she confesseth to be set downe in dumbe words obscure ambiguous applyable to every sense and which may be produced and vrged against her selfe How will the Atheists laugh at this how alas will the consciences of them bee shaken that beleeue and receiue this opinion of the obscurity ambiguity and insufficiencie of the Scriptures Let vs consider in the second place that their ayme is to cast all Christians into incertainty striuing to proue by these allegations that a man in what concernes Religion ought to mistrust his owne judgement which being once granted how shall a man know whether hee deceiues not himselfe in beleeving that there is a Church Here the Scripture cannot succour or helpe for it is presupposed that it cannot afford any certainty It is laid for a foundation that a Christian hearing reading meditating on the Scripture may coozen and deceiue himselfe Neither can a man in this straight haue recourse to the testimony of the holy Ghost for the allegation presupposeth that it cannot be knowne neither who hath neither whether a man himselfe hath the holy spirit or no. And as for the authority of the Church it cannot bee alleaged for question may bee made whether there be any Church at all As then to him who should doubt whether there ought to be a Pope in the world it would seeme strange far frō the purpose to alleage the testimony of the Pope for to perswade him that there ought to bee one Even so when we are to proue that there is a Church it is in vaine to alleage the testimony of the Church If then Christian Religion hath no foundation either in the Scripture or in the testimony of the holy Ghost or in the authority of the Church as it followeth from the allegation where shall shee seeke where shall shee finde where-vpon to vphold her selfe shall it bee in Philosophie there much lesse for if a Christian man cannot judge whether there be a Church by the spirit as not being able to assure himselfe whether hee hath the spirit much lesse able shall hee be to do it by his reason which without the spirit is starke blinde in spirituall things Let vs in the third place consider that in the disputes touching the markes and notes of the Church it is questioned what they are one is of one opinion another of another whence may a certaine knowledge of them bee had shall it bee from the Scripture but the allegation presupposeth that it is impossible shall it bee from the Church never the nearer for it so litle appeares which is the Church that it is controversed what are her markes by which she is knowne Let vs in the fourth place consider that grant wee had found the markes of the Church according to the allegation which casts men into incertitude it could not be discerned to what congregation to apply them amongst so many and divers assemblies who challenge them for it is supposed as granted according to the allegation that the Scripture cannot here guide vs that wee may deceiue our selues in making the choyce and the testimony of the Church can as little helpe vs if first of all it bee not presupposed that it hath the markes of the Church which is the point in question for wee seeke in what Church the markes of the Church are to bee found and to rely herein vpon the testimony of the Church doth presuppose that wee know already in what Church the markes of the Church are found Let vs in the fift place consider that according to the allegations there is no meanes how a man converted to the Church canne bee assured of his Religion For if hee hath not beene convinced by lawfull arguments neither his profession which followed the conviction of his conscience shall be lawfull It is very certaine that if the foundation of his faith who hath beene converted bee the authority of the Church the foundation of his conuersion hath not beene lawfull for there was no meanes to perswade him that the Church hath any such authority in alleadging to him the testimony of the Church And the allegation of Scripture and of reason according to their supposition is not a lawful meanes to resolue the conscience Having bin then brought to acknowledge the authority of the Church founded vpon these arguments it cannot be but weake and vnlawfull and consequently the beleefe of all that hee hath beleeued as depending vpon the authority which hee giveth vnto the Church And indeede if such a one whom wee would convert doth question the authority of the Church shall we proue vnto him that whereof he doubteth by alleaging vnto him that whereof hee maketh likewise doubt the argument then of his conuersion to the acknowledgment of the Church cannot haue beene the authority of the Church If then no man can bee assured of the foundation of his conversion no more neither can hee bee which is builded vpon the foundation In the sixt place let vs obserue that the Church which is called Catholique never speaketh by word of mouth they are the particulars that are her Heralds It may bee demanded then by what meanes a man may bee assured that they discharge their place faithfully since they may erre in proposing doctrine contrary to the meaning of the Church This cannot bee by the Scripture for according to the allegation truth and falsehood cannot be discerned by it no nor by the testimony of the Church for he speaketh not but by particular men of whom it is doubted whether they haue faithfully reported the determination of the Church In the Seaventh place let vs consider that if the authority of the Church bee the foundation of faith every one shall beleeue because his companion hath beleeued and so christian religion shall bee made ridiculous for seeing the Church is a congregation of persons in which every one grounds his faith vpon the authority of the whole congregation of which they are Members it will necessarily follow that every one of them shall beleeue apart because all haue beleeued together In the eight place let vs weigh this horrible inconvenience that we shall not beleeue the mysteries of the Trinit of the incarnation of the redemption of mankinde but by heare-say because our Ancestours our Parents our fellow burgesses haue beleeued so and shall not beleeue that they haue beene the Church of God but because they haue left this testimony of themselues which the Iewes may vsurpe with the like appearance of right if we renounce the authority of Scriptures Now haue wee verified this last meanes of Nullity not to incense any God is our witnesse but to shew if it bee possible into what and how many execrable absurdities some amongst them vnadvisedly precipitate themselues who by the meanes of these allegations endeavour to draw vs from the judgement of God speaking in the Scripture to the judgement of men pretending the title of the Church being most certaine that he who vrged principally this
convince or satisfie the heart and conscience such was the practise of the Apostolicall Church The Fathers haue so carried themselues towards Heretiques yea S Austustine himselfe speaking of the Manicheans is of this opinion And if any of the Ancients haue vsed perscription in any such case it hath beene in matters that were not properly of the essence of faith or if the doctrine was quaestioned then haue they to do with them who grounded not themselues especially vpon the Scripture but wrested according as they listed some certaine peeces of it forcing them to their purpose and as it were by torture making them to confesse what they never knew And therefore the same Fathers called theÌ„ Sucifugas Scripturarum men who shunne the light of the Scripture yea in those times prescription became them well It was impossible that then there should bee such a declining and falling from the trueth The mystery of iniquity which had already begunne to be conceiued in the times of the Apostles was yet in the cradle Our condition at this day is otherwise who are come vnto the last times who reckon a thousand and soe many hundred yeares since the flourishing and happy times of the Apostles During which so long space of time this mystery should in probability be well growne Wee see the most flourishing Churches in times past planted by the Apostles now brought into desolation and we cannot now call to witnesse the memory of men CHAP. 4. Wherein are proposed the allegations against the sufficiencie of the Iudge to whom those who desire a reformatioÌ„ do appeale BVT for all this they call in doubt the sufficiencie of the Iudge before whom the accusers commence their suite to wit God speaking in the Scriptures or by the Scriptures 1 They doubt whether hee can be Iudge considered after that manner because say they every Iudge ought to speake now God speaking in the Scripture is as though hee did not speake at all the Scripture having neede it selfe to bee propounded and applyed by some other 2 And besides the words of a Iudge ought to be cleare intelligible this writteÌ„ word is obscure as much as may be 3 Thirdly the Scripture is ambiguous and subject to divers interpretations whereas the decrees of a Iudge ought to be certaine and positiue 4 Fourthly the Scripture is defectiue and imperfect and therefore cannot be extended nor applied to the decision of our controversies 5 Fiftly the resolution of a Iudge ought to make them agree who referre themselues to him whereas it is seene what discord there is even amongst those who would end these variances by the Scriptures 6 Sixtly the Heretiques themselues make vse of the Scriptures whereas the sentence of the Iudge cannot advantage the party condemned by him 7 Seaventhly if God speaking in or by the Scripture were the Iudge to what end then serue the Councels 8 Finally if we had no other determination then that of the Scriptures we must needes alwaies liue in vncertainty for the weaknesse and deceitfulnesse of mans vnderstanding considered who amongst so great a multitude in such a discord of those who take vpon theÌ„ to haue the gift of the holy Ghost could know and discerne who hath it Who amidst such a nuÌ„ber of those who think they haue it are deceiued in their opinion can assure himselfe that hee hath it what then do they refuse to be Iudged by no meanes in apperance but they would haue the Church to be judge the truth is that when that comes to the vpshot wee find that this Church is themselues who would bee both iudges and parties as shall be more plainely showne hereafter CHAP. 5. The proposall of the meanes of nullity against the foresaid allegations and the verifying of the first meanes against the first and second allegation NOW let vs consider their arguments alleadged against the sufficiencie of the judge before whom they are summoned which if they are not 1 Contrary to their owne designe 2. to the truth 3. If they do not tend to the subversion of Christian Religion the accusers refuse not to accept of them But if they be found incompatible 1. with the cause for the defence of which they are alleaged 2. with the truth 3. with the authority of Christian Religion No body will condemne the accusers of false dealing if they keepe themselues to their first citation and appeale But we are confident that all these meanes of nullity may easily be verified and that wee may proceede in order let vs beginne with the first and let vs consider all these reasons one after another if they do not oppose that cause in favour of which they are produced 1 And as for the first if God speaking in the Scriptures or by the Scriptures is as if hee speake not at all vnder a colour that the Scripture is dombe and giuing no sound ought wee not vpon the same reason to say that the Fathers speaking in their writings the Church speaking in the CanoÌ„s of the Councells the Pope in his decrees and decretalls in his breefes and in his bulls and indulgences it were all one as if the Fathers Church and Pope speake not at all And ought not the writings of the Fathers the Canons of the Councels the decrees and decretals the briefes bulls and indulgences bee propounded and applyed nay and that by such who are not qualified for iudges to wit the particular or Ecclesiastical persons who may erre as not hauing the promise of infallibility Every one a part as they are in their pulpitt's in their states or lesse solemne exhortations proposing the traditions of the Fathers the CanoÌ„s of the Councels the decrees constitutions of the Popes their breefes bulls and indulgences This first reason then drawne from the nature of the Scripture that it is dumbe that it hath neede to be propounded and applyed cannot be admitted vnlesse they will vpon the same grounds annihilate the authority of the Fathers Councels Popes in whose words the very pretended defects are to be found as plainly â—ppeareth 2 And for the secoÌ„d allegation touching the obscurity of the Scripture it caÌ„not be maintained but it must be withal averred that all the proofes drawne from this word are likewise obscure and consequently that the Romish Religion cannot be gathered from the Scripture but by guesses and coniectures So that all the proofes drawn from this Scripture to maintaine the Doctrine of the Romish Church shall be meere coniectures and guesses And are they not to blame then vpon this reckoning not to bind those that accuse the Romish Church of reuolt to keepe themselues to the iudge before whom they haue made their appeale seing hee speakes so obscurely on the accusers side that hee will never iustifie his accusation neyther condemne the party accused who being in possession whereas the accuser is the plaintife if the evidences by which hee pretends to verifie his accusation be obscure and
no longer in vse no not in the Romish Church which notwithstanding doth glory so much for keeping observing of traditions approued by antiquity receiued for Apostolicall CHAP. 12. The verification of the second meanes of nullity against the fift allegation TOuching the fift allegation that the Scripture cannot be the rule seeing it cannot put an end to the dissentions of them who make profession to keepe themselues strictly vnto it is also wonderfully perverse For question is not made of such a rule as vnto which all those should truly and indeed conforme themselues who make a shew so to do neither of finding such a Iudge as all they who professe to yeeld referre themselues to his judgement should in effect performe it so long as the Church shall be militant here on earth such a rule such a Iudge will not be foūd But the question is of finding a rule of finding a Iudge to whom whosoever shall submit himselfe to which whosoever shall conforme himselfe shall not disagree frō those who do the like Otherwise albeit that passion and malice hinder not that men may seeme to hold themselues to one certaine rule of which the doctrine is evident and playne for to disguise the businesse and colour over a bad cause these vices notwithstanding will not suffer vs in truth to conforme our selues thereunto as is seene in the example of the heretiques aboue alleaged who did protest to keepe themselues to the Councell of Nice and to the traditions of the Fathers Moreover we do not seeke a rule to which whosoever conformeth himselfe doth it wholy in all points For it is well knowne that the Fathers did conforme themselues to the patterne of the Scripture to the consent of the Church and yet which of them hath done it so exactly all of them by reason of humaine infirmity disagreing one with another and oftentimes from themselues He that shall say that therefore God speaking in the scripture is not Iudge by the same reason should bee forced to conclude that neither the Church it selfe is Iudge But the question is of finding a Iudge a rule which might cause agrement at least in the Principall points amongst all those who sincerely desire the knowledge of truth There were betwixt the Christians and the Iewes great controversies they protested both the one and the other that the Scripture was the rule And S t Paul that hee taught nothing but what the Prophets had foretold And the Iewes would receiue no other doctrine but that of Moses and the Prophets ceased he therefore to convince the Iewes by the Scriptures and apply them as the rule against them And vnder colour that the Iewes boasting themselues in Moses writings agreed not with the Lords who made as much or more reckoning of them did he forbeare to tel them had yee beleeued Moses yee would haue beleeued mee for hee wrote of mee but if yee beleeue not his writings how shall ye beleeue my words and in the verse immediately going before Do not thinke that I will accuse you to the Father there is one that will accuse you euen Moses in whom you trust CHAP. 13. The verifying of the second meanes of Nullity against the sixt allegation BVT if hereticks for answere vnto the sixt accusation lay claime to the Scripture it is not in effect and indeede but only in shew and therefore as those who make some false Demonstrations in the Mathematicks although they make vse of principles of the science are notwithstanding refuted and convinced by the same principles and therefore their errour is no ways preiudicious to the authority and certainty of the Mathematicks even so the hereticks albeit for to cloake their heresie they teere in peeces the Scripture and wrest it to their sence ought neverthelesse to bee convinced no otherwise then by the same Scriptures of which the Lord hath left vnto vs a notable example in his person when being tempted by Satan who applyed and vsed against him the scripture he repelled the temptation by the same scripture the holy Fathers also did they leaue of to beate downe heresie even so farre as to put it to death by this sword of the spirit albeit that heresie also in shew made vse of it Truly the hereticks forge their heresie first in their heads and then afterwards seeke it in the Scripture which favoureth them so little that if their controversies were to be determined by it they would not subsist as very well said Tertullian who had never suffered himselfe to be carried away to the vaine fancies of Montanus if he had firmely held this his Maxime CHAP. 14. The verifying of the second meanes of Nullity against the seaventh allegation AS for the Councels if wee liued in the times of the Apostles wee should thinke it very expedient to intreate them to assemble themselves in a Councell to determine our controversies Their quality the authority of their charge or rather the extraordinary gifts and the particular assistance of the holy Ghost giuing them this advantage of being both able and willing to judge infalliblie humaine ignorance would not blinde their eies that they could not see the truth and the feare of a Pope of an Emperour of Kings would not hinder them to vtter it But we stand not now at this day on such termes this infallibility is no where to bee found there are no more Prophets no Evangelists but only as they exhibite thēselues to vs in their writings every leader of the Church taken a part is subiect to erre all vnited together in one body bring with them their portion of infirmity the weaknesse of humane nature passion particular interest may intermingle themselues into their consultations and so hoodwinke their eyes that they cannot see the truth or so tye their tongues that they cannot vtter it Witnesse the trueth of this the history of the Councel of Trent * set forth by those who were engaged more then ordinary to couer its shame avowed and evidently receiued in this Kingdome of France to strengthen the opposition which hath bin alwayes framed against it to vphold the liberty of the French Church a history which none hath beene able to disproue to this day But here it may be sayd hath not then the Lord in vaine promised his assistance if wee should yet doubt of the infallibility of the determinations of the Councels God forbid for is it not doubted nay is it not formally denyed that particular Synodes are infallible Is it not avouched that they haue erred and yet the promise of the Lord remaineth still true And it will availe nothing to reply here that the promise was not made to particular Councels but to the generall which are called Oecumenicall For the Lord hath promised to be as wel in themid'st of two or three gathered together in his name as of a whole multitude If this promise hindreth not but two or three may erre how shall