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A05172	Divine and politike observations nevvly translated out of the Dutch language, vvherein they vvere lately divulged. Upon some lines in the speech of the Arch. B. of Canterbury, pronounced in the Starre-Chamber upon 14. June, 1637. Very expedient for preventing all prejudice, which as well through ignorance, as through malice and flattery, may be incident to the judgement which men make thereby, either of his Graces power over the Church, and with the King, or of the equity, justice, and wisdome of his end in his said speech, and of the reasons used by him for attaining to his said end	Theophilus, fl. 1638.	1638 (1638)	STC 15309; ESTC S108356	57,625	70

account with Your selfe too Arch. ● And not to measure your peoples love by the unworthinesse of those few For a loyall and obedient people You have and such as will spare nor Livelyhood nor Life to doe You service And are joyed at the heart to see the Moderation of your Government and your constancy to maintaine Religion and your Piety in Exampling it As those that feare prejudice to Religion by the P●elates craft and unlawfull ambition Observ. are his Majesties most faithfull subjects and most to be trusted unto in a defence of his soveraignty against the Pope and Spanyard and all forreyne enemies of his greatnesse so are they for loyalty love the chiefe men to be trusted unto in the defence of his Majestie and of the publike against the prejudices which Prelates ambition avarice and artifice may breed to the quyet of the Church or State by the dangerous Practises of Papists Atheists and discontented persons within the Iland And as I thus beseech You for your People in generall Arch. ● so doe I particularly for the three Professions which have a little suffer'd in these three most Notorious Libellers Persons It cannot be made appeare that any of the three Professions have suffered by any act of the defendants Observ. done against the Kings honour benefitt or power but by practise of his Gr Counsell of the command which he adviseth his Majestie to lay upon the reverend Iudges not onely law and reason but the Kings honour likewise would mightily suffer For howsoever it is very consistent with justice and his Majesties goodnes to putt whatsoever he thinketh fitting to the deliberation of ●he reverend Iudges yet to prescribe them what to resolve is not compatible with his Majesties wisedome and honour And seeing it seemeth as well compatible with Episcop●ll dignity as it is with appearance of reason and moderation for Bishops to convent in a legall way before the reverend Iudges in those Courts where Bishops are no members such as affirme that their keeping Courts issuing Proces●es in their owne names are acts against the Statutes Lawes of our Countrie and seeing a Sen●ence of the Iudges in such course after hearing the reasons allegations and answers of both parties could not but shew more considerate more just and more legall then any decree or resolution of Iudges for obedience of his Majesties peremptory command without any hearing or citation of parties it is very strange to see that any greatnes of power in Church or State should have made so wise a man as the Archbishop to adventure to advise the K. to ordaine his Iudges to publish a resolution and declaration repugnant to Statutes and acts of Parliament which many understanding men affirme to be standing unrepealed especially seeing in consultations even about cas●s wherein there is nothing determined by Parliament it is a derogation both to the liberty competent to a Counsell and to the Majestie of a lawfull Soveraigne to prescribe or command their resolutions This d●sire of his Grace may happen to breede a suspition in most part of his loyall subj●cts in Scotland that it was his G● Counsell that made his Majestie in Parliament a● Ede in 1633. expresse what he would have them resolve in some cases put to voicing in his owne hearing and to discountenance and with his owne Royall hand write in a note as disaff●ctioned to his service the names of all those that voted not as his Highnes required whereby his Majesties honour as well as the liberty due to a Parliament did suffer in the opinion of his best subjects in that nation Meane while seeing upon the 12. of June it was ordered by his Majesties High Court of Starr-Chamber that the opinion of the Iudges should bee taken in the particulars which hee desireth his Majestie to cause them resolve and publish it seemeth strange that i● this Epistle Dedicatorie of his Gr most reverend speech pronounced two dayes thereafter his Gr willeth his Majestie to cause them resolve what is here craved for as it seemeth not to be pertinent to crave that his Majestie command the Iudges to deliberate or consider the matter after he hath done it so the matter being r●ferred to their consideration it seemeth not pertinent to desire his Majestie to cōmand what he will have them to resolve but leave it to their science conscience to declare what they judge to be lawfull in the case unlesse there bee som● prerogatiue not obuious to sence nor bounded with any reason either for his Gr desire or his Majestie command of such resolution ●r●h-B And for Physicke the Profession is honourable and safe And I know the Professors of it will ●emember that Corpus humanum mans body is that about which their Art is conve●sant not Corpus Ecclesiasticum or Politicum the Body of the Church State or Common-wealth Bastwick hath been hold that way But the Proverbe in the Gospell in the fourth of S. Luke is all I 'le say to him Medice cura teip●●m Physitian heale thy s●lfe As mans body is that about which the art of Phisick is conversant observ so the G●spell and mans spirituall good by the preaching of it not Corpus Physicum aut Politicum is that about which the art and calling of Churchmen ought to be conversant For albeit I can hardly agree to Erasmus where he writeth that as Crocodilus anceps animal nunc in terris nunc in aquis degit in terra ponit ova in aqua pr●edatur insidiatur ita qui aulici sunt Ecclesiastici utrobique pestilentes Yet I dare not but reverence the judgement of so learned a man where he writeth Quemadmodum mulus ex equo Asino conflatus nec equus est nec asinus ita quidam dum a●lici esse volunt Ecclesiastici neutrum sunt And yet le● me tell your Majestie Arch-B I believe hee hath gained more by making the Church a Pati●●t than by all the Patients hee ever had beside There is no Bishop that hath not gained more by conversing in matters Politicall and plying the wayes of Courts Observ. and by working upon the trust they gett sometimes with good Princes sometime with weake subjects then any of them hath ever gott by labouring in the word and doctrine for which the Apostle saith double honour is due to C●urchmen wh●me he designeth by the name of Presbyteri Sir Arch-B both my selfe and my Brethren have been very coursely used by the Tongues and Pennes of these men yet shall I never giv● your Majestie any sower Counsell I shall rather magnifie your Clemencie that proceedeth with these Offenders in a Court of Mercie as well as Iustice Sinc● as the Reverend Iudges then declared you might have justly ●alled the Offendors into another Court and put them to it in a way tha● might have exacted their Lives for their stirring as much as in them lay of mutinie and sedition Seeing

DIVINE AND POLITIKE OBSERVATIONS Nevvly translated out of the Dutch language vvherein they vvere lately divulged UPON Some Lines in the speech of the Arch. B. of Canterbury pronounced in the Starre-Chamber upon 14. June 1637. VERY Expedient for preventing all prejudice which as well through ignorance as through malice and flattery may be incident to the judgement which men make thereby either of his Graces power over the Church and with the King or of the Equity Justice and Wisdome of his end in his said speech and of the reasons used by him for attaining to his said end Prov. 26.28 A lying tongue hateth those that are afflicted by it and a flattering mouth worketh ruine Ovid. l. 2. Eleg. impia sub dulci melle uenena latent Printed in the yeare of our Lord MDC.XXXVIII The 〈◊〉 Dedicatory Epistle IF it may please Your Gr Your Apologie and defence of Innovations in divers Church matters made or approved by your Gr lately published in our language hath occasioned many both different and strange discourses and scannings of it amongst such of my Countreymen as doe not consider that the discourses and vvritings of men so much busied as your Gr in matters of state are hardly to be understood or obvious to the Iudgement of vulgar capacities And because there may be much mistaking incident to the Iudgement of those that through either presumption or rashnesse measure the expressions of so great a man as your Gr by the rule that the speeches or vvritings of men of common and ordinary sence and condition ought to be squared by I have therefore adventured to lay at your feet open to your Cracious vievv the Iudgement vvhich is made of your Graces said speech by men of bes● understanding and moderation asvvell in hope to give your ●r contentment hereby as in confidence to give satisfaction to such as by your ●r greatnesse are either scared to looke upon or affrighted to iudge of the Misteries both of Religion and Politike government vvhich your Gr said gracious speech implyeth Your Gr true Friend though unknowne Theophilus The Translator to the Rèader THere are many who considering that the defenc●s of the innovations conteined in the Arch. B. speech before ment●oned are not able to sa●isfie any in partiall judgement and that he obtained such cen●ure as ●ee sought against those three worthy men whom hee caused to suff●r for writing and pointing at his said innovations doe conceive tha● a publica●i●n of his speech could not seeme to his wi●dome either needfull or pertinent and that his Majesti●s command for pri●ting thereof hath been craved and obtained by his Gr either out of such a vaine glory which I cannot b●leeve incident to his Gr as ostentative persons aff●ct in shewing the wayes how they compasse t●eir ends or to make appeare the absolute implicite and fearefull power which he hath with his Majesty And albeit all minds aff●cted with these impr●ssions apprehend that his Majesties said command for printing of it implyeth his approbation of all the purposes in the said speech and thereupon scare to publish their judgement of th' expressions in it lest thereby they seeme ●o fail● in the duty which obligeth subjects to forbeare scanning the reasons of their Soveraignes commands and to acknowledge his will to be sufficient for the same Neverthelesse seeing great Princes can hardly see any thing but in such shape as it is represented to them by such of their Courtiers or Councellors as they are pleased to trust who often have private ends or interest for disguysing truths unto them I am verily perswaded that his Majesty did in his wisdome command a publication of the said speech thereby to try and discover of what value and weight the reasons mentioned in it for the innovations made by his Gr and other Prelates would bee found in the ballance of such judgements as are not to be swayed by either feare or hope from Prelates power And seeing his Majesty could not possibly get such notice and satisfaction herein as is expedient ●f all men forbeare either to speak which no man may in good manners doe but such as have some place ●ear● him or write ●heir conceptions of it I have therefore adventured to translate in English the foresaid Observations published in Dutch soone after the said speech was publishe● in that language both hoping that his Majesty shall see and approve divers things therein and confident that if ought be either deficient in them that is expedient for his Majesties satisfaction or disguysed misconstrued or wrested to a wrong sence by the artifice and power of such as have much benefit and their chiefe subsistence by disguysing truths to his Majesty The same shall be made good by some that have more understanding than I and a better faculty than th' Author of the Dutch now here translated to write what this Theame may beare and is expedient for Gods glory the good of the Church and the publike weale of his Majesties good Subjects and Dominions If in a countrey thou seest the oppression of the poore and the defrauding of judgement and justice bee not astonished at the matter for hee that is higher then the highest regardeth Eccles 5.7 The proud lyeth in wait● and turneth good into evill and in things worthy praise hee will finde some fault Ecclesiasticus ●1 31 DIVINE AND Politicall Observations upon a speech pronounced by the Arch. B. of Canter in the Starre Chamber upon the 14. of Iune 1437. newly translated out of the Dutch Languague Wherein They were lately divulged HIS Grace after some plau●ible Complements to his Majesty Arch. B● ●iteth a place in Proverb ch 18. ●6 Their foolish mouth●● have already called for their owne stripes and their lippes and pennes bee●e a suare for ●heir soules WHensoever it shall please his Grace to consider that the wordes immediatly going bef●re those which he citeth Pro. 18. viz. Observ. That it is not good to ac●ept the person of the wicked to cause the righteous to fall in judgement His conscience may happily tell him that he wresteth the sence of the words cited applying them to the words or writts of the poore men ●hat he ●e hath caused to suffer under pretext of a Crime which he ●ath caused through his power and greatnes to be imputed to acts ●f theirs both honest and lawfull But I humbly beseech Your Majesty to consider that 't is not We only ●at is the Bishops that are strucke at but through our sides Arch. B. ●ur Majesty Your Honor Your Safety Your Religion 〈◊〉 ●eached ●●serv The mention making yea the reproaching and condemning those actions of Bishops which argue a probability of their intention to labour innovation in religion is no striking of the King through the Bish●ps sides As Christian religion hath beene brought into th● dominion of many Princes so alterations have beene made in it sometimes against their wills and sometimes without their knowledge by artifice

Observ. Chat escha●dè eraign● l'eau ●roide Men that had heard of the pr●hibition of Sermons upon the wednesday in time of solemne fast an● had seene many other simptomes of dislike of them and inclination 〈◊〉 place all exercise of Religion in the Ceremonies and Letany migh● very probably feare and thi●ke there was some intention to suppress● wednesday Lectures Many wise men have shewed feare of thing● which have never come to passe and many have beene mistaken i● their ju●gements of mens intentions when they measured them b● t●e successe of their actions Great mens intentions are not allwaye obvious to the understanding of men that live in a condition beneat● them nor allw●yes Priv●ledged with succes●e or with prerog 〈◊〉 chardge a crime up●n such as mistake them or understand them no● and the argument is not good VVednesday Lectures are not sup●pres●ed E●go his Grace had no intention to suppresse them Arch. B. ibid. A●d ●he Arch. B. and B●sh●ps to whome the ordering of the book● i● commited have pow●r under the Ki●g ●o put in or leave out whatsoever they thinke fi●t for the present occasion as their P●edic●ss●●● have ever done before ●hem Observ. This generall implicite power is not suf●icient for affirming truel● tha● they have the Kings command or warrant for every thing th●● put in ●r leave out no more then the generall power which t●● Chancellor Secretary and other O●ficers have from the King is suffi●cient fur alleadging the Kings command and warrant for every act they doe in their severall stations they cannot change any thing once axcepted out of their O●fices without a new speciall vvarrant Arch. B. Pag. 21. Provided that nothing be in contrary to the Doctrine or Discipline of the Church of England Observ. Quaeritur whether the Doctrine and Discipline of our Church be that which Bishops invent prescribe or purchase colour of his Majesties au●hority for commanding off Or that which by other Reformed Churches is held to bee of divine institution Arch. B. ibid. And it is not the custome of the Church nor fitt in it selfe to pray for seasonable weather when wee have it But when we wan● it Why not as well as it is the custome of the Church Obser●● and fitt in it selfe ●o pray for grace wisedome and understanding of the Lords of coun●ell that want none of these and for illuminating Bishops with true ●nowledge and understanding of the word which they have want ●ot Thirdly 't is most inconsequent to say Arch. B● pag. 22. that the Leaving that Prayer ●ut of the booke of devotions caused the Shipwrackes and the Tempest ●hich followed In the newes from Ipswitch it is not saide Observ● that the leaving out that ●●ayer caused the shipwracks and tempests but was one cause that is 〈◊〉 farre as men may judge one of the occasions thereof and to this ●●ce a man may speake without exceeding the limits of Christian re●●rence duety and humility in speaking of actions and accidents ●●ereof no other cause can be affirmed literally but the will of al●●ghty God and the saying that the leaving out of that prayer is ●●e of the causes of the shipwracks is as justifiable a way of speech 〈◊〉 the saying of a man sick of the ague that his sinnes are the causes ●●reof I humble desire your Lordships to weigh well the Consequence of ● great and dangerous Innovation Arch. B. pag. 23. The Prayer for faire weather 〈◊〉 left out of the Book for the Fast Therefore the Prelates intend to ●●ng in Popery ●here is not so much as one line in those newes excepted against ●●is Gr. Obser●● inferring either upon this or any other of the innovations ●●●tioned in it a conclusion of the Prelates intention to bring in ●●ery yet upon the whole conjunctio an appearance of such inten●● may be in reason as well affirmed as feared August Tom. 10. ●●mil 42. saith de minutis guttis implentu● flumina per minutas rimula●●●●at aqua impletur sentina mergitur nav● Small drops make floods th●ough small rifts the water loaketh in filleth the deck and sinketh 〈◊〉 ship To this I answer First As before Arch. B● ibid It was lawfull for us to alter what we thought fit And Secondly since that Collect made mention of Preaching 〈◊〉 Act of State forbad Sermons on the Fast dayes in infected pla●●● wee thought it fit in pursuance of that Order to leave out 〈◊〉 Collect. For reply may bee repeated the answer to the 3 Se●● withal● act of State forbidding Sermons is not a sufficient warrant for leav●●● out of a prayer in use to be read a collect because it mention pre●●●●ing Arch. B. pag. 24. For the branch in the other which is the first Coll●ct Though 〈◊〉 did deliver our forefathers out of Romish superstition yet God be 〈◊〉 sed for it we were never in Observ. Though it were absolutely true as it is not that none of the ●●●rers of these prayers which are usually read were ●ver in Romis● perstition as his Graces Speech here implyeth yet could not t●●● a sufficient reason for leaving out the collect here mentioned be●● in the deliverance of our forefathers out of the said superstition● 〈◊〉 did deliver us Withall by the same reason his Gr. might cause 〈◊〉 beare the thanksgiving and prayers appointed to be used for del●●●●rance from the Powderplott A reverend remembring and than●●●●●ving in our prayers to God for delivering our foref●thers out of ●●●mish Superstition is a point more materiall in Gods worship the●●ther an aeriall Crosse a Surplice or bowing at the n●me of Iesus 〈◊〉 as there is not so much reason for leaving out t●a● branch of 〈◊〉 Collect as there is for refusing a nec●ssity of the aeriall Crosse Sur●●● and ducking to an Altar or at the sound of the word Iesus by su●● esteeme the doing thereof scandalous superstitious or otherwise 〈◊〉 lawfull and seei●g there are many of the ●ormalists or good Co●●●mists who by the doctrine practise the Ceremonies approved 〈◊〉 urg●d by most Prelates are led the b●●ad way to the avowed pr●●●●sion and beleefe of Popery that clause which implyeth a prayer fo●●●●liver●nce from Romish Superstition is not unfittingly expressed as 〈◊〉 Gr alleadgeth in the said Coll●ct the words left out being these 〈◊〉 hast delivered u● from Superstition and Idolatry wherein wee were ●●●ly drowned and hast brought us into the most cleare and comfortable 〈◊〉 of thy blessed word by the which we are taught how to serve and 〈◊〉 ●hee and how to live orderly with our neighbours in trueth and verity Arch-B ibid. Because in this Age and Kingdome there is little opinion 〈◊〉 meriting by fasting Observ. Papists in this age and Kingdome have still an opinion of meri●● by fasting and the enjoyning of a fast in Lent and other se●t ti●●●sed by the Roman Church maketh the lukewarme Conformists ap●●●●ertaine the same opinion and

some Pre●●●e whose advice he trusteth in matter of prayer and divine worship ●en that which is here sett downe because the King had no Children to pray for when he gave command to leave out these words for if that were the reason then that clause w●re now to be resumed which is not done since the K. hath ●eede which God bles●e like as ●he ●sing of those words is compatible enough with a●y Gods elect ●●ther having or wanting seede so as to obtaine his Majesties warrant ●●r leaving out these words it is likely th●t his Gr or some othe● P●e●●te hath suggested to him such arguments as Papists and Arminians vse for impugning that article of Christian religion which con●er●e●● Gods election without acquainting his Majestie with the answer● made thereto by orthodoxe writers Arch. B. pag. 28. The truth is it was made at the comming in of K. IAMES● and m●st of necessity be changed over and over againe pro ratione Te●●porum as Times and Persons varie Observ. The Parliament appointed that prayer to be vsed and it can nei●ther be lawfully omitted and forborne which his Gr granteth 〈◊〉 auoweth the doing of nor changed without warrant of the same a●●ritie Arch. B. pag. 29. Here give mee l●ave to tell you 't is At the name of Iesus in 〈◊〉 learned Translation made in K. Iames his time About which m●●ny learned Men of be●t note in the Kingdome were imployed bes●de some P●elates Observ. If the translation made in K. Iames time hath At the name ce●●tainly it is not soe consona●t to the Greeke Originall which ha●● 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or to the Latine version in nomine as in the the nam● and In being so long vsed in many impressions of the common pr●●●er booke confirmed by Parliament it is not likely that the chang● hath beene error Typographi but a direction of some P●elate in 〈◊〉 late edition and therefore with very good reason this alteration m●● bee numbred among other innovations made by Bishops Arch. B. pag. 30. And M ● P●ynn● whose Darling busines it hath long been to 〈◊〉 downe the honour due to the Son of God at the mentioning of 〈◊〉 sa●ing Name Iesus knowes the Gramm●r Rule well In a place or a● place c. Observ. The honor dew to the Sonne of God is not cryed downe by s●● as m●intaine that all reverence that can bee or is required by his D●●vine Majestie is dew vnto him as M r. Pryn and all good Christi●●● ackn●wledge and that alike honour is due unto him when hee mentioned by the name of Christ God Jmmanuell c As when 〈◊〉 is mentioned by the name of Jesus and the word Phil 2.10 Doe● oblig● Christians to worship the letters and sound of the word 〈◊〉 but his Person which is expressed to our memories and understa●●●ings as well by his other n●mes as by the name Iesus and by bow●●● of the knee in th●t passage nothing is understood or meant 〈◊〉 the same that is meant by b●wing of the knee Rom ● 14 1● Esa● 45●● ●t w●re idolatry to reverence the pers●n for the names sake and if we ●everence the name for the persons sake every name competent to him ●ught to bee a like reuerenced withall if the words bowing of the ●nee import a necessity of kneeling ●he words and every toung shall ●onfesse that Iesus is the Lord in that same place must oblige all men ●o a necessity of a uocall and loud confession that Iesus is the Lord ●hich must make a confusion disturbance in all assemblies for prea●hing praying or reading of scripture yea if the sence of the wordes ●ere to be taken literally that would ●blige men to kneele but not ●p no● crosse nor to bow the head at the name o● Iesus his Gr doth ●ot pres●e kneeling either in the literall or metaphoricall sence of the ●ords and is not able to produce a text for capping or bowing the ●ead at the sight or sound of the name Iesus This I finde in the Queenes Injunctions Arch-B pag. 31. without either word In 〈◊〉 At. Whensoever the name of Iesus shall bee in any Lesson Sermon or ●herwise pronounced in the Church 't is injoyned that due rev●rence bee ●ade of all persons young and old Queene Elizabeths injunctions ought to be reverenced Obser● yet mortuo ●anda●ore expirat mandatum And no act order or command of a ●●veraigne Prince not ratified and authorized by his estates in Par●●●ment doth rule either his successors authority or his subjects obe●●ence after his death Queene Eliz possibly ordained courtesy ●●d uncovering the head at the pronouncing of the name of Iesus for ●●e same respect for which shee suffered an Altar to remaine in her ●●appell after that by act of Parliament they were ordained to be● 〈◊〉 downe in all Churches of England and after the pulling downe 〈◊〉 them in many Parishes even before warrant of the said act was proved The reasons of Princes commands or connivences are not be too curiously pried into where subjects without being obnoxi●●● to any inconveniency may both forbeare doeing of the thing en●●●ned or commanded and imitating of the thing winked at or prac●●●●d by them against a Law Meane while the enjoyning of such cour●●s● onely as thereunto doth necessarily belong and before then ac●●●●omed sheweth that shee did not impose a necessity of ducking ●●●●ging capping or kneeling because it was easy to finde that there 〈◊〉 no custome in the old orthodoxe or Reformed Churches ancient●●● of late dayes for so doeing but onely among Papists whose abuses super●titions and mountebankeries though shee could n●● purge of a suddaine especially trusting much to Prelates in the busines yet had shee no intention doubtlesse by her injunctions to follow or approve them Arch. B. pag. 32. So here is necessity laid upon it and Custome for it both expres●sed by Authority in the very beginning of the Reformation is the●●fore no Innovation now Observ. Since such was the nature of the Law and Custome here ment●●●ned as is before designed they cannot be a ground for the in●●●rence which his Gr thereupon maketh that bowing at the name of I●●sus commanded by his Gr is no innovation because neither in the 〈◊〉 orthodoxe nor in the late Reformed Churches there was either 〈◊〉 or custome for the said bowing and the cannons or customes of Papi●● were not ordained to be followed by Qu Eliz injunctions yea Ho● calleth that bowing an absolute ceremony the introductiō of an ●●●solute ceremony is as well an innovatiō as the hatching of a new 〈◊〉 Arch. B. Pag. 33. That 's left to the Church therefore here 's no Innovation aga●●●● that Act of Parliament Observ. As it is a notorious trueth that the act of Parliament containing command for prayers thanksgiving every 5. Novemb was pri●● before the booke containing the prayers ordered to be read in obe●●●en●e of the saide act so