Magdeburgenses as in place conuenient I haue shewed which also in no time or Age sence Princes were first christened in no land or CouÌ„trie in no Councel General or National was euer witnessed practised or allowed last of al which directly fighteth with Christes Commission geuen to the Apostles and their Successours in the Gospell and standeth direct coÌ„trary to an Article of our Crede if such Supreme Gouuernement I say may be laweful and good then is the Othe lawefull and may with good Conscience be taken But if these be suche Absurdities as euery maÌ„ of any meane consideration seeth and abhorreth then may not the Othe of any man that hath a Conscience be taken neither can this Supreme Gouernement be possibly defended for good and laweful That al these Absurdites and many yet more which to auoide prolixitie I here omitte do hereof depende this Reply gentle Reader abundantly proueth The Primacy of the Bishop of Rome againste the which the Othe directly tendeth as M. Horne auoucheth is euidently here proued not only in our dere Countrie of Englande as well before the Conquest as sythens but also in all other Christened Countres not only of all the West Churche as of Italy Spaine Fraunce Germany and the reste but of the East Churche also yea amonge the Aethyopians and Armenians And that by the witnesses of such Authours as M. Horne him selfe hath builded his proufes vpon for the contrary The practise of the .8 first General Councelles and of many National Councelles beside in Spaine Fraunce and Germanye hath pronounced euidently for the Popes and Bishoppes Supremacy and nothing for the Princes in matters Ecclesiasticall It is now thy parte ChristeÌ„ Reader not to shutte thy eyes against the Truthe so clerely shining before thy face Againste the which Truthe bicause M. Hornes whole Answer is but as it were a Vayne Blaste the Confutation of that Answer to auoide confusion of Replies whereof so many and diuers haue of late come forthe I haue termed for distinctioÌ„ sake a Counterblaste And nowe gentle Reader most earnestly I beseche thee of all other Articles that be this day ouer all ChristendoÌ„ controuersious through the great temerite of selfe willed heretiks raised vp most diligently to labour and trauaile in this of the Supremacy As being suche that to say the Truthe in effecte al other depende vpon Of Protestantes some be Lutherans some Zwinglians some Anabaptistes some Trinitaries and some be of other sectes But as they all being otherwise at mutuall and mortall enemitie emonge themselues conspire againste the Primacy of the See Apostolike so a good Resolution ones had in this pointe staieth and setleth the Conscience as with a sure and stronge Anker from the insurgies and tempestes of the foresaide rablemeÌ„t and of all other sectes and schismes Contrary wise they that be ones circumuented and deceaued in this Article are caried and tossed with the raging whaues and flouddes of euery errour and heresy without staie or settling euen in their owne errours I reporte me to the Grecians who forsaking the vnitie of the Romaine Churche and being first Arrians defying the Pope as it may appeare by the letters of Eusebius the greate Arrian and his felowes to Iulius then Pope fell after to be Macedonians Nestorians Eutychians Monothelites Iconomaches with diuers other greate Heresies eche Heresy breeding great numbers of sectes and all conspiring against the See Apostolike vntil at the last proceding from heresy to heresie diuers RecoÌ„ciliations with the Romaine See comming betwene which staied a longe time Gods highe vengeaunce that ensewed they fel to Turkish Captiuitie in which ô lamentable case they remayne to this day I reporte me to the Africans who falling from the vnitie of the Romaine See first in the Donatistes despising the Iudgemente of Pope Melchiades in the very first springe of their heresy where then it might haue bene stopped if they had geuen eare to their chiefe Pastour then falling to be Pelagians and soone after Arrians by the conqueste of the Wandalles became in time Infidelles as to this daie they continue I reporte me laste of all to these Heresies of the Northe the Bohemians fyrste and nowe Luther and his scholers Whiche wythin fewe yeares their Maister yet liuing and flourisshing wente so farre from hym that he pronounced them in open writyng Heretiques and Archeheretiques And yet they nowe I meane the Sacramentaries whome Luther so defyed beare the greatest swaye of all other sectes What the ende of these Heresies wyll be except we abandonne them in tyme Hungarie and Lifelande maye be a lesson vnto vs whiche by Luthers heresye are bothe fallen awaye as from the Romaine Churche so from the Romaine Empire the one into the Turkes handes the other into the Moscouites But to leaue forayne Countres for triall what it is to separat our selues from the See Apostolike our owne domesticall affayres maye serue vs for a sufficient example At what time kinge Henry the 8. first banisshed the Popes Authoritie out of Englande as the kinge and the Parliament thought though erroneously that this doing imported no schisme nor heresy so they thought likewise in suche sorte to prouide that the people shoulde not fall into the other errours of the newe Lutheran or Sacramentary religion which then the kinge and the Parliament no lesse abhorred then they did Turkery But what was the issewe all the worlde knoweth and England the more pitie greuously feeleth For immediatly bookes came so thicke abrode as well of the Lutheran as of the Zwinglian secte and the people fell so fast to a contentation and liking with them that the king was fayne to make diuers streight lawes and Actes of Parliament for the repressing of heresy yea and to forbidde the common people the reading of the Bible And he sate in his owne person in iudgement vpon Lamberte the Sacramentary Neither the Lutherans and Zwinglians onely swarmed in the realme but the Anabaptistes also twelue of the sayed Anabaptistes being burned aboute one tyme. Nowe thoughe king Henrye altered no matter of fayth sauing this Primacie onely but kepte constantlye the Catholike fayth otherwise and though suppressing the Abbeys he would not suffer religiouse men that had vowed chastitye to marie yet after hys death and in the minoritye of hys sonne kinge Edwarde all the lawes that he had made towching matters of religion sauing against the supremacie were repelled and abolisshed And a new religion was through out the realme set forthe To the which though the Religion nowe vsed be much conformable yet is there in many thinges muche diuersitâ—e As among other for the mariage of Priestes for the which they had some colour in king Edwardes daies by Acte of Parliament Nowe they haue both the Church lawe and the lawe of the Realme against them and which more is the verie lawe of God that saieth Vouete reddite Make your vowe and perfourme it And S. Paule saieth Habentes
aske yow whether theÌ„perour toke pope Martinus for the head of the whole Church or no Yf ye say he did as the force of truth will coÌ„pell you then to what ende haue ye so busied your self with the doings of this Emperour Yf ye say he did not theÌ„ wil I send you to your owne authour Nauclerus of whom ye shall heare that not themperour but the Cardinals elected Martinus and that themperour as sone as he was elected fell flatte and prostrate before him and with much reuerence kissed his feete Now againe if as ye say he allowed and commaunded such thinges as the councell agreed vppon in matters of relligion to be obserued this agreemeÌ„t being as it was in dede against your new religioÌ„ what doe ye but blowe your own coÌ„demnatioÌ„ making it as strong as may be against your own self How Emperours haue coÌ„firmed councels I haue ofteÌ„ declared This therfore I let passe as a stale argumeÌ„t according to promise But now let me be so bold as ones to appose you M. Horn. Who was I pray you at this tyme supreame head of the Church in England Did king Henrie the .5 take him selfe trowe ye to be this head I suppose ye dare not say it for shame And if ye dare theÌ„ dare I be so bold to tel you it is a most notoriouse lie and withall that in case it were so yet did he eueÌ„ about the same time that Wiccleff and his schollers were coÌ„demned in the CouÌ„cell of CoÌ„stantia coÌ„demne theÌ„ as fast by act of parliament in EnglaÌ„d And it was I may say to you high time For your good bretherne had coÌ„spired to adnulle destroy and subuert not only the Christian fayth aÌ„d the law of God aÌ„d holy Church within the realm but also to destroy the kiÌ„g aÌ„d al maner of estats of the realm aswel spiritual as teÌ„poral aÌ„d all maner of pollicy and finally the lawes of the laÌ„d As it is more at large coÌ„prised in an act of parliameÌ„t made at that time In the which it was ordeyned aÌ„d established that first the Chauncelor Treasorer Iustices of the one bench aÌ„d of the other iustices of peace Sherifs mayors baylifs of cities aÌ„d townes aÌ„d all other officers hauing the gouernance of people or that at any tyme afterward shulde haue the sayd gouernaunce shuld take an othe in taking of their charge to put theire whole power and diligence to put out cease aÌ„d destroy al maner of errours and heresies coÌ„monly then called Lollardries within the place where they exercised theire offices And thus neither abrode nor at home can ye fynde any good matter for the defence of your newe primacy and your damnable heresies M. Horne The .141 Diuision pag. 84. b. After the death of Sigismonde Frederike the Emperour caused the Duke of Sauoy that vvas made Pope to renounce his Papacy and commaunded by his Decree the Prelates gathered at Basill to dissolue the Councell by a certaine daie This Emperour called a CouÌ„cell at Mentze to make an ende and vtterly to take away the Schisme of the Church and to deliuer it from more greuous daungers He vvriteth to the Frenche Kinge thereof declaring hovv this Schisme did so oppresse his minde and ferueÌ„tly sollicite him that as well for his loue to Religion as for his office called of God to be the chiefe aduocate of the Churche he did not onely runne with diligence to succour it but stirred vp al kinges and Princes that with a pure sinceritie delighted in the name of Christe to runne with him in this so necessary and healthfull a worke and to this purpose he declareth hovve he hath appointed to all his princes and prelates an assembly at Mentze whereat he entendeth to be personally present and therefore desireth the Frenche kinge also to bee there in his ovvne persone or at the least that he vvoulde sende his Oratours thither instructed distinctly vvith all vvaies and meanes by the vvhiche the Churche might be quiet from the calamities ready to fall on her Pope Eugenius sent to the Frenche king to desire him to take a vvay his .464 pragmaticall Lavve To vvhom the king ansvvered that he vvould haue it kept inuiolatly Then the Pope desidered the king neither to admit â—â— Basill couÌ„cel nor yet the couÌ„cel at MeÌ„tze that vvas called to the vvhich the kiÌ„g ansvvered that he vvold take aduise Stapleton Here is small or no matter for M. Hornes newe Primacie and that he here reherseth maketh rather agaynst him then with him For though M. Horne sayed in the last argument that pope Eugenius was deposed yet is he nowe pope styll and thother set in his place faine to geue ouer And though the princes would not obeye Eugenius for the dissoluing of the Councell of Basile yet nowe it is dissolued by the Emperour Friderike also And what answere so euer the French King made to Eugenius touching the sayed Basile Councell the Councell is no further allowed in the Catholike Church then Eugenius and his successour Nicolaus did allowe the same And as ye shewe your selfe themperour Friderike saieth that by his office he was called of God to be the chiefe Aduocate of the Church He saieth not the chiefe head of the Church the which honour he did attribute not to him selfe but to the Pope only of whome he was crowned as his predecessours were These also are but stale wares and much woren And for such I let them passe As for the Frenche King and hys pragmatical sanction which Charles his predecessour had made and whiche he at the requeste of Pope Eugenius would not reuoke it contained no such matter as you M. Horne doe attribute to princes nowe neyther was that gouernement like to that which you nowe defend This pragmaticall sanction stode most about monye matters It denied to the Court of Rome the great payements which went out of Fraunce about Reseruations collations expectations and coÌ„mendoes of bishoprickes prebendes and benefices Great and long contention there was betwene certaine Kings of Fraunce as Charles the .vij. and the .viij. Loys .xj. and .xij. Frauncis the first and certaine Popes as this Eugenius Pius .2 Sixtus .4 Innocentius .8 Alexander .6 Iulius the .2 and Leo the .10 as Duarenus a vehement writer for the French Kings aduantage mencioneth But notwythstanding all these matters the Popes supreme Authoritie in matters of Fayth and ecclesiasticall Iurisdiction was not denied For witnesse hereof I bring you the wordes of the Court of Paris vttered among the Articles which they proposed to the King about this matter as Duarenus him selfe recordeth them In the number .19 thus they say Ante omnia protestatur Curia c. Before all thinges the Court protesteth that it mindeth not to derogat any thing from the holynesse dignity honour and Authority of the Pope and the holy Apostolike See But rather it is ready to shewe and exhibit all honour reuerence and obedience that
and alone defende this most Barbarous Paradoxe of Princes supreme gouernement in al Ecclesiasticall causes all as you say without exception Sirs If you lyst so to stand alone against all and by Othe to hale men to your singular Paradoxe not only to say with you but also to swere that they think so in conscience gette you also a Heauen alone get you a God alone get you a Paradise alone Vndoubtedly and as verely as God is God seing in the eternal blisse of all other felicities peace ād loue must nedes be one either you in this world must drawe to a peace and loue with al other Christians or you must not looke to haue part of that blisse with other Christiās except you alone think you may exclude al other and that all the worlde is blinde you onelye seing the light and that all shall goe to hell you only to heauen O M. Horne These absurdites be to grosse and palpable If any Christianity be in men yea in your selfe you and thei must nedes see it If you see it shut not your eies against it Be not like the stone harted Iewes that seing would not see and hearing would not heare the Sauiour and light of the worlde To conclude Mark and beare away these .ij. points only First that in this so weighty a matter to the which only of al matters in controuersy men are forced to sweare by booke othe you are contrary not only to al the Catholike Churche but also euē to al maner of protestants whatsoeuer be they Caluinistes Zelous Lutherās or Ciuil Lutheranes and therefore you defende herein a proper and singular heresy of your owne Next consider and thinke vpon it wel M. Horne that before the dayes of Kinge Hēry the .8 there was neuer King or Prince whatsoeuer not only in our own Countre of England but also in no other place or countre of the world that at any tyme either practised the gouernement or vsed such a Title or required of his subiects such an Othe as you defende And is it not great maruail that in the course of so many hundred yeres sence that Princes haue ben christened and in the compasse of so many Countres lands and dominions no one Emperour Kinge or Prince can be shewed to haue vsed or practised the like gouernement by you so forceably maintayned Yea to touche you nerer is it not a great wonder that wheras a long tyme before the daies of King Henry the .8 there was a statute made called Praerogatiuae Regis contayning the prerogatiues priuileges and preeminences due to the Kings Royall person and to the Crowne of the Realm that I say in that statute so especially and distinctly comprising them no maner worde should appeare of his supreme Gouernement in all Ecclesiasticall causes which you M. Horn do auouche to be a principal part of the Princes Royall power If it be as you say a principal part of the Princes Royal power how chaūceth it that so principal a part was not so much as touched in so special a statut of the Prīces prerogatiues and preeminēces Shal we think for your sake that the whole Realm was at that tyme so iniurious to the King ād the Crown as to defraude ād spoyle the Prince of the principal part of his Royal power Or that the King himself that then was of so smal courage that he would dissemble and winke thereat or last of al that none of all the posterity sence would ones in so long a time cōplaine therof Againe at what time King Hēry the .8 had by Acte of parliament this Title of Supreme head of the Church graūted vnto him howe chaunceth it that none then in al the Realme was found to challenge by the saied Statut of Praerogatiuae Regis this principal part as you cal it of the Princes royal power or at the lest if no plain challēge could be made thereof to make yet some propable deductiō of some parcel or braunche of the said Statut that to the King of olde time such right appertayned Or if it neuer before appertayned how can it be a principal part of the Princes Royal power What wāted al other Princes before our dayes the principal part of their royal power And was there no absolut Prince in the Realm of Englād before the daies of King Henry the .8 We wil not M. Horne be so iniurious to the Noble Progenitours of the Quenes Maie as to say or think they were not absolut and most Royal Princes They were so and by their Noble Actes as wel abrode as at home shewed thē selues to be so They wāted no part of their Royal power and yet this Title or prerogatiue they neuer had This hath ben your own deuise And why Forsothe to erect your new Religiō by Authority of the Prince which you knewe by the Churches Authority could neuer haue ben erected And so to prouide for one particular case you haue made it M. Horn a general rule that al Princes ought and must be Supreme gouernours in al ecclesiastical causes Which if it be so then why is not Kinge Philip here and King Charles in Fraunce such Supreme Gouernours Or if they be with what conscience doe your bretherne the Guets here ād the Huguenots there disobey their Supreme Gouuernours yea and take armes against their Princes Religion What Be you protestants brethern in Christ and yet in Religion be you not bretherne Or if you be bretherne in religiō also how doth one brother make his Prince supreme Gouernour in al Ecclesiastical causes without any exceptiō or qualificatiō of the Princes person and the other brother deny his Prince to be such Supreme gouernour yea ād by armes goeth about to exterminat his Princes lawes in matters ecclesiastical Solute al those doubtes and auoid al these absurdities M. Horn and then require vs to geue eare to your booke and to sweare to your Othe The .174 Diuision fol. 121. a. M. Fekenham Hosius Episcopus Cordubensis qui Synodo Nicenae primae interfuit sic habet sicut testatur D. Athanasius aduersus Constantium Imp. Si istud est iudicium Episcoporum quid commune cum eo habet Imperator Sin contrà ista minis Caesaris conflantur quid opus est hominibus titulo Episcopis Quando à condito aeuo auditum quando iudicium Ecclesiae authoritatem suam ab Imperatore accepit aut quando vnquam pro iudicio agnitum Plurimae antehac Synodi fuerunt multa iudicia Ecclesiae habita sunt Sed neque patres istiusmodi res principi persuadere conati sunt nec princeps se in rebus Ecclesiasticis curiosum praebuit nunc autem nouum quoddam spectaculum ab Ariana heresi editur Conuenerunt enim Haeretici Constantius Imperator vt ille quidem sub praetextu Episcoporum sua potestate aduersus eos quos vult vtatur M. Horne As it is very true that Hosius Bisshoppe of Corduba in Spaine vvas in the
damnationem quia primam fidem irritam fecerunt Incurring damnation because they haue broken their first promise Againe in the first yeare of our gratious Queene the Acte of Parliament for making and consecrating of Bisshoppes made the .28 of kinge Henrye was reuiued And yet the Bisshoppes were ordered not accordinge to the acte but according to an acte made in kinge Edwarde his dayes and repelled by Quene Marye and not reuiued the sayde first yeare And yf they will say that that defecte is nowe supplied let them yet remember that they are but parliament and no Churche Bisshoppes and so no Catholike Bisshoppes as being ordered in such manner and fasshion as no Catholike Church euer vsed But thys is most to be considered and to be lamented of all thinges that wheras no Acte of Parliament can geue anye sufficient warrant to discharge a man from the Catholike faythe and wheras yt was aswel in king Hēries dayes by Acte of Parliament as euer before through out all Churches of Christendome sithens we were christened taken for playne and open heresie to denie the reall presence of Christes bodye in the Sacramente of the aulter for maynteining of the which heresie there is no acte of Parliamēt God be thancked neither of king Edwardes tyme nor in the tyme of our graciouse soueraygne Ladie and Quene that nowe is yet doe these men teache and preache and by writing defend and maynteine the saied greate and abhominable heresie with many other for the which they can shewe no warrante of anye temporall or spirituall lawe that euer hath bene made in Englande All this haue I spoken to shewe it is most true that I haue saied that there will neuer be redresse of errour and heresie or any staie where men are once gone from the vnitie of the See Apostolike which is the welspring and fountaine of all vnitie in the Catholike faith And touching this question of the Supremacie that we haue in hand if we wel consider it we shall find that we doe not agree either with the other Protestantes or with our selues For in this pointe that we make the Prince the supreme head of the Churche we neither agree with Luther him selfe or his scholers which denie this primacie nor with Caluin and his scholers the Sacramentaries Caluin saieth They were blasphemers that called King Henrie head of the Church One of his scholers Iacobus Acontius in a booke dedicated to the Queenes Mai. blameth openly the ciuil magistrate that maketh him selfe the Iudge of controuersies or by the aduise of other commaundeth this doctrine to be published that to be suppressed Nowe some of Caluins scholers and our owne countriemen haue taken forth such a lesson that they haue auouched in their bookes printed and publisshed to the world that a woman can neither be head of the Church nor of any Realme at all Againe manie of the Protestants though they will not the Pope should haue the chiefe gouernement because they like not his true doctrine yet they thinke it meete and conuenient that there be some one person ecclesiasticall that maie haue this supreme gouernement for matters of the Church It is also to be considered that the wordes of the Othe nowe tendered for the mainteining of the Princes Supremacie are other then they were in King Henries or King Edwardes daies with a certaine addition of greatest importance and such as to a ciuil Prince specially to the person of a woman can in no wise be with any conuenient sense applied I meane of these wordes Supreme Gouernour aswell in all spirituall or ecclesiasticall thinges or causes as temporall Such large and ample wordes were in neither of the foresaied Kings times put into the Othe And yet had they bene more tolerable in their persons for that men be capable of spiritual gouernmēt frō the which a woman is expresly by nature and by scripture excluded then they are nowe These wordes are such I saie as can not with any colourable pretext be excused Neither is it inough to saie as the Iniunctions doe that the Quenes Maiestie entendeth not to take more vpon her then King Henrie her father or King Edward her brother did what so euer that were more or lesse but it must be also considered what she or her Successours may take vpon her or them by the largenes of these wordes for an Iniunction can not limit an Acte of Parliament and whether there be any either Scripture or other good doctrine ecclesiastical sufficient to satisfie their consciences that refuse especially this Othe Which doth not only as it did before exclude the Apostolical See and all Generall Councelles also as though not in plaine wordes yet in effect in excluding the ecclesiastical Authoritie of al foren persons and Prelates but doth further adioyne the foresaied newe addition lesse probable and lesse tolerable then was any other parte of the former Othe And therefore certaine Protestants of some name and reputation being tendred this Othe by commission haue refused it Yea and how well trow you is this supreme Gouuernement liked of those Ministers which withstand the Quenes iniunctions touching the order of semely Apparell c Thus ye perceyue that as we are gone from the constante and setled doctrine of the Church touching this primacy so we agree not no not among our selues either in other pointes or in thys very Article of the Supremacy Neither shal we euer fynd anie cause of good and sufficiente contentation or constancye in doctrine vntill we returne thither from whence we first departed that is to the See Apostolike Which of al other people our Nation hath euer most reuerenced and honoured and ought of al other most so to doe As from whence both the Britaines and Saxons receiued first the Christian faith This returne God of his mercie graunt vs when it shall be his blessed pleasure Amen In Louaine the last of September An. 1567. Thomas Stapleton ¶ An Aduertisement to the Lerned Reader TOuching certain Authors alleaged in this Reply about matters of our own Countre it is to be vnderstanded that of certayne writen Copies not yet printed which we haue vsed as of Henricus Huntingtonensis and Gulielmus Neubrigensis or Noueoburgensis or Neoburgensis many thinges are in the said Copies which seme not to be writen of thē but of Some others As in the Copie of Henricus Huntingtonensis certayne thinges are founde which seme not to be writen of him but to haue bene gathered out of his workes and to haue bene writen by some other whom we coniecture to be Simeon Dunelmensis Also in the Copie of our Neubrigensis many thinges are added both at the beginning and at the ende which seme not to haue ben writen by Neubrigensis him self but by some other And that which is added at the beginning was writen as we vnderstand nowe of one Alphredus Beuerlacensis who liued vnder king Steuen The additions which do followe who wrote we yet knowe not except it were Roger Houeden This I
other that among other heresies recite some of those that you openly and your fellowes maintaine Yf ye will reiect the poore Catholiques S. Augustine and Epiphanius also yet I trust you will not be against your owne famouse Apologie whiche saith that Epiphanius nombreth fourscore Heresies of the which it is one for a man after the order of Priesthode to marie and S. Augustine a greater nomber and so concludeth you and the residue to be heretikes If ye wil denie ye mainteine any of those heresies your preachings your teachings and writings beare full and open testimony against you What then haue you to iustifie your cause You wil happely forsake and abandon S. Augustines authoritie withal the olde Canons and Councels and flye vnder the defence of your brickle bulwarke of Actes of Parliament O poore and sely helpe o miserable shift that our faith should hang vppon an acte of Parliamente contrary as wel to all actes of Parliament euer holden in Englande before as to the Canons and Fathers of the Catholike Churche A strange and a wonderfull matter to heare in a Christian common welth that matters of faith are Parliament cases That ciuill and prophane matters be conuerted into holie and Ecclesiasticall matters Yea and that woorse is that Laie men that are of the folde onely not shepheards at all and therefore bounde to learne of their Catholique Bisshoppes and Pastours may alter the whole Catholique Religion maugre the heades of all the Bishoppes and the whole Conuocation This is to trouble all things this is as it were to confounde togeather heauen and earth But yet let vs see the prouidence of God These men that relinquishing the Church would hang only vpoÌ„ a Parliament are quite forsaken yea euen there where they loked for their best helpe For I praye you what warrant is there by acte of Parliament to denie the Real presence of Christes bodie in the holie Eucharistia Is it not for anye Parliament as well heresie nowe as it was in Quene Maries King Henries or anye other Kinges dayes What can be shewed to the contrarie Doth not Luther your first Apostle and his schollers defie you therefore as detestable Heretiques Nowe concerning Transubstantiation and adoration is it not well knowen thinke you that in King Edwardes dayes there was a preaty legerdemaine played and a leafe putt in at the printing which was neuer proposed in the Parliamente What Parliamente haue your Preachers to denye free will and the necessitie of baptizing children Againe I pray you is there any Acte to confirme your vnlawful mariage Doth not in this point the Canonicall Lawe stande in force as well nowe as in King Henries daies And so doth it not followe that yee are no true Bishoppe Beside is it not notoriouse that yee and your Colleages were not ordeined no not according to the prescripte I wil not say of the Churche but euen of the verye statutes Howe then can yee challenge to your selfe the name of the Lord Bisshoppe of Winchester Whereof bothe the Municipall and Ecclesiasticall Lawe dothe woorthelye spoyle you Wherefore as I sayed let vs dashe out these wordes and then no reasonable man shall haue any great cause to quarell against the Title of M. Fekenhams Treatise The .2 Diuision M. Horne The booke by you deliuered vnto mee touching the Othe was writen in the Tovver of London as you your selfe confessed and the true title therof doth plainly testifie in the time of the ParliameÌ„t holden Anno quinto of the Q. Maiestie Ianua 12. at which time you litle thought to haue soiourned with me the winter follovving and much lesse meant to deliuer me the scruples and staies of your coÌ„science in writing to be resolued at my hands And although you would haue it seeme by that you haue published abroade that the cause why you wrot was to be resolued my hande yet the trueth is as you your selfe reported that you and your Tovver fellovves hearing that the Statute moued for the assuraunce of the Queenes royall povver would passe and be establissed did conceiue that immediately after the same Session Commissioners shoulde be sente vnto you to exact the Othe VVhereuppon you to be in some readines to withstande and refuse the duetie of a good subiecte .8 not without helpe of the reste as may be gathered deuised the matter conteyned in the booke committed the same to writing and purposed to haue deliuered it for your ansvvere touching the Othe of the Supremacy to the CoÌ„missioners if they had come This may appere by the Title of that booke that you first deliuered to me which is worde for worde as follovveth The answere made by M. Iohn Fekenham Priest and prisoner in the Tower to the Quenes highnes Commissioners touching the Oth of the Supremacie In this Title there is no mencion of scruples and stayes deliuered to the Bisshoppe of VVinchester but of aunsvveare to the Queenes Commissioners I am not once named in the â—itle ne yet in the looke deliuâ—â—â—â— to mee neither is there one worde as spoken to me although in the 〈…〉 abroad you turne all as spoken to me â—n your booke published aâ—e 〈…〉 kinds of speaches To the L. Bishop of VVinchestâ— VVhen youâ— L. shal be able c. I shall ioyne this issue vvith your L. c. But it is farre othervvise in your booke deliuered to me namely To the Queenes highnes coÌ„missioners VVhen ye the Queenes highnes coÌ„missioners shal be hable c. I shal ioine this issue vvith you that vvhen any one of you the Queenes hignes coÌ„missioners c. From October at what time you were sent to me vnto the end of Ianuarie there was daily conference betvvixt vs in matters of Religion but chiefly touching the foure pointes which you terme scruples and stayes of conscience and that by worde of mouth and not by any writing In all which points ye vvere .9 so ansvvered that ye had nothing to obiect but seemed resolued and in a maner fully satisfied VVhervpon I made aftervvard relation of .10 good meaning tovvards you to certain honorable persons of the good hope I had coÌ„ceiued of your conformity At whiche time a certaine friend of yours standing by and hearing what I had declared then to the honorable in your coÌ„medacion did shortly after .11 reporte the same vnto you which as it seemed you did so much mislike doubting that your confederates should vnderstand of your reuolt .12 which they euer feared hauing experience of your shrinking froÌ„ them at .13 VVestminster in the coÌ„ference there the first yere of the Q. Maiestie that after that time I founde you alvvaies much more repugnaÌ„t and coÌ„trary to that wherin ye before times seemed in maner throughly resolued And also to goe from that you before agreed vnto By reason vvhereof vvhen in debating betvvixt vs you vsinge manye shiftes amongst other did continuallie quarell in Sophistication of vvordes I did vvill you to
is not Luther the same man to yow that Donatus was to them doth not one of your greatest clerks there with you now write that Wyclyff begatte Husse Husse begotte Luther and thē addeth a shameful blasphemous note this is the seconde Natiuitye of Christe The Donatists being charged and pressed by the Catholiks to shewe the beginning and continuance of their doctrine and the ordinary successiō of their Bisshops were so encombred that they could neuer make any conueniente answer And are not ye I pray you with your felowes protestāt bishops fast in the same myre If not answer then to my thirde demaunde in the Fortresse annexed to S. Bede The Donatists fynding faulte with Constantine Theodosius and other Catholik princes ranne for succour to Iulianus the renegate and highly commended him And doth not M. Iewel I pray you take for his president against the Popes primacy Constantius the Arrian against Images Philippicus Leo Cōstantinus and such like detestable heretiks by general councels condemned Do not your self play the like parte in the Emperour Emanuel as ye cal him and in other as we shal hereafter declare Now who are I pray you Donatists for the defacing and ouerthrowing of Aulters for vilaining the holy Chrisme and the holy Sacrament of the aulter Which they cast vnto dogs which straitwaies by the ordinance of God fell vpon them and being therin Gods ministers made them fele the smart of their impietie It were a tragical narration to open the great and incredible crueltie that the Donatists vsed toward the Catholiks and especially their horrible rauishment of religious Nonnes And yet were they nothing so outragious as your Hugonots haue bene of late in France and the beggarly Guets here in Flandres namely about Tournaye The Donatists said of the Catholiks Illi portant multorū Imperatorum sacra Nos sola portamus euangelia They bring vs many of the Emperours letters we bring the only ghospels And is not this the voyce of all Protestantes whatsoeuer Only Scripture only the gospel only the word of God And for the first parte what is more common in the mouthes of the Germayn Lutherans of the French Caluinistes and now of the flemmish Guets then this complaint that we presse them with the Emperours Diets with the Kings proclamations and with the Princes placarts To the which they obey as much as the Donatists when they haue power to resiste Wel we wil nowe leaue of al other conference and cōparisons and tarry a litle in one more The Donatists though they were most wicked Murtherers of others and of them selues also killing them selues moste wretchedly without any other outward violence don to them yet were they takē of their confederats for Martyrs Of whome thus writeth S. Augustin Viuebant vt Latrones moriebantur vt Circumcelliones honorabantur vt Martyres They liued like robbers by the high way they died like Circumcellions meaning thei slew them selues they were honored as Martyrs And now where lerned M. Foxe the trade to make his holy canonisation in his deuelish dirty donghil of his fowle heretical ād trayterous Martyrs but of those ād such like scholemaisters As of the Montanists that worshipped one Alexander for a worshipful martyr thowgh he suffred for no matter of religiō but for myscheuous murther And of the Maniches that kepte the day wherein their maister Manes was put to death more solemply then Easter day Haue ye not thē in M. Foxe Sir Iohn Oldcastle and Syr Roger Acton canonised for holy martyrs though they died for high treason yea their names al to be painted dasshed ād florished in the kalender with read letters I thinke because we shoulde kepe their daye a double feaste Whose and their confederates condemnation for conspiringe againste the Kinge the nobilitye and their countreye appereth aswell by acte of parliament then made as by the full testimony of all our English Cronicles Is not dame Elleanour Cobhā a stowte confessour in this madde martyrloge whose banishment was not for religion but for conspiringe King Henry the sixts death by wytchrafte and sorcery by the help and assistance of M. Roger Bolinbroke and Margaret Iordeman commonly called the Witche of Aey The which two were openly executed for the same But nowe is it worth the hearing to know how handsomly M. Foxe hath conceyued his matters wherein he plaieth in dede the wily Foxe and springleth with his false wily tayle his fylthy stale not into the doggs but into his readers eies And as the Foxe as some hūters say when he is sore driuen wil craftely mount from the earth and kepe himself a while vpon the eather of a hedge only to cause the howndes that drawe after him to leese the sente of the tracte euen so for all the worlde hath our Foxe plaied with his reader But I trust I shal trace him and smel him out wel inoughe First then though M. Foxes authority be very large and ample in this his canonisation and such as neuer any Pope durste take vpon him yea and though he hath authority to make martyrs yet I dowbte whether he hath authority to make Knights to for this Sir Roger Onley is neither a Sir but of M. Foxes making nor Onley neither But M. Roger Bolinbroke only put to death for the treason before specified as not onely his owne authours Fabian and Harding whome he doth alleage for the story of Dame Elleanour but al other also doe testifie Truthe it is that Harding writing in English meeter and speaking of this M. Bolinbroke endeth one of his staues with this worde Only which is there to signifie no name but to better and sweate the meeter and is as much to say as chiefly and principally meaning that Maister Roger was the principal worker in this nigromancy The meeters of Harding are these He waxed then strange eche day vnto the King For cause she was foreiudged for sorcery For enchantments that she was in working Against the Church and the King cursedly By helpe of one M. Roger only Whiche last woorde some ignorant or Protestant Printer hath made Oonly And then hath M. Fox added a Syr and a Martyr too and adorned him with no common inke to set foorth and beutify his Martyr withal And so of M. Roger Bolinbroke sorcerer and traitour by a cunning Metamorphosis he hath made Syr Roger Onlye Knight and Martyr Wel wil ye yet see further the craftie dubling of a Fox walking on the eather of the hedge Consider then that for Margaret Iordaman that notable witch least if he had named her and M. Bolinbroke by their own names he had marred al the rost he placeth an other woman that by his owne rule died fortie yeares after And yet can he not hit vpon her name neither but is faine to call her in steed of Ione Bowghton the mother of the Ladie Yong who in deed is one of his stinking hereticall and foolish Martyrs For she craked ful
greatly passe howe the Donatistes in this pointe demeaned them selues and whether they openly or priuilie shonned proufes brought and deduced out of the olde Testament In deed the Manichees denied the authoritie of the bookes of the old Law and Testament whiche I reade not of the Donatists Yea in the very same boke and chapter by you alleaged Petilian him self taketh his proufe against the Catholikes out of the olde Testament whiche you know could serue him in litle stede if he him selfe did reiect such kind of euidences This now shall suffice for this branche to purge M. Fekenham that he is no Donatist or Heretique otherwise Concerning the other beside your falshood your great follie doth also shew it sesfe too as well as in the other to imagin him to be a Donatist and to think or say as you say they did that ciuile magistrates haue not to do with religiō nor may not punish the trāsgressours of the same M. Fekenhā saith no such thing ād I suppose he thinketh no such thing and furder I dare be as bold to say that there is not so much as a light cōiecture to be groūded therof by any of M. Fekenhās words onlesse M. Horne become sodenly so subtil that he thinketh no differēce to say the Prince shuld not punish an honest true mā in stede of a theef ād to say he shuld not punish a theef Or to say there is no difference betwixt althings ād nothing For though M. Fekenhā ād al other Catholiks do deny the ciuile Princes supreme gouernmēt in al causes ecclesiasticall yet doth not M. Fekenhā or any Catholike deny but that ciuil Princes may deale in some matters ecclesiastical as aduocates and defendours of the churche namely in punishing of heretikes by sharp lawes vnto the which lawes heretikes are by the Church first geuē vp and deliuered by open excōmunication and condemnatiō As for S. Augustines testimonies they nothing touch M. Fekenham and therefore we will say nothing to them but kepe our accustomable tale with you and beside all other score vp as an vntruth that ye say here also that the Papists are no parte of the Catholique Churche no more then the Donatistes M. Horne The .19 Diuision pag. 12. b. But for that S. Augustines iudgemēt and mine in this controuersie is all one as your opinion herein differeth nothing at al from the Donatists I vvil vse no other confirmation of my proufes alleaged out of the olde testament for the reproufe of your guilful restraint then Christes Catholique Church vttered by that Catholique Doctour S. Augustine against all the sectes of Donatistes vvhether they be Gaudentians Petilians Rogatists Papists or any other petit sectes sprōg out of his loines vvhat name so euer they haue S. Austine against Gaudētius his second Epistle affirmeth saiyng I haue saith he already hertofore made it manifest that it apertained to the kings charge that the Niniuites shoulde pacifye Gods wrath which the Prophet had denoūced vnto thē The kings which are of Christes Church do iudge most rightly that it appertaineth vnto their cure that you Donatists rebel not without punishmēt agaīst the same c. God doth inspire into kīgs that they should procure the cōmaundement of the Lorde to be performed or kept in their kingdom For they to whom it is said and now ye kings vnderstand be ye learned ye Iudges of the earth serue the Lord in feare do perceiue that their autoriti ought so to serue the lord that such as wil not obei his wil should be punished of that autority c. Yea saith the same S. Aug. Let the kings of the erth serue Christ euē in making lawes for Christ. meaning for the furtherance of Christes religiō How then doth kings saith S. Aug. to Bonifacius against the Donatists serue the Lord with reuerēce but in forbidding and punishing with a religious seuerity such things as are don against the Lords commaūdements For a king serueth one way in that he is a man an other way in respect that he is a king Because in respecte that he is but a mā he serueth the Lord in liuing faithfully but in that he is also a king he serueth in making lawes of cōuenient force to cōmaūd iust things ād to forbid the cōtrary c. In this therfore kings serue the Lord whē they do those things to serue him which thei could not do were thei not kings c. But after that this begā to be fulfilled which is writē and al the kings of the earth shal worship him al the nations shal serue him what mā being in his right wittes may say to Kings Care not you in your Kingdomes who defēdeth or oppugneth the Church of your Lord Let it not appertaine or be any part of your care who is religious in your kingdome or a wicked deprauer of Religion This vvas the iudgemēt of S. Aug. or rather of Christes Catholike Church vttered by him against the Donatists touching the seruice authority povver ād care that Kings haue or ought to haue in causes spiritual or ecclesiastical the vvhich is also the iudgemēt of Christes catholik church novv in these dais and defended by the true ministers of the same Catholique Churche against al Popish Donatists vvith the force of Gods holy vvoorde bothe of the old and nevv Testament euen as S. Augustine did before VVho to proue and confirme this his assertiō to be true against the Donatists did auouch many moe examples then I haue cited out of the old Testament as of the King of Niniue of Darius Nabuchodonozor and others affirming that the histories and other testimonies cited out of the old Testament are partely figures and partly prophecies of the povver duety and seruice that Kings shoulde ovve and perfourme in like sort to the furtherance of Christes Religion in the time of the nevv Testament The Donatists in the defence of their heresie restrained S. Augustine to the exāple and testimony of such like order of Princes Seruice in matters of Religion to be found in the Scriptures of the nevve Testament meaning that it could not be found in any order that Christ lefte behind him as you also fantasied vvhē you vvrote the same in your boke folovving yea going euen cheke by cheke vvith thē But S. Austine maketh ansvvere to you al for him and me both VVho rehearsing the actes of the godly Kings of the old Testament taketh this for a thing not to be denied to vvit That the auncient actes of the godly kings mentioned in the Prophetical bokes were figures of the like facts to be don by the godly Princes in the time of the new Testament And although there vvas not in the time of the Apostles nor long time after any Kings or Princes that put the same ordinance of Christ in practise al being infidels for the most part Yet the seruice of kings was figured as S. Augustine saith in Nabuchodonozor and others to be
whome he went about to poyson By reason of which outrages he was as I said denounced enemy to the Church of Rome by Alexander the .4 and shortly after Charles Kinge Lewys his brother was made King of Sicilie by Clemens the .4 paying to the Pope a tribute and holding of him by faithe and homage Such Supreme heads were your Conradus Conradinus and Manfredus As for Charles who only by the Popes Authority came to that dignity as I haue said it is not true that he as you say had all or most of the doing in the election or making of diuerse Popes For the Cardinalls only had the whole doing Truth it is that a strief and contention rising amonge the Cardinals for the election and many of them being enclined to serue Charles expectation they elected those which he best liked of But what can all this make to proue the Prince Supreme Gouernour in al ecclesiastical causes yea or in any ecclesiastical cause at al PriÌ„ces eueÌ„ now adaies find some like fauour sometimes at the electioÌ„ of Popes But thiÌ„k you therfore thei are takeÌ„ of their subiects for Supreme Gouernours c You may be ashamed M. Horne that your reasons be no better M. Horne The .130 Diuision pag. 79. b. Edvvard the first King of Englande about this time made the Statute of Northampton So that after that time no man should geue neither sel nor bequeath neither chauÌ„ge neither bye title assign laÌ„ds tenemeÌ„ts neither reÌ„tes to no maÌ„ of ReligioÌ„ without the KiÌ„gs leaue which acte sence that tyme hath beÌ„ more straightly enacted and deuised with many additioÌ„s thereunto augmeÌ„ted or annexed The which Law saith Polidore he made .442 bicause he was Religionis studiosissimê° c. most studiouse of Religion and most sharpe enemie to the insolency of the Priests The .27 Chapter Of King Edward the first of Englande Stapleton LEaue ones Maister Horne to proue that wherein no man doth stande with you and proue vs that either Kinge Edwarde by this facte was the Supreame Head of the Churche or that the Popes Primacie was not aswel acknowledged in EnglaÌ„d in those dayes as it hath ben in our dayes None of your marginal Authours auouch any such thinge Neither shall ye euer be able to proue it Your authours and many other haue plentiful matter to the contrarye especially the Chronicle of Iohannes Londonensis which semeth to haue liued aboute that tyme and seemeth amonge all other to haue writen of him verie exactlye Lette vs see then whether Kinge Edwarde tooke him selfe or the Pope for the Supreame Head of the Churche This King after his Fathers death returning from the holie Lande in his iourney visited Pope Gregorie the tenthe and obteyned of him an excommunication against one Guido de monte forti for a slawghter he had committed Two yeares after was the famouse Councell holden at Lions at the which was present the Emperour Michael Paleologus of whome we haue somewhat spoken And trowe ye Maister Horne that at suche tyme as the Grecians which had longe renounced the Popes authority returned to their olde obedience againe that the realm of Englande withdrewe it selfe from the olde and accustomable obedience Or trowe ye that the true and worthye Bisshops of England refused that Councell as ye and your fellowes counterfeite and parliament bisshops only haue of late refused the Councel of Trente No no. Our authour sheweth by a verse commonly then vsed that it was frequented of all sorte And the additions to Newburgensis which endeth his storie as the said Iohn doth with this King saith that plures episcopi coÌ„uenerunt de vniuersis terris de Anglia ibidem aderant archiepiscopi Cantuar. Ebor. et caeteri episcopi Angliae ferè vniuersi there came thither manye bisshops from al quarters and from EnglaÌ„d the Archbisshops of Canterburie and Yorke and in a maner all the other bisshops of the realme In this Kinges tyme the Pope did infringe and annichilate the election of the Kings Chauncelour being Bisshop of Bathe and Welles chosen by the monks and placed in the Archebisshoprike of Caunterbury Iohn Pecham In this Kings tyme the yere of our Lorde .1294 the prior of Caunterburie was cited to Rome and in the yeare .1298 appeale was made to the Pope for a controuersie towching the election of a newe Bisshop of Elie. Thre yeres after the bisshop of Chester was constrayned to appeare personally at Rome and to answere to certayne crymes wherewith he was charged Wythin two yeares after was there an other appeale after the death of the Bisshoppe of London towching the election of the newe Bisshoppe Yea the authority of the Pope was in highe estimation not onely for spirituall but euen for temporal matters also The Kinges mother professed her selfe a religiouse woman whose dowrie notwithstandinge was reserued vnto her and confirmed by the Pope For the greate and weightye matters and affaires standing in controuersie and contention betwene this King Edward and the Frenche Kinge the Pope was made arbiter and vmpier who made an agreament and an arbitrimente which being sente vnder his seale was reade in open parliamente at Westmynster and was well liked of all The Kinge and the nobility sendeth in the yeare of our Lorde 1300. letters to the Pope sealed with an hundred seales declaring the right of the crowne of England vpon ScotlaÌ„d and they desire the Pope to defende their right and that he would not geue a light eare to the false suggestioÌ„s of the Scots There are extant at this day the letters of Iohn Baliole and other Scots agnising the said superiority sent to this Kinge Edwarde In the foresaide yeare .1300 the Kinge confirmed the great Charter and the Charter of the Forest and the Archebisshoppe of Caunterburie with the other Bisshoppes pronounced a solemne curse vpon al suche as would breake the sayd liberties This Kinge was encombred with diuerse and longe warres aswell with Fraunce as Scotlande and therefore was fayne to charge the clergy and laity with many payments But in as much as Pope Bonifacius consideringe the wonderfull and intolerable exactions daylie layed vppon the clergy of they re princes had ordeyned in the councell at Lions that from thence forth the clergy shuld pay no tribute or taxe without the knowledge and consente of the see of Rome Robert Archbishop of Canterbury being demaunded a tribute for him self and his clergie stode in the matter not without his great busines and trouble And at the length vpon appellation the matter came to the Popes hearing The kinge had afterwarde by the Popes consente dyuerse payments of the clergy Many other thinges could I lay forth for the popes primacy practised at this tyme in Englande And is nowe M. Horn one onely Acte of Parliament made against Mortmaine of such force with yow that it is able to plucke froÌ„ the Pope his triple Crowne and set yt vppon the kynges head Yf
Lawe good maister Horne and no Lawe at all of Kynge Philippe made by yowe I say with as good authoritie and truthe as the damnable articles were made in your late conuocation Howe so euer yt be here is nothinge amended but abuses which to be amended no good man will I wene be angrie withall But what say yow nowe maister Horne to the whole ecclesiasticall iurisdiction that the Frenche clergie practised What became of yt Did the king take yt away or no Whie are ye tounge tyed M. Horne to tell the truth that so freelie and liberally yea and lewdly to lie againste the truth Wel seing that ye can not wynne yt at Maister Hornes hands good reader ye shal heare it otherwise The effecte and finall resolution then of this debate was that the kinge made answere to the forsayd bishop of Sans demaunding his resolute answere in the behalfe of the whole clergy that the prelates shoulde feare nothinge and that they shoulde not lose one iote in his tyme but that he woulde defende them in theire righte and customes neither woulde he geue to other an example to impugne the Churche Wherevppon the Bisshoppe in the name of the whole clergie gaue to the kinge moste humble thankes Howe saye yowe good reader hath this man any more shame then hath a very Horne And dareth he to looke hereafter any honest man in the face Yet he wil say that Paulus Aemilius sayth that the King was fayne to make this sharp and seuere Lawe Why CaÌ„ Paulus Aemylius tell better what was done then your other authour Bertrande being presente and playing the chiefe parte in this play and setting yt forth to the world to your perpetual ignominie with his own penne Wel tel vs then what Paulus sayeth Marie saye yowe Paulus reporteth that composuit rem sacerdotum he did set in order the matters of the Priestes But who speaketh of your sharpe and seuere Lawe Wil not coÌ„ponere rem sacerdotuÌ„ agree with al that I haue told out of Bertrand himself Is now coÌ„ponere reÌ„ sacerdotuÌ„ to be englisshed to make a sharpe and a seuere law Suerly this is a prety expositioÌ„ aÌ„d a try me tricke of your new graÌ„mer Your Authour Aemilius vseth his word coÌ„posuit valdè aptè compositè very aptly and fytlie But you M. Horne with your gaye and freshe interpretation doe nothing else but Lectori fallacias componere deceyue and be guyle your reader or to speake more fytely to our purpose ye doe nothing else but Legem Philippi nomine componere counterfeyte a lawe in Philippes name whereof your authour Aemilius speaketh nothing For Aemilius declaring a notable victory that this King had ouer his enemies saith that the victory obteyned and after that he had made his prayers and geuen thankes therefore to God and to his blessed Martyres composuit rem Sacerdotum he set in order the Priestes matters Then doth he shortly specifie that the foresaide Petrus Cunerius complained vpon the clergy for the hearing of many matters that appertayned to the kiÌ„ges secular cowrte and that the foresaid Bertrandus made him answere declaring amonge other thinges that their beste Kinges in Fraunce the most florisshing and the most notable were euer the greateste patrons and defenders of the clergies liberties and that the other that impugned the same came to a miserable and wretched ende He saith further that the Kings answere being from day to day proloÌ„ged the said Bertrandus with a nomber of the prelates vpoÌ„ S. Thomas of Canterburies day went to the Kinge admonishiÌ„g him that S. Thomas in the defence of the Church liberties vppon that daye spente his bloud and lyfe The King at the length answered that he wuld rather encrease than impayre the Churches right Wherevpon all rendred vnto him thankes and the Kinge purchased himselfe thereby the name of a Catholike King Ye heare good reader an other maner of exposition of â—omâ—osuit remsaceâ—dotum by theauthour him self then is M. Hornes gaye lying glose made in his theeuish Cacus denne And therfore with these words wherewith Aemilius beginneth his narration M. Horne endeth the narration to putte some countenance vpon his false and counterfeite Lawe The clergy then enioyed still their liberties and iurisdiction which ordinarilye they had before either by Law or by custome and priuilege though as I said many causes were but temporall Al the which teÌ„poral causes the said Petrus Cunerius by the way of coÌ„sultation only and reasoning declared by some coulorable arguments to belong to the Kings cowrte onely But for excoÌ„municatioÌ„s synodical decrees examinatioÌ„s of meÌ„s beliefes aÌ„d such like he maketh theÌ„ not as ye bable teÌ„poral matters nor abridgeth the clergies iurisdiction therein but onely reproueth certayne abuses therin committed forthe which and for the other the clergy promised a reformation Let vs nowe see your policie aÌ„d to what benefit of your cause ye doe so lie Imagyne yf ye wil that al were true aÌ„d for ones we will take you for Philip the French King and your Law made in your Cacus denne to be in as good force as yf yt had ben made in open parliament in France What issue ioyne you thereof what due and ordinate consequeÌ„t is this the Frenche King maketh a seuere lawe against the clergie vsurping his iurisdiction Ergo the Pope is no Pope or ergo the King of England is the Pope of Englande Agayne yf al are temporal matters howe standeth yt with your doctrine especially of this booke that ye and your fellowes shoulde busie your selfe therewith Neither will yt ease you to say that ye doe yt by the Princes commissioÌ„ for Cunerius vppon whome ye grounde all this your talke dryueth his reason to this ende that spirituall men be not capable of temporall iurisdiction and therefore this commission will not serue you And yf ye holde by commission take heade your commission be well and substancially made But of this commission we shal haue more occasion to speake hereafter M. Horne The .136 Diuision pag. 82. b. In England at this tyme many abuses about Ecclesiasticall causes vvere refourmed although the Pope and his Clergie did earnestly .448 mainteine them by Kinge Edvvard the .3 vvho vvrote his .449 letters to the Pope admonishing him to leaue of his disordered doings and vvhan that vvould not serue he redressed them by act of parliament and as Nauclerus saith he commaunded that from thence forth no body should .450 bring into the Realme any kind of the Popes letters vnder the paine of drowning and expelled al persones out of his kingdome that were by the Pope promoted to any benefice The .32 Chapter Of Edward the .3 King of England Stapleton THis argument also is right futely to the precedent as resting vpoÌ„ the reformiÌ„g of abuses in matters Ecclesiastical But I pray you tel vs no more M. Horn of reformiÌ„g of abuses if you wil ani way furder your preseÌ„t cause
except you tell vs withal and proue it to that in such reformation the whole clergy and the temporalty tooke the Kinge and not the Pope to be the supreame head Gouernour and directer thereof and of al other Ecclesiastical causes also Verily your own authors shewe playnely the coÌ„trary And the Popes authority was at this tyme takeÌ„ to be of such weight and force that the great league made betweÌ„ our KiÌ„g aÌ„d the FreÌ„ch King was coÌ„firmed by the Pope Ye wil perhapps replie and say the Popes whole Authority was abolished a commaundement being geuen vpon paine of drowninge no man shoulde bring into the realme any kinde of letters from the Pope Ye wil tel vs also of certaine letters that the Kinge sent to the Pope admonisshing him to leaue his disordered doings and when that woulde not serue he redressed them by acte of Parliament Why doe ye not M. Horne laye forth the tenour of those letters which as yet I finde not in any of your marginall authours Belyke there lieth some thing hidde that ye woulde be loth your reader should knowe least yt bewray your weake and feble argumente as yt doth in dede Neither that only but directlye proueth the Popes primacy Did this Kinge wene you M. Horne cal the Pope Antichrist as ye doe Or wrote he him self supreame head of the Churche of England Or did he abolishe the popes authority in England Harken then I pray you euen to the beginning of his letters Sanctissimo in Christo Patri Domino Clementi diuina prouidentia sacrosanctae Romanae ac vniuersalis Ecclesiae summo pontifici Edwardus eadeÌ„m gratia rex Francorum Angliae dux Hiberniae deuot a pedum oscula beatorum To the most holy father in Christ the Lorde Clement by Gods prouidence the high bisshop of the holy and vniuersall Churche of Rome Edward by the same grace King of Fraunce and England and Duke of Ireland offereth deuoutly to kisse his holy feete He calleth the Pope Successorem Apostolorum Principis the successour of the prince of the Apostles he desireth the pope to consider the great deuotion and obedience that the King the Cleargie and the people had shewed hitherto to the Sea of Rome He saieth vt nos nostri qui personam vestraÌ„ sanctiss sanctam Rom. Ecclesiam dominari cupimus vt debemus c. that he and all his did desire euen as their dutie was that his holy person and the holy Churche of Rome might gouerne and rule Now M. Horne vnlesse vppon some sodayne and newe deuotioÌ„ ye intende to haue the pope beare rule in England againe and will also offer your selfe yf neede be to kysse the Popes fote to wich thing this great and mighty Prince was not ashamed to say tell vs no more for shame of these letters Neither tel vs of disorders reformed nowe almost two hundred yeares agoe to make thereby an vnseasonable and fonde argumente to abolishe all the Popes authority in our Dayes The effecte then of those letters were to pray and that most humbly the Pope that he woulde not by reseruations collations and prouisions of Archbishoprykes Bishoprykes Abbeis Priories and other dignities and benefices bestowe any ecclesiasticall lyuinges in Englande vppon straungers and aliens The whych thyng hath bene euer synce straitly sene to and there were two Actes of parliament made in this Kinges dayes agaynst the sayed prouisions And yet did the popes ordinarie and laufull authoritie in matters and causes ecclesiasticall remayne whole and entiere as before Neyther doe I fynde nor take it to be true that suche persons as were promoted by the Pope were expelled the realme Nor did the statute take place againste suche as had taken before the enacting of the same corporal possession As for Nauclere it is no maruell yf he being a straunger doth not write so exactely of our matters And no doubte he is deceiued in writinge that the kinge forbad any letters to be browght from the Pope But what say I he is deceiued Nay you that should knowe Englishe matters better then he especially such as by penne ye set abrode into the face of the worlde are deceiued and not Nauclerus Yea rather ye haue wilfully peruerted Nauclerus and drawen his sentence as Cacus did Hercules oxen backwarde into your Cacus denne and to beguile and deceiue your simâ—le reader and to bring him into a fooles paradise therin fondly to reioyce with you as thoughe this King abolisshed all the Popes authority and Iurisdiction For thoughe Nauclerus his wordes be general yet they may be wel vnderstanded and restrayned to suche letters as conteyned any suche collatioÌ„ or prouision inhibited by the statute But you least this shoulde be espied haue altered the forme and order of your authours wordes placing that firste that he placed laste As before coÌ„trariewise ye placed in Paulus Aemilius that laste whiche he placed firste Then haue ye falsly traÌ„slated your authour to wrye him to your wroÌ„gful purpose He expelled sayeth Nauclerus all persons promoted to any benefice in his realme by the Pope commaundinge vnder payne of drowning that no man shoulde exequute there the Popes letters what so euer they were Your authour speaketh not of bringinge letters into the Realme those are your owne wordes falsly fathered vpon him but of exequutioÌ„ And therefore the generall wordes following what so euer are to be restrayned to the exequution of the Popes letters contrarie to the order taken against the sayde prouisions and of none other Whiche statute doth no more take away the Popes ecclesiastical and ordinary authoritie then this kinges royall authority was taken away because the Parliament vppon reasonable causes denied him a certaine paymente that he there demaunded And yet yf I shoulde followe your vayne and humour in your newe rhetoryke I might thereby aswell inferre that the people toke him for no king as you by as good argumentes inferre the abolishing of the Popes authority Nowe as towching theis prouisioÌ„s they were not altogether abolished against the Popes will For this matter was loÌ„g in debate betwene the Pope and the king and at lengthe yt was agreed by the Pope that he woulde not practise anye more suche prouisions And on the kinges parte it was agreed that Archbishoppes and Bishops should be chosen by the Chapter of the cathedral Church without any interruption or impedimente of the king As appeareth aswell in the sayde epistle sente by the king to the Pope as by our chroniclers M. Horne The .137 Diuision pag. 82. b. Next to Levves vvas Charles the .4 chosen Emperour vvho helde a councel at Mentze vvith the Prelates and Princes in the yere of the Lorde 1359. vvherein he much reproued the Popes Legate for his disorders and coÌ„maunded the Archbishop of Mentze to reforme his Clergy and the disorders amongest them for othervvise he would see to it him selfe .451 The Popes Legate seing hovv the Emperor tooke vpon him gate
they lie without al chaunge and alteratioÌ„ making of any word or sense thereof her Highnes in the interpretation set foorth in her IniuÌ„ctioÌ„s doth by very playn words claime the same spiritual gouernmeÌ„t here in this realme of the Church of England that her highnes father Kinge Henry and her brother king Edwarde did enioye and claime before her in the which iniunctioÌ„s and in the late acte of ParleameÌ„t also her highnes doth claime no more spiritual gouernmeÌ„t nor no lesse but so much in euery point as they had without all exception For answere his L. did still continue in the deniall thereof and that her Highnes meaning was not to take so much of Spiritual authority and power vppon her as they did with affirmation that he did moste certainly and assuredly know her highnes minde therein Then for some issue to be had of this matter seeing that the meaning of the Othe is not as the expresse words doe purport And seing that his L. did so well vnderstand her Highnes meaning therein and thereby the very righte sence therof I besought him that his L. would take some paines for truthes sake to penne the same wherevpon his L. did penne and write the interpretatioÌ„ of the said Othe as hereafter followeth I.A.B. do vtterly testifie and declare in my coÌ„science that the Q. Highnes is the only Supreme gouernor of this Realm and of al other her Highnes dominioÌ„s and countries as wel in al spiritual or ecclesiastical things or causes as teÌ„poral That is to haue the soueraingtie and rule ouer al manner persons borne within her Realmes dominions and couÌ„tries of what estate either Ecclesiastical or teÌ„poral so euer they be And to haue authority and power to visit the Ecclesiastical estate and persons to refourme order and correct the same and all maner errours heresies schismes abuses offenses coÌ„temptes and enormities Yet neuertheles in no wise meaning that the Kings and Queenes of this Realme possessours of this crowne may challenge authoritie or power of ministerie of diuine offices as to preache the worde of God to minister Sacramentes or rytes of the Churche appointed by Christe to the office of Churche ministers to excommunicate or to binde or loose Of the whiche fower pointes three belong onely to the Ecclesiastical ministers the fourthe is coÌ„mon to them with the congregation namely to excoÌ„municate And that no forain Prince Person Prelat State or PoteÌ„tate hath or ought to haue any iurisdiction Power Superioritie preheminence or authority ecclesiastical or Spiritual within this realme And therefore I doe vtterly renounce al foraine iurisdictions powers superiorities preheminences and authorities That is as no Secular or Laie Prince other than the King or Quenes possessours of the Croune of this Realme of what Title or dignitie so euer they be hathe or oughte to haue anye Authoritie soueraigntie or power ouer this Realme ouer the Prince or Subiectes thereof Euen so no manner of foraine Prelate or person Ecclesiastical of what title name so euer they be neither the See of Rome neither any other See hathe or ought to haue vse enioye or exercise any maner of power iurisdiction authority superioritie preheminence or priuilege spiritual or ecclesiastical within this realme or within any the Quenes highnes dominions or CouÌ„tries And therefore al suche foraine power vtterly is to be renouÌ„ced and I do ê“mise c. vt sequitur in forma iurameÌ„ti M. Horne These that ye terme Resolutions are none of .558 mine they are like him that forged them false feined and â—alitious They be your ovvne eyther ye could not or ye vvere ashamed to adioyne my ansvvere to your seely obiections and therfore ye feygned mee to vtter for resolutions your ovvne peuissh cauillations This report is false that I should affirme the Queenes Maiesties meaning in that Othe to be farre othervvise then the expresse vvords are as they lie verbatim This my constant assertion that her highnes mind and meaning is to take so much and no more of spiritual authority and povver vpon her than King Henry and king Edvvard enioyed and did iustly claime you vntruely feygne to be your obiectioÌ„ And that I should affirme of most certain and sure knovvledge her Maiesties mind or the very right sence of the Othe to be othervvise thaÌ„ it is plainly set forth is a malicious sclander vvherof I vvil fetche no better profe then the testimony of your mouth Ye coÌ„fesse that the interpretatioÌ„ folovving vvas peÌ„ned and vvriteÌ„ by me to declare the very right sence and meaning of the Othe vvâ—erein ye haue acquited me and coÌ„deÌ„ned your self of a manifest vntruth For the right sence and meaning declared in the interpretatioÌ„ that I made and you haue set forth doth .559 plainly shevve the cleane contrary if you marke it vvel to al that you here set forth in my name vnder the title of my resolutions to your scruples Furthermore in the preface to your fornamed points ye haue declared by vvord and vvriting that I did require you presently to svveare and by othe to acknovvledge her highnes to be the only supreme gouernour in al spiritual or ecclesiastical things or causes If this be true that you haue said it is manifest by your ovvn coÌ„fession that I declared her maisties meaning in that Othe to be none othervvise than the expresse vvords are as they lye verbatim For vvhen I shovve her meaning to be that ye should acknovvledge in her highnes the only supremacy I do declare plainly that she meaneth to exclude al other men froÌ„ hauiÌ„g any supremacy for this exclusiue only caÌ„ not haue any other sense or meaning And vvhaÌ„ I add this supremacy to be in al spiritual causes or things I shevve an vniuersal coÌ„prehension to be meant vvithout exception For if ye except or take avvay any thing it is not al. And you yourself tooke my meaning to be thus For ye chaleÌ„ge me in your second chefe point and cal for profe hereof at my hand vvhich ye vvould not do if it vvere not mine assertion and meaning For vvhy should I be driueÌ„ to proue that vvhich I affirme not or meant not Besides these in your vvhole trauaile folovving ye labour to improue this as you saie mine assertion to vvit that al spiritual iurisdiction dependeth vpon the positiue lavv of Princes If this be mine assertion as ye affirme it is and therfore bend al your force to improue it ye vvittnes vvith me .560 against your selfe that I declared her maiesties meaniÌ„g vvas to take neither more nor lesse authoritie and iurisdictioÌ„ vnto her selfe than king HeÌ„rie and King Edvvarde had for they had no more thaÌ„ al. And if her Maiestie take any lesse she hath not al. Touching therefore these false feined and slanderous resolutions as they are by you moste vntruly forged euen so vvhether this bee likely that in a yeres space vvel nigh I vvould not in all our daily coÌ„ference make .561 one reason or
them for the more better discharge of their cure and that by the mouth of God thei may not exercise any iurisdictioÌ„ ouer theÌ„ they may not visit theÌ„ they may not reforme theÌ„ they may not order nor correct them without a further coÌ„mission froÌ„ the Q. hignes Suerly my good L. these thinges are so strauÌ„ge vnto me and so contrary to al that I haue rede that I am not hable to satisfie my conscieÌ„ce therin Your L. aunswer vvas that for as much as al Spiritual iurisdictioÌ„ and authority to make Lawes and to iudge the people in courtes Ecclesiastical to visit theÌ„ to reforme theÌ„ to order aÌ„d correct theÌ„ doth depeÌ„d only vpoÌ„ the positiue Lawes of Kings and Princes aÌ„d not vpoÌ„ the Law of God therfore neither did the Apostles of Christ neither the Bishops and their successours may exercise any iurisdictioÌ„ vpoÌ„ the people of God iudge theÌ„ visit theÌ„ refourme order aÌ„d correct them without authority and coÌ„missioÌ„ of the King and Prince M. Horne It is very true that after ye had quarelled muche in sondry thinges touching vvoordes and termes expressed in the Act of Parliament and in the interpretation of the Othe Yee did neuerthelesse finally agree in the vvhole matter thereof finding onely doubt in one point of mine assertioÌ„ namely touching iurisdiction Spirituall or Ecclesiastical al vvhich you affirmed contrary to mine assertion to be committed by Christe to Bishops and priestes as pâ—oprely apperteyning to their office and calling vvithout further commission or authority from Princes or any other povver The distinction that I made of Ecclesiastical iurisdiction I vvil first repete and than put mine ansvveare to your argumentes Spiritual Iurisdiction is diuided into tvvo sortes the one is called Cohibytiue the other not Cohibityue That vvhich is called not Cohibityue is that iurisdiction or povver that is exercised and vvoorketh in the invvarde and .563 secrete courte of conscieÌ„ce that is .564 the preachinge of the Ghospell ministration of the SacrameÌ„tes and the absoluing and reteininge of sinnes by the vvoorde of God in the publique mynistery This therfore they call not Cohibityue bicause in the Court of conscience no man is bound or lovvsed vnvvillingly or against his vvill To exercise this kind of IurisdictioÌ„ neither Kinges nor ciuill Magistrates neither any other persone may challendge or take vppon him onlesse he be lavvfully called thereunto Iurisdiction Cohibityue hath .565 tvvo partes the one consisteth in the exercise of excommunication and circumstaunces thereunto required by Christes institution the vvhich povver or Iurisdiction belongeth to the Church onely and .566 not to the Prince Bishoppe or Priest for no man hath authority to excommunicate but onely the Churche and those vvho receiue authority therevnto by commission from the Church The other kinde of Cohibitiue Iurisdiction is a povver or authority that consisteth and is exercised in foro causarum in the courte of causes and apperteineth ad externum publicum forum to the externall and publike Courte and is defined to be saith Antonius an authority or povver to declare the Lavv geue sentence and to iudge in all controuersies pertayninge to the Courte vvhat is euery mans righte and in summe to doo those thinges that iustice dooth require accordinge to the Lavves Ioannes Quintinus defineth Iurisdiction to the same effect but openeth the nature therof more plainely saying IurisdictioÌ„ is an office and authority to declare the Law that is to admynister iustice and equity and to gouern the people with right aÌ„d Lawes whaÌ„ I name an office saith he I meane that iurisdictioÌ„ hath in it selfe a necessity to declare the Lawe for office is that which euery man is bound to doo to declare the lawe is to exercise iudgementes wherevppon commeth iurisdiction be meaneth that iurisdiction hath the name and is so called of exercising iudgementes iudgementes are exercised onelye of theÌ„ that haue iurisdictioÌ„ that is power to iudge Iurisdiction consisteth only in the contentions or debating of matters in Courte or iudgements This authority to iudge dooth discende nowe from the .567 Prince alone in whome only is all power By vertue of .568 this iurisdiction saith Antonius the Churche ministers accordinge to theire offices rightly enioyned vnto them may lawfully visite enquire of mens manners punishe the faulty send foorth apparitours or sommoners cyte the sturdy and stubborne represse their malepartnes call and sommon meete personnes to the Synode prouinciall or generall confirme the matters decreed in the Synode or CouÌ„cell .569 pardone faultes chaunge or mitigate the penauÌ„ce enioyned for confessed faultes condemne Heretiques and their writinges examine all mens writinges who so euer before they be set foorth or published and after due examination iudge whether they conteyne sounde or pestilent doctrin ordeine Decrees Lawes ceremonies and rytes constitute Bisshoppes and other Church ministers also depose degrade make them irreguler and vnhable to haue holy orders determine illegitimation in personnes for maryage bestowe Ecclesiasticall benefices and exact tythes and annates These and many other thinges may be lavvfully doone by those that haue the povver of this Cohybitiue Iurisdiction which is not saith he properly signified by the name of the keyes for although it may be named in some respect a Church key yet it differeth very much from the keyes of the first Courte that is of the Courte of Conscience For the vse of those keyes that are occupied in the Courte of conscience belongeth onely to the Euangelicall Priestes But this Iurisdiction may lawfully be exercised of those that are not ministers of the woorde and Sacramentes and are not Priestes As the tvvo former partes of Ecclesiastical iurisdiction haue their vertue povver and institution of Christe immediatly euen so this third part vvhich is saied to consist in foro causarum vvith those things vvhich may be vsed or exercised by vertu thereof doth depende vpon the .570 positiue Lavves of Christian Magistrats or vvhere such vvanteth vpoÌ„ the positiue rules and orders of that Church vvhere such orders must be practised and not immediatly vpon the Lavve of God The .7 Chapter Howe M. Horne restraineth the Othe to one kinde of iurisdiction thereby to auoide M. Fekenhams vnuincible Argument taken out of Gods woorde Stapleton AMonge other obiections that M. Fekenham made against the supremacy in the conference at Waltham this was one That Bisshops had their warrante and commission for their exercise of their spiritual function and office by the expresse woorde of God therefore he could not with quiet conscience allowe the othe that geueth the Prince supremacy in all causes spiritual with al priuileges and preheminences in any wise touching any spirituall iurisdiction He misliketh that Bisshops hauing such commission by Gods worde may not visite and reforme their cures without a further coÌ„missioÌ„ from the Queenes highnes M. Horne thinketh to wipe al this away with a distinction borowed as he saith of one IoaÌ„nes Antonius Delphinus If any
this allwaies your Consequent I say vpon one or diuers particulars to conclude affirmatiuely an vniuersal For what one Emperour or Prince amonge so many so longe a succession and in so diuers countres haue you brought forthe by whose example by sufficiente enumeration of all partes ▪ you might logiquely and reasonably cōclude the affirmatiue vniuersal that is the Supreme gouernement in al spiritual or ecclesiastical thinges or causes You haue not M. Horne brought any one suche Shewe but one and I will allowe you in all And come you nowe to charge M. Fekenham with thys foule and euil consequent What Thought you so by preuention to blame M. Fekenhā that you might escape therby the blame your selfe or thought you we shoulde haue forgotten to charge you herewith excepte your selfe by charging an other had put vs in minde thereof Vpon this imagined Conclusion of M. Feckenhams you induce a dilemma that whether the Conclusion folow or not folow yet he shal alwaies remayne in some absurdite But we say that as he neuer made that consequent so also that it foloweth not Then say you If the Conclusion folowe not cōsequētly vpon the Antecedent ▪ than haue ye concluded nothing at al by Christes diuinity that may further the matter ye haue taken in hande to proue To the which I answere That M. Feckenham hereby fully cōcludeth his principall purpose For Commission of Spiritual gouernement being geuen as he reasoneth and you expresly cōfesse to Bishops immediatly from God by Christ him selfe true God not only in some but euen in the principall spirituall causes as to fede the Church with true doctrine to preache the worde to bind and loose to minister the Sacraments it foloweth euidētly that the Prince is not the Supreme Gouernour in al Spiritual causes And that the Acte hath wrongfully geuen to the Prince the ful authorising for al maner of spiritual causes in any wise concerning any Spirituall or Ecclesiasticall iurisdiction to be vsed and exercised by persons when and as often and for such and so long time as it shal please the Prince to authorise them It foloweth I saye that the Acte hath wrongfully geuen al this to the Princes authorising seeing that God him selfe hath already geauen it to the Apostles and their successours Bishops and Priestes in his Churche without any cōmission or authorisatiō for any prince of the earth whatsoeuer God hath your self say M. Horn geuē to the Bisshops sufficiēt cōmission for the discharge of their cures It were therfore you say an horrible absurdity if they might not exercise any iurisdictiō ouer thē by that cōmissiō without a furder cōmission frō the Quenes highnes But bothe by the practise in king Edwardes daies at what time by the Kings letters patēts bishops had a special cōmissiō to minister the Sacraments and to preach the word frō the Prince and at the Princes pleasure as it hath before ben declared ād also by the plaine Act in the Quenes M. daies now reigning bishops can not exercise vse or execute any Spiritual iurisdiction without the Authorising naming and assigning of the Prince yea and that no oftener nor no longer then it shall please the Prince to Authorise them so that beeing a Bishoppe to daye to morowe by the Acte he shall be none if it please the Prince to dissauthorise him or discharge him Ergo by Maister Hornes own confession and plaine constante assertion bothe in King Edwardes dayes and now in the Acte an horrible absurdity is committed You haue saied M. Horne a great deale more against the Acte then euer M. Feckenham saied Beare therefore with him and vs I pray you yf to auoide such an horrible absurdity bothe he and we refuse the Othe of this acte Some reason I perceiue M. Sampson and D. Humfrey of Oxford had when they refused this othe being tendred vnto them by a Commission They saw it was in dede a most horrible absurdity so to weakē Gods authority that it must yet not of congruite but of necessite and by force of lawe be bolstered as of it selfe insufficient with the Princes authorising and letters patents The sawe it was a great impiety that bishops and Pastours by Gods lawe ordayned to suche offices should not oftener exercise their offices nor no lenger remaine in the saied offices then it should please the Prince for the time to Authorise them and allowe them Therefore these men them selues no doubte true subiectes to the Quenes highnes and well willers to her Maiest Person refused yet this Othe as is aboue saied But what a conclusion is this M. Horne how fowle an absurdity is it to take the Othe of supreme gouernemente in al spiritual thinges or causes in which Othe also you say nothing may be excepted for if you except any it is not al these are your owne wordes and yet to make nowe a limitatiō and to except so many and so principall causes ecclesiasticall in the which as you say also the Prince hath no gouernement at all but only the Bishops as hauing sufficient commission herein from God him selfe Whereas if there were in dede any limitation by the Acte expressed or intēded as there is not in dede any at all in the Authorising of mete persons to execute all maner of spirituall Iurisdictions it were yet open and manifest periury to sweare to a supreme gouernement in all causes without exception What yf you and your felowes intende not or meane not al maner spirituall causes Can this excuse them which sweare to all from manifest periury How many haue receyued the Othe which neuer vnderstode worde of any suche limitatiō If you meane in dede a limitatiō M. Horne procure thē that the limitation be put to the Othe expresly that men may sweare to no more then is intended Els if you intangle mens soules in open periury vnder a couert limitation assure your selfe you and al other the procurers hereof shal answer full derely to God for all the soules that hereby haue perished And assure your self that as the holy ghost infallibly threatneth he wil come as a quicke witnesse against al periured and forsworen persons Neither yet doth the limitatiō excuse thē frō periury which sweare Princes to be supreme gouernors in some spirituall causes who are in dede no gouernours at al in such causes nor euer had by the lawe of God any spiritual charge or Iurisdictiō cōmitted vnto them But yet if this limitation were annexed the periury were the lesse and the dealing were more playne though not therfore good In the meane while you which force men to sweare to al ecclesiastical causes and yet will except so many ecclesiastical causes how vnreasonably ād how absurdely do you write But of these your contradictory assertions I haue before spoken If I should here aske M. Horne ▪ what Authorite the parliament had to geue to the Prince all or any Iurisdiction at all in matters mere spiritual that parliament especially consisting only
the greatnes of this benefite he might wel doubt whether after the creation of the world and the redemption of mankind by the passion of Christ there be any one benefitte or worke of God more wonderful then this or whether there be anie one state or vocation in Christes Church after the Apostles more worthie laude and prayse then these that you so vilanously call Iebusites So filthely your blasphemous mouth can raile against Gods truth No no M. Horn these be no Iebusites The Iebusites be the cursed sede of Cham cursed of Noe their father for dishonouring of him Ye ye are the Iebusites that the celestiall father with his owne mouth hath cursed for making his Spowse your mother an idolatrouse strompet and harlet Whome the blessed Iesuites as good graciouse children honour and reuerence Who worthely beare that name also theire workes being correspondent to theire name which doth signifie a Sauiour For they by their preaching haue saued and brought from damnation many an hundred thousand of soules to the euerlasting blisse of heauen the which God of his goodnes and mercie graunt vnto vs. Amen FINIS Laus Deo qui dedit velle dedit perficere A TABLE OF THE PRINCIPAL MATTERS AND PERSONS IN THIS booke debated or otherwise contayned The figure noteth the leafe a. and b the first and second side A. ABgarus 396. b. 401. a. Abuses refourmed in CouÌ„cel 800. yeres past 237. a. The absurdity of the Act touching the Othe 424 425. Item 457. 458. Adrianus the first Pope 234. a. Adrian the 4. 286. b. Aeneas Syluius 356. 357. Aethyopians 304. b. 305. a. Agapetus Pope 169. Agatho Pope 209. 210. Albigenses 318 a. b. Alcuinus 231. b. Alexander the 3. 287. a. b. 288. a. b. Almaricus a Frenche heretike 317. a. Alphegius bishop of CauÌ„terbury 308. a. Alteration of ReligioÌ„ in EnglaÌ„d 453. b. Aluredus or Alphredus a kinge of the Saxons 292. b. Ambrose for the Clergies Primacy in matters Ecclesiastical 105. b. The story betvvene S. Ambrose and Theodosius at large 497. b. 498. a. Andronicus Emperour vvhome M. Horne calleth Emanuel 77. 78. Anselmus a Notable bisshop 297. b. Anthymus the heretical patriarche of Constantinople deposed by Pope Agapetus 169. Antvverpian Lutherans allovve but thee General Councels 220. a. In armes against the Caluinistes and in open vvritinge condemninge them 433. 434. a. A notable story of the Aphricane bisshops 91. b. Disputations of the Aphricanes 13. a. The Apologie of England accompteth mariage of priestes heresy 8. b. The Apologie clippeth the Crede 63. a. It falsifieth S. Hierom. 107. a. The childish toyes of the Apologie 151. b A double vntruthe of the Apologie about the Synod of FraÌ„ckford 235. a. A foule lye of the Apologie 282. a. A fable of the same 287. b. Double Authority in the Apostles ordinary aÌ„d extraordinary 477. a. b. The Apostles ordinaunces 487. a. Appeales to Rome from Constantinople 150. a. Apulia 289. b. 310. b. 311. a. Arcadius the Emperour 122. b. Arius 109. 110. Armenians 303. b. 304. a. Arnoldus Brixiensis 303. a. 318. a. b. Arnoldus de villa Noua 302. 303. Articles of our Crede 423. Athanasius calleth the Iudgement of Princes in matters Ecclesiasticall a point of Antichrist 97. VVhat Appeale he made to Constantine 95. His Iudgement touchinge the Princes Primacy 94.95.96 Item 512. b. 513. 514. S. Augustin for the Popes Supremacy abundantly 529. 530. S. Augustin our Apostle 232. a. Aultars 520. a. b. B. BAsilius the Emperour 258.259.260 261. Benedictus the second 203. a. Bisshops in olde time made vvith the consent of the people 155. b. Hovve princes depose bisshops 157. Bisshops only haue voice and doe subscribe in Councels 149. b. 474. a. Bisshops deposed for M. Horns vvhordom 164. a. 197. a. Bisshops confirmed of the Pope in England before the Conquest 293. a. Bisshops See Inuesturinge The bisshops office resembled by the shepeheards 409. b. Bisshops forbidden to preach and limited vvhat to preach in kiÌ„g Edvvards the sixt his dayes 452. b. 453. a. b. Spiritual Iurisdiction committed to Bishops by Christ aÌ„d so practised vvith out any coÌ„mission from the Prince 467. sequentib Iurisdiction geuen to bishops by Constantin 469. a. By Theodosius and Carolus Magnus 469. b. 470. a. The bisshops Superiority acknovveleadged by Constantin 491. a. seq By Valentinian 495. seq By Theodosius the elder 497. seq The cruelty of the Bohemheretikes 5 a Bonifacius the third 194. Bonifacius the Apostle of the Germains 230. b. 232. seq Braughton 380. sequentib C. CAluin calleth the Princes Supremacie blasphemie 22. b. His sentence condeÌ„neth the Othe 504. b. 506. b. 507. Caluinists and LutheraÌ„s at mortal enemitie 432.433.434 Carolomanus 230. a. b. Catholikes no seditious subiectes 21. a. Their defence for refusinge the Othe 83. b. A Challenge to M. Horn. 4. b. Chalcedon Councel .137 and fiftene leaues folovving The cause of Committies made in the Chalcedon Councel 145. b. Charles Martel 226. seq Charles the Great 48.232 b. 234. b. and 13. leaues follovving Charles the .4 Emperour 347. seq Magna Charta 322. a. Chrysostom touching the Spiritual gouernement 74 410.521 522. Tvvo povvers in the Church 445. a Clodoueus of Fraunce 164. Of the Clergies yelding to king Henry the eight 367. 368. Confessio S. Petri vvhat it meaneth in olde vvriters 227 b. 228. a. b. The Sacrament of CoÌ„firmation 476. b. Confirmation of Popes resigned by Levvys the first Emperour 251. b. 252. a. Graunted firste to Charlemaine by the Pope 252. a. Of that matter see 254. a. b. Conon Pope 204. Conradus Emperour 283. b. Constantin the Great 68.85.86 seq 99. a. 401. a. 469. a. 491. seq The Circumstance of CoÌ„stantins Iudgment in Cecilians cause 90. b. Constantin no lavvefull Iudge in the same cause 92. a. He abhorreth the Primacie in ecclesiastical causes 92. Hovve â—onstantin refused to Iudge in Bishops matters 103. a. 491. a. b. Constantin the .5 Emperour 200. a. The destructioÌ„ of CoÌ„stantinople 80 b. Constantius the Arrian Emperour reproued 111. b. Articles of the late Conuocation 317. b. Of the Conuocations promise made to king Henrie the eight 364. VVordes vsed at the Coronation of Princes 9â— b. Councelles see Emperours Councelles kepte before Princes vvere Christened 467. b. 468. a. General Councels abandoned by Acte of Parliament 54. a. 426 a. General Councels not to be kept vvithout the Popes Consent 137. b. The sixt General Councel 205. seq The seuenth General Councel 223. a. The eight General Councel 257. et seq Cusanuâ— 117. 118. Item 357.358 359. D. DAuid 47. 48. Dante 's a foule heretike 334. a. b Dioscorus Patriarche of Alexandria deposed by Pope Leo. 150. b. Condemned in Councell vvithout the Emperours knovvledge 153. a. The fruite of disputations vvith heretikes 12. b.
true The .477 vntruth False translation as shal appeare In form respons con ad verb. tanquam publ ex com n. 10. M. Horns impâ—rtineÌ„t arguments Practica IohaÌ„nis Petri Fer. In forma inter fieud cum reo coÌ„uento in act reali In forma iurameÌ„ti testium Numer 7. Informa responsi â—ei coÌ„uenti ad verbuÌ„ taÌ„quam publicè excoÌ„municatuÌ„ numero 11 Dict. cap. Adrianus dist 63. The .478 vntruth For he reproueth Ferrariensis The .479 vntruth He is of a plaine coÌ„trary minde In repetit lect de Christ. Ciuitatis Aristocratia The .480 vntruth He auoucheth not Speculator The .481 vntruth He citeth not Lotharius to that purpose The .482 vntruth Lotharius is not of the same minde ConcerniÌ„g Quintiâ—us Heduus M. Horn miserably misâ—seth his reâ—der vvith the alleaging of Quintinus M. Horn for his wretched handling of Quintinus coÌ„pared to Medea VVhat vvas the opinioÌ„ of Lothariê° of whom M. Horn speaketh and hovv it is to be vnderstaÌ„ded Quasi Principum nomine pontifices noÌ„ intelligantur Dist. 35 c. 4. Nos honorum ciuilium duntaxat extrae Ecclesiam populariumque dignitatum regem tenere fastigiuÌ„ intelligimus c. * Eduardi 3. An. 15. cap. 3. Clerkes peeres of the lande VVhy Speculator saith al that is iÌ„ the realm to be of the Kingâ— iurisdictioÌ„ Ecclesia vtruÌ„que gladiuÌ„ tenet vtramque pariter habet iurisdictioneÌ„ Nouimus vtrumque gladium soli Ecclesiae datum hoc est ecclesiae pontificem habere ius potestatem in spiritualia simul in omnia temporalia atque ex ijs decernere statuere ex causa posse cuius decretis standum Gibere deformem Flagitiosissimê° quidam postea tam infenso nebulone Quintinê° declareth M. Horn to be a liâ—â— in the story of kiÌ„g Philip valesius before rehersed Meus Sep. 1. An 1â—29 â—yue stâ—t vntruths of M. â—orn in lesse tâ—en 15 lynes The .483 vntruthe In that place he proueth the clergies povver not the PriÌ„ces in ecclesiastical matters Duabus regulis coÌ„cludaÌ„ prior est semper in fidei peccati materia ius Ecclesiasticum attendendum est in fore ciuili tumque cessat omne iuris imperatorij mandatum aboletur c. QuaÌ„do vult Deê° 23. q. 4. †Hovvâ— farre all this is true it hath at large ben shevved in the secoÌ„d book The .484 vntruth His Author speaketh not of tvvo Councels The king iâ— to be obeied in 485. Ecclesiastical causes and not the Pope The .485 vntruthe QuiÌ„tinus auouched no suche thinge The .486 vntruth That is meant in feudis regalibus which you haue quyte left out of Quintinus Interesse tameÌ„ volo reges tantuÌ„ non praeesse talibus sacerdotum coÌ„uentibus Num. 17. Al schismaticall couÌ„cels at fayne at the leÌ„gth to yelde to the popes couÌ„cells Fol. 70. Io. Mariê° de schism concil differ par 2. cap. 6. IdeÌ„ Quintinus Aristocrat fo 135. Paris 1552. Quatenus ad feuda regalia pertinet per glosam ca. reprehensibile 23. qu. 8. M. Horne leaueth out that vvhich serueth for the opening of the vvhole matter The .487 vntruth This chardge is not in Ecclesiastical matters but aboute Ecclesiastical persons in temporal matters as for external order to be kept and in execution of the Church Canons requiringe the PriÌ„ces ayde c. * VVho more corrupt then your nevve Clergy now of handycraft Ministers M. Hornâ— impertinent allegations Dist. 62. Docendus Dist. 65. Sî fortè Hovve handsomly M. H. pleadeth against him selfe L. QuicuÌ„que de Epis et Cler. The .488 vntruthe The place alleaged shevveth of no bisshops deposed by these Emperours The .489 vntruthe The King did not exact any thiÌ„ng The .490 vntruth He meaneth not so but such as being made in former Canons the Princes confirm aÌ„d promulge by their lavves also The .491 vntruth For concealinge vvho commaunded him vvhich vvas the Pope him selfe The .492 vntruth This is not in QuiÌ„tinus printed at Lyons An 1549. The Pope an 493. heretik compelled to recante before the French King The .493 vntruthe Slaunderous The .494 vntruth greate in false reasoniÌ„g For none of al these examples do proue the popes Primacy The .495 vntruth That hath not bene proued out of Quintinê° in such seÌ„ce as the Acte attributeth to the Prince L. quicunque de Episcopis et clericis QuicuÌ„que resideÌ„â—ibus sacerdotibus fuerit episcopali loco no mine detrusus si aliquid coÌ„tra quie teÌ„ publicaÌ„ moliri c. Dicta ep inter claras de suma Trininitate Vt noÌ„ vestrae innotescat sanctitati quia caput est omnium sanctarum ecclesiaruÌ„ Dict. ca. SatageÌ„duÌ„ 25. q. 1. SatageÌ„duÌ„ est vt pro auferendo suspicionis scandalo CoÌ„sideÌ„ter à nobis postulauit vt decuit quatenus c. Dict. c. Nos si incompetenter 2. q. 7. ibi in glos Lib. 14. Est receptum c. ff de iurisdic omniuÌ„ iudicum Causa 2. quest 4. cap. Mennam Reuerti illum purgatum absolutuÌ„que permisimus Vide marginaleÌ„ glosam ibidem Dict. c. mandastis ibidem Quod audiens ValeÌ„tinianus Augustus nostra authoritate Synodum congregari iussit mox Licet euadere aliter satis potuissem suspitionem tamen fugieÌ„s coram omnibus me purgaui Sed non alijs qui noluerint aut sponte hoc non elegerint faciendi formam dans In exemplar Lugdun An. 1549. in volum 14. A grosse errour of M. Iewel pag. 275. BraughtoÌ„ lib. 1. cap. de Papa Archiepiscopis alijs praelat The 496. vntruth The contrary appeareth plainely by Braughton as it shal be declared The 487. vntruth A parte of the sentence opening and ansvvering the vvhole obiection nipped quite of Hovv vvretchedlie M. Horne alleageth Brauhgton BraughtoÌ„ lib. 1. Homines quidaÌ„ sunt excelleÌ„tes prelati alijs principantur Dominus Papa in rebus spiritualibus quae pertinent ad sacerdotiuÌ„ sub eo archiepiscopi Episcopi alij praelati inferiores Item in teÌ„poralibus Imperatores reges c. EodeÌ„ libro Ergo non debet maior esse in regno suo in exhibitioneiuris Libro 4. Matters apperteining to the spiritual iurisdiction Braughton and Quintinê° be against Petrus Cugnerius that M. Horne before alleaged Prius fol. 82. The .498 vntruth You haue proued nothing lesse The 499. vntruthe You haue proued nothing sufficient to satisfie M. FeckeÌ„ham or anie meane man The 500. Vntruthe you haue shewed no such commaundement The 501. vntruthe None of your examples haue serued your turne The 502. vntruthe Your prophecies haue proued no such Supreme Gouernment The 503. vntruhe No Scripture of the nevve Testament hath proued the like gouernment c. The 504. vntruthe Your Auncient Doctours stand plaine againste you The 505. vntruthe The practise of all Councelles bothe Generall and Nationall hath vvitnessed the popes not the Princes Primacy The 506 vntruth Ye haue not proued the like gouernemeÌ„t by any one king or prince The .507 Vntruth Partiall thei could not be for your part being the
no coÌ„spiracy * modestia vestra M Horne nota sit omnibus hominibus The Turke is muche bovvnde to M. Horn aÌ„d to his M. Luther and other his fellovves Art 34. Vide Rofens Vide dubitantium Lindain pag. 322. ex MaÌ„lio â—om 3 in loc Com. pag. 195. Vide Crispinum in historia pseudomartyruÌ„ lib. 5. in Claudio Monerio The .558 Vntruth Shamful For they are your very own as it shall appeare The .559 Vntruth your interpretatioÌ„ agreeth vvith your resolutioÌ„s the interpretation exceptiÌ„g certaine iurisdiction in causes Ecclesiasticall from the Prince vvhereof doth follow that as the resolutions reporte the Othe must not be taken as it lieth Verbatim * So al general couÌ„celles are excluded * VVhy theÌ„ do ye exclude out of the Oth prechiÌ„g MinistriÌ„g of sacrameÌ„ts bindiÌ„g aÌ„d losing etc The .560 vntruth Not against him selfe For first you saied so but in your resolutioÌ„s and interpretation of the Othe you saie the coÌ„trary And so in both places you are truly charged The 561. vntruth M. FekeÌ„ham denieth it not in any his vvordes aboue rehersed The .562 vntruth M. FekeÌ„haÌ„ neuer yelded to any your proofes reasons or Auâ—horites Fol. 96. 97. Fol. 107. 108. Fol. 105.107 A contradiction irrecoÌ„cileable in M. Horne Note Act. 20. Ioan. 20. Math. 16. Act. 8. Heb. 13. Ezech. Ioan. Antoniê° Delph lib. 2. The .563 vntruthe Preachinge and Ministration of Sâ—craments â–ª pertayne not to the secrete Courte of Conscience The .564 vntruthe Neither preaching of the Ghospell nor ministration of the Sacramentâ— is referred to Iurisdiction not cohibitiue by his Author alleaged The .565 vntruthe For there is no suche diuision of the Cohibityue Iurisdiction The .566 vntruthe For excommunication properly belongeth to bisshops The .567 vntruthe Quintinus speaketh there of temporall Iurisdiction not of Ecclesiasticall The .568 vntruthe Antonius falsified He speaketh not of this Iurisdiction that is of that vvhich cometh from the prince onely The .569 vntruthe A great deale left out in the midle â–ª plainly confutinge M. Horns purpose The .570 vntruthe Your own Author Antonius calleth this Opinion ImpiuÌ„ erroreÌ„ a vvicked errour An ansvvere to Io. Anto. Delphinê° Io. Anthonius Delde potesta Eccles. Venet 1552. in 8. Tvvo povvers in the Churche the firste of order or of the keyes the second of iurisdiction Fol. 105. a. Lib. 2. pa. 76. Lib. 2. pa. 36. b. 37. a. Io. Anth. Delph lib. 2. pag. 76. b. Quamuis praelati superioris voluntate quis parochiali sacerdoti subijciatur tameÌ„ nisi ipse vltro subijciat seipsuÌ„ nuÌ„quam poterit absolui à peccatis In secretissimo eniÌ„foro coÌ„scieÌ„tiae nemo absoluitur inuitê° M. Horne in dauÌ„ger of a premunire M. Horns doctrine maketh frustrate al the excoÌ„munications made in England theis .8 yeares An other irrecoÌ„ciliable coÌ„tradictioÌ„ in M. Horne Fol. 3. co 2. 1. Cor. 15. 1. Cor. 4. 1. Tim. 1. 1. Cor. 6. ActoruÌ„ 5. Nicephor lib. 13. cap. 34. IdeÌ„ lib. 12. Cap. 41. See hovv M Horne playeth the Cacuâ— to take avvay the authority of excommunication from the PriÌ„ce IdeÌ„ lib. 2. pag. 84. Determinata in coÌ„cilio confirmare excoÌ„municare excommunicatos cuÌ„ vt decet resipiscunt ecclesiae reconciliare casus reseruare reseruatos casus relaxare dare indulgentias penas quae pro peccatis infliguntur coÌ„mutare Idem Quamuis potestas Ecclesiasticae spiritualisque iurisdictionis conueniat praebeaturque non sacerdotibus noÌ„ tamen puris Laicis neque religiosis corona clericali carentibus Pag. 85. The .571 vntruthe M. FekeÌ„hams obiection is of the first kind not of the secoÌ„d kiÌ„d The .572 vntruthe Sclaunderous M. FekenhaÌ„ reported the effecte of the Othe truely The .573 vntruthe For that is moste true as it shal appeare The .574 vntruth The expresse wordes of the Statute doe geue to the prince povver to Authorise men to vse all maner of iurisdictions as it is here reported absolutely Ergo it geueth to the Prince the iurisdictioÌ„s also * Marke If this iurisdiction be vnited to the croun which the Prince in al maner doth assigne name aÌ„d authorise other to execute why saied you before that the Statute gaue not to the prince all maner of Iurisdictions The .575 vntruthe It is no sophisticatioÌ„ at al you proue no such thing The .576 vntruth For they are not restrained in any part of the Acte The .577 vntruthe This limitatioÌ„ vveÌ„t before it is not added after those general vvordes here noted See the Acte it selfe Againe it is in effecte no limitation at all as shall appeare The .578 vntruthe These words make no limitation of ecclesiastical iurisdiction authorised by the prince neither doe appertayne therevnto The .579 vntruthe This is a false addition not expressed in the Acte but rather denyed by the generality thereof The .580 vntruthe To say so is impâ—us error A vvicked errour by Antonius Delphinus M. Hornes Authour The .581 vntruthe Sclaunderous The vvords of the Acte vvere by M. FekeÌ„ham plainely and truely sette forth The .582 vntruth Ioyned vvith an heresie as shall appeare * Such an euel coÌ„sequeÌ„t you haue vsed throughout your booke of certaine dealings coÌ„cluding supreÌ„ gouernment in al causes The .583 Vntruthe M Fekenham argueth not so * TheÌ„ S. Bernardis a Papist who saith so Epist. 238. Solus ipse Rom. Pont. plenitudineÌ„ habet potestatis The .584 Vntruthe For M. Fek. therby coÌ„cludeth that by such coÌ„missioÌ„ beiÌ„g geueÌ„ to bishops immediatly froÌ„ God in som spirituall causes the PriÌ„ces authorising for al maner of spiritual causes to be vsed and exercised is vvrongfully geuen by the Acte The 585. vntruth ioyned vvith an heresy * Here M. Horne coÌ„deÌ„neth the doinges in kinge Edwardes daies and now also for an horrible absurdite as shall appeare The .586 vntruthe Vnproued as before †A nevv terme for a nevv doctrine †This is againste the Acte For no Iurisdiction vvhat soeuer can be vsed or exercised in EnglaÌ„de vvithout the Princes special commission Act 20. Ioan. 20. Math. 26. Act. 8. M. Horne frameth argumeÌ„ts of his ovvn aÌ„d theÌ„ laieth theÌ„ forth as M. FekenhaÌ„s argumeÌ„tes M. Horne taketh vpoÌ„ him to restrayn the general vvordes of the statute to take avvay from the Prince the Autority of excoÌ„munication See the absurdity of M. Horne in expouÌ„ding the Othe Edvvard 6. Dei grat c ReuereÌ„d Thomae Cant Archiepisc. etc. Quando quideÌ„ omnis iuris diâ—eÌ„di authoritas atque etiaÌ„ iurisdictio omnimoda taÌ„ illa quae Ecclesiastica dicitur ê— secularis à regia potestate velut à supremo cap. c. Dat. 7. die meÌ„s Feb. An. 1546. Regni nostri primo Ibidem Ad ordinaÌ„duÌ„ igitur quoscuÌ„que intra diocoesin tuaÌ„ CaÌ„tuar ac ad omnes etiaÌ„ sacros presbyterariâ—s ordines ê“moueÌ„duÌ„ praesent atosque etiam ad beneficia eccles c. Ibâ—dem Per praesentes ad nostruÌ„ dunt axat beneplacituÌ„ duraturas cuÌ„ cuiuslibet coÌ„gruae Ecclesiasticae coertionis potestate Per literas datas 4.
articles of his faith he coÌ„cludeth vvith an earnest exhortation vnto the vnitie of faith The Emperour saith Liberatus supposing that Ioannes de Thalaida had not ment rightly of the ChalcedoÌ„ couÌ„cel but had doÌ„ al things fainedly vvrote his letters by the persvvasioÌ„ of Acatius to Pergamius Apolonius his Lieutenantes to .161 depose Iohn and enstal Peter Mogge Iohn being thus thrust out repaired to the B. of Antioche vvith vvhose letters of coÌ„mendacion he vveÌ„t to SiÌ„pliciê° bishop of Rome and desired him to vvrite in his behalfe vnto Acatiê° bishoppe of Constantinople vvho did so and vvithin a vvhile after died Stapleton The like drifte as before followeth nowe also and therfore the lesse nede of any long or exquisite answer Sauing that a few things are to be coÌ„sidered aswel for the weighing of M. Hornes reasons as for such matters as make for the popes primacye euen in those stories that M. Horne reherseth As that pope Simplicius of whome M. Horne maketh mention excommunicated Peter the Bishop of Alexandria here mentioned benig an Eutychian Again that Acatius bishop of Constantinople here also recited by M. Horne was also excoÌ„municated by pope Felix What saieth M. Horn a buttoÌ„ for your popes curse If that be a matter ecclesiastical our Emperors haue cursed aswel as your popes EueÌ„ our Emperour Zeno that we are nowe in hand withal Say you me so M. Horne Then shew me I beseche you by what authority For no man you say your selfe afterward hath authority to excoÌ„municate but only the Church and those who receiue authority therevnto by coÌ„mission from the Churche Thus you say euen in this booke Bring forth then the Emperours coÌ„mission Otherwise thinke not we will crie sanctus sanctus to all ye shal say And if you bring forth the coÌ„mission then are you vndone and al your primacy For if the Emperour hath his commission from the Church then belike the Church is aboue him Onlesse as ye haue found a newe diuinitie so ye can find a new lawe wherby he that taketh the coÌ„missioÌ„ shal be aboue him that geueth it This curse then M. Horne was no ecclesiasticall curse no more surely then if you shuld if Maistres Madge played the shrewe with you be shrewe and curse to her shrewes heart It was a zelouse detestation of heretikes as if a good catholike man should nowe say cursed be al wicked Sacramentaries And whome I pray you did he curse Any trow ye that was not accursed before No but chiefly Nestorius and Eutyches which were before by general CouÌ„cels excoÌ„municated Yet for al that we haue our margent dasshed with a fresh iolye note that the princes supremacy is in al causes I pray God send you M. Horne as much worship of yt as ye had of your other late like marginall florishe owte of the Chalcedon Councell Yet let vs see what proufes ye lay forthe Why say you Was not Zeno required to cause an vnity in the church Ye mary was he and so was Constantine and Marcian to Yea Marcian for that was called the cheif phisition to But we neade not put you any more in remembrance hereof leaste ye take to muche pryde of yt Yea but zeno sayeth that after God all people shall bowe their neckes to his power It is so in dede M. Horne But onlesse ye can proue that he saied to his spiritual power which he said not nor meante not a good argument the more pittye hath quyte broken his necke Neither yet doth Zeno speake of the neckes of any his subiectes but as yt semeth of such nations as were his enimies And assuredly such woordes al pagan Emperours vse And yet they are not I trowe therefore supreme gouernours in al causes spiritual Now yt would require some tracte of tyme fully to open either howe M. Horne hath confounded maymed and mangled his authours narration or to shewe that these things euen in the true narration of the stories that he reherseth make fully agaiÌ„st him and for the Popes primacy For this Ioannes Talaida saieth Liberatus appealed to Pope Simplicius euen as Athanasius did Simplicius writeth to Acatius who answereth that he did all this withowt the Popes coÌ„sent by the Emperours commaundement for the preseruation of the vnity in the Church To whoÌ„ Simplicius replied that he ought not to communicate with Petrus Moggus for that he agreed to the Emperours order aÌ„d proclamatioÌ„ onlesse he woulde embrace the decrees of the CouÌ„cel of Chalcedo Thus letters going to and fro Simplicius died and Felix succedeth who doth both depriue him from his bisshoprike and excommunicateth him for taking part with the said Petrus Moggus After the death of Acatius succedeth Flauianus who woulde not suffer himselfe to be enstalled without the Popes consent Within shorte tyme Euphemius was Patriarche of Constantinople who receiued synodicall letters from this Pope These and manye other thinges else might here be said euen out of the chapter vpon which Maister Horne himselfe pleadeth which we passe ouer But for the Princes Supremacy in causes Ecclesiastical what hath M. Horne in al this diuision His marginal Note lyeth in the dust What hath he beside He saith The Emperor by his Lieutenants deposed Iohn Talaida the Patriarche of Antioche But this is vntrue The Emperour in dede commaunded his Lieutenants vt pellerent eum to expulse and driue him out from his bisshoprike but to depose him that is to make him now no Bishop at all that lay not in the Emperours power He did as merely of him selfe a wise prelate said in King Edwardes dayes being then in the Tower for the Catholike faieth but take awaye the Ricke Iohn remayned bisshop stil. And that with this Iohn Talaida so it was appereth well by Liberatus your owne Author M. Horne For this Iohn Talaida saieth Liberatus appealinge from the Emperours violence to Pope Simplicius habeÌ„s episcopi dignitatem remansit Romae remayned at Rome hauing stil the dignity of a bishop who also afterwarde had the Ricke also For the Pope endewed him with the bishoprike of Nola in Campania Now as Emperours and Princes haue power though not lawful to expelle and depriue men of the Church from their temporal dignities and possessions so to depriue a man of the Church from his office of ministery to depose a bisshop or a priest froÌ„ his spiritual IurisdictioÌ„ and Authority which deposition only is a cause ecclesiastical to the Church only froÌ„ whom such Authority came it belongeth Princes depriuations are no ecclesiastical depositions Take this answere ones for al M. Horne you which vntruly reporte that Princes deposed bisshops M. Horne The .57 Diuision Pag. 35. a. This Pope Simplicius considering the great contentions that vvere accustomably about the election of Popes did prouide by decree that no Pope should hereafter be chosen vvithout the authority of the Prince vvhich decree although it be not extant yet it is manifest inough by the Epistle of Kinge Odoacer put into
the Actes of the thirde Synode that Simmachus the Pope did keepe at Rome vvherin the King doth not only auouche the decree of Simplicius but also addeth VVe maruaile that without vs anye thīg was accōpted seing that whiles our Priest meaning the bisshop of Rome Simplicius was on liue nothing ought to haue bene taken in hande without vs. The .16 Chapter of Simplicius Felix .3 and Symmachus Popes of Rome Stapleton IF Pope Simplicius by decree gaue the Prince Authority to confirme the chosen Pope what helpeth this your supremacy Nay doth it not much impayre the same For then al the Princes Authority in this behalfe dependeth of the Popes decree as of a Superiour lawe And so he is subiect both to the law and to the lawemaker And yet this is all that in this Diuision hath any maner inckling to iuduce the Prīces Supremacy in any cause ecclesiastical But yf M. Horn would haue loked but a litle further and vpō the first line of the next leafe he mought haue found in the said Synod that the see of Rome hath the priestly primacy ouer all the whole world And that Councels must be confirmed by that see with such other like matter For whereas this King Odoacer beside the decree touchīg the chosing of the Pope which as your self say he made at the Popes request made also an other concerning not alienating Church goods the whole Synod reiected and cōdemned it for these .ij. causes expressely First saith Eulalius a bisshop of Sicily whose sentence the other bisshops saying the same the whole Synode folowed because against the rules of the Fathers this Decree appereth to be made of Layemen though religious and godlye to whome that any authoritye was euer geuen ouer Ecclesiasticall goods it is not reade Secondlye it is not declared to be confirmed with the subscription of any bisshop of the Apostolike See Nowe whereas the holy Fathers haue decreed that if the Priestes of any whatsoeuer prouince keeping a Councel within their owne lymities shall attempt any thing without the authority of their Metropolitane or their bisshop it should be voyde and of none effect howe much more that which is knowen to haue bene presumed in the See Apostolike the Bisshop thereof not present which bisshop by the prerogatiue of the blessed Apostle Peter hauing throughe the whole worlde the Primacy of priesthood hath bene wonte to confirme the Decrees of Councels presumed I say of layemen though certayn bisshops agreing vnto it who yet could not preiudicat their Prelat of whom it is knowen they were consecrated is vndoubtedly voyde and of no effect neither any waye to be accompted amonge Ecclesiastical decrees Thus farre that Synod by your selfe alleaged M. Horne God rewarde you for geuing vs such good instructions against your selfe Or yf it came not of you but of your frende let him haue the thankes therefore But yf it so falleth out against your willes both yet God be praysed that as by sinne he worketh somtime a greater amēdement and turneth horrible temptations into a more confortable calmenesse then before the storme came so also by your vnhappy meaning hathe yet brought vs to a happye information of such doctrine as vtterly ouerthroweth your heresye For here you see M. Horne not only the laie Magistrat yea the King him selfe yea though he were religiouse and godly vtterly excluded from all authority in causes Ecclesiasticall whereby your phantasticall Primacie vanisheth cleane away but also that the Pope whome you cal a forraine power hath the Primacy the chiefty and supreame praeeminence of Priesthode not onely in Rome or the Romaine Prouince but saith this Synode by your self clerckly alleaged per vniuersum orbem throughout the whole worlde and then if you be a parte of the worlde he is your Primate too Thus much saith this Synode and thereby vtterly ouerthroweth the whole effect of the Othe in both those partes for the whiche the Catholikes refuse to swere vnto it Verely if ye goe on as you haue hitherto you wil surely be espied for a preuaricatour that is for a double faced Proctour secreatlie instructing your clients aduersarie but in face protesting to plead against him For better instructions no hyred aduocate coulde haue geauen vs then you the Counterpleader haue ministered vnto vs. M. Horne The .58 Diuision pag. 35. a. Next after Simplicius vvas Foelix the third chosen vvho after his confirmation sent many letters as vvell to the Emperour as to Acatius Bisshoppe of Constantinople about the matter betvvixt Iohn and Peter but vvhen he coulde not preuaile in his suite he made Iohn Bisshoppe of Nola in Campania One of the letters that Pope Foelix vvrote vnto Zenon the Emperour about this matter is put into the fift Synode of Constantinople vvherein the Pope after the salutation doth most humblye beseech the Emperour to take his humble suite in good parte He shevveth that the holy .162 Churche maketh this suite that he vvill vouchesafe to mainteine the vnitie of the Churche that he vvill destroye Heresies that breaketh the bonde of vnitie that he vvill expell Peter Mogge bothe oute of the Citie and also from Churche regiment that he vvould not suffer Peter being deposed to be admitted to the Communion of the Churche but that by his honorable letters he vvould banish him out of the bounds of Antioche And saith this Bisshop of Rome Foelix vnto the Emperour In his place appoint you one that shal beutifie the Priesthode by his woorkes Stapleton You procede still to bring authorities against your selfe This Peter was deposed I confesse But by whome M. Horne Not by the Emperour but euen by Pope Foelix as appeareth but one leafe before the place which your selfe alleage And in case it was to painefull for you to turne backe a leafe or two before yet might you haue vouchsaued to haue read the next lines before your own allegatiō In the which Foelix signifieth that he was so deposed and therfore requesteth th'Emperour to expel him and to place some other mete man for him whiche thing Popes doe at this day requiring Catholike Princes to remoue hereticall Bishops and to place good in their roome neither yet therfore are or euer were Princes accompted enacted or intituled Supreme gouernours in all causes Ecclesiasticall Your new Religion hath inuented this newe Title This Pope Foelix also excommunicated Acatius of Constantinople for bearing with this Peter Mogge as witnesseth Liberatus Whereby appeareth clerely the Popes Primacie ouer the ij chiefe Patriarches of the East Churche of Constantinople and Antioche And you againe are with your owne examples cleane ouerthrowen M. Horne The .59 Diuision pag. 35. b. Anastasius the Emperour .163 deposed Macedonius Bisshoppe of Constantinople as one that falsified the Ghospels as Liberatus saith Stapleton If this Macedonius falsified the Ghospel he was I wene worthy to be deposed But your Author vseth not this worde Deposed but he saieth he was expulsed Whiche might be being by an