principles of faith wherein consisteth the summe of all religion These first principles of religion assented vnto by this infused faith as the principles of reason by the light of nature haue taken a deeper impression in the mindes of the faithfull than the voice of the Church or an Angell from heauen could haue made For if we saith Paul the Apostles of Christ nay if an Angell from heauen confirmed in the state of happines should preach any other Gospell that is lay any other principles of religion then be all readie layd let him bee accursed Then somewhat there is of more certaintie to vs then Peter or Paul or any Angell Sinos aut Angelus Thus farre therefore you must of necessitie yeeld vnto vs except you withstand the streame of your owne Doctors that albeit the voice of the Church be a witnesse of this truth without exception yet aboue and beside this the minde of a beleeuing Christian is stroken with a lightning from Heauen inspyred with diuine reuelation enformed with that infused faith which farre surpasseth that former faith gotten by discourse and testimonie of the Church without vs. This is the last resolution of our religion into a principle that standes vpon his own ground to wit into an vndoubted assent of the minde informed by true faith fixed by the holy Ghost vpon the Axioms of Christian religion All that I would say to this point is by your Doctor Stapleton well concluded in one period Fideles enim omnes per vocem ecclesiae inducuntur ad fidem inducti autem lumine inspirationis diuinae illustrati non iam amplius propter Loquelam ecclesiae sed propter Lumen illud diuinum credunt But for more remote conclusions drawen from principles by discourse and tract of consequence because therein to rely vpon speciall reuelation were dangerous we most willingly imbrace the voice of the Church in manner as we haue said to your first motiue alwaies acknowledging Gods spirit to be more fully resident in holy assemblies then priuate braines promising to leade the Church into all truth to be resident where two or three are gathered together in his name which spirit for his part will neuer be wanting if the Church for her part be not defectiue But whether these promises made be absolute or with condition that is suppose the Church will not be led whether the spirit will perforce driue her into all truth Suppose her chieftaines assemble themselues with preiudicate and sinister affections not with that sinceritie which is required whether the spirit will therin assist them Or whether these suppositions be possible that God in regard of our sins will suffer such corruptions to creepe into Synodes as may lead thē into errour in some ages more in some lesse though euermore preseruing life in the principles of religion is the point in question Vpon which issue we denie such a power of not erring to the Church militant as should enforce the mind to giue assent to counsell decrees in the same kind and degree of faith as to the articles of beleefe which remaines more fully to be shewed out of your owne groundes MOTIVE FOr they affirme that the authority of the Church and ministerie of whom their followers receiue the sacred scriptures and their expositours be humane and such as may goe aside into errour and sometimes doe So that of necessitie whosoeuer standeth in the integritie of their opinion either haue no faith at all or else onely humane and errant For they that haue a possible impotencie of erring in one point of faith what assurance can they make of distinction that they doe not erre in all ANSVVERE WE affirme the authoritie of the Church and ministerie to be humane in the same sense as Saint Iohn cals it the testimonie of men If we receiue the testimonie of men the testimonie of God is greater Which testimonie of men was by all consent the testimonie of the Apostles themselues who ioyntly were witnesses of the resurrection of the Lord of life Then if the testimonie of the Apostles be humane I hope in the like sense we may call the authoritie of the Church humane I come at the last to that grand motiue whereupon all the rest depends the omnipotence of not erring Wherein that I may quickly touch the point I spare to proue what is granted for we go along certaine steps together without iarring First it is confessed that any counsell particular or general may erre if it be not confirmed by the Pope Secondly that Pope and counsell may erre in any by matter beside the definitiue sentence principally intended Thirdly that they may errein application of scriptures in illustrations in sequel of argument drawne from scripture to inferre that definitiue sentence Fourthly the definitiue sentence it selfe may be erronious if it be defined onely as a probabilitie not as a point of faith Fiftly though it be concluded as a matter of faith yet there may be errour in the proprietie of speech by superfluitie or want of termes by displacing of wordes or such like Only the verie bare maine sense of the conclusion it selfe is cocke sure from errour Into this narrow straite they confesse themselues to haue been alreadie pursued the consideration of which point me thinkes should cause an indifferent mind to pause a little and thinke it strange at the least that the euident truth of the Church testimonie whereupon all catholike faith must depend that the first principle standing vpon his owne ground into which all religion is to be resolued as into a pure element should be put to so many shiftes and hunted into such a narrow roome But further to vrge you with your owne I demaund from whence a counsels definitiue sentence doth receiue her infallibilitie Either it must be immediately from the spirit of God or else by means of consequence from the text of scripture or article whereupon it groundeth The first is by your selues denied for it is the first and speciall difference Bellarmine putteth twixt counsels Canons and canonicall scripture that the word of God is authorized by immediate reuelation from the spirit but counsels deriue their conclusions by discourse from the word Your champion answered me to this point that indeed God would haue his Church to vse those meanes of discourse and testimonie yet at the vpshot the spirit doth fortifie the conclusion and lets the rest go So I hope Paul did apply his bookes and parchments vsed the meanes of studie and discourse though that which he resolued vpon to put in writing was by the immediate motion of the spirit Therefore still this makes no difference at all Then belike if Bellarmine stand it is the discourse sequele of argument which the conclusion must rely vpon for her certaintie but that also proues a broken staffe euen in your owne iudgements Bellarmine saieth it is erronious and Stapleton resolues vpon it that from erronious arguments counsels doe
which that ancient writer so approued by you doth auere Solus sufficit ad omnia satis superque all reformations of the Church whatsoeuer haue been since or hereafter shalbe must come vnder the name of meere restitutions without addition not instituting any new doctrine but restoring the ancient not creating a new Church as you fondly imagine but reducing the old vnto the primitiue Therefore in this kind there is no need of miracles or prodigious signes seeing our reformers bring no new reuelations of their owne but only make appeales to the iudgement of the primitiue Church desire credit of others no further then they giue euidence of argument drawne from such grounds as be receiued of all hands Then seeing their proceedings be ordinarie what extraordinarie wonders are to be expected Neither was it their desire motion in this reformatiō that the present visible Church should fly the world and leaue her kingdome royaltie but onely this y t it should be purged because reason telleth vs experience hath proued it that the visible Church is not al spirit but some flesh though she be informed by the holy Ghost in her holy and generall assemblies yet she consisteth likewise of earthly fraile sinful men therfore she must of necessity gather some dust in time grow corrupt if she do not clense refine her selfe Wherupon motion was made to the commanders of the Church for the reformation of certaine abuses which being crept in had gotten a head and were growne to that pitch that they became burdensome to the consciences of religious men This complaint being not harkened vnto they perswaded themselues that the backwardnes of their brethren could not be to them a sufficient excuse not to reforme themselues For this cause they protested a separation from their fellowship and communion in those points vntill such time as it should please God to moue their minds so to refine themselues from those corruptions as there might insue conformitie a thing wished and praied for with sighes not to be expressed So that the strength of this your Motiue which makes Martin Luther his fellowes seeme so odious vnto you is resolued into these two questions First whether in his time there were abuses in the Church that required a reformation Secondly reformation being denied vnhoped for whether they were abuses of that nature degree as did bind the conscience of true catholikes not to cōmunicate with others in them Which two points if they be true they cleer our reformers frō all slander suspitiō either of heresy or schisme vntil you haue proued them false this the like generall motiues to this purpose be mere shadows without substance of no value or force at all THE SIXTH MOTIVE AS the cause is the paterne of the effects vpon which ground Saint Paul from the vnitie of Gods Church buildeth the vnitie of faith so may we go backwards from the defference of effects to denie the affinitie of the cause and from the impossibilitie of vnion in faith take away the possibilitie of dependance vpon God Such is the religion of the protestants which hath no certaine principle of vnitie and therefore lacketh the cognisance whereby true religion is knowne For where there is not an infallible authoritie which doth iudge and decide controuersies by remouing all actions of doubt and reply and vnto which absolute obedience is tied there must needs be varietie of iudgements and opinions which cannot be tied in one knot For all vnitie in particulars proceedeth from the vnitie of some cause wherein all agree But there is no such infallible authoritie the iudge of controuersies besides the voice of the Church which the protestants either put altogether to silence or else obey so farre as they please For the scriptures whom they haue erected to be iudges as rebels that put downe all iudges and pretend to be ruled onely by the law cannot alone supply this place to take away all occasionof controuersies And if there were no other argument their owne irreconcilable quarrels in so manifold differences among themselues might suffice to stop their mouthes herein For as diuers parcels of silke of deeper or lighter ground dipped by the Dyar in the same liquour drink in a seuerall tincture of colour according to their former varietie so they that diue in the letter of the holy scripture according as their iudgements are before stained with preiudice of one or other opinion come forth againe not in vnity of minds but in the same differences as they went in more or lesse Or as in the miracle of tongues giuen to the Apostles when many auditors of diuers languages came to heare them although the same men could speake no more but one idiome at once yet the seuerall auditours comprehended them as if they had spoken in the proprietie of their speech so when many of diuers languages in religion come to heare some one of the Apostles speaking in the scripture although the author vse onely the voice of the truth yet euery sundrie faction doth conceiue him as speaking in the seuerall confusion of their opinions Neither can they comfort themselues with any hope to see these diuerse opinions wound vp in one confession For as the vnitie in conclusion in logick cannot be without the vnitie of the medium so they cannot meete in that middle way which should bring them into peace able cōposition vnlesse they returne to the Church For all grant there is no way to accomplish it without a councell but who shall call it when there is none whom they all obey How many factions shall assemble out of what sect shall the president be chosen what number of suffrages shall there be on euery side what rule shall bee allowed for the interpretation of the scriptures And if all this were by a dreame imagined yet the authoritie of the Canons and conclusions shall not be so authenticall but that any priuate head may refuse it if in his owne singularity he thinke it disagreeing from the scripture so desperate is the possibilitie of vnion among them that hope which imagineth impossible things cannot possibly imagine it ANSVVERE AS euery defect and imperfection tendeth vnto dissolution so the good estate of euery bodie aswell politicke and mistical as natural doth consist in the vnity of the whole harmonie of the parts amongst themselues Therfore seeing the band of vnitie knitting many members into one whole maketh an entire body that societie is of all others conceiued to be most absolute which hath attained to the greatest perfection of vnitie Which kind of reason moued the Philosopher to giue the preeminence to a Monarchy before other simple formes So the Apostle in the place whence you take your rise from the vnitie of Gods Church doth build the vnity of faith as also the vnity of spirit in the bond of peace vrging a preseruation and increase of the same as a thing most perfecting the
waigh together the spouse of Christ with Luther Caluin Melancthon aecumenicall counsels with priuate opinions the reuerend and learned fathers with Arius Aetius Vigilantius men alwaies in their time burned for heretikes the harmony of Churches with the iarring of conuenticles of them that are in as great brawle with themselues as with the catholikes The vniforme practise of 1500. yeares with the often change of others The tradition of the Apostles with the dregs of heretikes Now let any man though ouerbalanced by affection consider with himselfe whether of these should be beleeued in expounding the scriptures and consequently in the truth of the controuersies which relyeth vpon the sence ANSVVERE THis is right the wise man of Athens who thought all the shippes his owne which came to hauen Church councels Fathers Apostolicall traditions all yours And we poore soules turned ouer to a few single spirits Luther Caluin Melancthon c. If I might be so bold with you as Sir Thomas More was in like case with a protestant it were time to put you in minde of one Caius who encountring with a scholler would needs haue his first demaunde graunted to wit whatsoeuer had two eares was a foolish beast For els he could not so gallantly haue come vpon him as otherwaies he had ment Your demand is alike reasonable For you assume no more as graunted but the iudgment of the Church the definition of councells the consent of Fathers the harmonie of Churches the practise of all ages the rule of Apostolicall tradition Which if we giue you and leaue our selues a few particular mens expositions indeede I confesse you may conclude at your pleasure But it is wel knowen we doe no further relie vpon those learned mens assertions then they be authorized by the forenamed witnesses Which testimonies so confidently alledged for your parte I hope you are not ignorant how that all along in our apologies defences and answeres they be brought against you by our defenders especially those witnesses of more ancient times vnto whom we are content to appeale as most indifferent iudges and more sincere then any of later times being neerer to Christ and further from these factions To put you out of doubt I will set downe our owne words Quam ea die Iuellus vocem verissimam ac constantissimam emisit quando ad sexcentorum annorum antiquitatem prouocanit vobisque obtulit vt si vel vnicam ex aliquo patre aut consilio claram dilucidam sententiam afferretis non recusaret quin vobis palmam concederet ea est nostrûm omnium professio idem omnes pollicemur fidem non fallemus THE SECOND MOTIVE THe mysteries of religion do so far exceede the narrow straites of our vnderstanding that because they cannot be comprehended by reason God hath therefore appointed faith to entertaine them which faith is built vpon diuine and vnfallible authoritie the minde yeelding obedience in stead of discourse receiuing indifferently the truth of doctrine vpon the credit and affiance of the teacher Therefore that religion which doth not stay the assent of the scholler and hath not irrefragable authoritie in all matters of faith hath neither merit of beliefe in it selfe nor others But such is the discipline of the protestants that they affoord their schollers no other but humane and mutable authoritie whereby to beleeue the number and dignitie of the scriptures with the sense and interpretation of them in which consisteth the summe of all religion ANSVVERE THe mysteries of religion doe far exceede the narrow straites of our vnderstanding for without controuersie great are those mysteries to wit God is manifested in the flesh iustified in the spirit seene of Angels beleeued on in the world and receiued vp into glorie Amongst which the schollers assent to those misteries is accounted one beleeued on in the world which you haue well expressed appointing faith not reason to entertaine them The mind yeelding obedience in steed of discourse receiuing indifferently the truth of doctrine vpon the credit and affiance of the teacher This teacher you haue determined to be the inflexible testimonie of the catholike Church of whome we receiued the forenamed principles of religion yea the scriptures themselues And surely that minde which would not yeeld obedience to the testimonie of this generall voice were in all sound iudgments most vnreasonable For doth not reason her selfe tell vs That which most men and wisest agree vpon is most true doth she not adde further Those men be wisest next God that are most deare vnto him Then that religion which is professed and taught by the most holy and catholike Church which is venerable for antiquitie certaine for succession comely for order admirable for vnitie approued by experience allowed by prouidence confirmed by miracles rooted in so many kingdomes neuer doubted of but by heretikes is in the very eye of reason to be imbraced How thinke you Is not this reasons discourse And a sound discourse You must not deny it for it is your owne If reason then build vpon Church authoritie how place you faith in reasons roome If this be reasons discourse what is that yeelding obedience in stead of discourse Where is that great mysterie of godlines beleeued on in the world which captiuates the vnderstanding to the obedience of faith Let me helpe you out with a schoole distinction that wee may cleere the way before vs. The schollers assent to the Church testimonie is called faith I confesse but such a faith as the schoole termeth Acquisita fides faith gotten by discourse testimonie of the holy men of God a faith caried along by reason grounding vpon sufficient witnes and conuincing the vnderstanding by euidence of demonstration a faith incident not to wicked men only but the diuels themselues But the schoole diuines haue taught a more diuine faith which they call Infusa fides immediatly inspired by the holy Ghost from heauen informing the minde inclining the will to entertaine the principles of christianitie with all perfect obedience in stead of discourse For the begetting of which faith in the hearts of men that former testimonie of the Church and discourse of argument doth wonderfully dispose and prepare the minde but y t which giues the stroke and addeth life vnto it is the celestiall motion of Gods spirit which Saint Iohn calls the witnes within vs opposing it to the Church testimonie without vs. This is that true faith which Aquin affirmes neuer to bee found in diuels which Scotus aueres neuer to be void of christian charitie which Bellarmin proues and Trent defines neuer to be obtained without diuine reuelation and inspiration of Gods spirit vpon which it is built as vpon diuine and vnfallible authoritie the minde yeelding obedience in steede of discourse and receiuing indifferently the truth of doctrine vpon the credit and affiance of this teacher Hereupon doth our religion stay the assent of the scholler and hath irrefragable authoritie in the
was from the law of nature to the subiection of the law written The second from the seueritie of the law vnto the obedience of the Gospell Christ being the summe of all but with difference For in the state of nature he was discerned a farre of as a bodie In the law he was distinguished neerer as a man In the Gospell he is seene face to face Both these chaunges were restitutions of the former but with some perfection For Moses restored the decalogue sacrifice worship of one God circumcision tenths sabbaths and such like which were in the state of nature but arbitrarie for harmonie In the Gospell Christ the interpretation of the law which was corrupted and the three great parts of religion iustificaon by faith which was exemplified in Abraham the sacrifice of himselfe which was figured in Isaack and in the Pasca the mysterie of baptisme which was instituted in the deluge and redde sea and the Eucharist which was acted by Melchisedech For like as when Thamar the daughter in law of Iuda brought forth her twinnes Zaram and Phares Zaram first put forth his hand and the midwife tied a red threed about it and he pulled it in againe and his brother Phares was borne afore him So the Sacraments of the Gospell which are bound about with the redde threed of Christ his passion did first shew their hand in Abraham and Melchisedech but the Sacraments of the Iewes were borne before them So that these two be not chaunges but restitutions and these are two earthquakes registred in the scripture prophecied of before expected by the Church brought in with prodigious signes confirmed by the visible presence of God in miracles and one more we expect which shall chaunge all things temporall into eternall at the ende of the world Besides these neither the scripture mentioneth any more neither the iudgement of the Chuch and fathers did expect other For what prophesie either in the old testament or in the new made way for this reformation after 1000. or 1500. yeares What prodigious signes gaue the world warning of Luthers comming which of the creatures out of course gaue attendance at his birth with what extraordinarie power was he garded with what miracles was his doctrine graced That a religion venerable for age certaine for succession comely for order admirable for vnitie approued by experience allowed by prouidence confirmed by miracles rooted in so many kingdomes that neuer was doubted of but by heretikes neuer saw change but by her enemies should vpon one mans and such a mans credit and authoritie without greater cause nay without any cause fly the world leaue her kingdom and royalty at the dispose of one Apostata and Monke and an incestuous Monke ANSVVERE THose two memorable varieties one restoring nature by the moral law adding withal a vaile of shadowes and religious ceremonies the second remouing that vaile changing the moonelight of the law into the sunshine of the Gospell haue the preeminence before all other changes whatsoeuer neither is there any past or herafter to be expected cōparable to these two Notwithstanding besides these there haue been many restitutions of the Church from errours and heresies in al ages you discern none at all Yet of all others I wonder you spied not that of the morning starre Iohn Baptist so conspicuous aboue the rest so consonant to your owne notes Registred in Scripture prophesied of before expected by the Church brought in with prodigious signes who made a memorable varietie not onely by way of restitution in the doctrine of repentance but also by addition in his watrie baptisme The rising of which starre was the moone-set of Moses and the Prophets making a period of the law For so saith the text The law the Prophets lasted till Iohn Baptist who shined till the son of God appeared and then ceased Oportet illum crescere meautē minui Moreouer besides these three lights if I should take vpon me to reckon the lesser lights of the Church which haue restored it from darkenesse and corruption in all ages I might as well number the starres in the firmament Were not Abraham and Lot lights to expell the mistes of that idolatrous age Did not false gods after so farre preuaile that they entred into the familie of blessed Iaacob and possessed all that were about him till he rose as a starre in his brightnes to cleere his whole family and make restitution of his former religion in Bethel How many relapses in the time of the law not onely the congregation of Israel adored a calfe but euen the Priest himselfe was vrged to consent as you confesse Pope Liberius was to Arrianisme Did not all Israel after the death of Ioshua and that good generation runne after Baalim In the time of Saul the Arke of God was neuer sought for till that glorious starre of Israel king Dauid restored it againe How many Idols were after erected by the kings of Ierusalem and Iuda All the abhominations of the nations and the whole host of Heauen worshipped in Israel carued Images seated in the temple of God yea the booke of the law lost by the priestes Yet notwithstanding as their backslidings were many so was there manifold restitution made by the lightes of Israel the Church still reformed againe by the Prophets and holy men of God And can you spie neuer a reformation besids those two grand ones of Moses and the sonne of God This was the condition of the natural branches the Iewes and no lesse is to be expected of the Church of the Gentiles in this state militant but that it be sometimes darkned eclipsed as wel in abuse of practise as error of doctrine in some ages more in some lesse again by diuine prouidence raising vp some of notable learning and extraordinary spirit enlightned and restored to her first integritie so farre forth as truth can preuaile with corruption of the time such were the Catholike Bishops that restored her from the deluge of Arrianisme Neither is it to be expected that any of the creatures should be out of course to giue the world warning of such reformers For it is well knowne these reformations be of a farre other kind then those former made by Moses Iohn Baptist the son of God For those were euer with some addition of perfection not reuealed before Therefore no reason the world should take notice of them without diuine confirmation by signes wonders For had Moses Iohn Baptist or the Messias himselfe borne witnesse of themselues without the testimonie of miraculous workes or former prophesies there being neitheir Canon of Scripture to proue them nor diuine reuelation to discerne them by no reason in the world nor religionin the Church could possibly haue entertained them But sithence the last perfection is now reuealed by the Gospell and that absolute Canon of Scripture giuen to the Church to which nothing must be added in paine of eternall plague of