v with_o his_o estate_n i_o have_v by_o certain_a intelligence_n understand_v m._n cartwright_n say_v that_o in_o a_o certeme_a book_n he_o know_v not_o where_o i_o promise_v to_o be_v a_o surveyor_n or_o auditor_n of_o he_o and_o other_o land_n but_o unless_o he_o can_v show_v the_o place_n we_o must_v record_v it_o as_o untruth_n and_o in_o the_o mean_a while_o we_o take_v he_o for_o a_o man_n that_o speak_v he_o know_v not_o what_o and_o that_o be_v write_v he_o remember_v not_o where_o by_o this_o which_o be_v confess_v and_o i_o have_v learn_v it_o appear_v that_o if_o i_o have_v say_v that_o his_o revenue_n be_v more_o than_o some_o 3._o or_o 4._o lordship_n yet_o the_o untruth_n have_v not_o be_v such_o as_o be_v pretend_v for_o you_o see_v what_o be_v confess_v 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