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A90962 The city-remonstrance remonstrated. Or An answer to Colonell John Bellamy, his Vindication thereof, in justification of The moderate reply to the city-remonstrance. / By I.P. Price, John, Citizen of London. 1646 (1646) Wing P3339; Thomason E345_18; ESTC R200996 24,101 36

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personally sell such bookes as prayer bookes c. which were ordinarily sold by other Stationers in your Masters shop in so much as that your name grew famous for a most pious and conscientious man to the multiplying of your acquaintance and the begetting and increasing your customers when you set up shop for your selfe and studying to know more of the mind and will of God as touching the dispensation of his publique Ordina●c●s worship the businesse of infants baptisme came into your consideration and in that point you fel into the opinion of Anabaptists but whether rebaptized or no I cannot tell after this still respecting so far as men could judge the main duty of christ●anity viz. not to sin against your conscience condemn●●● your selfe in the thing that you allowed according to the 〈◊〉 of your own judgement and conscience you applied your s●ll to a ●eparate congregation whereof Mr. Jacob was Pastor and desired admission thereunto and upon your acknowledgemen● o● your error concerning Anabaptism you were admitted with whom continuing and frequen●ing to walk with them in their more private meetings through the tyranny of those times you were by the Bishops officers apprehended so had up into the High-Commission Court at which time your godly friends as was their duty came unto you and gave you brotherly exhortations encouragements unto Christian courage and fortitude not to sh●inke but to honour God by suffering according to that present call which you had thereunto but it seemes you had not yet received strength to abide such a temptation and therefore grievously tooke on wishi●g you had never beene borne and in short by the mediation of some friends and upon the giving of your bonds that you would no● goe among that separate Church congregation any more c. you were set free againe and being called in question by some of your brethren for so doing you endevoured to satisfie them as cōcerning your giving bonds to come among them no more with this consideration viz you could better give bonds therby only hazarding your purse then your verball promise to doe so nomore to the hazard of the peace of your conscience insinuating thereby that it was not the care of your purse but of your conscience that made you run that course at which answer your friends being satisfied for the present as judging the best of you they expected your Communion and fellowship as before but considering it seemes the danger thereof you withdrew from them made a Schisme and went away and as some say after along tymes forbearance and many admonitions was at last excommunicated which act of theirs it is presumed is the maine sourse of those bitter proceedings of you●s against these wares revenge it s feared putting you on worke After your separation and rent from them you became againe an obedient and dutifull child to the Canons of Episcopacy giving ample testimony hereunto by singular observance of one of their great Commandements viz. the frequent and decent publique use of the Common prayers of the Church observing their injunctions even to a tittle standing whē they bid you stand kneeling whē they bid you kneel so observing your postures to the life yea your dutiful obeysance to the fathers of the Church falsely so called I meane the Prelates was abundantly testified by your exact performance of another of their great lawes like unto the former viz receiving the Sacrament of the Lords Supper kneeling at the high Altar as intelligence affirmes if men may beleeve their eyes but before your stomach could digest a high Alter you prepared your self for it by degrees first refusing to come to common Service but going only to heare Sermons after this common prayer would down with you but not if read by any with a Surplisse a while after neither Common Prayer nor Surplesse nor high Altar it selfe was to hard meat for you to the great griefe and amazement of godly non-Conformists who were never in the separate Churches and the rather considering your Christian dial●ct and language of Canaan which was yet notwithstanding all this often found to proceed from you and not very long since the glory of Christian society and brightnes of such a fellowship dashing upon your cōscience you betook your self to a very precious select company of christians who met togetherin a coutsary maner according to agreeme● for the mutual com●ort edification of one another by pra●er exhortation and the exercise of one anothers gifts in which company none more free frequent and forward then Master Bellamy and indeed according to their acknowledgements exceeding and excelling them all in delivering many lushious soule-refreshing and heart-quickening truths both in pra●er and other exercises the sweetnesse benefit and comfort thereof being yet as Manna in their palates the dew of Heaven upon their hearts who with much griefe of soule assert these things Now sir I beseech you take notice that I doe not in the least reflect upon you for your difference in judgement from what you have beene heretofore your selfe nor from your brethren nor yet for your so often altering your judgement and practice but this is that that I would you all others should observe in you how you have made a personall experiment of all those waies have been for Bishops against Bishops for Anabaptists and against Anabaptists for Sepatates and against Separates for Bish ●gain and against Bish for Common prayer book and against Common-prayer book for conformity against conformity and now as it were halfe facing you are for Presbytery viz. jure humano and so left to the wisdom of Parliament and the prudence of Christian Magistrates this is the profession of your lips and yet you act and that to the utmost with those that hold it Jure divino and seekes the establishment of it in that cōsideration so that your tongue complements with the Parliament and sayes as concerning the power of Church government let the Crowne be set upon the head of Civill authority the high Court of Parliament sitting at Westminster and yet your hands endevour to lift it up and fix it upon the Temples of the Episcopall Corporation the London Ministers sitting at Sion Colledge and so you are likewise for Presbytery against Presbytery and yet that you should scoffe and jeere at your brethren that differ from you though you agree not even with your selfe as men intoxicated and elevated with new Lights doctrines of new date Sectaries hereticks more beseeming a Judas a Julian a Baalamite then Master Bellamy oh Sir whither are you fallen Master Bellamy what is salt worth that hath lost its sav●u● will you that have beene enlightned and tasted of the Heavenly gift and beene made partaker of the Holy Ghost tasted the good word of God and the powers of the world to come crucifie to your selfe the Sonne of God afresh in his members by seeking for and endevouring after an effectuall course of
d●ssent from it c. For this as Paul did referre the Athenians to one of their owne Poets so shall I you to your own Oracle the City Remonstrance where you do in expresse terms affirme from the botome of your heart you do seriously professe before Almighty God that you do not conceive it in the power of any humane Authority King Lords Commons together or apart in Parliament or out of Parliamēt to discharge or absolve you from adhering to the Covenant see Mr. Bellamy if you your self with al your brethen Remonstrants do not make good w ht I have affirm'd viz. that when the Kngdome representative acts in a direct evident obvious manner against the expresse will word of God the Kingdome collective ought in duty to dissent from it if not to protest against it and thus Mr. Bellamy your foot is taken in that very snare which you laid for your Brethren now Sir should I as weakly sult over you as you do over the Replier I may say what I pray you will tha● produce think you in the common Wealth●er Kingdom of England and anon after if this be not then I pray tell me what is the highway to desolution of Parliaments and consequently to the distructon of the Kingdome and therefore have not I as good reason to say to you and the rest of the Remonstrants as you had to the Replyer either shew me whether the Remonstrants have not said as much as the replyer or else confesse your error and cry peccavimus but to go on the Replier saith All which granted as cannot be denied You demand what he meanes by all which granted as cannot be denied I answer for him that surely he meanes nothing but what he did affirme Viz The undoubted truth of those 4 conclusions for he had said no more although he might have made it very good that the Common cou●cell had acted in all and every one of the 4. fore-mentioned cases I shall instance in the first of the 4 and if that be cleared that the Common-councell by their Remonstrance did act in a direct evident and obvious manner against the expresse will and word of God it will follow that they did act against the apparent welfare of City and Kingdome c. LET VS TRY THEN WORD OF GOD. CITY REMONSTRANCE Rom. 14 5. Let every man he fully perswaded in his own minds That as we are subjects of one Kingdom so all may be equally required be they perswaded in their own minds or not perswaded to yeeld obedience to the government 〈◊〉 forth or to be set forth by Parliament Rom. 14. 13. That no man put a stumbling block or an occasion to fall in b● brothers w●y That all such Sectaries as conforme not to the publique Discipline established or to See stablished may be fully declared against and some effectuall course setled for proceeding against such persons 5. Petition Heare is a stu●blingblock viz. a menace in a Brothers way Deut 19. 15. At the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every thing be established That Quarter-man may be brought to some exemplary punishment for the affront done by him c. Though no such thing was ever proved by one witnesse or testimony that what he did was any affront done to the priviledges and government of the City Hang him hang him what hath he done Mat. 7. 12. As you would that men should doe unto you so doe unto them for this is the Law and the Prophets Page 3. We will not receive impression of any forced construction of the Covenant Compare this with page the 7th The 4. Petition That no person disaffected to Presbyterian Government may be imployed in any place of publique trust but some effectuall course setled to proceed against such persons as in the 3. Petition Presbyteriall government is not in the Covenant therefore an interpretation and this you force upon others though you will receive no forced construction of the same your selves And thus the word of God and the City Remonstrance proclaime open warre one against the other and it is no hard matter to determine which shall get the victory and take the spoyle And for the other 3. cases the Replyer hath said more then your Vindication as substantiall as it is hath yet disproved But let us heare what your Vindication further affirmeth The Replier dealeth with your Remonstrance 1. In the Narrative Part of it 2. Petitionary Part of it 3. The tendency and dangerous effects of both 1. In the Narative part of it he tels you the phrase and Dialect of it carried afull complyance with his Majesties wonted declarations against the Parliament to this you answer it complies in verbis with a declaration of the House of Commons and referres your reader to the Remonstrance of the state of the Kingdome Page 19. where there are in deed the same words with your Remonstrance the Replier tels you that the phrase stile and dialect of your Remonstrance agrees with the Kings wonted declarations against the Parliament infinuating into the people that all manner of Heresies and Sectaries c. are tolerated by the Parliament c. you doe not seem to deny such things in the Kings Declarations but you deny any such things in the City Remonstrance and for this you compare the words of the Remonstrance with the words of the Replyer and demand whether the words of the Remonstrance be the same with the words of the Replier I answer you the Replier did not say they were the same but yet they were insinuations for the boldest and brazen ●ac'd Malignant that is durst not positively affirme it in the Parliaments quarters and should we produce as a very little labour will serve to doe it several passages and expressions from the tongues pens and pulpits of severall and divers sorts of men who had no small influence in the businesse of the City Remonstrance and reference unto it since it came out it would very easily appeare what were the Insinuations of the phrase stile and dialect thereof you say the Sectaries are incouraged by their misconstruction of that expression in the late declaration concerning tender consciences but how doe you know they are incouraged Surely it must be your observation of them and their expressions as you have occasion to converse with them give us but this ground to build assertions upon and we can boldly affirme that the phrase stile and dialect of the City-Remonstrance insinuates that the Parliament under a pretence of their respects to tender consciences designes a toleration of Sectaries Heretiques c. and more that Malignants Royalists Cavaliers Ignorant Scandalous Prophane Lewd and wicked persons are more imboldned encouraged tickled and comforted by this Remonstrance then by anything that ever came out against the Parliament blessed be God the Parliament hath still respect unto tender consciences surely the Remonstrants consciences were not very tender in taking any offence thereat and if they were
proceedings against such persons whom your owne soule and consci●●ce cannot but know to be as tender unto God as the apple of his eye will you put the Lord Iesus againe to open shame by representing his Servants and redeemed ones in the eyes of the world for Sectaries Schismaticks Hereticks will you prove the earth that drinketh the rain● that commeth oft upon it I meane one of those who have been so ancient a professor conversant in so many precious meetings heard and received so many glorious truths of God powred forth so many prayers and tears unto Cod made so many Covenants of love tendernes to the Saints of God professing such indeered intimate respects to godly men retained such noble resolutions to follow God according to your light c not bringing forth ●●earbs I mean meat for him his children family viz. Glory to God love kindnesse gentlenesse meeknesse mercy goodnesse to his children meet for him by whom it is drest that you might receive a blessing but contrary wise bring forth thornes and briers scratching galling and vexing your brethren in the faith undermining their peace and comfort not only joyning with but stirring up the Magistrates against them and appearing in print in the vindication thereof is not the end of such ground everlasting burnings God deliver you from it consi●e● Sir your master is comming if you smite your fellow servants he will call you to an accompt for it and how will you answer it I know you doe not thinke that you persecute the Saints but what is persecu●ion if this is not To seeke for a suppression by an effectuall course of those Saints and servants of God that submit not to Presbyteriall Church Government which your selfe except altered of late in your judgement will not acknowledge of divine institution If you doe the same things which the Bishops did is it persecution in them not in you I hope Mr. Bellamy you have yet those sparkes in you of divine heat and fire which may yet kindle into a glorious flame quench●t not I confesse it will be a great piece of selfe-denyall in you to retract such unworthy proceedings especially lying under such great temptations to the contrary as you doe but Sir the world to come is the everlasting world the riches thereof the durable substance the praise of God and not of men the chiefest honour consider of it and doe as God shall perswade your heart but listen then unto his perswasions and stifle not the motions and dictates of your owne light hereunto Consider Sir the day wasteth the night is comming your house of clay cannot last long your soule must shortly sit upon your trembling lips you have a precious soule in a vile body and your Antagonist loves it what ever you suppose who is more bold with you in this kind of dialect because you very well know the meaning thereof I have more to say concerning your booke otherwise I would be more pressing and urgent with you th●n I am But you demand What is Londons care of keep their Covenant now become Londons ruine I answer Sir did our Covenant bind us to suppresse all the holy godly conscientious sons daughters of God which were but even di●affected to Presbyteriall government if so bold I am to affirme that Londons care to keep the Covenant Will now become Londons ruine a bloody cruell cursed Covenant if that be the meaning of it but confident I am as there is no such thing exprest in the Covenant so no such meaning can be rationally gathered there from and therefore it is not the Covenant but such an interpretation that is here impleaded can wee think that the present Parliament of England the great benefactors of tender consciences for which the good will of him that dwelt in the Bush be ever amongst them would ever bind the inhabitants of this Kingdome in such amonstrous designe if persecution of tender consciences evidenced but by so much as disaffection ●o the Presbyterian government be the matter of the Covenant what have wee done but even struck hands with the Devill and said a confederacy with all his cursed seed that we will root out a great part of as holy harmelesse and blessed a generation as is in the world is this the meaning of the lifting up of your hands unto the most high God to give the greater blow upon the head of his servants here upon earth Surely Sir if I had lifted up my hand in taking the Covenant with such an intention I should have expected the withering of it and better it should be so then ever it should be found performing such a cursed thing but the truth is the holy Scripture it selfe by a wicked interpretation proves the bane and ruine of some and so may this Covenant upon such an interpretation but who ever it is that maketh such an interpretation of the Covenant let him be for ever numbered among the Cananites covenanted Enemies against the Isralites but let the Heavens be astonished and the earth tremble that ever any professing Christ not fild with malice and despite against the Spirit of grace should take such a covenant with such an interpretation You goe on with more interrogatories which are little more then meer flourishings and that which any impartiall man may answer even in reading them and therefore I shall wave them In the next place where you deale with the Replyer for I observe nothing else you take upon you to decide a State question and that none of the meanest neither I confesse some Common-councell men need to be states-men for they intermeddle with States-matters more I presume then ever any that were before them and more I beleive then ever God or man gave them authority to doe I feare some of them doe much forget themselves and take themselves to be Londons Parliament and not Londons Common-councell for it is the Kingdome the Church the State-affaires that they intermedle with not confining themselves unto their City-Charter but acting according to Parliament principles in time they may be better instructed but to the question and that is this Wherein resides the Supreame power of this Kingdome Mr. Bellamy answers thus The two Houses of Parliament viz. the Lords and Commons with the King who is alwaies in his Kingly power present with them though in person somtimes as now is absent from them are those three Estates of which the fundamentall constitution of this Kingdome is made up and have in them ioyntly and together all the Supreame power of this Kingdome and not any one of those three Estates considered apart and by it selfe can properly be said to have the whole Supreame power of the Kingdome residing in it and therefore the House of Commons being but one of those three estates well might the Remonstrants say that they are betrusted but with a share of the Supreame power of the Kingdome and for proofe of all this his reading referres us to